Richard 92
Neo Member
Is PS6 still be the same Specifications as before vs Next Xbox? That means nearly less than 30% powerful?
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Is PS6 still be the same Specifications as before vs Next Xbox? That means nearly less than 30% powerful?
Tobimacoss
Member
The same game pass that MS is looking to expand, they're gonna let it die organically?
Where do you come up with your random theories and numbers.
crackajack
Member
It should further blur the lines of "proper" PC and console. The parts are anyway already practically identical despite "semicustom". Sony is running their version of BSD on similar AMD stuff MS is getting. MS abandoning a true console OS for an actual Windows just makes sense, and when the new Box can run old XBox stuff on it, it also should enable them to run the very same stuff on actual Windows too. MS should then allow full BC on PC and XBox (incl. any handhelds or whatever), while Sony still has yet to talk about their official RPCS3 solution and improving their rather lukewarm PS1/2 emulators. MS is cooked, but BC is much better solved already and should in theory be awesome with this.
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Team Andromeda
Member
And people who want to bash the Xbox are desperately trying to make out it will be a PC from a vendor and not a corp who can bulk buy and also done a deal with AMD to develop the SOC in the 1st place.
I would guess MS will still take a small hit on the cost and the console will come in at £800 to £900. MS have now more reason to look to push its next gen console with Vavle coming in with its own console and Windows gaming coming under a little preassure and I wouldn't put it past Vavle to look to make its own OS for the PC at some stage. So MS again will have a fight for the living room
vaibhavpisal
Member
I think whatever happened with xbox was good thing cause that Magnus is looking sweet.
MrTired
Member
Just backup what you said here's what KeplerL2 thought the prices of the two consoles were going to be at the end of last year. Obviously Ram prices have gone crazy but...
The performance delta between the two isn't going to be anywhere near double the price
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
No, I mean they are still supporting it now and they will continue to do so but I think there's a high chance it just ticks along. Stops being as good as it was and basically dies as we knew it.
I think that's a possibility. I don't want it to happen, personally. I like GP.
It was literally less than 3 years ago when there was a major inquest at Sony (with layoffs) over declining profit margins.
Sony of today aren't going to take a PS3 type loss.
You're proving my point if you're saying there was essentially no subsidy on the disc PS5 in the first year. The digital PS5 made up a very small fraction of the 1st year sales.
A weighted average of $50 subsidy per console is very apt in that case
Samsung's mobile division is entirely separate, and will have its profitability computed separately from the components business. Samsung also doesn't use the exact same displays they sell to others in their own phones.
Any venture with the potential to bring in hundreds of millions of dollars in annual profit is worthwhile, even for a business as large as Microsoft, Google or Apple.
Breakfast at Noon
Member
Unless they sack majority of leadership and completely change their approach to making videogames it's all for nowt.
Cumulus
Member
I continue to fail to see the appeal of a non upgradable PC with an XBOX logo. How many people are gonna shell out ~1200 bucks just for possible native backwards compatibility, most of which you have on PC anyways instead of going for a playstation at ~600-700 bucks or a fully open modular PC.
I see this as a continuation of MS third party strategy, that thing is basically just PR...
I see this as a continuation of MS third party strategy, that thing is basically just PR...
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Exactly, It wont be twice as powerful. Thats not how tech industry works with cost per performance. But if its 30 to 40 percent faster on raster and with better Raytracing etc then it will be in line with other products in tech and I think there will be people who will pay double if it delivers up to 50 percent better performance.
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HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
There is little doubt about that because one will be subsidized and one will not because one will have multiple store fronts and as far as we know, the other will not
Unless the markup is insane for the Xbox or Sony is returning to launch PS3 levels of subsidy, the performance delta would certainly have to reflect the large difference in BoM.
Good thing is, this will play all games from all teams
Except for Nintendo exclusives…but emulation exists.
Realistically, how much Subsidy do you think Sony is planning to eat? Especially since a lot of buyers will stick to the PS5 for a while, and devs will make games for PS5 for years.
You may well be living in an alternate reality where most PC gamers upgrade their devices past RAM and storage changes
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
I would think they will still try to keep the price at mainstream pricing IF prices of parts return to normal
MrTired
Member
Could be wrong but I believe the performance gap is similar to the current generation. However Magnus i believe will be superior in all facets compared to Xbox Series X compared to PS5 where the PS5 has some advantages.
Your correct in that there is a subset of consumers who will the price to performance ratio doesn't matter and will opt for the more performant device.
I would be right in saying that the unsubsidised device will be price to include a healthy profit margin ( don't know why 30% comes to mind), to account multiple storefronts.
Then it means they'll use parts aligned with that price. Because there's no way they're taking on a steep loss on every console.
The only way you're getting a $600 vs &1200 scenario is if the Xbox is significantly more powerful. Leaks align with that.
So it's not just driven by 'subsidized vs unsubsidized'.
Even at a 30% markup, you're looking at a significant increase in BOM compared to the PS6 (hundreds of dollars more) for you to get to a $600 vs $1200 scenario.
At that point, it becomes a 'you get what you pay for' value conversation.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
The problem with the PS5 vs Series X is they did end up being pound for pound around the same performance at the start of the gen. the 12TF vs 10TF argument didn't work because we had a fast and narrow apu vs a fat and slow apu. From all understandings of this Magnus APU it is going to be a beast in terms of size and power. so those who purely want the best performance of a console, could opt for the xbox.....if they can get around everything else about the company.
Orbital2060
Member
Digital Foundry comparisons are going to be fun
It will be closer to Xbox One X vs PS4 Pro
Cumulus
Member
Absolute nonsense. GPU/CPU upgrades are the norm for gaming PCs. There`s not that many people who always replace whole systems simply because it`s neither necessary nor cost effective.You may well be living in an alternate reality where most PC gamers upgrade their devices past RAM and storage changes
Being able to upgrade is quite literally the point of having modular systems and those who don`t want or need that already buy laptops or all-in-one-PCs, but in the gaming space the modular kind is vastly more common.
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diffusionx
Gold Member
Except it's not a console
MrTired
Member
As KeplerL2 stated the Magnus like the Xbox One X should have performance advantage in 98% comparisons. So unlike this generation were especially at launch PS5 ports were more performant that shouldn't be the case for Magnus.
I'll refer you to KeplerL2 post in the gap in performance for the next generation.
Also I through a random number for the marked up number however it could easily be more.
This is to account for those Power User who this device is trying to appeal, having the option to not interact with Microsoft again after the initial purchase of the console.
So hardware price will reflect a figure that will mitigate for the potential loss in content and services revenue from being a platform holder.
Acceptable performance delta but the pricing will not scale linearly with performance (20% more performance is more like 40% higher price). I still hope MS does well since nobody benefits from arrogant Sony.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Thats pretty substantial, I dont know how they market that as being twice the cost though. Interested to see more on all of this stuff.
IMO:
1. Pit user's Steam library to compete with user's PSN library
2. Offer a somewhat premium PC experience for a fraction of the cost
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Sounds great, it'll be my once-a-decade kind of purchase that replaces the 1060 I currently have as well as continuing the Xbox line.
diffusionx
Gold Member
1. they'll be marketing a pc to pc users, who already have a pc. maybe they need to upgrade but most pc users will look at the downside of this as much as the upside. The hardcore "PCMR" (cringe term but you know waht I mean) type look with disdain on prebuilts and this is a less configurable prebuilt.
2. If it's a PC with added Xbox hardware, and Microsoft is going to price it without subsidy, then it's not going to be a fraction of the cost. It's going to be the same cost. You will be paying PC prices for a PC. It's not going to be magic.
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David_Android
Neo Member
Series x is much more efficient than the Ps5, they really had to let it boost to the maximum and thus efficiency suffered. Average Series x 175 Watts, Ps5 always exceeds 200 watts average 220-230 Series x only in a few games like Gears 5. On avcerage sx is far more Power efficient. I tested this myself on over 80 Games.
SX is more raw Power but the ms os and the far greater ps install base let that ps5 be the lead plattform every time and or Pc.
Ps5 is work smarter but they unlocked the boost mode to the maximum thats why the old 9tflops rumors with its internal OC so to speak after SX reveal it got its 10TF with that. but overall they are the same, some games are heavy outliers where one leads 20% but thats the same with amd or nvidia gpus too.
David_Android
Neo Member
some cant accept that for some reason. its ridicolous to watch.
lol comparing pcs to console will be the new generation. uselss stuff. especiall yf there are oem version of magnus that will be faster but hey its not a pc right....
diffusionx
Gold Member
it's also weird because like, the OP states flat out this is a PC, but people are acting like this is a console.some cant accept that for some reason. its ridicolous to watch.
lol comparing pcs to console will be the new generation. uselss stuff. especiall yf there are oem version of magnus that will be faster but hey its not a pc right....
I need to stop going into this thread, it's like people are on totally different wavelengths.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
That is putting a lot of faith into Jez
diffusionx
Gold Member
isn't it consistent with what everything people are saying
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
asdasdasdbb
Member
It's both.
memoryman3
Member
You sure? There were third party Panasonic Gamecubes that played Gamecube games. If this Xbox is a Windows device (highly likely at this point), then surely the publishing terms must cover the Xbox store in general?
This is what Lisa Su stated
"And we're doing it all with backwards compatiblity, so gamers can access their favourite titles across devices"
So far we only know of one first party Xbox device, the console.
Xbox 360 games running on Xbox One were technically different binaries so relicensing was required. So are "Play Anywhere" titles. But wouldn't this case be running unaltered Xbox One/Xbox Series binaries on compatible devices?
David_Android
Neo Member
Loxus
Member
I still disagree with disabling of the cpu core.
It's was never done with any of the PS hardware from AMD.
Fess
Member
Gamepass is not dead for MS, subscriber numbers might not have increased as much as they hoped but the total is still above console sales, and remember that their end game plan was to have Gamepass on every screen.
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
Which at least one analyst believes we might not see until closer to 2030
Absolute nonsense.
I'd be shocked if the percentage of folks who upgrade surpasses 30%.
Additionally, most folks who upgrade choose to do so when performance dips significantly compared to new games. So basically, skipping one gen.
If you're already used to upgrading GPUs every other generation (so, 5 years interval), that's already nearly a console generation.
Magnus will start at a high enough RAM and GPU baseline that the vast majority of folks will be under no pressure to upgrade. AAA games will still be made with the weaker PS6 in mind.
And of course, SSD upgrades will be standard fare.
Cumulus
Member
Never heard such an utter bullshit claim.
30+ years of standardization for easy compatibility, guaranteeing plug and play for most parts, and then you go online seeing people go;
"No one does what the systems are built for and what the whole end-consumer silicon industry exists for".
yeah, we`re done.
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AtomicStarving
Member
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
The majority are not upgrading like people tend to think, just look at Steam surveys
David_Android
Neo Member
well see i guess. makes sense tho you dont need much power for an os and to save energy its great. hell 10 year old cpus or even older are esily enough for desktop tasks esepcially in a REAL console where the os does almost nothing. And can also be used in very cpu light games to save energy that can than be redistributed to the gpu so it can boost higher. which is extremely important especially in a extremely power limited console/s .
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Cumulus
Member
steam surveys only say that people tend to keep old stuff for a long time => Save money. How you go from that to that they definitely do whole system upgrades when they upgrade instead of continuing to be cost sensitive like before is beyond me. I´ve in my life never met a PC gamer that hasn`t at least upgraded his GPU separately.
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IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
Yeah especially on this forum we are just going in circles because of this lol
We probably won't know for sure for quite some time. But I'm pretty damn sure it's not a console lol
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Ellis
Member
They haven't increased. They've lowered. Even with more "screens" to make use of it on.
It's not dead right now, but it absolutely will be in a couple of years. You can pretty much guarantee that.
Team Andromeda
Member
Yeah, over 30 million subs is the end.,,Playsation fans crack me up
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