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[Combichristoffersen]

Sonic 2 is way easier. I'd argue 3 is easier too, because of how many Special Rings there are in each act.

I've never been able to get more than 2 emeralds in Sonic 2 :| Sonic 3 is doable, but harder than Sonic 1. Sonic 1 is generally a cakewalk IMO. Sonic CD was fairly easy too, except for bonus stage 5 being borked in the PSN/XBLA re-release >:|

So what's the deal behing the Eggman Vs. Robotnick debate? Which one's right?

Technically both are right. Robotnik is his actual name, while Eggman is a nickname Sonic began using, which Robotnik adopted.

Personally I call him Robotnik, Eggman sounds just awful to me.

 

[Box of Bunnies]

So what's the deal behing the Eggman Vs. Robotnick debate? Which one's right?

He was always called Eggman in Japan, but it was changed to Robotnik for the west because goofy, cartoonish villains can't have goofy names and instead need to sound sinister apparantley. Since Sonic Adventure/2, both are technically correct with Robotnik being his name and Eggman being an alias.

Only nostalgists who feel the need to hold the fort against any post-Mega Drive concepts really care though.

 

[Nocturnowl]

Decided to try and finish off Sonic 1 or at least make it to the final boss...

- Starlight Zone isn't too bad, not too good either but it's a breather zone so i'll take it, better than the previous zones that's for sure.

- Scrap Brain, never before have I made so many weird noises of surprise and terror in such swift succession, it's like every step of act 2 is met by some kind of hazard, fire out the floor, sudden swinging spike ball out of nowhere, floor falls open, jumped it, hit spring Noooooooo! and so forth, I had to laugh at the sheer randomness of it all, it's like a mess of hazards.

- Suddenly Labyrinth Zone returns, yeah you people weren't kidding, it actually is more labyrinth right down to the theme, after having Sonic drown due to my inability to have him drop between some blocks (controller incapacitated, using a fight stick, feels awkward but kind of fun) I stumbled upon what I assume was the shortcut so time saved.

- NO RINGS! CRUSH DEATHS! FINAL ZONE!
yep i'm out, it'll be left in Sonic 2 style stasis. As for how I got this far....

Spoiler

I abused the level select code when I got a game over, don't judge meeee!

On that note am I the only person who is terrified of crush based deaths in Sonic? they're so abrupt and often kind of screwy (whoops your toe was in the way, whoops the platform carried you into a spiky ceiling you couldn't see), only in Sonic do they make me "jump" like it's survival horror.

 

[Shadow Hog]

Sonic 2 is way easier. I'd argue 3 is easier too, because of how many Special Rings there are in each act.

Not to mention New Game +, so if you miss the rings the first time, there's every time thereafter to try again.

So what's the deal behing the Eggman Vs. Robotnick debate? Which one's right?

Both. Dr. Ivo "Eggman" Robotnik. Even in Japan, his grandfather's name is officially "Gerald Robotnik".

Although I wish they stuck with what they had in SA1, where Eggman called himself "Robotnik", while everyone called him "Eggman" as a pejorative.

On that note am I the only person who is terrified of crush based deaths in Sonic? they're so abrupt and often kind of screwy (whoops your toe was in the way, whoops the platform carried you into a spiky ceiling you couldn't see), only in Sonic do they make me "jump" like it's survival horror.

Going by Pokecapn's Generations LP, the gang there also find crushing deaths more frightening than, say, drowning deaths, due to how sudden they are.

 

[nintendoman58]

So what's the deal behing the Eggman Vs. Robotnick debate? Which one's right?

Robotnik is right.

Spoiler

"Nobody calls me that anymore!"

 

[PeakPointMatrix]

Although I wish they stuck with what they had in SA1, where Eggman called himself "Robotnik", while everyone called him "Eggman" as a pejorative.

Yeah, I thought that was a pretty good solution going forward. But I imagine it would be a little messy overseas since they've had him as Eggman from the start. While Robotnik sounds more evil, I like Eggman too, it's an iconic and fun name. It's not like Miles Prowler or Knuckles are any less silly. It's actually pretty amusing to see people get worked up about it either way.

 

[BlazeHedgehog]

So what's the deal behing the Eggman Vs. Robotnick debate? Which one's right?

The only people who cling to the Robotnik name are blindly reaching out for youthful nostalgia, and/or associate the name "Eggman" with the franchise's fall from grace. That being said, when Sega of America was tasked with localizing the Sonic franchise, "Dr. Eggman" was obviously something they did not think would play with American audiences and changed it to something its English-speaking audience would find more palatable. After all, if it was up to Sonic Team, Sonic the Hedgehog would be the lead singer in a rock and roll band trying to save his human girlfriend, Madonna. That marketing team at Sega of America at that time did a lot of good things for this franchise.

As long as you don't act like a jerk about it, I'm fine with either one. Even I've found myself typing "Robotnik" every now and then when referring to stuff in the older games, but all this chest-beating over "IT'S NOT A GOOD GAME IF HE ISN'T CALLED ROBOTNIK" stuff is silly.

 

[qq more]

I always call him Robotnik. It just sounds like a cooler name to me. Nostalgia or not.


But yeah I don't mind Eggman much.


EDIT: By the way, way before we've decided that we'd have a Community thread, is anyone still interested in a SonicGAF chatroom?

 

[Emitan]

There is a SonicGAF chatroom. It died or something. I don't remember the name. It was on Rizon.

 

[J@hranimo]

Part 10 of Pokecapn's Sonic Generations LP is up!

 

[Dark Schala]

I call him Robotnik out of habit. I don't really care about Eggman/Robotnik, but I usually use the latter when I'm jotting things down quickly or something. Like now.

If you have a PS3, you could buy Sega Genesis collection PSP to play on the Vita. Sonic Rivals 1 & 2 are on sale, but I wouldn't recommend them. Here's detailed instructions on how to do that. http://segabits.com/blog/2012/02/22...ega-psp-games-on-your-vita-if-you-have-a-ps3/

Thanks. I was thinking of the Genesis PSP collection, and then I started wondering if SEGA would release a Vita version of it. I'd love to be able to play those on the Vita and screencap stuff (I'm totally have lots of fun screencapping stuff).

I have hard copies of Sonic Rivals 1 and 2 and I... don't think I'll be revisiting those any time soon.

The court case? I'm not the most familiar with the subject, sorry. The topic I linked was the first I heard of it, and the person didn't follow up at the insistence of the Retro Admins and oldbies.

On a more general topic of who controls what Sonic music? I thought about posting a topic, listing some of the notable installments and the legal issues or questions regarding their music, but I may not be the best-versed person to discuss the finer details. I was also worried the standard "lolsonic" threadshitting would kick into gear.

Plus it does come across as a "Sega why can't you get it together" post, when they're obviously trying to get it together lately.

It's kind of interesting how they approached it, they've nearly always tried to bring in real musicians (obviously not putting down all the brilliant chiptune artists and musical programmers of that day, I just mean people who went out touring, put out albums to stores, etc) and build them into Sonic, rather than just do the music in-house. It probably goes back to his original designs as being a part of a rock band. Like you said, there's probably no reason for them to expect in 1991 that they'd have to some day decide whether or not to license Green Hill's music 15, 20 years later.

Thanks, Kulock.

And I don't think the thread would've went over very well either. Such is the life of Sonic threads on GAF, I guess. It's incredibly unfortunate, but at least we have the community thread to discuss this stuff in a rational fashion. -_-

SEGA's approach to music in general was kind of interesting, though, since a lot of the music in their more popular games seemed to be drawn more towards popular music and arcade-style tunes (ie: Sonic, Streets of Rage, etc) as opposed to traditional tunage (of course, this is before the Super Nintendo came on the market which used a lot of the SPC 700's capabilities to construct some great genre-varying stuff). It's great that they brought regular musicians in to construct Sonic's soundscape, though, even though they lacked the foresight to get the rights to use the music in the future.

I wonder if not locking down the rights back then just goes back to the fact that Sonic seemed like a bit of an experiment on their part to see if it'll sell the machine.

 

[qq more]

There is a SonicGAF chatroom. It died or something. I don't remember the name. It was on Rizon.

That was mine and it was made before the community thread (and it wasn't exactly ready)... so wouldn't hurt to give it a second chance. Anyone actually interested?

 

[Shadow Hog]

So it occurred to me, yesterday, that over the past couple of years, I bought two new Genesis games (X-Men and The Lion King)... and haven't yet plopped them into S&K to get their Blue Sphere stages. Huh. I better get on that.

Admittedly, that used to be a favorite activity of mine, back when the Genesis was still more or less in vogue - take my entire Genesis library, slap it into S&K, and try to Perfect the stage so I could play it in Blue Sphere proper (Sonic 1 plugged into S&K, obviously). I think my favorite was the one I got for Scholastic's The Magic School Bus: Space Exploration (hey, the game was fun, don't judge me!) - a delightful minty green/violet color scheme set against a dark night sky, and the layout wasn't too shabby, either. Also kind of liked Aladdin, but I don't remember its stage quite as well. Toy Story just got me S&K, though (IIRC it went over the Genesis's 4MB limit?). Maybe, if I get some spare time this weekend (which, considering I'm working this weekend, might be tight), I'll plow through those again and share the codes.

I actually managed to get Sonic 2 to load into Blue Sphere, once (cartridge must've been ajar, I guess), but alas, I never did get its code...

 

[qq more]

Ah man, I keep forgetting how amazing the Lock-On technology was. I am very sadden there's no other game that does something like this.

EDIT: I think I've also managed to get Sonic 2 work on the Blue Sphere game too. I forgot honestly.

 

[Hot Coldman]

I'm waiting patiently for Taxman to announce he's making a Sonic 3 and Knuckles Retro Engine super port, with unlockable KiS2 and Blue Sphere.

 

[Professor Beef]

I'm waiting patiently for Taxman to announce he's making a Sonic 3 and Knuckles Retro Engine super port, with unlockable KiS2 and Blue Sphere.

Make Knuckles in Sonic 1 also.

In fact, Vector needs his own game so we can see more of that sweet swag-walk.

 

[Sciz]

Make Knuckles in Sonic 1 also.

Rom hackers did this aaaaaages ago.

 

[Shadow Hog]

If they allow Blue Sphere, it'd be nice if they reworked the level generation algorithm to allow play of all stages - as I recall, some stages don't have assigned level/password combinations (yes, there's a distinction between stage/level, in this case - the former is any combination of four corners, while the latter are the ones you can actually play).

 

[Dragoon En Regalia]

You know what? They sould bring back Blue Sphere as a special stage next time they feature a special stage in a mainline Sonic title. Outfit it with platforming challenges, unique traps/obstacles, and a randomization element—makes for a great special stage and a great diversion.

But Iizuka!

Spoiler

But there's still hope, as he worked on S3&K.

 

[Hot Coldman]

Knuckles in Sonic 1 would probably be super easy with Retro Engine, so yeah, sure! Make it so.

And then patch Sonic CD with Knuckles. :3

 

[Dark Schala]

Well, I had an interesting day today... er, outside of that snowstorm which blew snow around making it hard enough to hurt when it hits your ungloved hand/face.

I tried to teach my boyfriend how to play Sonic Generations. It didn't go so well. As for background, he was more of a Nintendo/Intellivision kid, and the only Sonic games he has experience with are the first four games, and whatever small amounts he played on the Sonic Gems Collection.

He was... ok with the Classic Sonic bits. He disliked Classic Sky Sanctuary, though. He wasn't good at the Modern Sonic gameplay at all, lol. Playing those bits for him was a disaster because:
a) I turned off Omochao and in hindsight I should have kept that on for him
b) he didn't read the button prompts when they came up (and they're big and obvious enough for his eye to see)
c) he doesn't like using boost or homing attack because it feels unnatural to him
d) he thought it was too fast for him to keep up with (but this is very likely due to his eyesight).
A little unfortunate, though he did kinda well in Modern GHZ after watching me go through it.

I had him try out Colours with the GCN controller next and that went really well, outside of him not wanting to use the wisp powers at all, trying not to go into the water in Aquarium Park, and not sidestepping. He liked that the maps were reminiscent of Super Mario World, and really loved Starlight Carnival's and Planet Wisp's presentation. So, Colours = good.

I do have to wonder why he preferred Colours Modern gameplay over the Generations Modern gameplay, though. He didn't really give me a good answer, but I can guess it's because Colours focuses more on platforming/skill usage as opposed to getting through the level quickly?

 

[Sciz]

I do have to wonder why he preferred Colours Modern gameplay over the Generations Modern gameplay, though. He didn't really give me a good answer, but I can guess it's because Colours focuses more on platforming/skill usage as opposed to getting through the level quickly?

At a guess, it's because Colors is something like 70% 2D and the 3D sections are all brainlessly simple.

 

[Kokonoe]

I posted this on SEGA forums, i'd like to discuss it here as well.

http://forums.sega.com/showthread.p...game-or-is-it-just-a-bad-*Classic*-Sonic-game

Is Sonic 4 EP1 really a bad Sonic game, or is it just a bad *Classic* Sonic game?

I want to know your opinions on this subject. I know they pretty much advertised this game as a homage to the Classic Sonic games. It unfortunately, isn't physics wise, and has rehashed things like bosses. All the other stuff I see people complain about seem like nitpicks, that when combined together, leads to a whole lot more to complain about.

I don't see the nitpicks as justified, but I do see the complaints about the physics justified as the game is called "Sonic 4", and not "Sonic (Inserttitlehere). I myself enjoyed EP1 a lot, to the point i'd give this game an 8.0 I don't see it as a Classic Sonic game, as it doesn't really play as one, but I do see it as a good Sonic game.

So. What's your take on this? Is Sonic 4 Episode 1 a bad Classic Sonic game, yet a good Sonic game?
Or is it a bad Classic Sonic game, and a bad Sonic game?

Poll incoming.

 

[Box of Bunnies]

I can understand people not liking Sonic 4's physics, or wanting them to be closer to the originals or whatever, but I mean it's not like Super Mario 4 played exactly like Super Mario 1 so it was never a huge sticking point for me.

 

[Anth0ny]

I posted this on SEGA forums, i'd like to discuss it here as well.

http://forums.sega.com/showthread.p...game-or-is-it-just-a-bad-*Classic*-Sonic-game

It is a bad game.

It is a FUCKING HORRIBLE Classic Sonic game.

 

[BlazeHedgehog]

Sonic 4 is a bad Classic Sonic game and a mediocre Modern Sonic game.

It is basically Sonic Rush minus the boost, which sort of defeats a lot of the point.

 

[TheOGB]

It's a subpar Rush game.

Sega1991 when did your post get there

 

[Professor Beef]

Ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

Sonic 4 is ok. I wouldn't recommend it to anyone, though.

 

[qq more]

I can understand people not liking Sonic 4's physics, or wanting them to be closer to the originals or whatever, but I mean it's not like Super Mario 4 played exactly like Super Mario 1 so it was never a huge sticking point for me.

That point is moot as Super Mario World (assuming this is what you mean by Super Mario 4) has much better control/physics than Super Mario Bros 1.






Anyways, Sonic 4 Episode 1 as a *Classic* Sonic game is awful and a huge joke. The physics were a joke, the controls feels awkward, the visuals were unappealing, the levels were hardly original most of the times, and nearly every enemy/boss were rehashed in such a blantant. The game did not play like a Classic game at all. It felt more like Sonic Rush trying to pretending to be a Genesis game.


As for a game itself, it's just an underwhelming average platformer. I actually played it pretending it wasn't called Sonic 4 but I still felt really underwhelmed by it.

 

[Rlan]

So over the past six months, while checking out the mags in the supermarket, I've been a little fascinated with the little kids mags. You guys in America have these right?

Basically I noticed that I would always see one a month with a picture of Sonic on the front. Over the past 6 months there hasn't been one time where I couldn't spot a blue hedgehog on the cover of one of them. This month has two!

It's always interesting to see how these mags go. I mean I'm going to assume they don't have the highest of "journalistic integrity", but I'd assume covers are always "Put something popular on them so kids will buy it".

So Sonic's been pretty popular, especially in Australia. What's america like?

 

[qq more]

UGH THAT SPYRO

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA


Also I don't know. I'd say Sonic is a popular game with da kidz, but he ain't no Pokemon or Mario for sure. He was definitely more popular back in the 90s though.

 

[TheOGB]

Sonic is the hot shit in the UK AFAIK, and was much more popular in the States in the 90s where he and his attitude fit in.

That combination of characters certainly does take me back...

Spoiler

but replace fugly Spyro with Crash Bandicoot

 

[Combichristoffersen]

I posted this on SEGA forums, i'd like to discuss it here as well.

http://forums.sega.com/showthread.p...game-or-is-it-just-a-bad-*Classic*-Sonic-game

It's a terrible *Classic* Sonic game, and honestly fairly mediocre even for Modern Sonic. Sega really shot themselves in both feet by naming it Sonic 4, as that raised expectations for the game to be of the same quality as Sonic 1-3&K, which it very clearly isn't. The graphics in Episode 1 were bad, the music was bad, the physics were borked, and the bosses weren't particularly fun either (fuck that final boss, bah). Had Sega named it Sonic (insert something that isn't 4), expectations would have been significantly lower.

 

[Dark Schala]

Oh God, that new Spyro design is atrocious. Ew. Gross.

At a guess, it's because Colors is something like 70% 2D and the 3D sections are all brainlessly simple.

Hah, I didn't even think about the 3D sections of that game. Yeah, I guess that might be part of it. They're pretty simple: you just drift (he doesn't know how to drift, and I told him the mechanic in Colours was bad), attack enemies in 3D, platform in 3D. It isn't too difficult, and it can probably be used as a starting point to teach newer players the basic points of the 3D sections.

I'll have to ask. He complimented the look of the game a lot, though. "One of the best Wii games I've seen! :O"

I posted this on SEGA forums, i'd like to discuss it here as well.

http://forums.sega.com/showthread.p...game-or-is-it-just-a-bad-*Classic*-Sonic-game

I agree with everyone else. It's a mediocre platformer, and I didn't really have much fun with it as a general platformer.

It's also a bad Classic Sonic game and they never should have advertised it as that in the first place. While it was probably a neat idea to call it that marketing-wise, in hindsight it really wasn't since it created some lofty expectations for the game based on the name alone. Classic fans expected the game to play much like the classic games, not a poor attempt at a console Sonic Rush (I concur that it's a bad Sonic Rush game too). I'm not even sure if some Classic fans had even played Sonic Rush before.

...

It also has bad synth samples and poor art execution. Direction is okay. Execution is not.

 

[nintendoman58]

I think Sonic 4 wouldn't have gotten so much hate if it wasn't called Sonic 4.

It should have been called NEW Sonic the Hedgehog, or Sonic: The Next Lap, or something along those lines.

People would still hate it as a Sonic game, but at least it would not have been advertised as a *Classic Sonic* game

 

[Kokonoe]

I actually enjoyed the soundtrack to Sonic 4 quite a bit.

This is probably my favorite track from it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2M3vpRXasrM

 

[OMG Aero]

Even if Sonic 4 had nothing to do with Sonic and was full of completely new characters it would still be a mediocre to bad platformer.

 

[Box of Bunnies]

I actually enjoyed the soundtrack to Sonic 4 quite a bit.

I generally liked the Sonic 4 OST. I think the problems with it are mostly down to instrumentation rather than composition.

 

[RobbieNick]

I think Sonic 4 wouldn't have gotten so much hate if it wasn't called Sonic 4.

It should have been called NEW Sonic the Hedgehog, or Sonic: The Next Lap, or something along those lines.

People would still hate it as a Sonic game, but at least it would not have been advertised as a *Classic Sonic* game

I think "Sonic HD" would have been the best choice. A name like Sonic 4 is impossible to live up to.

 

[Seven Force]

Didn't Sega take Sonic 1 and rebrand it as Sonic High Speed (Or something along those lines) at one point for XBLA? They should have just gone with a similar naming convention for Sonic 4.

 

[Christopher]

Ok i'm going for Sonic Colors now after being somewhat disappointed in Unleashed, man those Warehog levels were atrocious. I hope it's better, but from everyone's raves on here I'm going to think that it is.

I will then officially have played every Sonic mainline game.

Sonic
Sonic 2
Sonic 3
Sonic & Knuckles
Sonic Adventure
Sonic Adventure 2
Sonic Heroes
Sonic 2k6
Sonic Unleashed
Sonic Colors
Sonic Generations

I believe that's if it I'm not mistaken. The only ones I were truly disappointed playing were Unleashed and Heroes, and you all know I like my Sonic 2k6

 

[Shadow Hog]

You're missing Sonic CD. I mean, I suppose you could consider it a spin-off, but it's treated as if it's mainline (and plays like it's mainline, at that).

Shadow the Hedgehog, too, considering its plot wraps up Shadow's awkward "who the hell am I" arc that Heroes barely touched, so he can put it behind him for 2K6, and otherwise continues from Adventure 2. Although frankly, the game's terrible, and I wouldn't blame you for not playing it.

 

[Christopher]

You're missing Sonic CD. I mean, I suppose you could consider it a spin-off, but it's treated as if it's mainline (and plays like it's mainline, at that).

Shadow the Hedgehog, too, considering its plot wraps up Shadow's awkward "who the hell am I" arc that Heroes barely touched, so he can put it behind him for 2K6, and otherwise continues from Adventure 2. Although frankly, the game's terrible, and I wouldn't blame you for not playing it.

We do not count Shadow the Hedgehog

 

[qq more]

Shadow The Hedgehog didn't exist


neither did Sonic 06

 

[Professor Beef]

Shadow The Hedgehog didn't exist


neither did Sonic 06

I am glad Sonic 06 exists, because otherwise it would mean Mael suffered for nothing.

 

[Lijik]

I posted this on SEGA forums, i'd like to discuss it here as well.

http://forums.sega.com/showthread.p...game-or-is-it-just-a-bad-*Classic*-Sonic-game

I disagree with the premise, because it assumes the possibility that Sonic 4 is good. Sonic 4 is simply a bad game no matter how you spin it.

First and foremost, the way it controls is unacceptable for any platforming game, period. Forget about bad rolling physics; everything including simple running and jumping feels heavy and awkward. Its almost like a chinese bootleg created by people who have never touched a controller. Im told Sonic 4 uses the same physics as Rush, but the basic movement doesn't feel as bad in that game. Im not really sure why.

Level design is focused around stage gimmicks, yet never really escalates them the way something like a Mario game would. When its not blandly using gimmicks, its rehashing Rush-esque level design without the mechanics and pacing that makes that kind of game fun. This leaves behind shallow stages that wear out their welcome long before they're done. Don't forget about the homing bridge over a pit crutch that just about every stage ends with!

Graphically and musically Sonic 4 is a putrid mess. The visual style is wildly inconsistent, something that is evident in any screenshot of the game. Sonic, the world, the HUD, the enemies - they all look like they were pasted in from different sources. Sources that incidentally, all happen to be resoundingly awful. The characters have an absolutely ugly cel shading applied to them, and the world looks like someone took the prerendered blandness of NSMB DS and cranked it up to eleven. The music isn't much better. A chunk of the soundtrack is utter shit composition-wise. Granted, there are some good compositions but these are betrayed by everything sounding like dying cats.

At the time of release, Sonic 4 was fifteen dollars on console platforms. This is more than the price of a movie ticket, yet the game offered about 45 minutes of mostly mediocre gameplay sans potential replayability (which personally was low due to game being terrible).

There is nothing about the package that is in anyway fully acceptable. Its a bad classic Sonic game, its a bad Sonic game, its just full on a bad game.

 

[Kokonoe]

I disagree with the premise, because it assumes the possibility that Sonic 4 is good. Sonic 4 is simply a bad game no matter how you spin it.

The premise is my own opinion, and my own opinion spins different than yours.

First and foremost, the way it controls is unacceptable for any platforming game, period. Forget about bad rolling physics; everything including simple running and jumping feels heavy and awkward. Its almost like a chinese bootleg created by people who have never touched a controller. Im told Sonic 4 uses the same physics as Rush, but the basic movement doesn't feel as bad in that game. Im not really sure why.

When I first started up the game, I felt as if Sonic had poor acceleration, but then I realized the homing attack/airdash is the key to get speed instantly, and I never had any issues after that. The only thing I really noticed that was "bad" was the whole walking on walls thing, but you're constantly moving in a Sonic game, so I don't see that it changes much of anything to make the whole game horrible.

Level design is focused around stage gimmicks, yet never really escalates them the way something like a Mario game would. When its not blandly using gimmicks, its rehashing Rush-esque level design without the mechanics and pacing that makes that kind of game fun. This leaves behind shallow stages that wear out their welcome long before they're done. Don't forget about the homing bridge over a pit crutch that just about every stage ends with!

My issues with level design were in the Mad Gear levels, and in the Casino levels that had the cards. Mainly due to the overly random pits, and death traps. Other than that, I liked the level design, and of course I don't technically pick apart games if I don't get any sense that it's not enjoyable. It was enjoyable for me, as was using the homing attack.

Graphically and musically Sonic 4 is a putrid mess. The visual style is wildly inconsistent, something that is evident in any screenshot of the game. Sonic, the world, the HUD, the enemies - they all look like they were pasted in from different sources. Sources that incidentally, all happen to be resoundingly awful. The characters have an absolutely ugly cel shading applied to them, and the world looks like someone took the prerendered blandness of NSMB DS and cranked it up to eleven. The music isn't much better. A chunk of the soundtrack is utter shit composition-wise. Granted, there are some good compositions but these are betrayed by everything sounding like dying cats.

I didn't have any issues with this, although I didn't have any issues with New Super Mario Bros. DS either.

At the time of release, Sonic 4 was fifteen dollars on console platforms. This is more than the price of a movie ticket, yet the game offered about 45 minutes of mostly mediocre gameplay sans potential replayability (which personally was low due to game being terrible).

It was a good deal for me personally, as I put a lot of time playing/replaying this game since I actually enjoyed it.

 

[Lijik]

I don't technically pick apart games if I don't get any sense that it's not enjoyable.

I don't think feeling that the level design isn't fun, and then figuring out why I don't think its fun is being nitpicky or picking something apart. If I just went "Its a bad game" and didn't back up why I felt that way other than "I just didn't like it" it'd be a shithouse post.

The game has glaring problems on all fronts, and if you can ignore them and have a fun time then more power to you.

 

[RobbieNick]

I disagree with the premise, because it assumes the possibility that Sonic 4 is good. Sonic 4 is simply a bad game no matter how you spin it.

Your opinion is not fact. The fact is critics overall liked the game and it got above average scores. There is about a 50/50 split on Sonic fans who either like it or loathe it. In my OPINION, I thought it was a decent platformer for the price, but not worthy of the name Sonic 4.

Sorry, I just really hate when people state opinion as fact.

 

[Aaron Strife]

Didn't Sega take Sonic 1 and rebrand it as Sonic High Speed (Or something along those lines) at one point for XBLA? They should have just gone with a similar naming convention for Sonic 4.

Originally, they were going to do a special port of Sonic 1 and call it that, but they eventually just scrapped it for the Backbone emulation.