Square Enix AAA Game Budgets Revealed - Forspoken Cost More than FFXVI - On Average, Square AAA Games Cost +100% More than Capcom's

Do we really need a second thread?


Also, don't ever listen to activist investors. Their agenda is to push a company to M&A and short the stock on the news.
The complete opposite, they own shares in the company and aim to get the stock up higher so they can sell at a profit.

They're actually suggesting a lot of good things for Square. You might want to read the actual slides.
 
A big NO.

And this is coming from someone that thinks FFR/R is the absolute best rpg combat system ever made.

Square is always doing something new and revolutionary (at the very least fresh and addictive) in their FF games, even if the previous already had a ground breaking system in place, and this is why they deserve all the praise.
I don't want new FF games to become some shitty Chinese knock off of older entries.
for me its a big YES

and this is exactly why the persona turn based battle system is refined

instead of fully abandonding their previous game battle system, they improve upon it. Demanding every FF game to have a different battle system is exactly why their budget balloon up in the first place. Improve upon FF7 remake battle system instead
 
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They should just stick with the ff7 remake combat system for the next mainline FF. Stop trying to reinvent the wheel each game (like they have 11 onwards). Save some cash. Don't make it 100 hours. I wouldn't be bothered with a 30 hour game as long as it's quality.
Every FF game since FF2 has had a slightly different combat/progression system though.
 
I really REALLY wanted to show these numbers without Forspoken, because, for example, FFXVI cost less than Capcom's DD2 and of course Sony injected money for exclusivity, normal. But nobody is talking about that because Forspoken was so costly and so bad that is messing all the numbers even more!
 
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How did that turd cost more than ff16
From what I understood they put A LOT of time and money into the game engine, because they wanted to use it internally all over Square.
This of course increased the costs, and when the game turned out as it did the engine was trashed too...

Good use of investment money...
 
The USD figures at current exchange rates translate to:

133 million for FFVII Remake
118 million for Rebirth
87 million for Forespoken
58 million for XVI
58M for XVI is an achievement in itself, I know is not that liked, but compared to your average western dev cycle and cost, the result was great
 
58M for XVI is an achievement in itself, I know is not that liked, but compared to your average western dev cycle and cost, the result was great
That's in huge part because the yen's value is extremely low. Just 5 years ago, this would have been $87.36M USD. The budget is still massive by Japan's standards. That it only translates to $58M USD isn't all that relevant to them.
 
Capcom's engine is built for scanning in shit cheaply. Most of their games aren't super large either, barely over 30 hours. A ton of them are just remakes of PS1 games or ports. Their only new IP are Kunitsu-Gami, which is a smaller AA game, and Exoprimal. Dragon's Dogma 2 is pretty big though.

They're also better game designers, so there's that. But yeah, SQEX spending more isn't a huge surprise to me.
 
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That's in huge part because the yen's value is extremely low. Just 5 years ago, this would have been $87.36M USD. The budget is still massive by Japan's standards. That it only translates to $58M USD isn't all that relevant to them.
87M still way better than whatever big budget game is developed by western devs, you can't have it both ways, unless you're doing it in China and you can pay an army of devs with pennies 🤷‍♂️
 
Cut the old-school way to market your games, gamers now don't need this cause in 2025, it's definitely a sign of insecurity to spend that much on marketing. As far as I know Sony invest a lot on Real Estate like I do and McDonalds. Diversify your portfolio for income stream and to free yourself from life stressors.
 
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Those budgets for FF7R are insane. Assuming the 3rd game has a similar budget that's 600M for three games and I know that 200M is basically standard now in AAA but that doesn't make it any less crazy to me.

What The Hell Wtf GIF
It's $200 mil for Western devs in places like California or London. It should NOT be the budget in Japan where salaries and office space (outside very central Tokyo/Osaka/Kyoto) are a lot lower.

This just shows SE's incompetence.
 
This is nonsense.

The report compared B-Tier Capcom titles to flagship Square Enix ones.

If you were angling to push for change which is what these activist investors are doing, that's exactly what you would do.

Let's compare a Final Fantasy title to a Resident Evil or Monster Hunter Wilds. I bet they're very close.
 
This is nonsense.

The report compared B-Tier Capcom titles to flagship Square Enix ones.

If you were angling to push for change which is what these activist investors are doing, that's exactly what you would do.

Let's compare a Final Fantasy title to a Resident Evil or Monster Hunter Wilds. I bet they're very close.


DD2 is Capcom's first $70 game. The comparison is perfectly apt, it's not an 'SD' game, per SE.
 
DD2 is Capcom's first $70 game. The comparison is perfectly apt, it's not an 'SD' game, per SE.

As i said, compare flagship franchises to flagship franchises.

Comparing Monster Hunter Rise to FFVII Rebirth is absolutely ridiculous, and it's just transparently poor agenda pushing.
 
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too many Western DEI consultants like Sweet Baby involved. that was peak DEI era
Wtf is this cope? Hahaha expenses high- blame the LGBTQ? Didn't know the CEO was part of that community.
The USD figures at current exchange rates translate to:

133 million for FFVII Remake
118 million for Rebirth
87 million for Forespoken
58 million for XVI
Wild that FF XVI only cost ~$58million USD. Game looked stunning and had great voice actors.
It shows though. Rebirth's graphic and production value is top tier.
Top tier? Isn't it still missing FSR4 and XeSS on PC? And the lighting is just… ass.
 
From what I understood they put A LOT of time and money into the game engine, because they wanted to use it internally all over Square.
This of course increased the costs, and when the game turned out as it did the engine was trashed too...

Good use of investment money...
Should have just made an Agnis Philosophy game like everybody wanted.
 
They should just stick with the ff7 remake combat system for the next mainline FF. Stop trying to reinvent the wheel each game (like they have 11 onwards). Save some cash. Don't make it 100 hours. I wouldn't be bothered with a 30 hour game as long as it's quality.
It amazes me how companies aren't figuring out that we don't need some 100 hour journey to play your game. Meanwhile Capcom is releasing like 10 hour RE games and people are loving it.
 
From what I understood they put A LOT of time and money into the game engine, because they wanted to use it internally all over Square.
This of course increased the costs, and when the game turned out as it did the engine was trashed too...

Good use of investment money...

I think you're right. But they have that now with Rebirth's engine.
 
This data is garbage. There's zero chance FF16 cost less than Rebirth, DD2 or Forespoken. It had a longer development cycle, had more people working on it (see the credits) and Square themselves have publicly commented on FF16s high dev costs in public statements. Public companies don't necessarily share information like this hostile shareholders.

This same garbage document cites a random steam review to bash DQ3.
 
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It's kind of crazy that we still haven't had any update on FFXVI's sales.

Officially, it's still stuck at 3 million copies sold, with no new update since then.

It really makes you wonder if the sales are as disastrous as some people claim…
 
Multiple sources are cited under each relevant slide.


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Also, I think you mean 'made up', 'made out' means something completely different.
By made up I meant they did put there random numbers out of their ass, because Newzoo doesn't make these specific estimations (because as I mentioned they don't have proper related data to analyze) for these things and that these companies don't share that data in their IR materials. "Third-Party Research Organization" may mean "random 4chan post" or "my cousin's personal guess".

They could have made a very rough but somewhat decent estimate of the budgets by considering the amount of people on the game credits and the years under development, but doint so the results would have been very different than the ones they posted there.

There are several other graphs you didn't quote that also are made up. But a few include real data reported in the IR material provided by the companies.
 
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This data is garbage. There's zero chance FF16 cost less than Rebirth, DD2 or Forespoken. It had a longer development cycle, had more people working on it (see the credits) and Square themselves have publicly commented on FF16s high dev costs in public statements. Public companies don't necessarily share information like this hostile shareholders.

This same garbage document cites a random steam review to bash DQ3.
This is true how would they know the dev costs for these games?
 
FFXVI being one of the worst selling FF is not surprising. Nobody asked for an action game for the mainline series. I didn't hate it, but even FFXIII was more enjoyable.
 
How did that turd cost more than ff16

If they allocated all that budget from forspoken to ff16 it would have been a better game.
Well forspoken was not tht at first it was final fantasy 16 actually called agni philopshy. Then it seems they split the idea into 2 games probly to capitalize on this good idea and removed the final fantasy aspects because they thought final fantasy sells good by its name alone so they can make 2 games tht sell. 2 games sell better then 1 they though instead then they released 2 average games amd did not sell. It was a bad idea should have stuck with igni philopshy for ff16
 
Kinda stupid a mainline FF current gen game cost less than a remake (divided into 3 parts) and a new ip that's given bare bones compared to every other game on that list.
Ff16 was a quick cashgrab. It showed . The real ff16 was igni philosophical and they messed it up and turned it into forspoken
 
The luminous engine had such potential, wish they didn't shelf it. 😔
The cost being so bloated is very much due to development costs of lumin engine along with the game.
They had to update and build onto the engine for next gen. That was factored into the forsaken budget.
 
But in Forspoken they had to figure out how to get her to "move this with her mind". So a lot of budget went it the "moving shit with my mind" part. Thus, it pushed up the budget significantly.
 
The cost of Forspoken relative to 16 makes no sense. In of itself, it's not that expensive compared to something like Concord. However, it would be like the new Onimusha having a much bigger budget than Resident Evil 9. FF17 should have the biggest budget of any other game they are making.
 
People who bet big money on Forspoken should be out of their jobs for good. Even if gameplay would turn out better the protagonist was doing a solid work in driving potential customers away. I remember seeing a few gameplays and convincing myself it's not someone I would want to befriend when playing the game, quite the opposite.
 
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