Mass Effect 3 SPOILER THREAD: LOTS OF SPECULATION FROM EVERYONE

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SpectreFire said:
As another writer, I strongly disagree. Speculative endings are terrible and they are lazy. They're a last ditch effort by less than talented writers who could not or did not plan out a proper trajectory or ending to their stories. It's a cop-out, pure and simple.

When you make people invested in something, you have to make sure they get paid off. It's like putting money into an investment at a bank and 5 years later, when you come back to collect, the bank tells you they have no idea what's happening with your money. It's just bad writing.

I can't respect a writer that drags people along for a 100 hour ride only to tell them at the end "well tell me what you think happened to everyone?" That doesn't play, that is one of the worst moves a writer can pull and the team at Bioware pulled it.
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This is the source of my rage. I couldn't have said it any better.
 
Quick said:
I don't think the Crucible beam was harmful to other ships other than the Reapers, depending on the ending. So, the Normandy fleeing was really confusing.
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I thought it only damaged the Normandy because it was in FTL while the beam was shooting through all of the relays. It didn't seem to hurt any other ships that were around Earth.

Also the Normandy wouldn't have been able to beat that beam to the mass relay at Earth, so that gives off the assumption that he was fleeing before any of that happened.
 
Zeliard said:
Anderson also died for me, and I shot Illusive Man. I don't know. Seemed to wrap things up pretty well.

Important people die but Earth is saved, the Mass Relay system is kept intact to keep communication with other species in the galaxy, and the Reapers are controlled to advance humanity and the other races far ahead of what they were. Everyone wins. And Shep and Anderson are now sharing a toast in the afterlife ;)
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The relays blow up in every ending.
 
Last Hearth said:
All they needed was to have multiple endings, you can have you happy ending, you can have you tragic sacrifice ending, you can have you bittersweet ending, you can have you reapers win and destroy everything ending. You can have even a twist ending like synthesis.

Then everyone is happy. And if you want to do something with the universe later just pick one as the canon.

Seriously it's not that hard to keep the ME fanbase happy.
Click to expand...

But that would have taken time. And resources.


SpectreFire said:
As another writer, I strongly disagree. Speculative endings are terrible and they are lazy. They're a last ditch effort by less than talented writers who could not or did not plan out a proper trajectory or ending to their stories. It's a cop-out, pure and simple.

When you make people invested in something, you have to make sure they get paid off. It's like putting money into an investment at a bank and 5 years later, when you come back to collect, the bank tells you they have no idea what's happening with your money. It's just bad writing.

I can't respect a writer that drags people along for a 100 hour ride only to tell them at the end "well tell me what you think happened to everyone?" That doesn't play, that is one of the worst moves a writer can pull and the team at Bioware pulled it.
Click to expand...

Great post. I couldn't agree more.
 
Zeliard said:
What do you mean? The final choices you get hinge on whether or not you care about the synthetics at all. You can choose to have them and the Reapers all destroyed. The kid warns you that your descendants will inevitably create synthetics and the cycle will continue, and that plays into the choice you have to make.
Click to expand...

This is completely baseless and infact runs contrary to what we have been shown. THe geth were perfectly happy to leave organics alone unless they were trying to kill them. It's Sovereign who convinces them to attack humans in ME1. They have no aggression or resentment towards organics at all. If the organics would understand that, there would never be a problem and we can easily maintain a peaceful co-existance. Establishing the Quarian-Geth peace proves it.
 
jimi_dini said:
Thx. That cleared a bit up.
Although my assumption was still somewhat correct. The ME3 ending(s) just sucked, all of them were bad, nothing good/happy and also seem to be unlogical (made no sense), if I understood correctly.

So my point would still be correct. MGS4 had a good, everyone is happy ending. Snake
still lives
. And ME3 is the opposite of that.

Or did I misunderstand it again?
Click to expand...

ME 3's ending doesn't suck because it's sad, it sucks because everything you did has no bearing in it. Everyone gets the same shit regardless. Resulting in LOTS OF SPECULATION FROM EVERYONE.

If anything, you could somewhat be correct in saying that MGS 4's ending is fanservice and ME 3's ending is the complete opposite.
 
Vamphuntr said:
I never used Liara or Garrus unless I was forced too >.>
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Never use Garrus, and he's dead in my 2nd game so the issue is truly moot. Liara I use in the one where she is LI, otherwise only as necessary. Tali I use every game, not just the my "definitive" Tali LI one.

Even back in ME1 I'd have Tali and Wrex as part of the ME Shotgun Squad, optimal choices or not.
 
BuckRobotron said:
Never use Garrus, and he's dead in my 2nd game so the issue is truly moot. Liara I use in the one where she is LI, otherwise only as necessary. Tali I use every game, not just the my "definitive" Tali LI one.

Even back in ME1 I'd have Tali and Wrex as part of the ME Shotgun Squad, optimal choices or not.
Click to expand...

Wrex in Rage armor, Garrus in Phantom armor.

Only way to roll.
 
SpectreFire said:
As another writer, I strongly disagree. Speculative endings are terrible and they are lazy. They're a last ditch effort by less than talented writers who could not or did not plan out a proper trajectory or ending to their stories. It's a cop-out, pure and simple.

When you make people invested in something, you have to make sure they get paid off. It's like putting money into an investment at a bank and 5 years later, when you come back to collect, the bank tells you they have no idea what's happening with your money. It's just bad writing.

I can't respect a writer that drags people along for a 100 hour ride only to tell them at the end "well tell me what you think happened to everyone?" That doesn't play, that is one of the worst moves a writer can pull and the team at Bioware pulled it.
Click to expand...

I could not agree more
 
Wasn't it Destructoid or some hack journalist who said that fans demanding the ending should be changed was like demanding Hamlet should be changed.

So apparently this deserves the same aesthetic status as Hamlet:
NV0Jc.png
 
Zeliard said:
Anderson also died for me, and I shot Illusive Man. I don't know. Seemed to wrap things up pretty well.

Important people die but Earth is saved, the Mass Relay system is kept intact to keep communication with other species in the galaxy, and the Reapers are controlled to advance humanity and the other races far ahead of what they were. Everyone wins. And Shep and Anderson are now sharing a toast in the afterlife ;)
Click to expand...
Uh, no it's not. It's destroyed in every ending. Earth and every civilization is still doomed because they don't have access to each other to provide aid and resources to rebuild. Every race's military and fleet are on Earth now. How are the Quarians supposed to survive without the Geth or their fleet? How is Earth supposed to survive longterm without aid from its colonies? Or is anyone supposed to survive cut off from one another?
 
Lime said:
Did you go through these:
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lul that video

If the endings are roughly identical, yeah, that's pretty lame.

Generic said:
This is pure speculation. THe geth were perfectly happy to leave organics alone unless they were trying to kill them. It's Sovereign who convinces them to attack humans in ME1. They have no aggression or resentment towards organics at all. If the organics would understand that, there would never be a problem and we can easily maintain a peaceful co-existance. Establishing the Quarian-Geth peace proves it.
Click to expand...

Well yeah, but that's the whole point. The A.I. was wrong about the chaos of organic vs. synthetic and you basically tell him so, and then you make your choice.

Now if every choice does lead to basically the same ending, that is indeed shit. :P
 
Ok with:
Shep Dying (standard Hero Complex Protocol)
Any/All Crew dying (Standard Hero + Apocalypse Protocol)
Bad Ending for the Universe, even the Mass Relay's Destruction

Not ok with:
Strange editing where The Normandy and Crew are instantaneously rocketing out of the system

Strange editing of Anderson's and TIM's role, and how they got there (Anderson getting there first, TIM coming out of nowhere)

Strange inclusion of a live and breathing Shepard, and where his/her location is.
How did Shep survive an explosion to the face, followed by a 1/2 to 1 mile wide explosion, followed by (more than likely) crash landing on earth (while being burned to a crisp, entering the atmosphere)
 
SpectreFire said:
As another writer, I strongly disagree. Speculative endings are terrible and they are lazy. They're a last ditch effort by less than talented writers who could not or did not plan out a proper trajectory or ending to their stories. It's a cop-out, pure and simple.

When you make people invested in something, you have to make sure they get paid off. It's like putting money into an investment at a bank and 5 years later, when you come back to collect, the bank tells you they have no idea what's happening with your money. It's just bad writing.

I can't respect a writer that drags people along for a 100 hour ride only to tell them at the end "well tell me what you think happened to everyone?" That doesn't play, that is one of the worst moves a writer can pull and the team at Bioware pulled it.
Click to expand...

I think if that's the intent from the beginning or if it's particularly well done it's fine, but coming at the end of a series like Mass Effect? Big no-no.
 
Zeliard said:
Important people die but Earth is saved, the Mass Relay system is kept intact to keep communication with other species in the galaxy, and the Reapers are controlled to advance humanity and the other races far ahead of what they were. Everyone wins. And Shep and Anderson are now sharing a toast in the afterlife ;)
Click to expand...

jk7y0.jpg


Those are the relays. Not being intact.
 
Alucrid said:
Wrex in Rage armor, Garrus in Phantom armor.

Only way to roll.
Click to expand...

I did use Garrus more often back then. But always dug the shotguns (and Tali). I used to have that Tali Carnage animated ME1 gif after all.

Still, I'm actually liking ARs this time around, many feel meatier in ME3.
 
SpectreFire said:
Uh, no it's not. It's destroyed in every ending. Earth and every civilization is still doomed because they don't have access to each other to provide aid and resources to rebuild. Every race's military and fleet are on Earth now. How are the Quarians supposed to survive without the Geth or their fleet? How is Earth supposed to survive longterm without aid from its colonies? Or is anyone supposed to survive cut off from one another?
Click to expand...

I concede that point. Synthesis was supposed to keep them intact, and it doesn't, so that's undoubtedly dumb.
 
Zeliard said:
Well yeah, but that's the whole point. The A.I. was wrong about the chaos of organic vs. synthetic and you basically tell him so, and then you make your choice.

Now if every choice does lead to basically the same ending, that is indeed shit. :P
Click to expand...

Uh....No, you don't. That's the problem. Shepards meekly accepts what he says without any sort of inquiry or defense, and he chooses between 3 endings, none of which make any sense.
 
Lonestar said:
Strange inclusion of a live and breathing Shepard, and where his/her location is.
How did Shep survive an explosion to the face, followed by a 1/2 to 1 mile wide explosion, followed by (more than likely) crash landing on earth (while being burned to a crisp, entering the atmosphere)
Click to expand...

SPECULATION FROM EVERYONE
 
jimi_dini said:
Thx. That cleared a bit up.
Although my assumption was still somewhat correct. The ME3 ending(s) just sucked, all of them were bad, nothing good/happy and also seem to be unlogical (made no sense), if I understood correctly. Or is the problem that all the endings are quite the same and people mainly just got a problem not having a good ending as well?

Anyway my point would still be correct. MGS4 had a good, everyone is happy ending. Snake
still lives
. And ME3 is the opposite of that.

Or did I misunderstand it again?
Click to expand...
One thing the video didn't go into - a Mass Relay explosion can be over 10,000 million kilometers. So the chain reaction probably destroyed a large amount of life. Mac often forgets technical things regarding the universe, so it's no surprise he let that slide.
 
Seriously Zeliard, it would be a good idea to read the Gamefront article before you reply. It covers a lot of the criticism of the ending, so you don't have to waste time understanding and replying to the notions in this thread.
 
Zeliard said:
What do you mean? The final choices you get hinge on whether or not you care about the synthetics at all. You can choose to have them and the Reapers all destroyed. The kid warns you that your descendants will inevitably create synthetics and the cycle will continue, and that plays into the choice you have to make.
Click to expand...

I mean that I was able to stop the war with the geth. The geth were now assisting the Quarians on Rannoch, and were fighting with me. The kid says stuff like the solution to chaos, and how people bring it on themselves. "without us to stop it, synthetics would destroy all organics", when ingame you're actually able to stop a good example of this...but unable to say ANYTHING.

I get what he meant with stuff like destroying the reapers and all current synthetics, but it would give rise to the problem again, I just specifically wanted to bring up stuff like the geth and EDI to say his cycle was bullshit. Then I would be okay if, say, you were forced into his endings had the quarians been wiped out, as it showed his point. But with your choices, you can prevent what he said--for nothing.
 
rvy said:
ME 3's ending doesn't suck because it's sad, it sucks because everything you did has no bearing in it. Everyone gets the same shit regardless. Resulting in LOTS OF SPECULATION FROM EVERYONE.
Click to expand...

Well, it seems that parts of it also didn't make sense. Anyway, quite interesting.

If anything, you could somewhat be correct in saying that MGS 4's ending is fanservice and ME 3's ending is the complete opposite.
Click to expand...

Yes, that's what I meant. Because the "fanservice" in MGS4 made at least me act almost the same as everyone in here. Although I should have been happy about that ending. But it didn't fit (at least imho).

Like I already said - it would have been interesting, if MGS4 had that speculated really bad ending (I think it was said that Snake+Octacon would have been shot and/or Snake would have killed himself). I wonder, if the fans would have been totally fine with it.
 
jimi_dini said:
Thx. That cleared a bit up.
Although my assumption was still somewhat correct. The ME3 ending(s) just sucked, all of them were bad, nothing good/happy and also seem to be unlogical (made no sense), if I understood correctly. Or is the problem that all the endings are quite the same and people mainly just got a problem not having a good ending as well?

Anyway my point would still be correct. MGS4 had a good, everyone is happy ending. Snake
still lives
. And ME3 is the opposite of that.

Or did I misunderstand it again?
Click to expand...

People didn't like MGS4's ending not just because
Snake lived, but because it deliberately retconned previous games and went out of it's way to pander to fans by unnecessarily reviving and returning old characters. The nanonmachines plot was nonsensical and completely inconsistent, and the game handled emotional themes and character story arcs (eg: Naomi) in a cheap, forcible way. It was a cluster fuck of confusion and inconsistent nonsense that seemed to be composed entirely of twists for the sake of twists, regardless of them actually making sense.

People dislike the ME3 ending because the entire series has been built on engaging the player in galaxy spanning conflicts and personal issues, with choices and decisions impacting their outcome. People live, and they die. Species are united. Disease is cured. Alliances are forged and enemies are made. All of these variables are dependant on the decisions you make, and what you experience won't necessarily be exactly what another player does.

ME3, up until the ending, was a culmination of all your decisions. Everything came to fruition. Then, right at the end, the game devolves into an absurdly binary selection of three colour themed endings, all of which are near identical and weighted minimally by your decisions made throughout the series. These decisions are weighted by background lore that doesn't make a whole lot of sense, and is forced upon the player through a surprise god-like AI entity that shows up at the last minute. The ending sequence then follows through with absurd, unexplainable scenarios, and leaves the player with no real closure to trilogy. You're left with more questions than you started with, and few answers to the ones you already had.

People wouldn't mind Shepard dying (though some wish there was an option to have him/her live). People, I think, would also deal quite alright with the relays exploding if it were integrated well into the climax. It's everything surrounding these two plot points that is absurd and reasonless, coupled with a whole bunch of new, unexplainable shit that pisses people off.
 
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