GI.biz: "Wii U less powerful than PS3, Xbox 360, developers say"

I'm calling this rumor a trolling by some devs who want beefier specs and/or the latest devkits.

Actually, looking at games like Goldeneye Wii, the Cod games, Red Steel 2, Anno, Madworld, Silent Hill Shattered Memories... i'd say 3rd parties actually delivered the best Wiimote experiences on Wii. Outside of Metroid Prime Trilogy, the wii sports games and Zelda, Nintendos own efforts with the Wiimote felt like an afterthought in most places. SMG, DKCR, MOM and NSMB for example show the worst methods of implementation of the wiimote.

I'm still not expecting 3rd parties to use the screen in any meaningfull way though, but I also expect Nintendo to leave it's potential on the table and shoehorn certain features in their games to use it.

Madworld was awesome.
Red Steel 2 did not live up to its promise in my opinion.

It will probably up to japanese devs to find suitable uses while western devs focus on online.

Games like AssCreed, Batman will greatly benefit from a simple map/inventory addition.
Other games I don't really care, the streaming thing justifies everything in my opinion.
 
I'm not expecting the Wii U to be a generational leap but releasing a home console in 2012 that is actually weaker than a 7yo 360 would be quite a feat in its own way...
 
I have stopped giving a flying crap about graphics long time ago. My favourite games this gen are either 3DS or mobile phone titles (with a couple of PS3 titles like Catherine or Uncharted). The videogame history have proved that graphics are irrelevant to the success of systems again and again, and people is still freaking out with these news? after the Wii? Also, this. The graphic arms race have to end someday. I will take good digital distribution, ease of development and lower cost developing tools over raw horsepower any day of the week.
 
In some respects, yes; in others, no.

Xbox had programmable pixel and vertex shaders - a huge boon - but the Wii has more RAM, for instance.

Xbox also had some games running at 720P and 1080i. The fact something like Soul Calibur 2 could run at 720P on Xbox is all the proof you need that the original Xbox was WAY more forward thinking than the original Wii.
 
I dont think the WiiU will be less powerful overall than the current gen systems, but I dont think Nintendo cares about trying to keep up with anyone in terms of system specs. If part of the WiiU is less powerful than a 360 or PS3 then its just less powerful.

The Wii sold millions and it was underpowered compared to the current gen and not even an HD system. If Nintendo can shave off money by assembling a less powerful but cheaper system then why wouldnt they? They lowballed everything the last time and made out like a bandit.
 
Xbox had fixed function pixel shaders. Programmable pixel shaders came with the debut of dx9 video cards.
Um. Given I've written pixel shader microcode for the original Xbox used in actually-released games on shelves... I respectfully disagree.
 
Nintendo doesn't care about its hardcore fans now, huh?

None of the companies care about their fans. They may care about your money, but they do not care about us.

Xbox had fixed function pixel shaders. Programmable pixel shaders came with the debut of dx9 video cards.

Wrong, programmable shaders were introduced with MS shader language 1.1 in DX8 IIRC.

Fixed function would be T&L units or the TEV units found in the Wii.

Edit: Beaten right above me. =p
 
I'm not expecting the Wii U to be a generational leap but releasing a home console in 2012 that is actually weaker than a 7yo 360 would be quite a feat in its own way...

I think that it's even debatable that it could be true is cringe worthy enough. And it's Nintendo's fault. But they're making money and that's all that matters to their audience...for some reason.
 
Nintendo has stuck with the "good enough" standard when it comes to console hardware and Wii U won't likely be the exception. Whatever the console lacks in graphics, it will make up for with its unique capabilities. This is similar to how 3DS is not as powerful as the PS Vita yet capable of doing 3D without the glasses. The platform just has to be strong enough to make whatever gimmick Nintendo wants to focus on work effectively and smoothly. Devs will be attracted to it. Of course, if third-party games don't sell well, then Wii U is going to suffer almost as badly as the Wii did - just without the much cheaper development costs.

Even if Wii U is essentially like the 360's HD visuals, then at least it will likely have better performance. It probably has less to do with "future-proofing" the console and more to do with making it capable of handling the seemingly stressful tech involved in getting the console to work with the UPad without a hitch (kind of like how the 3DS has to be strong enough to render the games twice in 3D). For all we know, Wii U may even be capable of handling UE4 if its scaled down. In any case, it can't be as bad as it was with the Wii's graphics where it wasn't only behind the 360 and PS3, but also lacked HD output and even shaders.

I think the reality is Nintendo won't be getting the strongest third-party support. Third-parties have been burned by Nintendo before with its past home consoles to put all their eggs in one nest. Even when third-parties offer multiplatform games on Nintenod consoles, the case is often that the other versions sell better. However, in all fairness, a lot of devs don't even give Nintendo versions of their games a chance to be successful to do poor marketing and overlooking them in favor of a different platform's version. Nintendo really just needs to make Wii U compotent enough so that it qualifies for the LCD for third-party multiplatform support. It may get lucky and serve as the lead platform for some current-gen games.However, being lead platform once Xbox 3 and PS4 enter the fray probably won't happen. That's naturally where making it easy to port games to becomes even more important. After all, most of us recognize how the third-party exclusive is becoming a thing of the past. Beyond just making Wii U an easy platform to port third-party software to, Nintendo's already solved the issue of dual analog controls so developing for a specialized controller won't be nearly as much of an issue as it was for the Wii. Even if devs feel like they're ported games need to take advantage of Wii U's controller, most of it seems like it can be implented with ease. The most basic capabilities would give Wii U a slight advantage even if Wii U version of the game cannot visually compete against Xbox 3 and PS4. Quite frankly, that's the part Nintendo hopes it can rely on third-parties for.

Then there's the online service. More and more it seems to be like graphics are the least thing Nintendo is going to be focused on with the Wii U. Yes, they'll make impressive games and take advantage of their own hardware (as they always do), but establishing a more flexible online service is a bigger priority. It's going to be easier for gamers and developers to be more accepting of Wii U's lack of visual punch over another outdated home console online service. Fortunately, we've already seen signs of Nintendo moving forward with a better online service plan that's account based and capable of using the controller for voice chat, video chat,and internet browsing using a virtual keyboard on the touchscreen.

Yeah for me the Wii U is at least more appealing than the Wii because of the HD
factor, even if it ends up being on par with current tech. You cannot underestimate how terrible the Wii looked on HDTVs. It was okay on the old DLP one we had, but when that bit the dust and we switched to LCD it was awful. It made me not want to play games that I was kind of interested in like Zelda and xenoblade.
 
I can't imagine the hardware actually being LESS powerful than PS360. The "it has less shaders" comment, it's not even conceivable to me. They would have to go out of their way to release a less graphically capable console than the current gen. Even run of the mill, cheapest off-the-shelf GPUs are more capable.
 
Yeah for me the Wii U is at least more appealing than the Wii because of the HD
factor, even if it ends up being on par with current tech. You cannot underestimate how terrible the Wii looked on HDTVs. It was okay on the old DLP one we had, but when that bit the dust and we switched to LCD it was awful. It made me not want to play games that I was kind of interested in like Zelda and xenoblade.
Zelda was really hard to play coming off of Skyrim. It looked like crap.
 
Xbox also had some games running at 720P and 1080i. The fact something like Soul Calibur 2 could run at 720P on Xbox is all the proof you need that the original Xbox was WAY more forward thinking than the original Wii.

All that proves is that the Xbox wasn't bottlenecked by video memory like the Wii is. (Xbox used unified memory so its framebuffer could be as large as developers wanted it to be, while Wii has to fit everything in 2 MB which is too small for a 720p framebuffer). In terms of actual computational power the Wii is quite a bit ahead of the Xbox.
 
If indeed Nintendo has opted for graphics on par with current generation machines, then they must have - and have GOT to have - some other very cool features lined up for the machine.

It would be nice if there was a lot more choice in downloadable titles, and it was much easier for developers to get games on whatever WiiWare-type service the Wii U offers. In fact, it would be nice if Nintendo made this a very strong aspect of the console. Working with and funding much smaller scale projects intended to appear on the service would be a great idea.

I am still unsure about the Wii U's tablet controller. But, again, if Nintendo are really planning to introduce such an underpowered console, then I would like to see the following happen:

- Tablet controller design needs tweaking to make it look much sleeker, as I currently think it looks a little like a toy.

- It should at least be possible to use 2 of these controllers at the same time for multiplayer.

- Much improved tech inside the Wii Remote. They should introduce a next-gen Wii Remote with the Wii U.

- 2 tablets should be bundled with the console, with one Wii Remote and nunchuck.

- Very strong online focus for multiplayer and downloadable titles.

Is that too much to ask?
 
If indeed Nintendo has opted for graphics on par with current generation machines, then they must have - and have GOT to have - some other very cool features lined up for the machine.

It would be nice if there was a lot more choice in downloadable titles, and it was much easier for developers to get games on whatever WiiWare-type service the Wii U offers. In fact, it would be nice if Nintendo made this a very strong aspect of the console. Working with and funding much smaller scale projects intended to appear on the service would be a great idea.

I am still unsure about the Wii U's tablet controller. But, again, if Nintendo are really planning to introduce such an underpowered console, then I would like to see the following happen:

- Tablet controller design needs tweaking to make it look much sleeker, as I currently think it looks a little like a toy.

- It should at least be possible to use 2 of these controllers at the same time for multiplayer.

- Much improved tech inside the Wii Remote. They should introduce a next-gen Wii Remote with the Wii U.

- 2 tablets should be bundled with the console, with one Wii Remote and nunchuck.

- Very strong online focus for multiplayer and downloadable titles.

Is that too much to ask?
Yes. Why the fuck would you include three controllers? Most of us already have Wiimotes and will never need a second pad.
 
They have not shown a thing that says otherwise.

Simple game like mario was even jaggie!
183zG.jpg
 
kickstarter....

we will gather enough cash for someone to break their NDA and retire from work.

(i am waiting for e3.......)

I like it. But there have been multiple people 'in the know' claiming the Wii U is an upgrade from ps360, GAF just ignores it and jumps on the next janitor that claims otherwise.
 
All that proves is that the Xbox wasn't bottlenecked by video memory like the Wii is. (Xbox used unified memory so its framebuffer could be as large as developers wanted it to be, while Wii has to fit everything in 2 MB which is too small for a 720p framebuffer). In terms of actual computational power the Wii is quite a bit ahead of the Xbox.

You're not right, but hey, lets run with it.
 
Really using that as a means to show the Wii U's graphical power?

I don't think he meant that. I think he was saying that even a graphically simple game like this still has significant aliasing. Usually you'd expect a simple-looking game to make up for it with sharp image quality (see: Rayman Origins).
 
Really using that as a means to show the Wii U's graphical power?

Why not? Bullshots seem also to be applicable to compare console power on GAF so why not?

Obviously a Demo using Wii assets is the perfect way of deducting the capabilities of a console. Didn't you know that Vampire Rain did max out the 360?
 
Wii U at E3 2011 was such a joke. Ubisoft didn't get to see the actual controller until days before they had to demo ghost recon and killer freaks. They were working on the bird demo up to the last hour, as evidenced by the fact that the stage demo looked noticeably worse compared to the floor demo.

It also seems like the hardware was in a perpetual state of flux and that dev kits were overheating (from all that lack of power of course!). I just personally have decided not to really take anything shown at E3 as a sign of...anything, really, other than the fact that they're not targeting some crazy monster machine.
 
You're not right, but hey, lets run with it.

He's right. You could overclock the Wii (and GC) 10x and be nowhere close to render at 720p due to hardcoded framebuffer limitations.

The problem with the Wii wasn't its power, but its outdated architecture.
 
I don't think he meant that. I think he was saying that even a graphically simple game like this still has significant aliasing. Usually you'd expect a simple-looking game to make up for it with sharp image quality (see: Rayman Origins).
Even so... is the implication that the Wii U is not powerful enough to do FSAA on a NSMB title? That's just absurd, and should be treated with an appropriate level of contempt.

(Of course, it's technically not impossible, I feel I ought to say that. But it really is a ludicrous concept)
 
He's right. You could overclock the Wii (and GC) 10x and be nowhere close to render at 720p due to hardcoded framebuffer limitations.

The problem with the Wii wasn't its power, but its outdated architecture.

He's probably contending my point about the Wii being more powerful (computationally) than the Xbox, in which case he's wrong.
 
Yes. Why the fuck would you include three controllers? Most of us already have Wiimotes and will never need a second pad.

Like I said, I would want a Wii Remote included if it was new and improved tech; not the regular Remote/Motion Plus.

Include 2 tablets and you get multiplayer straight out of the box. Each player having their own private screen and playing in the same room is likely to be a big draw of the machine.

I would expect this if they were going to launch the machine at a £230-ish pricepoint, and the console was packing graphics on par with the PS3 and XBox 360. Obviously if they were launching at the same price the Wii launched at, then I'd expect only one tablet controller to be bundled.
 
I would think the idea that they have 7th generation 360 titles (like Assassin's Creed 3) running on 1st gen dev kits kind of squashes the notion that this could be true.
 
I would think the idea that they have 7th generation 360 titles (like Assassin's Creed 3) running on 1st gen dev kits kind of squashes the notion that this could be true.

Lol, you think GI would damage its reputation??!

Get that logical thinking and common sense out of this thread!
 
I don't think he meant that. I think he was saying that even a graphically simple game like this still has significant aliasing. Usually you'd expect a simple-looking game to make up for it with sharp image quality (see: Rayman Origins).

RO is a 2D, sprite based, game...
 
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