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[grumble]

Enlighten me. You think pickup is a joke but say people need real social skills. What's. The. Difference?

Seriously?

Real social skills are a general term for having the ability to have an honest and positive social experience. Pickup skills have heavy doses of dishonestly and 'playing a game'. A real social skilled person isn't playing a game - they're being honest, genuine, are interested if they seem that way, and are genuinely trying to have a good time and enable others to do the same. There's no manipulation involved.

 

[Kinitari]

Yeah Pick Up Artistry sure is cool:

Anti-slut Defense



Oh yeah, real swell thing they got goin' on. Between this and Last Minute Resistance, so much class.

Well, I don't think it's -all- something you should take as gospel, and I -definitely- don't think every proponent of PUAistry or the like should be given your ear - but to look at one or even a couple of people and think "these guys are representative of the idea/message behind this" is being unreasonable.

I point to guys like SP first and foremost when I mention PUA stuff - specifically because most of the time their message is so simple that I rarely actually have to show someone a video. When you get into specifics like this site does, it overcomplicates things and then you have situations where someone can easily get offended by advice, or worse, you can start listening to really bad PUA labelled advice.

Honestly, I don't even really like mentioning PUAistry as a whole in general because it gives people opportunities to mix messages from a bunch of self-proclaimed pick up artists.

Just take the good and ignore the bad. Same advice I give people who insist on being religious.

 

[DY_nasty]

lol Dy, we're talking about the same thing. You call it "real social skill" everyone else calls it pickup. They're the same thing dude, sorry to disappoint you.

real social skills apply to a lot more than just talking some girl into taking her pants off

but emphasizing "game", a slang term that is essentially meaningless, and pickup some incredibly off the wall bullshit that is presented to most in a way of "how to trick a girl into fucking you" is just not a type of advice you should look to hand out

 

[UFRA]

lol Dy, we're talking about the same thing. You call it "real social skill" everyone else calls it pickup. They're the same thing dude, sorry to disappoint you.

I disagree.

Real social skills means that a person can be "socially normal" in most situations. However, using pickup does not necessarily mean you are socially normal.

Example:

Dude 1 is popular, talkative, interesting, and comfortable around people.

Dude 2 is socially awkward, generally shy, uncomfortable meeting new people, and doesn't talk much. He says stupid shit a lot that makes others feel uncomfortable too.

Dude 1 and 2 can both use pickup, and can both be successful at it. But only Dude 1 has real social skills. Dude 2 is awkward and lacks social skills, and even though he may pickup a girl, later on she will find out he's actually awkward to be around and he will fail.

This is the difference between having social skills and using pickup. I think I'm on the same page as DY, he can correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Devolution]

Well, I don't think it's -all- something you should take as gospel, and I -definitely- don't think every proponent of PUAistry or the like should be given your ear - but to look at one or even a couple of people and think "these guys are representative of the idea/message behind this" is being unreasonable.

I point to guys like SP first and foremost when I mention PUA stuff - specifically because most of the time their message is -so- simple that I rarely actually have to show someone a video. When you get into specifics like this, it overcomplicates things and then you have situations where someone can easily get offended.

Honestly, I don't even really like mentioning PUAistry as a whole in this situation because it gives people opportunities to mix messages from a bunch of self-proclaimed pick up artists.

Just take the good and ignore the bad. Same advice I give people who insist on being religious.

I'd say the best advice is telling people to be genuine and just learn how to communicate that better.

 

[DY_nasty]

Seriously?

Real social skills are a general term for having the ability to have an honest and positive social experience. Pickup skills have heavy doses of dishonestly and 'playing a game'. A real social skilled person isn't playing a game - they're being honest, genuine, are interested if they seem that way, and are genuinely trying to have a good time and enable others to do the same. There's no manipulation involved.

Why is this a bad thing? lol

Isn't this a better goal to reach for than idolizing some random guy on youtube as a party magician?

 

[rush777]

You've turned pickup and "game" into some mythological entity that is rival to the speed force from dc comics.

Social skills mean that you can, consistently, communicate with people around you. Teaching or emphasizing PUA stuff is putting the cart way the fuck out front of the horse. To the point where people will ignore their real issues, shortcomings, and social quarks in preference to what will get them rare attention and positive feedback for coming off like something that they almost never are. Social skills mean you can talk to a waitress. And not get the idea in your head that she wants you when you left her a bigger than usual tip. Social skills mean you don't flip the fuck out over how to return a phone call. Social skills help you figure out when your foot is in your mouth. Social skills keep you from saying YOLO at work.

"Game" is not this big entity that people need to divert energy on. Its slang. Its irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. Its just a stupid name that people assign to one small aspect of social skills and communication. You can't put all that energy into just one thing and forget about everything else that goes into building relationships with people. Romantic or not.

How does one with bad social skills improve upon them if they are unable to approach a stranger in the first place? I've improved leaps and bounds with my social skills because I have gotten to the point where I have the confidence to walk up and talk to someone and that leads to conversations where I can improve my comfort level in those situations.

I wish what you say is true but in my experience the game is real and everyone is playing it, regardless if they want to.

 

[Devolution]

How does one with bad social skills improve upon them if they are unable to approach a stranger in the first place? I've improved leaps and bounds with my social skills because I have gotten to the point where I have the confidence to walk up and talk to someone and that leads to conversations where I can improve my comfort level in those situations.

I wish what you say is true but in my experience the game is real and everyone is playing it, regardless if they want to.

Play a game, you'll get players. Have fun building relationships upon that.

 

[Dr_Boris_Goltz]

I think my girlfriend and I are going to try again.

She told me the feelings are still there but she's scared of us failing a second time. I told her life is too short and random to be scared all the time.

The last season of Six Feet Under Nate says to his sister, "I was scared my whole life. Look where it got me."

In context of the show this is extremely powerful.

 

[The Anti-Monitor]

Personally, I think the last thing a lot of gaffers need is the idea that dating women (even "getting" or "picking them up") is a "game". As if a lot didn't have enough problems already trying to follow some sort of guide when it comes to dating.

If you pretend to be someone you're not and lie your way into a girl's pants, it doesn't make you confident, it lets you pretend to be confindent long enough to get on some idiot's pants. But it's not gonna last beyond that.

 

[Vermillion]

Yeah Pick Up Artistry sure is cool:

Anti-slut Defense



Oh yeah, real swell thing they got goin' on. Between this and Last Minute Resistance, so much class.

Depends on what you consider PUA, Dev. I've actually never heard these terms except from when you brought them up.

 

[Kinitari]

I'd say the best advice is telling people to be genuine and just learn how to communicate that better.

In the end I'd agree with you, with maybe a mild bit less of a focus on genuine...ity(?) and a bit more of a focus on self improvement. Sometimes, if we're being blunt, being genuine isn't good enough. You need to make efforts to improve yourself.

That and fake confidence until you make it, I always stand by that advice.

 

[bjb]

I think my girlfriend and I are going to try again.

She told me the feelings are still there but she's scared of us failing a second time. I told her life is too short and random to be scared all the time.

The last season of Six Feet Under Nate says to his sister, "I was scared my whole life. Look where it got me."

In context of the show this is extremely powerful.

Good luck man. Hopefully you both have learned from your mistakes and can be happy again.

 

[Bam Bam Baklava]

Why is this a bad thing? lol

Isn't this a better goal to reach for than idolizing some random guy on youtube as a party magician?

This is so true man. These guys have become prophets or something to emulate. You can't be Brent Smith, you gotta be yourself.

 

[FyreWulff]

How does one with bad social skills improve upon them if they are unable to approach a stranger in the first place? I've improved leaps and bounds with my social skills because I have gotten to the point where I have the confidence to walk up and talk to someone and that leads to conversations where I can improve my comfort level in those situations.

I wish what you say is true but in my experience the game is real and everyone is playing it, regardless if they want to.

Treating it as a game, to me, comes off as not treating other people as human beings, and sheltering yourself from emotions by saying anything that happens is just a game. That's the "it's a race" aspect I mentioned earlier. A game is something that you're trying to win. So who are you trying to please by winning it? Other people?

 

[DY_nasty]

How does one with bad social skills improve upon them if they are unable to approach a stranger in the first place? I've improved leaps and bounds with my social skills because I have gotten to the point where I have the confidence to walk up and talk to someone and that leads to conversations where I can improve my comfort level in those situations.

I wish what you say is true but in my experience the game is real and everyone is playing it, regardless if they want to.

1) you just said you improved, so i'm kinda lost as to what you mean in the first part

2) there's only a game if you're ready to play it. fuck the back and forth bullshit and high school games - be straight up with people and be direct with them the moment that you're unclear about something and you'll shave off most of the drama before it even starts

people make it sound like its impossible to get a clear message from someone. start with the basics - like calling them instead of texting, not trying to read minds (well, i heard her friends like ___... i wonder if she likes ___... I'm not really feeling ____. best to make up some bullshit to preempt the non-existent drama!), and not pretending to be things you aren't. if you don't start off doing shit like this, then it can't turn into huge headaches down the road like they always do

 

[Kinitari]

This is so true man. These guys have become prophets or something to emulate. You can't be Brent Smith, you gotta be yourself.

I think if people are out there idolizing people like Brent Smith (I actually don't follow the guy) it speaks of a deep seeded issue that person already has. Honestly, I didn't even consider that there was so much variety to PUAistry - the message just seems so... simple to me. So clearly self evident, without the need of a spokesperson or a superhero to attach to it.

Be confident, take risks, and don't be afraid of rejection or saying the wrong thing. Quit with the excuse making and make that effort.

 

[Bam Bam Baklava]

I think if people are out there idolizing people like Brent Smith (I actually don't follow the guy) it speaks of a deep seeded issue that person already has. Honestly, I didn't even consider that there was so much variety to PUAistry - the message just seems so... simple to me. So clearly self evident, without the need of a spokesperson or a superhero to attach to it.

Be confident, take risks, and don't be afraid of rejection or saying the wrong thing. Quit with the excuse making and make that effort.

I guess for some guys it's like a re-entry into the world. They lived sheltered lives or something so they have no idea what to do and PUA gives them a how to guide. It's obviously not useful for a guy who has gone through an "average" life and grew up learning how to interact with people.

 

[Vermillion]

I think my girlfriend and I are going to try again.

She told me the feelings are still there but she's scared of us failing a second time. I told her life is too short and random to be scared all the time.

The last season of Six Feet Under Nate says to his sister, "I was scared my whole life. Look where it got me."

In context of the show this is extremely powerful.

It is short... I hope it works out

 

[Kinitari]

I guess for some guys it's like a re-entry into the world. They lived sheltered lives or something so they have no idea what to do and PUA gives them a how to guide. It's obviously not useful for a guy who has gone through an "average" life and grew up learning how to interact with people.

I would agree with that sentiment - if you already have no problem going up and talking to someone you find interesting - ie, you have a relatively healthy understanding of social dynamic and are comfortable making that effort - you already have everything you need to take from PUAistry. Reading up on this complex PUAistry stuff like... what a girl REALLY means when a girl says X... bullshit, nothing you have to worry about even if it WERE accurate.

However If you are the sort of person who maybe hasn't been out there in a while, are new to the game and have grown up 'nerdy' or something stereotypical - and you really think the social dynamic of striking up conversation with someone you find attractive is the conversational equivalent of a Unicorn, something like SP will (hopefully) show you that it isn't that hard/scary.

 

[rush777]

Treating it as a game, to me, comes off as not treating other people as human beings, and sheltering yourself from emotions by saying anything that happens is just a game. That's the "it's a race" aspect I mentioned earlier. A game is something that you're trying to win. So who are you trying to please by winning it? Other people?

Fair enough, you and Devo make sense and I agree with both of you, I just see the people around me treat it that way... maybe I'm around the wrong crowds. I can only say the person is pleasing themselves by winning the so called game. I'm always honest with every interacton I have with a girl I don't need to bullshit to pick anyone up, I hardly even talk about myself as I'm good at asking questions and I'm genuinely interested in people.

I've always had good social skills, just not with women and until I finally got the guts to approach them and talk to them. Now it's very natural for me because I'm comfortable with that situation and advice in here and PUA was a big part of getting me to stop caring and put myself out there.

 

[Devolution]

Fair enough, you and Devo make sense and I agree with both of you, I just see the people around me treat it that way... maybe I'm around the wrong crowds. I can only say the person is pleasing themselves by winning the so called game. I'm always honest with every interacton I have with a girl I don't need to bullshit to pick anyone up, I hardly even talk about myself as I'm good at asking questions and I'm genuinely interested in people.

I've always had good social skills, just not with women and until I finally got the guts to approach them and talk to them. Now it's very natural for me because I'm comfortable with that situation and advice in here and PUA was a big part of getting me to stop caring and put myself out there.

You put yourself out there, don't give yourself so little credit.

 

[Mumei]

Seriously?

Real social skills are a general term for having the ability to have an honest and positive social experience. Pickup skills have heavy doses of dishonestly and 'playing a game'. A real social skilled person isn't playing a game - they're being honest, genuine, are interested if they seem that way, and are genuinely trying to have a good time and enable others to do the same. There's no manipulation involved.

Correct.

PUArtistry is fundamentally about dishonesty in the service of getting laid. I have a friend who talks much like Nerds with Guns does, whom I have posted about before.

I think it's all very well wanting to learn to interact with people, to go up to a stranger confidently and talk to her (or him), and to carry on a conversation. I think it is a great goal to feel confident in social situations like that. And these are things that I myself would never claim to be particularly good at and could certainly stand to improve. If it were merely about improving confidence in these ways, people would not have a problem with it.

But "The Game" is not merely about teaching these basic social skills (however much it might); it also goes about teaching rather odious rape myths, encourages a fundamentally dishonest approach of faking who you are, what you think, and what your intentions are in the service of getting laid, and creates a mythological bogeyman form of feminism that is rabidly anti-sex. And as I said it constructs male-female relationships as this game of male ingenuity vs female social programming, where the woman doesn't possess the actual ability to know what she wants. It's this absurd and ultimately adversarial understanding of social interaction that is less about genuine social connection and more about winning the game - keeping her ASD from going off (or getting past her "resistance") and "scoring."

If someone says that "game" just means "learning to be a more socially confident person" to them and that's all they are trying to learn, I don't really have a problem with that - though I don't think that fundamentally is what it is about. But when someone says that they are trying to learn game, and they mean all that baggage? I'm disgusted.

 

[rush777]

I guess for some guys it's like a re-entry into the world. They lived sheltered lives or something so they have no idea what to do and PUA gives them a how to guide. It's obviously not useful for a guy who has gone through an "average" life and grew up learning how to interact with people.

I wouldn't say PUA gives anyone a how to guide, I just think they are good at demonstrating how silly the whole situation is and why we shouldn't give a shit when approaching someone we're interested in.

I've seen several of your posts and the main thing I read is that you're uncomfortable with approaching girls because you're awkward and not good looking enough. How can what they say not apply to yourself? Did your avererage upbringing allow you to be comfortable with meeting and getting women to go out with you? Although it seems as if several people in here are saying that they are telling you to lie about yourself in order to get in the girls pants which I think is total bullshit and I would never resort to that. I've never seen a video where they do that though.

 

[Kinitari]

Correct.

PUArtistry is fundamentally about dishonesty in the service of getting laid. I have a friend who talks much like Nerds with Guns does, whom I have posted about before.

I think it's all very well wanting to learn to interact with people, to go up to a stranger confidently and talk to her (or him), and to carry on a conversation. I think it is a great goal to feel confident in social situations like that. And these are things that I myself would never claim to be particularly good at and could certainly stand to improve. If it were merely about improving confidence in these ways, people would not have a problem with it.

But "The Game" is not merely about teaching these basic social skills (however much it might); it also goes about teaching rather odious rape myths, encourages a fundamentally dishonest approach of faking who you are, what you think, and what your intentions are in the service of getting laid, and creates a mythological bogeyman form of feminism that is rabidly anti-sex. And as I said it constructs male-female relationships as this game of male ingenuity vs female social programming, where the woman doesn't possess the actual ability to know what she wants. It's this absurd and ultimately adversarial understanding of social interaction that is less about genuine social connection and more about winning the game - keeping her ASD from going off (or getting past her "resistance") and "scoring."

If someone says that "game" just means "learning to be a more socially confident person" to them and that's all they are trying to learn, I don't really have a problem with that - though I don't think that fundamentally is what it is about. But when someone says that they are trying to learn game, and they mean all that baggage? I'm disgusted.

I think you touch on an important point here - some people hear 'the game' and assume what the meaning behind the phrase is. I think when some people in this thread mention 'the game' they speak of the social dynamic, and it's constructs. In this thread there are people who have mentioned the game as something else, as a mechanism to (maliciously) manipulate females into sex, all the while undermining the 'humanity' of said women.

I think I always look to the more... light hearted yet sincere side of PUAistry, like SP (I always mention them, but they are my gold standard) - and I don't even consider people like Brent in the equation.

 

[Vermillion]

I think that this is somewhat anecdotal, but many girls have told me (and friends) that when they go to parties (if they're a virgin), they bring friends with them particularly to keep them from hooking up with the guys there (and vice versa). I remember helping with this at one point - a girl wanted to have sex with my friend, but her friends were like "no, she wouldn't want to do this," and we got them out of the room.

Then the girl took my friend to her room and they fucked anyways. Ah, well.

 

[rush777]

I think you touch on an important point here - some people hear 'the game' and assume what the meaning behind the phrase is. I think when some people in this thread mention 'the game' they speak of the social dynamic, and it's constructs. In this thread there are people who have mentioned the game as something else, as a mechanism to (maliciously) manipulate females into sex, all the while undermining the 'humanity' of said women.

I think I always look to the more... light hearted yet sincere side of PUAistry, like SP (I always mention them, but they are my gold standard) - and I don't even consider people like Brent in the equation.

The Social Dynamic is what I refer to when I talk about the stupid "game".

 

[SquiddyCracker]

I think my girlfriend and I are going to try again.

She told me the feelings are still there but she's scared of us failing a second time. I told her life is too short and random to be scared all the time.

The last season of Six Feet Under Nate says to his sister, "I was scared my whole life. Look where it got me."

In context of the show this is extremely powerful.

Good luck with that, just stay honest and hold it together for as long as you think it's possible.

 

[Izick]

Not true. The other night when I was waiting in line to close out tabs or get more rounds I'd just chat up the girls in front or behind me, and just simple questions would elicit long-winded responses. Get this--some would even control the conversation and start asking ME question! And if you saw my pictures, you'd see I'm not a very good-looking guy! If you're slim and don't have jacked-up face, you can pretty much get ten times this sort of response....if you lose your shitty attitude, that is.

...

He had balls for sure. The rest was pretty cringe worthy though He's a fan of keys to the vip? Couldn't tell, really. Those guys have similar outlooks on everything to how Brent views the world. They have great stuff here. The show is pretty hilarious too, especially the judges.

I couldn't bother with watching more than 8 minutes or so but it seemed authentic to me. The guy obviously knew the camera was there but she seemed genuinely surprised by the encounter at first, or she's a great actress. I suspect you put too much weight in the word model here. She's just a woman. He also seemed to know precisely what to say as he wasn't stumbling for words either, which I interpreted as being confident. As for being the only one who sees the shit, maybe it's you who can't see the truth? We're not posting this stuff to screw you over. It's pretty clear you are not a believer yet, but it also seems like you aren't even willing to take the "risk" of becoming one either. What do you have to lose?

I'm just saying, some dude walks up to this model on the street, who looked like she was on her way somewhere, and just starts to ask questions, she is going to stop-dead in her tracks and just start spouting out her lines real responses? Good thing a blonde supermodel happened to have been leaned up against that wall that day, and she happened to accept his date-offer. Give me a break.

I'm fine if you guys want to be positive all the time or whatever, but don't get bamboozled by crooks like this guy.

 

[Vermillion]

It actually does happen. But you've never tried.

 

[Izick]

It actually does happen. But you've never tried.

I'm sure it does happen. Supermodels are people too, I'm just saying this weasel must have incredible luck to manage to find a supermodel on the street and successfully ask her out, whilst conveniently being filmed for that segment.

I wonder why they never show her face?

 

[Vermillion]

Or you could just be aiming to shoot a video, see someone on the street and start filming. And maybe they didn't show her face because she was actually looking at him?

 

[Etrian Oddity]

...

And by jacked-up I mean seriously disfigured. But then again you are hideous, after all (so you keep telling us).

I'm just saying, some dude walks up to this model on the street, who looked like she was on her way somewhere, and just starts to ask questions, she is going to stop-dead in her tracks and just start spouting out her lines real responses? Good thing a blonde supermodel happened to have been leaned up against that wall that day, and she happened to accept his date-offer. Give me a break.

I'm fine if you guys want to be positive all the time or whatever, but don't get bamboozled by crooks like this guy.

Explain Simple Pickup pwning the ABC reporter than. As has been said numerous times, they have proven that, while making use of editing for the sake of time, they meet any challenge posed to them by not hiring folks and actually picking up random women who aren't "in" on it. If you had a semblance of self-esteem and actually tried cold approaches you would see it isn't the impossibility you make it out to be.
Seriously dude get your head out of your ass with your negativity because it's getting very old in this thread.

 

[rush777]

I'm sure it does happen. Supermodels are people too, I'm just saying this weasel must have incredible luck to manage to find a supermodel on the street and successfully ask her out, whilst conveniently being filmed for that segment.

I wonder why they never show her face?

It happens brother, confidence goes a long way. I think the model thing is irrelevant anyways, you shouldn't always be looking for the most beautiful girls in the area and expect to get a result every time. They get hit on all the time, find a girl you think is attractive and or interesting and go for it! Just get comfortable talking to them first and move on from there, a normal conversation has gone a long way for me. And you're right that so called weasel probably did get lucky, and so might you if you tried!

 

[SquiddyCracker]

PUA?
*Turns 360 degrees and leaves thread*

 

[Vermillion]

PUA?
*Turns 360 degrees and leaves thread*

Lol. As I said, it depends on what you consider to be PUA. The magic and the terms? Ignore. People talking to any woman they find attractive? That's another story.

 

[Bam Bam Baklava]

Lol. As I said, it depends on what you consider to be PUA. The magic and the terms? Ignore. People talking to any woman they find attractive? That's another story.

How is that PUA though? Sounds like everyone is a PUA then. From what I've seen the description is basically given to those who make some kind of system out of approaching women. This system is then basically taught and replicated.

Also, every time I read Izick's posts I see this picture in my mind.

 

[Nerds with Guns]

So much bullshit on the last page, can't deal with it all.


"Real social skill" and social dynamics (Game,pua,Day Game, Night Game, Pickup) are the same thing. They literally go hand in hand. If you want to talk to girls, and become good at talking to girls; you have to become comfortable and relaxed when talking to everyone. I do not give a fuck what your opinion is this is fact. Pickup is a tool for self improvement, deal with it. Nobody is changing into something they are not; I don't even know where that idea even came from. Nobody is tricking girls into having sex with them; once again, I don't know where that idea even came from. At no point when I was approaching girls was I ever lying to a girl, nor was I tricking a girl into doing anything ever. The vast majority of people on Gaf have a severely fucked up and tainted interpretation on what day game even is. I'm sorry about that, I really am. The entire purpose of day game is becoming a social and confident person. It is not lying to someone, it is not manipulating someone, and it is not playing games with someone. It is to work on yourself as a person, know what you want from life, and step outside of your comfort zone. I don’t know how people can repeat word for word the last sentence I just wrote and then turn around and bash the shit out of game. They are. The same. Thing.

 

[rush777]

So much bullshit on the last page, can't deal with it all.


"Real social skill" and social dynamics (Game,pua,Day Game, Night Game, Pickup) are the same thing. They literally go hand in hand. If you want to talk to girls, and become good at talking to girls; you have to become comfortable and relaxed when talking to everyone. I do not give a fuck what your opinion is this is fact. Pickup is a tool for self improvement, deal with it. Nobody is changing into something they are not; I don't even know where that idea even came from. Nobody is tricking girls into having sex with them; once again, I don't know where that idea even came from. At no point when I was approaching girls was I ever lying to a girl, nor was I tricking a girl into doing anything ever. The vast majority of people on Gaf have a severely fucked up and tainted interpretation on what day game even is. I'm sorry about that, I really am. The entire purpose of day game is becoming a social and confident person. It is not lying to someone, it is not manipulating someone, and it is not playing games with someone. It is to work on yourself as a person, know what you want from life, and step outside of your comfort zone. I don’t know how people can repeat word for word the last sentence I just wrote and then turn around and bash the shit out of game. They are. The same. Thing.

Great post, this is what I talk about when I say the "game".

 

[Vermillion]

How is that PUA though? Sounds like everyone is a PUA then. From what I've seen the description is basically given to those who make some kind of system out of approaching women. This system is then basically taught and replicated.

Also, every time I read Izick's posts I see this picture in my mind.

Well, I don't know about any system.

 

[Nerds with Guns]

PUArtistry is fundamentally about dishonesty in the service of getting laid. I have a friend who talks much like Nerds with Guns does, whom I have posted about before.

At no point do I talk like this, do not insinuate that I do. Your friend is sleazy, I am not.

 

[SquiddyCracker]

Because I've dabbled in PUA, and I know all about the more positively-spinned aspects of it such as "It's not about techniques and tricks, it's about becoming a better you"

Using a shotgun approach isn't just stepping outside of your comfort zone, it usually results in you thinking of women as objects or targets. In a sense, you're depersonalizing them in order to make any rejection trivial and non-important.

Their are other ways of improving on ones self-confidence, and other ways of dealing with rejections, such as engaging in activities that will naturally result in increased self-confidence, or accepting a rejection and understanding that it wouldn't work out between the two of you instead of having some bro-tude about fish in the sea or something along those lines.

Whatever works for you though, I just don't think most if not all constructed methods of attracting temporary or long-lasting mates are suitable for most people.
Even if you have nothing to do with the game, calling it "the game" or something to that effect can turn relationships and the procurement of them into an actual game - which is a grave simplification of the social dynamics at play.

 

[Vermillion]

Because I've dabbled in PUA, and I know all about the more positively-spinned aspects of it such as "It's not about techniques and tricks, it's about becoming a better you"

Using a shotgun approach isn't just stepping outside of your comfort zone, it usually results in you thinking of women as objects or targets. In a sense, you're depersonalizing them in order to make any rejection trivial and non-important.

Their are other ways of improving on ones self-confidence, and other ways of dealing with rejections, such as engaging in activities that will naturally result in increased self-confidence, or accepting a rejection and understanding that it wouldn't work out between the two of you instead of having some bro-tude about fish in the sea or something along those lines.

Whatever works for you though, I just don't think most if not all constructed methods of attracting temporary or long-lasting mates are suitable for most people.
Even if you have nothing to do with the game, calling it "the game" or something to that effect does kinda show how you view relationships and the procurement of them.

Well, it seems like we're all talking about different things, here.

 

[Nerds with Guns]

Because I've dabbled in PUA, and I know all about the more positively-spinned aspects of it such as "It's not about techniques and tricks, it's about becoming a better you"

Using a shotgun approach isn't just stepping outside of your comfort zone, it usually results in you thinking of women as objects or targets. In a sense, you're depersonalizing them in order to make any rejection trivial and non-important.

Their are other ways of improving on ones self-confidence, and other ways of dealing with rejections, such as engaging in activities that will naturally result in increased self-confidence, or accepting a rejection and understanding that it wouldn't work out between the two of you instead of having some bro-tude about fish in the sea or something along those lines.

Whatever works for you though, I just don't think most if not all constructed methods of attracting temporary or long-lasting mates are suitable for most people.
Even if you have nothing to do with the game, calling it "the game" or something to that effect does kinda show how you view relationships and the procurement of them.

And we are going to end this with: whatever works for you.

 

[Minamu]

Devolution, what was it about the pua links that bothered you? I can agree that some of the phrasing was pretty bad but the terms and what they represent are real. I stumbled upon LMR with that 19 year old I met. I didn't push her into anything, she came home with me of her own accord (meeting up was her idea), and instead of sort of forcing the sex to happen like you can to overcome the token resistance, I let it slide because anything else felt wrong morally. Now I haven't heard a peep from her in I don't know how long. It could very well be because I didn't act like a jerk, there is "documentation" of that happening.

And what happened here? Didn't we already establish that pua isn't inherently *anything*, the only thing that matters is how and why you use it, on an individual level? Or am I alone in looking at it like that?

 

[DY_nasty]

So much bullshit on the last page, can't deal with it all.


"Real social skill" and social dynamics (Game,pua,Day Game, Night Game, Pickup) are the same thing. They literally go hand in hand. If you want to talk to girls, and become good at talking to girls; you have to become comfortable and relaxed when talking to everyone. I do not give a fuck what your opinion is this is fact. Pickup is a tool for self improvement, deal with it. Nobody is changing into something they are not; I don't even know where that idea even came from. Nobody is tricking girls into having sex with them; once again, I don't know where that idea even came from. At no point when I was approaching girls was I ever lying to a girl, nor was I tricking a girl into doing anything ever. The vast majority of people on Gaf have a severely fucked up and tainted interpretation on what day game even is. I'm sorry about that, I really am. The entire purpose of day game is becoming a social and confident person. It is not lying to someone, it is not manipulating someone, and it is not playing games with someone. It is to work on yourself as a person, know what you want from life, and step outside of your comfort zone. I don’t know how people can repeat word for word the last sentence I just wrote and then turn around and bash the shit out of game. They are. The same. Thing.

lol okay

fuck dat chicken like nobody is looking

 

[Izick]

-The dude runs up to this girl; obviously he's not an intimidating man by any stretch of the imagination, but he literally runs up to this girl, I mean that's a bit creepy

-camera man has camera on and seemingly runs into place

-the guy manages to guess she's foreign, but slyly chooses the incorrect origin country

-a bald dude with glasses stares back at the camera (whilst in front of the girl) for at least 5 seconds, head-on; I would freak the fuck out if some dude was staring right behind me like he's seen a ghost

- a dude walks right in front of the camera, behind the girl, then around behind the ""pick up artist"" then back around behind the girl; the girl never moves. She is completely frozen.

-I mean, just picture this; this guy is talking to this girl, whilst some dirty man is standing a few feet behind her, behind a building, filming the conversation

-the man with the camera stalks them, careful not to be seen, hiding, keeping the camera out of sight; with every step he lurks right behind the actors, careful not to be seen

-she never looks behind her, nor notices the creepy stalker with the camera as he follows the pair

-the man wait outside the pub, filming and filming; what's his story? Forget this spaz, I want to know the life of the guy that films this shit!

I mean, it's not that hard to see. If you want to suspend your belief and hope that this shit is real, then that's fine I guess, but I can see this isn't.

 

[Etrian Oddity]

Well, it seems like we're all talking about different things, here.

I agree.

I suggest we codify some terms so as to avoid future bickering like this. We need to differentiate social betterment (as Nerds with Guns and others have mentioned), sleazy pick-up artistry (such as what Devo and others have mentioned), and the things not quite in either category. Because this shit too is getting old very quickly.

 

[DY_nasty]

Devolution, what was it about the pua links that bothered you? I can agree that some of the phrasing was pretty bad but the terms and what they represent are real. I stumbled upon LMR with that 19 year old I met. I didn't push her into anything, she came home with me of her own accord (meeting up was her idea), and instead of sort of forcing the sex to happen like you can to overcome the token resistance, I let it slide because anything else felt wrong morally. Now I haven't heard a peep from her in I don't know how long. It could very well be because I didn't act like a jerk, there is "documentation" of that happening.

And what happened here? Didn't we already establish that pua isn't inherently *anything*, the only thing that matters is how and why you use it, on an individual level? Or am I alone in looking at it like that?

Maybe it was the stuff bolded?

Before sex, anti-slut defense often manifests as token resistance put up by the woman to demonstrate that they resisted the sexual advances, which helps absolve them of their guilt of sex, which originates mostly from social programming. Post-sex ASD often involves justifications for the sex act: “It just happened,” “he wouldn’t give up,” “I was really drunk,” etc. PUAs should take this tendency of women into consideration, and make sex as easy for her as possible by taking the lead and responsibility for sex, and providing her with convenient excuses for sleeping with them.

and Last Minute Resistance... I mean, come the fuck on.

Everything about it comes off as tricking those hapless sluts into fucking you then rinsing off their inevitable shame so that you can do it again.

Its not people you're talking about anymore. Its a mark system.

 

[Izick]

I'm not going to say anything more on these ""pick up artists"" I just wanted to outline the most absurd points of that video.