The Dark Knight Rises |OT| The Legend Ends (Warning: Unmarked Spoilers Within)

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Expendable. said:
I'm back! It's a highly entertaining movie, but unfortunately the second act has moments where Nolan really loses control of the story. Characters turn into puppets in service of compressing time and some tension is lost due to plot points feeling forced. Though I never once felt it was bloated, rather the opposite. It honestly felt like Nolan had a 3.5 hour movie he had to cut down.

I'll eat some crow regarding Anne Hathaway, as she was indeed one of the strongest element, albeit oddly underused. Joseph Gordon-Levitt was probably my favorite of the supporting cast. Bane is a great villain, no worries there. There's an underlying sense of menace throughout the whole film because of him and his plan, but no single action scene that lived up to the jaw-dropping "wow" factor that was TDK's chase scene.

The film works better as a piece of the trilogy than a standalone, as I was impressed the way Nolan brought back many references and tied things together. He especially nails Bruce and a lot of his interactions with other characters results in the most emotion in any of the Batman films. There's tons to talk about, so I'll leave it at that. Especially since it's so late here.

I'm in the B range now, might take a second viewing to confirm. TDK = TDKR >> BB for me. It's a solid trilogy, but I don't consider any film to be flat-out great.
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I thought the TDK chase scene was unbearable. In fact, nothing impressed with the dark knight in terms of action scenes. I am hoping Nolan doesn't try and do too many action scenes, he's pretty terrible when it comes to those scenes. Is there a lot in the way of action scenes here in this film? Approximately what percentage of the run time would you say? I remember the avengers had a really lengthy and healthy portion of its run time dedicated to just pure well shot action. I am hoping Nolan doesn't go that route -as said before - he's somewhat clueless when it comes to action.

That's another reason I am looking forward to The Man of Steel. Story wise it will hopefully be one of the better Nolan stories. Couple that fact together with Snyder's eye for visual orchestra, and it looks like it'll be a great piece of film.
 
Is this thread still spoiler free? I've been avoiding it since I'm going to see the movie tomorrow and don't want any last minute spoiling to take place.
 
Sojgat said:
saw the Dark Knight Rises a couple of hours ago and the Aint it Cool review is being kind, the film is a wretched piece of shit. Nolan reinforces his profound misunderstanding of the Batman/Bruce Wayne character at every turn while the rest of the movie is just painfully boring, insultingly stupid and drowned out by it's own monotonous score. Batman is wrong, Bane is wrong, Alfred is wrong, Gordon is wrong.... the whole film is wrong, and anybody who likes it doesn't really like Batman IMO. I'm thankful Nolan is moving on, I like all his other films just fine, but his bat stuff sucks.
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lol wat

I've only just got into the comics/graphic novels but I really love the films. Your line about anybody who likes it doesn't really like Batman is really really stupid and is insulting the people who got into Batman because of the films.
 
watershed said:
Is this thread still spoiler free? I've been avoiding it since I'm going to see the movie tomorrow and don't want any last minute spoiling to take place.
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Safest to stay out. There are serious spoilers in here but they are spoiler tagged. Some fool might come in and troll us all and spoil it with an account suicide too (happened 3 times already). Also steer clear of reviews, so close now
 
JB1981 said:
so can we talk about the plot of TDK? i was watching the movie in bed last night and no matter how many times I watch the movie there are sections that leave me confused.

1.) when batman is standing on top of that skyscraper .. i guess he he listening to a radio broadcast of some sort by the joker? OK so by listening in on this he is able to determine the location of joker's next victim, or does joker actually reveal the location to him? once batman arrives at scene of victim, he finds two people dead at a kitchen table. apparently their names are harvey and dent. a bullet hole is found in the concrete of the room. batman "scans" the bullet or something and then brings the scan back to HQ and replicates the bullet hole? somehow he is then able to come up with some type of 3D rendering of the bullet and is also able to extract the finger print? WTF? he then matches the fingerprint to 4 possible people. he goes after the suspect that has an apartment building overlooking the scene of Commissioner Loeb's funeral procession?

2.) when batman finds this apt, he sees there are a few cops tied up and bound... apparently this is the apt of the psychotic guy from arkham? joker and this guy steal the cops clothes and one of them manages to shoot gordon. gordon takes a shot in the back, secret service style, but his wound is not fatal. gotham pd keeps the fate of gordon secret in order to "protect his family"? i don't understand the reasoning behind this.

3. anyway, dent interrogates the crazy dude who was working with the joker, learns from Bats that he is crazy and won't learn anything good from him. after speaking to Falcone or Marone (can't remember, it's Eric Roberts), Batman decides he can't be Batman anymore (WTF) because the Joker is just too crazy. I guess he figures he has made the world too crazy and he needs to step aside and let Gotham's White Knight take down the mob and the criminals himself (lawfully).

4.) bruce convinces dent to hold a presser where bruce will reveal to the world that he is actually the batman. instead dent reveals that he is batman, gotham pd take dent into custody and will transport him to MCU? by doing this, dent hopes that he can lure the joker and the rest of his cronies and catch him out in the open? OK, so there is a big showdown in the city, batman shows up. batman has a chance to basically kill the joker but he doesn't. the joker is ready to slice bats up in the streets but Gordon pops out and puts a shotgun to joker's head. the joker is taken to MCU but we learn later that this was joker's plan all along and he wanted to be captured! somehow the joker was also so prepared that he had Ramirez and other Gotham PD take both dent and rachel to separate locations. while in prison, the joker is also somehow able to plant a bomb inside one of the inmates' stomachs? how was he able to do this and when did he have time to do this?

5.) joker finds lau and i guess gets back the mobs money. the mob boys meet joker and lau in front of all the money. joker calls into that TV show with the dude from Weird Science. the joker then tells everyone that if coleman reese isn't dead in 60 minutes then a hospital will blow up (likely gotham general). Bruce then wants to know if anyone in Gotham PD has any relatives admitted to Gotham General. why is this signficant? someone in the force was able to get the joker into the hospital? this plot point is totally lost on me. someone please explain!!!
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1. Joker dials 911 and tells the police "8th and Orchard, you'll find Harvey Dent there." The bullet part is one of the more farfetched CSI parts of the film - back at the lab, he presumably takes the same rounds and fires them into different samples of brick before finding a close match simply by looking at them, where the bullet has shattered in a similar fashion to the sample at the scene. By knowing this process he reverses it for the crime scene sample, and virtually pieces the bullet fragments together. It's awesome and ridiculous at the same time. The bullet belongs to Melvin White, and Wayne follows this lead, thinking that this assassin could also shoot the Mayor.

2. Everyone, including Gordon's family, has to believe that he died. We assume that Joker would leave Gordon's family alone after finding out Gordon has died, since Gordon is no longer a threat. If Joker found out Gordon was actually alive, he could still attempt to harm/blackmail Gordon by threatening/harming his family.

3. Yes, he wants justice to be something public and legitimate (Harvey Dent), and not seen as being dished out by a vigilante who thinks himself above the law.

4. I assume he had some other thugs drug and rig up the guy with a bomb, but it's not clear for us.

5. Because Joker threatens to blow up a hospital, Wayne is worried that a police officer will try to kill Coleman Reese (who is on TV to reveal Batman's identity), in order to save his family in hospital. This turns out to be Berg, in the car with Gordon. In the text message, we also learn that Ramirez has family in the hospital (her mother), and could be compromised (which is true).
 
Spoilers in my previous post were for Batman Begins or blacked out, what's the problem?


JB1981 said:
There have been numerous interpretations of Batman throughout the life of the character in the comics. There isn't just one definitive take on the character. For you to say that there is is misleading and disingeuous. You personally may not like this interpretation of the character, but that does not mean that Nolan doesn't get the character or that his interpretation isn't a valid one.
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I believe in selective continuity and that if you take all the best work that's truest to how a character has been built and evolved, you will get a perfect version of that character, thus there is a perfect version of the Batman character which is "right" and others that are "wrong". Nolan's Batman is a version of Batman and it may be just as valid as any other version of Batman, but it still isn't close to the Batman I've been reading my whole life. Nolan doesn't get that Batman at all, and if you can honestly argue that he does, then you just don't know what you're talking about.

Freewheelin' said:
lol wat

I've only just got into the comics/graphic novels but I really love the films. Your line about anybody who likes it doesn't really like Batman is really really stupid and is insulting the people who got into Batman because of the films.
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If you think either I or my comment stupid that's fine it's your opinion, I was being intentionally insulting in a very non-specific sort of way purposefully, and it's only my opinion, but if I'm stupid it shouldn't bother you.


brianjones said:
like people who dont care about comic books?

cause if so i guess i dont really like batman
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Do you like a Batman that runs around roaring at everybody like the Grinch while constantly doing the stupidest possible thing in any given situation? Then I guess not.
 
Expendable really loves Captain America that much? I'm surprised. I liked it a lot also but most people seem to shit on it. I thought the 2nd half was underwhelming but everything up to after the montage in the middle was great. It's so much better than Thor which was AWFUL but everyone seems to rank that high up, Captain America is better than Avengers too imo. Opinions I guess. I'm not a patriotic guy either but I was really wrapped in that era, it felt quaint and endearing. I thought Cap and the main lady had good chemistry too.

30 something hours until I can see this, fuuuuuuuuuuuck I'm hyped. Lincoln Square IMAX, NYC audience, Friday night, comfortable chairs, by myself so there are no annoying people asking me questions during the movie.

Honestly even though I'm hyped for the big screen I actually love imax more for the sound. It's so fucking loud and bombastic I love it. I hope nobody pulls out their damn phone during the movie with the bright light and nobody brings their stupid loud baby/kids.
 
the best film of those building up to avengers was IM1, heck I think IM1 is better than Avengers itself.
 
Angry Fork said:
Expendable really loves Captain America that much? I'm surprised. I liked it a lot also but most people seem to shit on it. I thought the 2nd half was underwhelming but everything up to after the montage in the middle was great. It's so much better than Thor which was AWFUL but everyone seems to rank that high up, Captain America is better than Avengers too imo. Opinions I guess. I'm not a patriotic guy either but I was really wrapped in that era, it felt quaint and endearing. I thought Cap and the main lady had good chemistry too.

30 something hours until I can see this, fuuuuuuuuuuuck I'm hyped. Lincoln Square IMAX, NYC audience, Friday night, comfortable chairs, by myself so there are no annoying people asking me questions during the movie.

Honestly even though I'm hyped for the big screen I actually love imax more for the sound. It's so fucking loud and bombastic I love it. I hope nobody pulls out their damn phone during the movie with the bright light and nobody brings their stupid loud baby/kids.
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Marvel does the opening half of their movies really really well, then they spend the entire 2nd half pandering to the transformers crowd, it works so you cant blame them but it does leave them with terribly lopsided movies, Captain America being chief among them. Iron Man is the only film which manages to hold its integrity in the 2nd part and even that gets wearing right at the end. It is a shame, there are good films hidden in their current lineup.
 
Expendable. said:
And just to stir it up before I fall asleep, yes, Captain America and Ghotocol are better films than The Dark Knight Rises.
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f-3.gif
 
Scullibundo said:
If I could have Nolan do the movie over, I would tell him to axe Catwoman and JGL's character from the film.

Catwoman is enjoyable, but in the grand scheme of things hurts the film imo.

Film was begging to give more time to Bruce's personal struggle.
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Eh..... I thought Selina was brilliant.

Really do love that we have people going:

BB > TDK > TDKR
BB > TDKR > TDK
TDKR > TDK > BB
TDK > TDKR > BB (which seems to be critical consensus, so)

LOVE IT.
 
This film probably has the most powerful audio side I have ever witnessed. The 'drive' of this film was just overwhelmingly fucking huge at times. Walked out two hours ago and I'm still pumped! I need to fight something ASAP.
 
Gonna answer this as well, catching up on 11 fucking pages because my phone ran out of battery

NotTheGuyYouKill said:
So Sculli, when you look at the entire TDK saga, does it tell a completely satisfying tale, even if you had some issues with the final part of story?

Just curious what people think of it in the whole context of this giant story.
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Yes yes yes yes yes. It really does bring it full circle (!!!). It's refreshing, because obviously comics go on and on and on, and while I'd love the next Batfilm to not be a film and be an episodic big budget thing, I love it that there's a story here with an obvious beginning and conclusion to Bruce's story.

Honestly, this trilogy and LOTR are my Star Wars, you know? I was 8, 9 and 10 when the LOTR films came out. I was 11 when Batman Begins came out, and that was a fantastic movie for possibly my favourite character of all time. So I've been waiting 7 years for this conclusion. I wasn't disappointed in the slightest.

I can understand a lot of the criticisms, but they definitely apply to the trilogy as a whole. Fuck me, I was cringing my tits off when the water people were talking in BB about the train smashing into them or whatever it was, there's nothing as bad as that here. But as a trilogy its near flawless in its story telling.
 
DoctorWho said:
The thing with Knowles is, he's usually gushingly positive about anything in the realm of geek. That's one of the big reasons I dismiss his reviews. I'm surprised to see him be so overwhelmingly negative over this film.
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Trust me, it's a fucking disgraceful review. He's gone into the film somehow orchestrating an image of Batman in the comics being exactly the Batman in this film. It's fucking awful. So many times I sighed in disbelief.
 
For people who have seen it, is Bane's musical theme used as well in the film as Joker's theme was? It seems like it's a big part of the score.
 
Sojgat said:
I believe in selective continuity and that if you take all the best work that's truest to how a character has been built and evolved, you will get a perfect version of that character, thus there is a perfect version of the Batman character which is "right" and others that are "wrong". Nolan's Batman is a version of Batman and it may be just as valid as any other version of Batman, but it still isn't close to the Batman I've been reading my whole life. Nolan doesn't get that Batman at all, and if you can honestly argue that he does, then you just don't know what you're talking about.
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the fuck is this
 
Wilbury said:
Trust me, it's a fucking disgraceful review. He's gone into the film somehow orchestrating an image of Batman in the comics being exactly the Batman in this film. It's fucking awful. So many times I sighed in disbelief.
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I usually think most of his reviews are crap, he doesn't understand good films and he loves garbage, this review was right on the money though. His image of Batman seems to be drawn from most popular media featuring the character, from which this new film completely diverges (other than the fact that Bruce Wayne is a rich guy dressed as a bat).


Wilbury said:
the fuck is this
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Science.
 
Ithil said:
For people who have seen it, is Bane's musical theme used as well in the film as Joker's theme was? It seems like it's a big part of the score.
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Umm.. I can't see how this would be a spoiler but Bane is much more militaristic? So is the movie, the scope, the editing. The Joker sort of sneaked into situations and had a eerie tune before the mayhem. Bane is the godzilla in the distance you want to avoid. The score is large, overwhelming. This movie starts slow and then ramps up and ramps up until you just remember to breathe once the credits roll.
 
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