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[Sheroking]

Also, with no second hand market publishers will feel less inclined to adjust their game prices shortly after release. So the wait for a good deal will be much longer.

The only way this is accurate is if the game is selling in spite of it's sale price, and that's true WITH an used game market. GameStop has no problem gouging you for 50$ on an used copy of CoD because both the new and used sell in spite of that tag.

A game that isn't moving at $50 will see a reduction in price. If not in store, then in digital distribution.

 

[Dali]

Won't that like cut out a significant slice of potential customers? I guess they are going the Apple route of "step your game up, consumer, or this awesome product will never be yours" the way the iPhone increased data plans with ATT. Difference being an equal if not better alternative didn't exist for the iPhone. MS will have to make the 720 wtfbbqsauce awesome with its services and secondary functions for people to not just throw them the finger and get a PS4 instead.

 

[Deleted member 22576]

If this is true. I think it will be a big deal for maybe about a year. If its true, Microsoft must be pretty confident in the appeal other aspects of the console may have. I think in large part a giant piece of the audience will buy the console completely unaware it doesn't play used games, and find out once its far too late. Microsoft can sustain this "blow" pretty easily, in my opinion. If things play out as the article states and things on the PS4 are business as usual while Microsoft is some sort of brave new world. Then I have to imagine they'll be able to pull out some pretty sweet exclusive deals. I have to imagine a move like this makes them a very attractive platform for publishers -if they can maintain the sales they've always had. In short, its still all about the content. If Microsoft can bring the content and whatever other benefits this feature will provide them then its not doomsday. It will make people grumpy, but thats about it. You gotta picture the ecosystem as a whole too, its not like you're going to be paying 60$ for every. single. game. XBLA is going to branch out into the 20-35$ experience range too, think titles on par with DayZ, Chivalry, Primal Carnage.. etc.. there will surely be tons of content on that level. I dunno. I think in a lot of ways Anti-Used is a great and necessary thing, and I have to wonder what the reactions would be EDGE were so certain Microsoft was using a system like the one detailed in those Sony documents, rather than the dreaded "always-on."

 

[Dirtbag]

The only way I saw this ever happening was if both MS and Sony got together on the used game market and launched with matching strategies to block used games. A united front.

This will just push lots of sales to Sony if this rumor is legit and only planned for xbox.

 

[Vesper73]

"What if every used book that an individual opened up burst into flames because it had been read already?"

Ebooks are selling like hotcakes. These are single account.

 

[Vinci]

We saw the ultimate conclusion to this sort of path in the 80's though. The market turned into a mess of uninteresting product that had zero value and the entire thing collapsed in on itself.

The market now, and especially the enthusiasts who partake heavily in it now, are a bit different than back then. Frankly, I think this is a gamble that MS might be able to win. Because, truthfully, they are betting that enthusiasts dont have the willpower to say no. And it's debatable whether that's true or false.

Very interesting.

 

[Piggus]

the Sony patent

Sony has a ton of patents... And most of them are never used.

 

[Cipherr]

It may be bad for gamers but if they want the Nextbox, who are you to tell them not to buy it?

He didn't...

 

[vg260]

Steam is different in that:

1. Your games are tied to your account, not your device. You can run Steam from any computer that meets the system requirements and play your games anywhere. Whenever I go visit my parents for instance, I log into Steam on their computer to play some old school games. If I want to buy something, I buy it there and when I leave and go home, it'll be waiting for me to download on my home computer

We don't know anything about how this would be implemented though. If it's like games on demand or XBLA, it can be played by any account on one system and can be played on any other system as long as you sign into the owner's account. That's not that much different than Steam.

 

[Scoops]

If true and PS4 doesn't do this next gen will go:

PS4 > WiiU > Nextbox

 

[enzo_gt]

Perhaps Sony came up with their idea after they heard rumblings of Microsoft doing it, and much like everything on the 360, they'll simply have their copy in place if they think it's working out in Microsoft's favor.

Pretty much. I see no reason why Sony wouldn't do it too if they can also reap the rewards because they know people will still buy a console anyways, and it won't nearly make the apocalyptic dent people think it will. If the games are still there, folks will still play 10-20$ more, and not many folks borrow games in today's online world.

The only real thing going against them doing this is pissing off retailers. Which is a pretty big factor.

Personally, I don't see it happening for that reason.

 

[Cynar]

Makes it that much easier to do pc gaming only.

 

[MisterHero]

What if this has the Steam effect, (tends to lower the price of games)?

They're not. They're going to sucker more people with DLC through advertising and $150 pre-order Special Editions.

Games are going to be more expensive to make. Why would brand new games with tech like Unreal 4 be cheaper?

 

[Piggus]

Ebooks are selling like hotcakes. These are single account.

ebooks are not physical, and usually cheaper than physical books.

 

[LyleLanley]

Because gamers are going to be pissed.

Gamers get pissed and do nothing all the time. Horse Armor and Consumable DLC come to mind.

 

[FourMyle]

Our source has also confirmed that the next Xbox’s recently rumoured specs are entirely accurate. That means an AMD eight-core x64 1.6GHz CPU, a D3D11.x 800MHz graphics solution and 8GB of DDR3 RAM

Didn't that guy who sold the Durango dev kit say that these specs were outdated? Someone is bullshitting.

 

[Vinci]

If true and PS4 doesn't do this next gen will go:

PS4 > WiiU > Nextbox

I wouldn't be so sure...

 

[Thoraxes]

Pretty much. I see no reason why Sony wouldn't do it too if they can also reap the rewards because they know people will still buy a console anyways, and it won't nearly make the apocalyptic dent people think it will. If the games are still there, folks will still play 10-20$ more, and not many folks borrow games in today's online world.

The only real thing going against them doing this is pissing off retailers. Which is a pretty big factor.

Personally, I don't see it happening for that reason.

It would ruin Gamestop, but a majority of retailers would ultimately sell more new copies of games from their stores instead of having to compete with the cheaper prices of buying used, putting every retailer on equal footing.

 

[Vesper73]

I'm not trying to defend Microsoft here. I just see this as being absolutely inevitable, regardless of what GAF thinks.

I also believe that this could have the effect of lowering game prices across the board.

Having been on Steam for so long, I don't see how you guys are willing to pay $60 for a game.

 

[Xamdou]

I wouldn't be so sure...

It is very hilarious what he said though because it sure ain't happening.

 

[PastorOfMuppets]

How do you know #1 won't be the way they go? Did they say its tied to your console not your account?

#2 same thing, although somehow I doubt they will match the level of sales on Steam

#4 - I think I was really talking about Steam, since realistically if you are a big PC gamer and want to play the majority of releases you pretty much need to use Steam. Steam is DRM.

So far, I'm assuming they will just try to replicate what Steam does (in terms of DRM, accounts, buying games, etc.). Of course they could mess that up really, really badly.

I do think that if this rumor holds it will be a serious, serious blow to Microsoft. I kind of can't imagine they would do this if Sony doesn't. Too much is at stake for them this gen.

Counterpoints.

1. I don't.

2. Of course they won't, they have no competition.

3. See, that's the weird thing about Steam. They have competitors and sell the same games that are sold on Steam...and then you can activate them of Steam anyways. The only game I actually bought on Steam during the Christmas Sale was Super Street Fighter 4. XCOM and Sleeping Dogs I got on Green Man Gaming and then activated on Steam. The only service that doesn't do this is GOG. They fill a fundamentally different niche than Steam though; a lot of their games are old PC games that aren't sold anywhere else and they are retooled to work on modern system and include DVD-style extras.

 

[cdkee]

If Microsoft does this and Sony does not, won't it force publishers onto the next Xbox due to revenue concerns?

My guess is, if Microsoft does this, there is no reason Sony won't.

Welcome to Steam everyone! ... It really isn't that bad over here! )


...Oh and one more thing. You all know that this is inevitable right? Any of you think that soon everything won't be 'always online' and purchases attached to a single account? Really? .. Love it or hate it, this IS the future.

There is some game theory going on here.

If Microsoft goes no used, publishers will flock to them and all the big games will be there.

Given this, one of two things could happen.
1. Sony also goes down no used road.
2. Sony doesn't, and risks being isolated from big publishers. What interests me is if Durango sales would be bad enough for publishers to be forced into making their games for the more popular console, which we can surmise would be Orbis...probably.

Then again a lot of consumers are dumb and in economics we assume everyone is rational...which is not always the case.

 

[soundscream]

If PS4 doesn't go this route would 3rd party publishers make the next xbox the lead platform and not waste effort in optimizing the PS4 version, since they would stand to make the most money on the xbox?

 

[kittens]

The Edge article says "Kinect will also ship alongside the next Xbox". Does that mean bundled in with the console, or sold seperately...? The wording is ambiguous.

 

[fritolay]

Maybe this is why EA is not supporting the Wii U much. They want to prevent second hand sales, Sony and MS said yes, Nintendo don't.

 

[Fistwell]

"What if every used book that an individual opened up burst into flames because it had been read already?"

No need to warm up the place in the winter! Think of the savings!

 

[Corto]

What if this has the Steam effect, (tends to lower the price of games)?

It will never happen to the same degree. You can buy whole catalogues of publishers for under 80$ on Steam. On PC you have competition from several digital distribution services and as simple as it is to open a browser and visit an independent developer site, and buy directly from the creator, with no middle man mediating that transaction taking his share.

 

[Syph Medwes]

Wow

 

[Pooya]

Exactly, Japan is all about the second hand market.

well, they can have different features for that region if it's a problem and region lock it, that's not really something that would persuade them against adapting anti used policies, if it's western publishers that are pushing for it, they have no market in Japan.

 

[alr1ght]

If PS4 doesn't go this route would 3rd party publishers make the next xbox the lead platform and not waste effort in optimizing the PS4 version, since they would stand to make the most money on the xbox?

I highly doubt the revenue lost to used sales would make up the revenue lost from not selling on PS4.

 

[syllogism]

At this point, it's come to either one of two conclusions for me:

1. EDGE loses all of their credibility when this gets debunked, especially since they've doubled down.

OR

2. Microsoft dooms the Next Xbox before it's even released.

Also, I stole this quote from another forum that's losing their shit about this, but it's profoundly hilarious:

"What if every used book that an individual opened up burst into flames because it had been read already?"

Neither of those conclusions make any sense. EDGE would lose some credibility (few people outside gaf will care or remember in a week), not "all" of it. Microsoft presumably has done some market research on this and believes that it's worthwhile, which is more than gaf used-gaming armchair analysts can say. Indeed, few gaffers know anything about the market and base their gloomy analysis solely on the fact they don't like the idea. It's probably a slightly risky move, but to suggest that it will single-handedly doom a console regardless of other factors is completely absurd.

 

[Beckx]

Pretty much. I see no reason why Sony wouldn't do it too if they can also reap the rewards because they know people will still buy a console anyways, and it won't nearly make the apocalyptic dent people think it will. If the games are still there, folks will still play 10-20$ more, and not many folks borrow games in today's online world.

The only real thing going against them doing this is pissing off retailers. Which is a pretty big factor.

Personally, I don't see it happening for that reason.

The win-win strategy for Sony is to have the technology, but (like region locking) make it the publisher's option - and never use it for any of their first party games.

EA stays happy, but also bears the brunt of consumer & retailer backlash because they were the ones that made the choice (no one complains about Sony in the P4A situation, even though their tech allows for region locking; all the hate goes to Atlus).

 

[Ace Harding]

Yup, collectors are screwed by this if it turns out to be true.

This is actually a really big bummer. Collecting newer games is kind of a dubious prospect as it is (try finding a working Xbox 360 in 25 years), but collecting will basically be cut off because of this.

 

[verbum]

I can see this future coming just because the resources required for physical disks are increasing in price every year.
It would be nice to be able to transfer ownership of a game online. Any chance of that happening? Like maybe submitting a request to Live and have them do it. There would be a lot of free transfers but I imagine the number of people wanting to charge for a used game would remain the same.

 

[MooseKing]

No used games is a HUGE blow that console gaming doesn't need right now. Fuck

Joke?

It's only a blow for companies like Gamestop and Walmart. PC gaming doesn't have second hand games and it's doing just fine (in fact, makes up a majority of revenue for every publisher).

The only downside I see is for collectors.

That said, having to be online to play your games is downright stupid.

 

[PatientRain]

I get that limitations are inevitable, even necessary, but no second hand games and always-on internet are two pretty remarkable limitations as we move from one generation to the next.

 

[sixghost]

What if this has the Steam effect, (tends to lower the price of games)?

It's been mentioned before, where would the competition be coming from? XBL already has a digital distribution service, it's called Games On-Demand, and it's terrible. Everything is way too expensive. One of the reasons Steam is so competitive with price is because there is plenty of competition in the PC DD front, and they are also compete for people who game on both consoles and PC. It would be great if MS' DD store was as great as Steam, but I would be shocked.

 

[Vinci]

I highly doubt the revenue lost to used sales would make up the revenue lost from not selling on PS4.

They'd still sell it on PS4. Just wouldn't be the lead platform and wouldn't be optimized for it. At least in his scenario.

 

[Takuya]

If PS4 doesn't go this route would 3rd party publishers make the next xbox the lead platform and not waste effort in optimizing the PS4 version, since they would stand to make the most money on the xbox?

If the consumer backlash is strong enough, the third parties will have no choice but to support the PS4 (and even drop support for XBOX).

 

[PowerSmell]

Sounds like they're trying to gauge consumer reaction to no used games by giving the story to Edge.

 

[Neuromancer]

Joke?

It's only a blow for companies like Gamespot and Walmart. PC gaming doesn't have second hand games and it's doing just fine (in fact, makes up a majority of revenue for every publisher).

Is that true? I find it hard to believe.

 

[Clay Davis]

Didn't that guy who sold the Durango dev kit say that these specs were outdated? Someone is bullshitting.

yes he did. all will be revealed through kotaku apparently.

 

[trixx]

Have a pc for third party/indie etc
Have a wii u for first party, i usually buy first party games on nintendo consoles anyways.
So i'm okay if this goes down but hopefully it doesn't.

If anything hopefully this will cause Sega to make a comeback(LOL).

 

[Vesper73]

Again, if Microsoft does this and Sony does not, will it not force publishers onto the next Xbox?

Publishers could perceive the PS4 to have cooties, (potential of lost revenue due to second hand sales).

 

[Fistwell]

Gamers get pissed and do nothing all the time. Horse Armor and Consumable DLC come to mind.

Go tell that to ninja theory, capcom, and ben parfidious.

I highly doubt the revenue lost to used sales would make up the revenue lost from not selling on PS4.

That's a pretty reasonable point.

 

[Baconsammy]

Because gamers are going to be pissed.

The same gamers that despise Nintendo's inept account system? The same gamers that buy tons of unsellable content on XBLA, PSN, Steam, iOS and Android? A little customer outrage mixed in with tons of publisher love isn't going to make third parties jump ship to the Wii U. That's pure fantasy.

 

[Le-mo]

Would you guys still have a problem with it if in return Microsoft promises you will get all future DLC for free.

 

[Vinci]

If the consumer backlash is strong enough, the third parties will have no choice but to support the PS4 (and even drop support for XBOX).

MS released a console they knew was a ticking time-bomb and they've done pretty damn well with it. What 'consumer backlash' are you expecting?

 

[Data West]

Is that true? I find it hard to believe.

People like to bullshit stats about Steam all the time because they don't release their numbers and can't be fact checked.

 

[Rat Salad]

I've purchased every XBox day one but no more. Unless the games sell for considerably cheaper day one,then Fuck You Microsoft.
You don't tell me how to spend my money. I'll vote with my wallet. IOS and Sony PlayStation gaming for me then. Same goes for Sony,fuck off if you do the same.