2012 First U.S. Presidential Debate |OT| OK Libya... We need a leader, not a reader.
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Angry Fork
Member
The disastrous Bush years + Obama continuing some of them led to immense resurgence in the left and Occupy would just be the start. If Romney/Ryan came in, slashed infrastructure programs, started a war with Iran and overall be 10x worse than Bush administration forget about it. There would be revolutionary sentiment.
If Obama wins with house/senate, maybe some stuff can get done through legislation and that's fine. But if they don't history has shown us things will get heated among normal people, workers, minorities, students and so on and the american dream lie will finally die. It will suck horribly for people like me, young people and anyone on their own in the short term but long term it could bring something new imo when the apathy balloon pops.
SouthernDragon
Member
Again, try to address the mountain of bullshit in the time allotted.
I could give a course on the bullshit.
That's what you've been conditioned to think. It doesn't have to be that way. There's always a discussion had after these debates where the turds can be revealed for what they are. Instead the focus is on the superficial elements.
Al-ibn Kermit
Junior Member
I already expected Romney to win this debate, but not the other ones. The fact checkers are scrambling their fighters though.
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
Somebody give Chris Hayes a weeknight TV show. Stat.
EatinOlives
Member
The real fun begins here.
SquiddyCracker
Banned
Content versus presentation.
Only the presentation from Romney consisted of acting like a belligerent child, which is the sort of behaviour that a lot of americans look up to it seems.
Only the presentation from Romney consisted of acting like a belligerent child, which is the sort of behaviour that a lot of americans look up to it seems.
soul creator
Member
Obama just had that bomb anniversary sex he's about to get on his mind. It's easy to be a bit distracted.
Rollo Tomasi
Member
The challengers always look better the first debate.
GAF's memory is short. Everyone, media included, gave McCain the first debate until the snap polls came in.
No one but the internet wants to see argumentative Obama, the people who haven't been paying attention until now don't like him that way. they like Professor Obama even when the pundits don't. Just like they loved Professor Bill at the convention.
No one but the internet wants to see argumentative Obama, the people who haven't been paying attention until now don't like him that way. they like Professor Obama even when the pundits don't. Just like they loved Professor Bill at the convention.
The Frankman
Banned
I'm getting fucking tired of Obama being too nice. Being nice to Repubs who sandbagged his whole campaign didn't work, and it won't work here in the debates. Next time I need to see the fire he used to display in the last campaign... Hell, in speeches the gave last year.
I really think his camp is planning to attack Romney post-debate, but sheesh the undecided voters/Fox News is going to have a field day with this.
I really think his camp is planning to attack Romney post-debate, but sheesh the undecided voters/Fox News is going to have a field day with this.
ThisWreckage
Banned
Romney's strategy is also brilliant. Positioning himself as a nonpartisan will swing some independent voters. Facts are irrelevant in presidential debates. He knows he can say literally anything and get away with it.
No, just a poor showing tonight. There's still 2 more between them.
OldAsUrSock
Banned
Romney kept interrupting but he did not get to talk as long but I doubt he knew that.
ReturnOfTheRAT
Member
He was good on Real Time, he's always good on MSNBC.
Even on the quality at parts Obama clearly wasn't as prepared as he was in the later parts of the debates and Mitt walked over him. I think fact checks will even the playing field a little but Mitt has the win tonight. I really wish the Jim didn't let Mitt get so many last words in since they were desperation moves at certain points.
I did say Romney was going to be declared the winner of this debate. Expected. He'll likely get a point or two back in the polls over the next week or so.
Obama came into tonight playing defense, which is what was (or should have been) expected coming in. This was the debate where Romney was most likely to make gains due to it being about the economy, so it was Obama's basic job to just minimize any bleeding that could result from it.
All told, this went more or less how I expected it to go. The VP and foreign policy debates are where Obama/Biden need to go on offense and basically put this election to bed.
Obama came into tonight playing defense, which is what was (or should have been) expected coming in. This was the debate where Romney was most likely to make gains due to it being about the economy, so it was Obama's basic job to just minimize any bleeding that could result from it.
All told, this went more or less how I expected it to go. The VP and foreign policy debates are where Obama/Biden need to go on offense and basically put this election to bed.
Technosteve
Banned
Anyone watching the univsion stream, who do they think won?
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Ed Shultz asks how Obama prepared.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/theoval/2012/10/02/obama-debate-prep-is-a-drag/1608033/
"It's a drag," [Obama] added. "They're making me do my homework."
http://www.usatoday.com/story/theoval/2012/10/02/obama-debate-prep-is-a-drag/1608033/
"It's a drag," [Obama] added. "They're making me do my homework."
This. Just watch tomorrow, you can't possibly talk about the debate without bringing up the fact Romney was full of shit for most if not all of it.
Bill Maher is a clown, and a near racist when it comes to this type of stuff. His whole wanting Obama to be "Black" in these types of moments is offensive as fuck, like being angry and forceful is some kind of characteristic inherent within black people, and being passive and kind is a uniquely white trait.
computers putin'
Member
It's disappointing, but I shouldn't be surprised.
Ken Masters
Banned
EatinOlives
Member
Chiggs
Gold Member
Turn your back on Elway, will you?!!!!
oneils
Member
Is there a live stream of this? lol.
Pretty much.
They just plastered their previously prepared talking points, over and over, no mater what was refuted.
Just rinse and repeat.
the 1 takeaway is that Romney is going to reduce the deficit & make life perfect for the poor and the rich.
See?
How are your teeth...friendo..?
Tylahedras
Banned
Holy shit. That was a front row seat to an ass kicking.
Are you a fellow American? That's kind of our MO.
NullPointer
Member
Romney got under Obama's skin, made him defensive. The conversational attack-mode of Romney's detailing America's woes and Lehrer trying to rein in the clock disrupted Obama's rhythms and forced him to speak with a much quicker cadence - his words were right for the most part, but the emphasis and space to hammer his points wasn't there. Moments where Obama begins by collecting his thoughts come across as flinching recoils from an attack or accusation.
The problem I have when examining these two is that Romney has laid down principles, but no details - no hard choices - no plan that has been examined that has been found to match his principles. This is huge, and Obama tried to point out this lack of details a few times, but couldn't truly nail the point.
Obama was the bearer of hard choices - each one of those an avenue for attack by Romney, which is perfectly fine - and Obama has a record to show for those choices and how they could lead to success over the long term, but the fact that he didn't turn a huge economic crisis in 2008 into an engine of growth and prosperity for all right now puts that record against Romney's 'trust me, I won't let you down', and Romney's passionate vagueness will sway more people.
Another disappointment was that I wanted to see Obama clearly riposte Romney's attacks - because I felt he did a great job when he did - but he left some attacks on the table: Obamacare raising premiums by $2500 instead of lowering them - the rationale for investment in green technology companies when looking at their track record - cuts to the military - tax credits for moving plants overseas. I think Obama could have tackled these and come out on top, but they didn't match the direction he seemed to want to speak about, so they were left in the air to linger.
Romney got blood tonight, even though we got ZERO details, yet again. But his attacks and ready-to-fight and readiness for quick statements will be eaten up by the pundits and his base.
Its too bad too, because Romney expects us to forget what we've already seen from him, whether it be the hidden camera footage, or blatant trolling during the Libya attack, or the lack of plans that meet any arithmetic sense. None of those have changed - but if you're angry, he's got skills at being your standard bearer.
The problem I have when examining these two is that Romney has laid down principles, but no details - no hard choices - no plan that has been examined that has been found to match his principles. This is huge, and Obama tried to point out this lack of details a few times, but couldn't truly nail the point.
Obama was the bearer of hard choices - each one of those an avenue for attack by Romney, which is perfectly fine - and Obama has a record to show for those choices and how they could lead to success over the long term, but the fact that he didn't turn a huge economic crisis in 2008 into an engine of growth and prosperity for all right now puts that record against Romney's 'trust me, I won't let you down', and Romney's passionate vagueness will sway more people.
Another disappointment was that I wanted to see Obama clearly riposte Romney's attacks - because I felt he did a great job when he did - but he left some attacks on the table: Obamacare raising premiums by $2500 instead of lowering them - the rationale for investment in green technology companies when looking at their track record - cuts to the military - tax credits for moving plants overseas. I think Obama could have tackled these and come out on top, but they didn't match the direction he seemed to want to speak about, so they were left in the air to linger.
Romney got blood tonight, even though we got ZERO details, yet again. But his attacks and ready-to-fight and readiness for quick statements will be eaten up by the pundits and his base.
Its too bad too, because Romney expects us to forget what we've already seen from him, whether it be the hidden camera footage, or blatant trolling during the Libya attack, or the lack of plans that meet any arithmetic sense. None of those have changed - but if you're angry, he's got skills at being your standard bearer.
Tell that to Paul Ryan.
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