I don't think that perception has changed yet.
Rumor: Xbox 3 = 6-core CPU, 2GB of DDR3 Main RAM, 2 AMD GPUs w/ Unknown VRAM, At CES
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I don't think that perception has changed yet.
Products sell for what people are willing to pay. None of these company are forced to sell anything at $200-300. They chose to enter the market, and they chose to compete with the iPad not by making better software, or via better marketing but by spec bumping and price dropping. They are free to go about doing it that way if they want, but don't act like the iPad is a case of "Apple Premium".
When the iPad was rumored everyone assumed it would be $1,000+, instead they set the entry at $500. Does Apple make a profit? Sure, but companies don't make products out of the kindness of their hearts, they make them to make a profit.
Guek: How come more companies don't use this slight of hand magic brainwashing Apple does for creating loyal customers? If we agree all companies want to be successful, as or more so than Apple, and Apple is doing something other than making great products that make their customers happy and return for repeat service why aren't these other companies doing it?
Looking forward to what MS has instore for the next Xbox. I don't believe these latest rumors, and think it is still a few years off from releasing, but whatever they do if they stick with technologies like kinect it should be interesting.
I'm not arguing there will be a paradigm shift, but things like the edam on the 360 (although not utilised perhaps as much as desired) show a willingness to customise in a different direction to PC GPUs.
they're not aiming for the living room day one. If they're launching 2012 or early 2013 they'll be on 32/28nm. A noisy/hot box at that size would come down nicely with a shrink to 22nm after 18 months, just as the prices drop and mass market sales start.
all its doing is selling to nerdy nerds who want to play nerdy games in the first 12-18 months anyway, so whats the big deal?
there are a bunch of people on here who seem obsessed with mass market, living room penetration and low power consumption. Sure. Eventually. But I'm kind of with Dopeyfish here (except perhaps his STB numbers..). Nothing wrong with a power hungry box at launch, providing your roadmap includes getting that under control as quickly as possible.
Xbox 360 slim is 90W using a SoC? So you think maybe 125W for the next xbox? Thats crazy imo. First, SoC is where you go later in the generation to save costs. If you're trying to push anything, you would go with a more expensive, but traditional layout initially which means more heat but more power. So expecting only a tiny increase over a die shrunk, cost engineered 360 slim is just as crazy as dual GPUs etc.
I'm the guy who will be there day 1 for the next XBOX and I could not care less if the box is rather big as long as the technical improvements are here as long as it has the games to enjoy it.
But if MS gets a new console out at the same time as Halo 4 for 360, it better have something that makes it worth playing on the new one.
EricDiesel
Member
I'll pay attention if you post a meltdown about how "underpowered" it is, as these are ridiculous expectations. I'd temper them significantly if I were you.
You keep using this generation as a touchstone, but it's no longer relevant. Things are way different now than they were in 2005. The economy is in worse shape now. The Wii happened and, for better or worse, it shook up the market. Couple that with the 360's RRoD overheating issues... I really don't see the next XBox being some two GPU powerhouse. Not one bit.
not to mention the numbers game is pointless. What is your frame of reference? Saying maybe we'll get a 6xxx equivalent - are people thinking we'll get games that look like a PC game running on a 6xxx card? Because obviously we won't. Its possible that a 6xxx card will give us console games that look like a 7xxx card on a PC due to the closed architecture
so the numbers game is almost meaningless. I'm more interested in what devs can do with what they are given, and also how the big three will compare with each other.
so the numbers game is almost meaningless. I'm more interested in what devs can do with what they are given, and also how the big three will compare with each other.
dragonelite
Member
Something in 6950 ill be glad.
Considering devs can code to just one setup they can push a shitload more then they ever will out of the same card in a pc layout.
And im pretty sure directX will have some console optimization not posiible or not yet implemented on pc directX versions.
hoping for a 5. MS have a clear opportunity to spend more than the other two and really go for the throat. If they do that, then it could be the most powerful of the three.
I just hope the Wii hasn't rubbed off on MS/Sony
The "Wii happened" really means nothing. Things change all the time and just because Nintendo and the Wii's approach were successful this time, doesn't mean it would be again. Casuals are a fickle crowd.
HollovVpo1nt
Banned
Powerfull in terms of what? Hardware? If anything, next gen is going to be about features, now how much more polygons a char can have. The Xbox annihilated the PS2 and was tronger than the GC when it came to power. Didn't help them, at all.
Maybe for you , but the average consumer will go: "oooh pretty graphics, that's the best one!!!". And I couldn't see a big (if any at all) difference between PS2 and xbox.
yes hardware. Features need hardware. Most of the 'living room' crap doesn't need powerful hardware, you can do it fine on a basic STB - streaming etc.
And I don't just mean graphics. Level size, AI, physics blah blah, all benefit from power
I'm sure the fact that Nintendo and Sony had a massive reputation already and a huge fanbase read to buy their consoles, Microsoft didn't. They were just the new kids on the block.
With the 360, they established themselves and can now play the heavy hitter game again and succeed.
And as for the price discussion, I'm willing to pay premium dollars. Don't want some watered down cheap-o console that has to last me 6-7 years. I want top of the line and I'm ready to pay.
This six-core thing with two GPUs rumour, let's see if we can make it fit. How's this: it features an updated XCGPU with twice as many cores and a somewhat updated embedded GPU. This allows them to have full backwards compatibility (assuming it's more important to MS this time). To give it an extra punch, they accompany it with a new GPU, probably some derivative of a mobile HD7xxx chip. Six cores, two CPUs, 2GB sounds fitting, could be made into a small console. Is this plausible?
Lovely Salsa
Banned
Oh **** ***
I'd gladly pay 500 bucks for a monster machine! Whats the problem? The iphone costs more than that
Lovely Salsa
Banned
So is the rumor still up that they'll show it at CES or has it been debunked?
infinityBCRT
Member
I honestly think people are mixing up their personal desires with what would work business wise. A $399/$499 launch price would work. They key is that they'd have to be more aggressive in cutting the price than they were with the 360 (something which they admit they couldn't do due to RRoD).
herzogzwei1989
Banned
Xbox3 wont retail for more than $399 methinks.
REMEMBER CITADEL
Banned
The average consumer values other things over graphics, as Wii, DS, PS2 and countless other systems have proven in the past.
PS2 was the dominant console with 70+% of the market share so most developers weren't putting too much effort into GC and Xbox ports of their games. When they did, you got things like this or this.
"Stays"? Launch Xbox 360 was well below 200W. And even so, they're all dead now. Too much heat for that kind of size.
Launch PS3 was round about 200W, but it was bigger too. And ridiculed for its size by the very same people who would be interested in the next Xbox near launch.
FreeMufasa
Junior Member
Actually hope it's a monster and don't care if it costs $500+. I'll get it a few years into the gen anyway.
herzogzwei1989
Banned
exactly.
Slayer-33
Liverpool-2
$349 - $449
Odd pricepoint I know but MS is going to do it like that imo.
Shit is going to be pushed hardcore.
It's going to sell an assload.
I would rather have a larger console that is more powerful, than a weaker more aesthetically appealing one. I'm sure most gamers would agree. The casuals will jump ship when the redesign hits.
Are you seriously trying to imply that your average person buys the iPhone unlocked? Do you have any idea who Apple markets to? Hint: Idiots.
And gamers are what exactly? I'll be there first, 500 bucks, so what?. Hell, here where I live PS3 is still 449$, and 5 years ago it was 1000$, alot of people bought it.
Iphone unlocked is now 900$. City is practically full of them...
Risk Breaker
Member
Paying 40€ a month for 2 years and more than 100 upfront is still a shitload of money.
Personally I hope at least one of the two are large, powerful, well made and $450/$500. If you prefer to spend 300 every 2 years, go iOS.
Personally I could care less where the power's at for next gen. As long as there's a significant jump over PS360 (which even the Wii U will be) it won't matter. What'll matter the most is cost, and how well Nintendo, MS and Sony will balance that cost between staying competitive power-wise, and diversifying their hardware with unique features.
Seriously, anybody thinking that they're going to play the "cram in as much power as possible and charge a fuck-ton" game again must have been asleep the first 3 years of this gen.
Seriously, anybody thinking that they're going to play the "cram in as much power as possible and charge a fuck-ton" game again must have been asleep the first 3 years of this gen.
no wifi on the cheapest model is a joke so bad The Joker might come rape you at your place...
as for flash memory, there out to bay an expansion bay ala 360s at minimum.
Phone = console. Yep.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Not this again.
A phone is NOT a game console. You can't even begin to compare them.
specialguy
Banned
I think a 399/299 model is the best they can get away with reasonably at launch.
ALTHOUGH trying to push it to 499/399 might be worth it. It would still be $100 less than PS3's 599/499 launch.
Still, 499 just feels wrong and "too much" where 399 feels "ok"
Although, I do remember when the launch frenzy for PS3 came, people were paying 1k+ for them on ebay. I cant remember anymore exactly but I sold one for I think 1200. Sounds crazy now but I just assumed the guy was rich.
ALTHOUGH trying to push it to 499/399 might be worth it. It would still be $100 less than PS3's 599/499 launch.
Still, 499 just feels wrong and "too much" where 399 feels "ok"
Although, I do remember when the launch frenzy for PS3 came, people were paying 1k+ for them on ebay. I cant remember anymore exactly but I sold one for I think 1200. Sounds crazy now but I just assumed the guy was rich.
specialguy
Banned
Yeah, I believe so. That's really the key factor. They really put a 200 premium for Blu Ray, if they had gone DVD and put a $200 premium in for an extra 512 RAM and G80 GPU, it would have been a different story. But obviously they had a corporate strategy towards Blu Ray profits.
But, they had the Playstation might behind them, people expected the new playstation to just be the King, so they could afford to get away with something crazy like 599, not that it didn't bite them soon enough. Nobody will be in that position this time.
Lord Error
Insane For Sony
That perception started changing with being able to play DVD movies on PS2, and continued with bluray, netflix, online renting, all of which you can do on consoles. Of course games themselves have improved from the bleeps and blops of old into something that appears as a legitimate entertainment to someone who's never even been into games. I agree with you, for the younger it's not quite as much of a toy, at least for a portion of them.
-ImaginaryInsider
Member
With them packing in Kinect 2.0, it pretty much guarantees it.
Those specs have already been proven fake. Like 3 months ago.
Aizu_Itsuko
Member
I said they would be "neck and neck", "close enough", "within reasonable margins" or whatever you want to call it.
In other words, that the worldwide sales of both systems wouldn't differ much.
Aizu_Itsuko
Member
It will be so powerful it will have dual RODs... YES, THAT AWESOME!
Wait, really? Link?
Original source:
http://bbs.expreview.com/thread-46257-1-1.html
B3D and Hard already had their sources confirm its fakeness months ago.
http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1037718679&postcount=22
http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1037715769&postcount=1962
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