Support NeoGAF

[MisterXDTV]

I never said anything about Linux, now did I? PC isn't defined by any operating system. PC is an open slate that you can do anything you want with.

I mean a PC has to have an operating system on it to work, right???

How many OS are there? Windows and Linux

I'm really confused here, to be honest

Seems like you are trying to argue with me for no logical reason

 

[The Mad Draklor]

So only the OS with the most market share can be called "PC", right?

It is pretty ironic he shares the Steam hardware survey numbers show Linux is continuing to rise. The previous December 2025 results had it drop by 0.01 points, but has since been revised to actually have risen for the 3rd straight month.

 

[MisterXDTV]

It is pretty ironic he shares the Steam hardware survey numbers show Linux is continuing to rise. The previous December 2025 results had it drop by 0.01 points, but has since been revised to actually have risen for the 3rd straight month.

Amazing rise indeed when the ratio is still 94% to 3%

Just leave the NeoGaf bubble and check the real world for God's sake

Ask 100 people what "Bazzite" is, 98 won't even answer...

 

[The Mad Draklor]

Amazing rise indeed when the ratio is still 94% to 3%

Just leave the NeoGaf bubble and check the real world for God's sake

Ask 100 people what "Bazzite" is, 98 won't even answer...

Compared to how much it rose in 2023 and 2024, it's actually quite substantial.

But then again, I'm talking to someone who is only able to judge numbers in a vacuum...

 

[Baki]

In today's market conditions, making money selling hardware is practically impossible. Unless, of course, they set a market price based on the cost of components, but then no one will buy it (the price tag is unlikely to please). Typically, such hardware is sold at breakeven or negative at launch, to build a user base.

Minecraft, COD, Diablo—these brands are currently generating revenue for them, but as we can see from their financial reports, it's not helping them much, for a variety of reasons. So far, Activision - Blizzard's acquisition of has been more of a negative than a positive, and according to recent news, we may be saying goodbye to several more studios this year (possibly). So, again, it's unclear why this should suddenly turn into a profit if they can't do so now.
Elder Scrolls - Let's wait for the release, otherwise I have a feeling I'll have grandchildren before this game comes out.
3rd party publisher – again, there are so many publishers on the market, it's completely unclear why everyone should suddenly abandon other publishers and rush to Microsoft. To do that, they would have to offer better terms than others, which they don't yet have.

The entire pc hardware market is based on making profit from hardware. Microsoft is going to join them but at the expense of collapsing the Xbox user base by 90%.

Microsoft is the biggest 3rd party publisher in the world after buying the #1 for $69B.

 

[Topher]

I mean a PC has to have an operating system on it to work, right???

How many OS are there? Windows and Linux

I'm really confused here, to be honest

Seems like you are trying to argue with me for no logical reason

lol...even if that were the case, it takes two to tango and so it applies to you as well.

Obviously operating systems are needed, but none of them define PC. If that confuses you then I don't know what else to tell you. I say we drop it.

 

[MisterXDTV]

lol...even if that were the case, it takes two to tango and so it applies to you as well.

Obviously operating systems are needed, but none of them define PC. If that confuses you then I don't know what else to tell you. I say we drop it.

Seems to me like the only point of contention here is this:

"Would a device that were locked to Windows OS still be a PC?"

To me, it clearly would be, to you it wouldn't...

I don't see any other part where my opinion is different from yours

 

[Topher]

Seems to me like the only point of contention here is this:

"Would a device that were locked to Windows OS still be a PC?"

To me, it clearly would be, to you it wouldn't...

I don't see any other part where my opinion is different from yours

Then let's leave it there

 

[viveks86]

Then let's leave it there

 

[Topher]

 

[DeltaPolarBear]

I've been working in retail and wholesale distribution for over 25 years. And all I can say is that no one will release a product to the market that can't make money. Especially large corporations; they have to report to shareholders for it. So far, everything I've seen and read doesn't really fit with the word "profit."

That is why i told people to stop dreaming about the machine being affordable; i am expecting the hardware to be sold at 30% profit. The hardware cant be subsidised.

 

[memoryman3]

That is why i told people to stop dreaming about the machine being affordable; i am expecting the hardware to be sold at 30% profit. The hardware cant be subsidised.

Only way I can see it being subsidised is if Microsoft lock you to a 24 month contract for Game Pass.

 

[Punished Miku]

Only way I can see it being subsidised is if Microsoft lock you to a 24 month contract for Game Pass.

Don't threaten me with a good time.

 

[Maxchief6788]

If MS wants sure, it's only a business decision whether losing money from 3rd party store sales and potentially fewer Gamepass subscriptions is worth the benefits of "the new Xbox can run Playstation games!"

that's why they are putting their games EVERYWHERE to make up for the loss of 3rd party store money but also xcloud will grow rapidly. geforce is losing money for nvidia the same way stadia was losing money for google and we know how that ended up.

 

[Topher]

that's why they are putting their games EVERYWHERE to make up for the loss of 3rd party store money but also xcloud will grow rapidly. geforce is losing money for nvidia the same way stadia was losing money for google and we know how that ended up.

Where are you seeing that Geforce Now is losing money like Stadia did?

 

[DeltaPolarBear]

Only way I can see it being subsidised is if Microsoft lock you to a 24 month contract for Game Pass.

And what could they do if you refuse to pay and dare them to take the gamepass away? You can't threaten to end the contract if the user never needed it. If this was a console they could brick your machine. But this is a PC... MS couldn't stop you from just NOT PAY.

MS has no leverage. They can't force the PC user to do ANYTHING. The only way to profit is from hardware cost alone. So, those who dream of subsidized hardware can keep sleeping. You will be lucky if Nexbox is anywhere near Apple prices.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

Same here. IMO Microsoft has a chance to really do something special here but they cannot fuck it up. If it's a PC with target specs that guarantees a level of deep optimization for PC games to scale upwards for 5-8 years and I build itx so it's appealing to me in a very specific way.

God what I'd do be in the design room...

Why are you guys praying and hoping Microsoft are the ones who do this? If anything, Valve are much more likely to accomplish what you want to see, as they've been ahead of MS in the PC gaming space since 2004. And while people can scoff at rumored price leaks, Steam Machine is a product we know actually exists. It's tangible, we've seen it run, we've seen multiple people see it in person. We know what it's capable of doing.

Microsoft's effort is still mostly vaporware until it actually gets revealed, and if the first impression's as much as what ROG Ally was, then it's DOA.

Colloquially for like 2 decades PC Gaming has referred to Windows. Even the Linux machines today are running games designed and coded for.. you guessed it.. Windows.

Even in a greater context colloquially PC = Windows Machine. I think to techies it can mean something less specific but you are full of shit if you can't admit this is how "PC" has been used for decades by the majority of people.

If you say "I'll be installing Bazzite on my PC" people know you are referring to general Personal Computing.. language sometimes changes based on context, that's just how language and communication works.

All the better reason for Linux distros becoming genuine alternatives to the OS that built most of its market share off of anticompetitive & monopolistic market practices during the '80s and '90s

Amazing rise indeed when the ratio is still 94% to 3%

Just leave the NeoGaf bubble and check the real world for God's sake

Ask 100 people what "Bazzite" is, 98 won't even answer...

Windows is the McDonald's of OSes. Everyone might know of it, but it's also the lowest quality option if you actually have any taste (and are informed).

The entire pc hardware market is based on making profit from hardware. Microsoft is going to join them but at the expense of collapsing the Xbox user base by 90%.

Microsoft is the biggest 3rd party publisher in the world after buying the #1 for $69B.

They aren't the biggest 3P publisher, either. Even tho people are hyping it like the second coming of Jesus, GTA6 is going to demolish all sales of MS's collective output from the past five years, in its first year alone.

So AFAIK, Take Two are still the biggest 3P publisher. And arguably after them, Epic Games if you view Fortnite as a title they "publish" on other platforms, tho it's not a B2P game in the traditional sense.

Only way I can see it being subsidised is if Microsoft lock you to a 24 month contract for Game Pass.

That's something I was suggesting a while ago but it'd require significantly higher production volumes than what they're likely aiming for (even if the subsidy's only $100, if you're making 10 million units that's the BOM * 10 million units, still a lot of money being spent).

Also, the type of person Magnus is being aimed at probably already has a stacked Game Pass sub, so how would a 24-month contract work for them without refinancing the sub at a rate undoubtedly worst for the person who had the stacked sub prior?

 

[yogaflame]

This could be a $ 1200 dollar minimum. Anyway MS more like competing against Alienware and Steam Machine. To bad for MS pchybrid, Steam machine stole its thunder and it has more hype.

 

[ZehDon]

This could be a $ 1200 dollar minimum. Anyway MS more like competing against Alienware and Steam Machine. To bad for MS pchybrid, Steam machine stole its thunder and it has more hype.

Steam Machine has received a mixed response, whereas Microsoft's pc-hybrid hasn't been announced yet. I'm all for giving Microsoft a hard time, but let's at least pretend to be fair.

 

[Topher]

but let's at least pretend to be fair.

 

[kevboard]

This could be a $ 1200 dollar minimum. Anyway MS more like competing against Alienware and Steam Machine. To bad for MS pchybrid, Steam machine stole its thunder and it has more hype.

what are you talking about? the Steam Machine is absolutely DOA if the price is higher than 600€... and even that price is pushing it.

it won't even match Steam Deck sales, and the Steam Deck is a very niche product