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[diffusionx]

I'm not interested in Xbox at all because. My largest collection is by far on Steam, and with the demise of exclusives, consoles have lost their appeal as a platform for me. I want my next console to be able to play my Steam library on a compact device in my living room.

And I much prefer hardware that is a well-designed, optimized console-like PC than building a PC in a mini case, which is not only very expensive but also loses many of the conveniences of custom-built hardware, such as silly things like being able to turn it on remotely. And Valve's machine is a potato.

if you think this is an audience ("people who already own games on PC and want another PC that they can put under their TV) that could drive an entire massive product launch you have major main character syndrome. It doesn't change my point at all.

This is even if Microsoft can pull off the UI and I am dubious.

 

[Topher]

Where did you hear that?
You can't go out to Windows desktop and install whatever you want?

Where did you hear that?
No NexusMods?

Yup.

The items you quoted is just speculation on my part. But it hinges on what K KeplerL2 and HeisenbergFX4 have said about this being a console. I just can't see admin level access to the OS in that scenario.

 

[IntentionalPun]

"OEM consoles by manufacturers like ASUS. First Party Xbox serves as baseline, could see more higher end premium consoles from OEMs as well as cheaper slimmed down versions from a variety of companies"

That sounds like a headache for devs to optimize their games, but whatever, not interested in the poor man's version, I want to see how over the top powerful this Xbox-PC-hybrid is gonna be now that I guess they're not trying to adjust to a budget like on a normal console

They probably won't optimize their games for it.

There's no real reason MS can't do what nVidia and others already do and have their own settings optimizations figured out. I 95% rely on nVidia app (formerly GeForce experience) and my games are basically plug and play that way. Just kind of annoying you have to launch a game first most times and quit before running their "Optimize" option.

But I also think coming up with the right engine settings is a very loose form of the word "optimizations." Even if devs for whatever reason choose to come up with settings profiles to what will amount to a tiny fraction of PCs out there, they aren't going to be doing anything more than that.

 

[MisterXDTV]

if you think this is an audience ("people who already own games on PC and want another PC that they can put under their TV) that could drive an entire massive product launch you have major main character syndrome. It doesn't change my point at all.

This is even if Microsoft can pull off the UI and I am dubious.

They want us to believe MS is gonna invent an "HDMI out" port on a PC....

Unreal

 

[Fess]

The items you quoted is just speculation on my part. But it hinges on what K KeplerL2 and HeisenbergFX4 have said about this being a console. I just can't see admin level access to the OS in that scenario.

To me it sounds like it's both.

1. A regular Windows device booting into Xbox App, like the Ally. And there you can install whatever you want, you just can't launch everything from Xbox App.

2. A console which can run Xbox Series and older console games. Either through a separate console mode you boot into, or through some launcher digging into the Xbox specific hardware AMD put into the Magnus APU.

 

[Topher]

To me it sounds like it's both.

1. A regular Windows device booting into Xbox App, like the Ally. And there you can install whatever you want, you just can't launch everything from Xbox App.

2. A console which can run Xbox Series and older console games. Either through a separate console mode you boot into, or through some launcher digging into the Xbox specific hardware AMD put into the Magnus APU.

Could be. Mine was just one guess out of many.

 

[Edmund]

I have brought this up before here but like my son who spends most of his work day looking at a PC screen would like to PC game but doesn't really want the hassle of a gaming PC

If they can nail this machine and still have a console like experience where it can go under your TV and you pick up your controller and turn it on and jump into gaming at the right price then maybe

If you retired in your 30s, you must be filthy rich. Can I apply to be your son please?

 

[Shogmaster]

Soooo..... potentially a 3rd party ODM could decide to go full LLMtard with this and sell you a $6000 96GB GDDR7 version via clam shelling 4GB modules?

On second thought, that would be more like $10K. LOLOL

 

[bender]

Xbox's first-party console will be the baseline, quintessential "Xbox" experience, but we could see more expensive, even more super-premium Xbox "consoles" from Microsoft's Windows partners, as well as slimmed-down, more affordable options on top. Expect a smorgasbord of innovations in the coming years on this front, from a variety of companies.

What good is a baseline if your partners can go below it?

 

[Shogmaster]

Xbox's first-party console will be the baseline, quintessential "Xbox" experience, but we could see more expensive, even more super-premium Xbox "consoles" from Microsoft's Windows partners, as well as slimmed-down, more affordable options on top. Expect a smorgasbord of innovations in the coming years on this front, from a variety of companies.

What good is a baseline if your partners can go below it?

Baseline might have two m.2 slots where cheapo might have only one like Steam Machine. Shit like that prolly.

 

[bender]

Baseline might have two m.2 slots where cheapo might have only one like Steam Machine. Shit like that prolly.

True and I was thinking about that, but those types of cuts would most likely not provide meaningful cost savings. More affordable? Sure. But you aren't going to recapture that $300 Series S audience.

 

[crazyriddler]

if you think this is an audience ("people who already own games on PC and want another PC that they can put under their TV) that could drive an entire massive product launch you have major main character syndrome. It doesn't change my point at all.

This is even if Microsoft can pull off the UI and I am dubious.

It seems like you know more about the market than Valve and Microsoft.

 

[Shogmaster]

True and I was thinking about that, but those types of cuts would most likely not provide meaningful cost savings. More affordable? Sure. But you aren't going to recapture that $300 Series S audience.

That was never the point with Magnus (the fucking SoC is 407mm²).

 

[Topher]

So.....with the way Microsoft has been doing things of late, how much Copilot integration do you think we can expect in this thing? Controller going to have a dedicated button?

 

[bender]

That was never the point with Magnus (the fucking SoC is 407mm²).

No shit. It's why the pricing section of the article doesn't hold up to any scrutiny.

 

[IntentionalPun]

It seems like you know more about the market than Valve and Microsoft.

Valve isn't even attempting to make a true mass market product; at least nothing even close to what game consoles do.

MS is exiting the console business with ~30 million sales and is considered a hard flop. Getting even 5 million sales for a set-top-box PC would be a massive success relative to that industry.

Maybe MS doens't know that and actually thinks they can outdo Xbox Series sales with an expensive PC hybrid but I seriously doubt that. They are morons but they aren't that big of morons. They are just trying to make Windows Store more popular and trying to entice XBox owners to their PC.

 

[crazyriddler]

Valve isn't even attempting to make a true mass market product; at least nothing even close to what game consoles do.

MS is exiting the console business with ~30 million sales and is considered a hard flop. Getting even 5 million sales for a set-top-box PC would be a massive success relative to that industry.

Maybe MS doens't know that and actually thinks they can outdo Xbox Series sales with an expensive PC hybrid but I seriously doubt that. They are morons but they aren't that big of morons. They are just trying to make Windows Store more popular and trying to entice XBox owners to their PC.

What makes you think Microsoft wants that? They have focused on software and making their own brand of hardware to establish a presence. They don't need to sell 100 million units because, unlike Sony or Nintendo, they don't need to sell Xbox consoles to sell games.

 

[Shogmaster]

So.....with the way Microsoft has been doing things of late, how much Copilot integration do you think we can expect in this thing? Controller going to have a dedicated button?

Prolly the background OS would hog the NPU and feed you annoying hints about the game as you play and shit like that.

 

[DeepEnigma]

So.....with the way Microsoft has been doing things of late, how much Copilot integration do you think we can expect in this thing? Controller going to have a dedicated button?

 

[Shogmaster]

No shit. It's why the pricing section of the article doesn't hold up to any scrutiny.

Didn't bother reading article. lol

It would only annoy me.

 

[IntentionalPun]

What makes you think Microsoft wants that? They have focused on software and making their own brand of hardware to establish a presence. They don't need to sell 100 million units because, unlike Sony or Nintendo, they don't need to sell Xbox consoles to sell games.

I feel like you aren't reading your own posts or something lol

 

[bender]

Didn't bother reading article. lol

It would only annoy me.

It reads like "no Xbox console user left behind" when it assumes a $1000 price point and minor cuts to the design can overcome that. If I were a betting bot, I'd say it will come in closer to $1500 than $1000 as it seems Microsoft is done with subsidizing. This really feels like a solution without a problem. My long running joke about the race to 8M lifetime sales might have been far too generous.

 

[MisterXDTV]

Xbox's first-party console will be the baseline, quintessential "Xbox" experience, but we could see more expensive, even more super-premium Xbox "consoles" from Microsoft's Windows partners, as well as slimmed-down, more affordable options on top. Expect a smorgasbord of innovations in the coming years on this front, from a variety of companies.

What good is a baseline if your partners can go below it?

He doen't even know what "baseline" means...

 

[Shogmaster]

It reads like "no Xbox console user left behind" when it assumes a $1000 price point and minor cuts to the design can overcome that. If I were a betting bot, I'd say it will come in closer to $1500 than $1000 as it seems Microsoft is done with subsidizing. This really feels like a solution without a problem. My long running joke about the race to 8M lifetime sales might have been far too generous.

Valve has what, 5M Steam Deck sales and bought Gaben a 500M boat for funsies?

MS has finally decided that hardware isn't the point. Its the platform. Instead of bashing against the same brick wall for 6th generation, they are doing what they should have after the XB One fuckup.

MS isnt $3Tn company because they sold PCs. Its because they sold the OS on 97% of the PCs sold. Gabe figured it out way back and now MS is clued in.

 

[bender]

MS has finally decided that hardware isn't the point. Its the platform. Instead of bashing against the same brick wall for 6th generation, they are doing what they should have after the XB One fuckup.

And yet they are still releasing new hardware with aspirations for even more in the future, if the article has any merit, so I disagree that they are doing what they should be doing.

 

[DavidGzz]

okay lets make a point what is a console?

A neutered PC. Magnus is a console+.

But seriously. This whole argument reminds me of when people make threads asking opinions on what makes a RPG.

 

[IntentionalPun]

MS has finally decided that hardware isn't the point. Its the platform. Instead of bashing against the same brick wall for 6th generation, they are doing what they should have after the XB One fuckup.

Eh.. MS has been trying to make Windows Store a thing for nearly 15 years. They were way more successful with their gaming platform that was exclusive to their hardware literally right from the start as well as the bitter end. At no point in Xbox's history has Windows Store even sold a tiny fraction of the Games Xbox has, and that includes today when Xbox hardware is a bit of a joke sales wise.

There is also a serious irony to your post in that MS's latest attempt at "making Windows Store a thing" is partly via hardware lol In fact hardware is key to their plans since they know they aren't making inroads into desktop PC gamers hence why they are going after the handheld / HTPC niches (and trying to get the HTPC market to take off as it never really did)

It's true the real money is in owning the store, but the only stores really competing at Valve's level are the ones attached to hardware, which is why MS is trying to get XBox buyers to move to PC gaming who aren't fully invested in Steam and they are hoping they can attract publishers to Windows Store because windows FSE will be front and center on theirs and other devices.

It's a last ditch effort only enabled by their failure in the console space, not some realization they suddenly came to.

As it stands there are 3 stores that are close to or past Steam's level.. Playstations, Nintendo's and Xbox's (by that I mean the ACTUAL Xbox store lol) . Nothing else is even within pecking range of those 4.

 

[diffusionx]

It seems like you know more about the market than Valve and Microsoft.

Valve made the Steam deck to sell Steam software. Every steam deck sold is more people on steam. Every game sold on Steam, is more money for Valve. It actually is very much like a console in this regard. Even if Valve sells only a few million of the cubes, it's more customers locked into Steam.

This stupid thing, the only thing people talk about, including yourself, is using it to play Steam games. In other words it doesn't help Microsoft sell games or grow their own (basically moribund) Xbox on PC platform at all. Whether you buy Forza Horizon 6 on Steam on your existing PC or with this thing, it's all the same to Microsoft.

if they sell a few million of these, all they did was become a very minor and shitty PC manufacturer, and that is a really poor business for a software maker to get into.

 

[Skifi28]

how much Copilot integration do you think we can expect in this thing?

How does the official name being "Xbox copilot" sound to you? I'd bet adam's left testicle.

 

[MisterXDTV]

Valve made the Steam deck to sell Steam software. Every steam deck sold is more people on steam. Every game sold on Steam, is more money for Valve. It actually is very much like a console in this regard. Even if Valve sells only a few million of the cubes, it's more customers locked into Steam.

This stupid thing, the only thing people talk about, including yourself, is using it to play Steam games. In other words it doesn't help Microsoft sell games or grow their own (basically moribund) Xbox on PC platform at all. Whether you buy Forza Horizon 6 on Steam on your existing PC or with this thing, it's all the same to Microsoft.

if they sell a few million of these, all they did was become a very minor and shitty PC manufacturer, and that is a really poor business for a software maker to get into.

 

[mayham2199]

My man Heisenberg, I wasn't referring to you... I was referring to his narrative, and with that irony, I was agreeing with you. In fact, I already liked your post

I meant that many people need to omit details in their arguments to strengthen their narrative... Like saying that the Gabecube runs the same games and will be cheaper, but they "forget" (as you pointed out) that the Xbox Next would run those same games but utterly outclasses the Gabecube in terms of power.

I thought it was clear that the irony wasn't directed at you, but at the narrative from person you were quoting... I should have emphasized that to avoid confusion. Sorry.

They don't even run the same games. Steamos can't run several popular MP games.

 

[Neo_game]

Nothing new, we already knew this from earlier leaks. Low spec version though it is technically possible I guess by lowering clock speed, memory and power, cooling requirements. I wonder if Xbox Hybrid might be the low spec, base version and OEM version be the one with 36gb memory. 48gb rumor, sounds too expensive.

 

[Baki]

MS wants to absorb the Steam audience. I think they'll let Steam users import their library but make it hard to purchase directly on Steam through the box. If you want something more open, buy the ROG Ally version. What's most important for MS about this project is Windows-Xbox mode, turning all gaming PCs into Windows Box that prioritise the Windows-Xbox launcher. If this flops, that's OK, because they will make most of their gaming money from publishing games. Essentially, instead of Xbox absorbing ABK, ABK absorbed Xbox.

 

[adamsapple]

MS wants to absorb the Steam audience. I think they'll let Steam users import their library but make it hard to purchase directly on Steam through the box. If you want something more open, buy the ROG Ally version. What's most important for MS about this project is Windows-Xbox mode, turning all gaming PCs into Windows Box that prioritise the Windows-Xbox launcher. If this flops, that's OK, because they will make most of their gaming money from publishing games. Essentially, instead of Xbox absorbing ABK, ABK absorbed Xbox.

If it's supposedly going to be able to run Steam, then that goes without saying.

 

[viveks86]

He doen't even know what "baseline" means...

He said baseline experience. Not baseline performance or cost.

 

[Ozriel]

if you think this is an audience ("people who already own games on PC and want another PC that they can put under their TV) that could drive an entire massive product launch you have major main character syndrome. It doesn't change my point at all.

This is even if Microsoft can pull off the UI and I am dubious.

But just weeks ago, you fully understood the target audience.

"I am increasingly becoming that person" indeed

 

[diffusionx]

But just weeks ago, you fully understood the target audience.

"I am increasingly becoming that person" indeed

Steam Machine is a niche device (like the deck) while this is supposed to be the successor Xbox, totally different devices.

If MS is fine with selling a couple million of these ok, but why bother if you're Microsoft. I addressed this point in the next post.

 

[Ozriel]

Valve made the Steam deck to sell Steam software. Every steam deck sold is more people on steam. Every game sold on Steam, is more money for Valve. It actually is very much like a console in this regard. Even if Valve sells only a few million of the cubes, it's more customers locked into Steam.

This stupid thing, the only thing people talk about, including yourself, is using it to play Steam games. In other words it doesn't help Microsoft sell games or grow their own (basically moribund) Xbox on PC platform at all. Whether you buy Forza Horizon 6 on Steam on your existing PC or with this thing, it's all the same to Microsoft.

if they sell a few million of these, all they did was become a very minor and shitty PC manufacturer, and that is a really poor business for a software maker to get into.

So…it is 'stupid' and 'shitty' because consumers will want to play Steam games on it?

Lmao

 

[diffusionx]

So…it is 'stupid' and 'shitty' because consumers will want to play Steam games on it?

Lmao

it's extremely stupid from Microsoft's POV and it turns them into a shitty PC manufacturer, yes.

 

[Ozriel]

Steam Machine is a niche device (like the deck) while this is supposed to be the successor Xbox, totally different devices.

If MS is fine with selling a couple million of these ok, but why bother if you're Microsoft. I addressed this point in the next post.

You were asking who this is for.

Meanwhile you already knew.

it's extremely stupid from Microsoft's POV and it turns them into a shitty PC manufacturer, yes.

It's actually pretty sensible. Who would have bought a regular Xbox next gen with no exclusives and all their games on PlayStation?

They've been a PC maker for years. Ever heard of Surface before?

If they end up making no dent with the Xbox PC store, they'll probably count it as a win if they push back against SteamOS. And they won't be losing money on the hardware anyway.

 

[diffusionx]

You were asking who this is for.

Meanwhile you already knew.

Well no, because I have no interest in playing Xbox One games or Xbox Series games and have no desire to pay for that functionality.

 

[Ozriel]

Well no, because I have no interest in playing Xbox One games or Xbox Series games and have no desire to pay for that functionality.

You're not being charged for that. It's the same chipset that'll handle that function.

Ideally, this should be cheaper than an equivalently specced mini PC.

But if sub PS5 visuals are what you want, then yes, the Steam Machine may be a fit for you.

 

[MisterXDTV]

Well no, because I have no interest in playing Xbox One games or Xbox Series games and have no desire to pay for that functionality.

MS is banking on Xbox 360 games

 

[Gambit2483]

The mass market doesn't want an expensive PC disguised as a console. Who is this for?

 

[crazyriddler]

Valve made the Steam deck to sell Steam software. Every steam deck sold is more people on steam. Every game sold on Steam, is more money for Valve. It actually is very much like a console in this regard. Even if Valve sells only a few million of the cubes, it's more customers locked into Steam.

This stupid thing, the only thing people talk about, including yourself, is using it to play Steam games. In other words it doesn't help Microsoft sell games or grow their own (basically moribund) Xbox on PC platform at all. Whether you buy Forza Horizon 6 on Steam on your existing PC or with this thing, it's all the same to Microsoft.

if they sell a few million of these, all they did was become a very minor and shitty PC manufacturer, and that is a really poor business for a software maker to get into.

The difference is that this time Microsoft intends to make money from the sale of the next Xbox, rather than subsidising it and then recouping the cost through software sales. This is why its software is available on all platforms. Microsoft has long since stopped trying to sell software from its store. Instead, it aims to attract people to its gamepass subscription. This is NOT incompatible with having games on Steam, since Steam does not offer a similar service.

 

[Smoke6]

Honestly, I think this is Microsoft's smartest venture in years. Instead of chasing traditional console hardware numbers, they're focusing on Magnus — a move that plays directly into their core strengths in the PC space. With their control over Windows and deep OS-level optimization, they're planting a long-term seed in the market where they have the most leverage.

If Microsoft had explored this direction back in the late Xbox 360 era, they could have built a massive alternative storefront that genuinely challenged Valve's dominance. An ecosystem parallel to — and competitive with — the Steam marketplace could have existed today.

Magnus won't threaten Steam immediately, but ten years from now it could develop into a serious force. Ignoring that possibility would be shortsighted. Smart companies pay attention to every move in the market — because the smallest seed today can become the biggest competitor tomorrow.

This has to be a joke post right? Steam has there fanbase and nobody is gonna jump ship to use windows as I seen and read countless times on forums everywhere!

So here's the rub:

That 30% everyone gets from third party games… Xbox can kiss that all the way goodbye due to their games everywhere initiatives! Why would go to their eco system that just recently shutdown access to their touted handheld and buy games?

If I'm a steam player what sense would that make?

I say that to say that if steam wasn't included in this or name dropped like how rappers do other artists and celebs to get that "wow" factor. I don't think you'd be feeing this way at all!

Take away steam and why do you have?

 

[Smoke6]

The difference is that this time Microsoft intends to make money from the sale of the next Xbox, rather than subsidising it and then recouping the cost through software sales. This is why its software is available on all platforms. Microsoft has long since stopped trying to sell software from its store. Instead, it aims to attract people to its gamepass subscription. This is NOT incompatible with having games on Steam, since Steam does not offer a similar service.

Make money from who and how?

I'm sure steam is not paying MS for them to out there storefront on this device? I'd say halo 7 comes to everywhere right and steam has a sale on the game day one compared to Xbox or whoever, why would I log onto my Xbox and purchase this game through their eco system when you can do it from anywhere else?

Even if you do get it from the Xbox full UI or whatever, does MS charge steam that 30% and if so how ridiculous does that become? Steam has its own drives and services without that need

 

[Smoke6]

What makes you think Microsoft wants that? They have focused on software and making their own brand of hardware to establish a presence. They don't need to sell 100 million units because, unlike Sony or Nintendo, they don't need to sell Xbox consoles to sell games.

This is the problem! They're not selling enough games as it is! They're losing on all fronts on the gaming space and have been for quite a while! Look at the massive losses they've accrued this gen by barely selling 30m consoles and then raised the price on newer hardware.

I dunno man…the cost of ram and all that going on right now I think the stars are lining up for them to just say fuck it at this point! There's rumors of Satya retiring and if Amy hood or the other dude mentioned take his place… this is dead in the water for reals

 

[Sooner]

Can't f-ing wait

For a mid PC? Can't you go get one today and put an Xbox sticker on it?

 

[FF:Enhanced_Reality]

I said this when steam originally tried the steam machines. It should have been Microsoft.