Pachterballs
Banned
it says that its doing good things for sony. if you learn how to read. pyscho_mantis is right.
PlayStation Vita Sales See Massive Spike in Japan (nearly six times increase)
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it says that its doing good things for sony. if you learn how to read. pyscho_mantis is right.
Ladies and gentlemen, the Vita, as it stands, is doing good things for Sony. You heard it here.
nhlducks35
Member
From June 2011
Gokurakumaru
Banned
You mean the same kind of price drop and new software the 3DS needed to start selling? Why didn't you pick 9 weeks from the middle or end of 2012 for your comparison? Surely if sales were so awful at launch it would be just as fair a comparison to pick any arbitrary period.
The only real takeaway from the "new games and price drop" is that they reignited interest in the platform. How you can spin that to be a bad thing is beyond me. Everybody knows Vita sales have been in the gutter due to price and lack of content, and to be back to post-launch levels is a remarkable comeback from that position.
Thank you for your insight, I now see the way. I shall go back to kindergarten to learn to read so I can come to this same conclusion on my own.
I'm serious.
metalslimer
Member
Are you ever going to actually put forward an argument?
i honestly don't think Sony are as concerned as some people are in this thread. if they were losing money or were under any pressure we would have seen desperation moves from them. the first price cut came after a year and a half and only in japan. you don't see anyone from Sony going oh shit we need to do something or say sales are terrible like nintendo did when they did their shocking price drop less than 6 months after launching. there ain't much marketing and they are probably making a lot of money off of memory cards and royalties of digital games. i see a decent launch, struggling couple of years and then pick up once more good games come out and the price is at mass market levels around 199 and lower during holiday times. i find it funny that some people keep looking at these terrible sales and think they are going to abandon the platform. guess what it is not going to happen and for those people that actually believe that it is dead and never coming back go ahead and give a rough time period of when you think it will be discontinued or abandoned.
here is why i don't think it will happen: in all probability this is the last handheld as far as sony are concerned. there would be no point coming out with a more powerful handheld as this has everything needed to survive with dual analogs and multi touch and games probably don't need to look any better than they are for a dedicated handheld market which is going down everyday with the rise of phones. . right now at 249.99 and some games not a lot are willing to bite but will people keep ignoring the system when it goes down to 199, 149 and then 99 in like 5 years? and with connectivity and remote play with the ps4 there will be many ways to get more people to eventually get one. vita is positioned to compete with nintendo's next handheld system as well. there will be a price cut around the holidays with a gran turismo game in the US and EU and with killzone and probably another ubisoft assassins or some other game they could get more decent sales and slowly more third parties will start to make more games or add ports. well that is my prediction anyway aka slow burn.
here is why i don't think it will happen: in all probability this is the last handheld as far as sony are concerned. there would be no point coming out with a more powerful handheld as this has everything needed to survive with dual analogs and multi touch and games probably don't need to look any better than they are for a dedicated handheld market which is going down everyday with the rise of phones. . right now at 249.99 and some games not a lot are willing to bite but will people keep ignoring the system when it goes down to 199, 149 and then 99 in like 5 years? and with connectivity and remote play with the ps4 there will be many ways to get more people to eventually get one. vita is positioned to compete with nintendo's next handheld system as well. there will be a price cut around the holidays with a gran turismo game in the US and EU and with killzone and probably another ubisoft assassins or some other game they could get more decent sales and slowly more third parties will start to make more games or add ports. well that is my prediction anyway aka slow burn.
You are right, indeed. Sony seems pretty confident about Vita's future.
Exterminieren
Banned
If all the stuff in that post had actually been announced, then you might have a point.
I haven't seen confidence. I've seen Vita sidelined at E3 and TGS for years, and the only big initiative announced for the future is allowing Vita to serve as a controller for a console they're actually confident about.
grimshawish
Banned
The sad thing is I can't see half of the cross play stuff being pushed if it wasn't for the WiiU.
Sony have a strategy for the PS4; they never bothered with the Vita, just like they never bothered with the PSP.
I don't expect Nintendo's next console to be a phone, but I do expect it to have a different (non DS) design and more social features/apps. I also think they might try to have a mainline Pokemon game on launch day to assure a certain level of success.
It seems likely the 3DS will have a longer than average life. It's been out for almost exactly 3 years, with Pokemon 3D releasing 3.5 years in. they'll have a Pokemon remake year 5 or 6, and release the successor year 6 or 7.
It seems likely the 3DS will have a longer than average life. It's been out for almost exactly 3 years, with Pokemon 3D releasing 3.5 years in. they'll have a Pokemon remake year 5 or 6, and release the successor year 6 or 7.
I still have a hard time seeing people buy a PS4 that will maybe cost $399-449 and then buy a Vita for $249 (or 199 when it drops in price this Xmas). That is $599-649 just to buy a PS4 with a vita so you can lay on your bed to play PS4 games when you already have a beefy setup and surround sound?
Father_Brain
Banned
Putting aside the subject of non-dedicated mobile devices for the moment: Whether you like it or not, the current-gen handheld war, such as it is, is over, and Sony has lost quite decisively. Unless Soul Sacrifice/Tearaway/PS4 remote play/Unannounced First-Party Game Here miraculously turn out to be system-sellers on a large scale, or unless Sony takes third-party execs' families hostage to force them to make Vita exclusives, there's no visible path to get Vita to "commercially relevant competitor" status.
Relative to what they lost on PS3? No doubt true, but Vita doesn't have to be a massive money pit in order for continued support to become an increasingly unwise decision. Given the absence of realistic prospects for a significant turnaround (and to be clear, a Gamecube-level LTD would qualify as such at this point), the opportunity cost to Sony of attempting to keep the platform afloat is only going to grow over time.
If GC had performed as badly as Vita, it might indeed have been Nintendo's last home console. If PS3 had, I have no doubt that it would have led Sony to exit the gaming hardware business entirely, considering the magnitude of the losses they were already taking.
There's a grain of truth here, in that the JP price cut is the first time that Sony has responded to Vita's historically abysmal sales with anything resembling genuine urgency.
But the notion that Sony isn't concerned about a major product selling less than half of what they projected for the fiscal year, including sub-PSP 2011 holiday sales in the West despite a major marketing/bundling push and terrible third-party support worldwide, is completely absurd. Instead, nearly every aspect of Sony's handling of Vita to date indicates that the lack of "desperation moves" is for a very simple reason: they just don't have the latitude (edit: or will) to execute them. They couldn't cut the price in even one region until the weakened yen made it viable; they won't divert first-party development away from PS3/PS4 (and even then, the kid-dominated demographics of the remaining Western dedicated handheld market make it far from certain that Naughty Dog et al. could even produce a system-selling handheld title); and they don't have the leverage over third parties to secure significant exclusives (or seemingly any support at all, in the case of Capcom and most Western third parties).
I find it potentially telling that "offering game software on mobile devices, including smartphones and tablets" is characterized as part of their solution to Vita's sales:
Sony Q3 FY2012 results release said:
He's preparing some gifs now!
You may be right. I think it is more likely that they have no idea how to rectify the situation (inactivity) and can't afford to pull off any desperation moves or market the Vita properly.
Not to mention the fact that they also have the PS4 on their plate and want to make sure that it is guaranteed success so that is where they are devoting most of their resources to.
That's the magic combination that will make the Wii U irrelevant according to most anti Wii U posters I've encountered. Cost does not seem to play a role in what technology it better is what I've been told.
Because the Neo-Geo was such a financially successful console.
shinra-bansho
Member
Correction: Sony misread the success of the PSP in Japan and thought there was room for a higher-end system. They were wrong.
That's actually a reference to revenue. It doesn't imply much with regard to segment profitability.
I would say it's a combination of a lack of latitude and a lack of will; presumably, they - like everyone else - should realise the dedicated handheld market is becoming more and more niche. Also, I don't think leverage over third parties would ever get them to commit to the handheld ghetto.
grimshawish
Banned
People said this about Monster Hunter!
It's good to see the machine getting support at least.
Father_Brain
Banned
It has more of a chance of being one than Killzone (limited audience for handheld dudebro games, not actually that popular an IP even on consoles), IMO, but that's not saying much.
Yeah, "latitude or will" would have been a bit better worded on my part. Latter point is pretty much what I meant by lack of leverage, though.
yurinka
Member
Talking about system sellers, do we have any example of a single game who increased substantially the console sales since the release of this game?
Because for the cases where I see only 4 or 5 big games in a console it was in systems with a really poor library which sw sales were concentrated in these few games because the rest were mediocre or bad.
I think the 'system seller' thing is bullshit, and having your sales polarized in some few games means that you have a really poor library. How about to use 'a game with more than XX million units sold' instead?
Because for the cases where I see only 4 or 5 big games in a console it was in systems with a really poor library which sw sales were concentrated in these few games because the rest were mediocre or bad.
I think the 'system seller' thing is bullshit, and having your sales polarized in some few games means that you have a really poor library. How about to use 'a game with more than XX million units sold' instead?
ArtHands
Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
In 5 years time we'll have probably more powerful tablets or other handheld gadgets , more games for those stuffs too, and maybe with buttons in some way. Vita isn't the only thing that will be growing you know.
When sony forecast 10 million units of vita to be sold in the current fiscal year report early last year, which was already an overestimation to many at that moment, people take it that they have something up their sleeves and then was subsequently burnt at E3 from that expectation. Its baseless to take sony's lack of desperation move as a sign that they are not worrying. It might be due to their inability to do anything or the lack of solution.
When sony forecast 10 million units of vita to be sold in the current fiscal year report early last year, which was already an overestimation to many at that moment, people take it that they have something up their sleeves and then was subsequently burnt at E3 from that expectation. Its baseless to take sony's lack of desperation move as a sign that they are not worrying. It might be due to their inability to do anything or the lack of solution.
Halo? Gran Turismo? Mario? Zelda? Monster Hunter?
I did a year on year comparison therefor the first 9 weeks in 2012 and the first 9 weeks in 2013.Also I didn´t say it was a bad thing that Sony took that measures, on the contrary they were neccessary because there was a notable decline compared to last year before that happened.
metalslimer
Member
Killzone will probably outsell Tearaway though. Sony will attempt some last ditch bundles this Fall with both of them regardless. It's surprising they haven't done any Golden Abyss bundles yet.
Well this is a weird way of looking at video game sales. The point of a system seller is to expand the system's market base so that sales are not concentrated in 5-6 games i.e SM3D Land, Mario Kart 7, and MH3G giving a large boost to the 3DS in order to be able to sell more software.
Father_Brain
Banned
That's likely. I just think Tearaway has more of a shot at being a miraculous system-selling hit for the aforementioned reasons, which obviously isn't saying much.
ShineALight
Member
Time flies when you're having fun, but 3DS just turned 2 in Japan and will do so in the west later this month.
you're right, I thought something looked wrong as I was typing it. something about 2013 throws me off.
i am sorry what? there has been one E3 and TGS since its release. yes there has been no groundbreaking exclusives but decent stuff has come out and has been announced. if we don't hear anything about vita regarding price cut and new game announcements at this years' e3 or tgs then i will join you in saying sony have given up but i highly doubt that.
JakkuFurosu
Member
not for nothing but people been saying "wait till X" since day1 bomba and here we are. at what point do you say fukit
I for one have faith in my vita despite all these silly numbers.
yes i am perfectly happy with my fingers in my ears humming to myself itll be ok
nhlducks35
Member
Tearaway was in development before the Vita was announced in January 2011.
metalslimer
Member
An interesting point of Sony's first party Vita titles is that nothing they have announced actually began development after Vita came out worldwide. Soul Sacrifice, Killzone, and Tearaway were all in development pre launch. The first title that will seemingly be announced (if its still in development) is Golden Abyss 2. I'm not exactly sure which studio Sony has is going to work on more Vita games considering the closures as of late. Perhaps LittleBigPlanet 3 could be cross platform.
Gravity Rush 2?
i am sorry i don't live in a fantasy world where i think vita is going to make a huge comeback and blow the doors open. all i am saying is that it will be a slow burn and will be fine in the long run. i just find it ridiculous when people say Sony have given up and the system is dead looking at sales in its first year. there are still games (ports i should say) announced on a regular basis and most of them are small games and nothing ground breaking but they are making efforts to fill the gap during this initial struggle. i have already said that the time when sony doesn't announce decent stuff for vita at e3, gamescom or tgs that is when i will accept that they have given up on the system.
shinra-bansho
Member
On PSN, for the PS3, where it will sell far more. Alongside Gravity Rush HD.
Do people really not see how poor ROI likely is on most Vita projects? It really makes no sense for Sony to commit development resources to an ailing product in a waning market, when they're gearing up for the launch of the PS4.
Father_Brain
Banned
So E3, Gamescom, and TGS 2011 don't count? Nice. Well, I suppose a comparison to 3DS', PS3's, PSP's, DS', or even GC's announced pre-launch software support would be pretty unflattering, but it's not as though your case is really any stronger if you make the post-launch comparison for those respective platforms.
That you believe a slow burn is a plausible scenario is confirmation enough that you're living in a fantasy world. Nothing remotely like that has ever happened in this industry.
Bullshit. Especially since GR is pretty much tailored to Vita's input methods. Sony and the director were happy with GR sales. Vita games actually sell and seem to reach their target. Now you could argue that is because the games are niche so the hardcore who have already bought Vita will swallow it up, and the fanbases will buy their games for any platform. Still the games sell decently to warrant warm comments like those from Ubisoft. Another success story is Atlus.
I'm not saying Vita is an amazing platform for every developer to put their games onto. But acting like there is no reason to invest into Vita projects is just as ignorant.
i can almost guarantee you a gran turismo port and gravity rush 2. i would say it would probably take atleast a year before game that has started development after vita launch to be announced realistically . i would venture to guess they will announce some good games at the end of this month when their slate of games in japan this month are done
Gravity Rush started out development on the PS3, IIRC.
Both House and Gara have indicated that there are other unannounced games to be released on the platform this year which they will talk about soon. And no, Andrew House, President and CEO of SCE, wouldn't lie about it, especially since he mentioned it at the start of PS Meeting where he didn't even have mention Vita' future.
JakkuFurosu
Member
it did. im on my vita now so i cant find vid but a utube search of ps3 gravity rush should net you what you looking for
shinra-bansho
Member
Gravity Rush sold 81K in Japan. That is not a product providing return on investment. That is not a product providing better return on investment than could have been achieved elsewhere.
It would have sold far more had it remained a PS3 project.
It's not about having no reason to invest in Vita. It's about having better reasons to invest elsewhere. Every decision has a cost in the alternative not taken.
ringwaldhaze
Neo Member
If the Eurogamer article is true, and it's being developed for the PS3, I could see it being cross platform with the Vita. A potential holiday line-up of Gran Turismo, Final Fantasy X HD, and a port of Ground Zeroes, maybe? Seems alright on paper, but, again, there's no original software.
It actually sold 100k as of last June (including digital downloads).
We're talking about a first party dev here that would decide to make a sequel to its succesful game on one platfrom which needs game for another platform that is on its way out. Never gonna happen.
It's about publishers managing their expectations. Ubisoft did AC3:L with just one studio and sold 600k of that game. That's a very good return on the investment. I imagine Activision feels the same way with COD. Atlus was really pleased with Persona 4 sales as well.
Father_Brain
Banned
At the risk of repeating myself: It's not a question of whether unannounced Vita titles releasing this year exist; I'm sure they do. Rather, it's a question of what could plausibly be announced at this point that would drive hardware sales to a significant degree, given the failure of every major 2012 Vita release to do so.
i never said the 2011 event don't count. i was responding to a post that said sony sidelined vita for years. i didn't think he was delusional enough to say sony sidelined vita even before release when they were hyping up the vita at those events with launch software in 2011 . i thought he was talking post launch in which case he is wrong.
with regards to your second comment i don't see anything from Sony that says they are dropping support or are in deep shit when it comes to vita sales. you keep asking for confirmation when it comes to if sony are making profit on the system but do you have any proof that they are losing money? atleast we have some evidence from sony execs that the system was designed to not lose them money and hence the guess that they are making money or breaking even. Sony hasn't abandoned a platform yet and hence it is a plausible scenario not fantasy. i am sure there is a wise guy that will probably say psp go but whatever that obviously doesn't count. i actually want to hear your prediction. do you think they are going to discontinue it this year or next year? i have laid out my prediction and will have no problem in admitting i was wrong if they do abandon it.
Actually the 2012 Holiday releases led to Vita bundles being sold out well before December even (at least in Ireland and from what I gather the UK as well). It seemed like the interest in those was underestimated. It actually led to decent sales (mind you not good or great by any measure).
As for what can be announced, I'd imagine Sony has GT ready for the Vita. Either that or GoW for Christmas. From third parties, I'm sure there will be COD, simply because Sony usually signs 3 game deals with developers and publishers.Plus I'd say Activision would be pleased with the sales given how little fuck did they give about Declassified. I'd imagine Ubi has another AC ready too. In fact Ubi mentioned they have several Vita games in development. I can see a FIFA from EA, which isn't much, but it'll have to do I guess.
Glorified G
Member
How would you or anyone know what the return on investment is without any knowledge of the budget? Did it need to sell 91k?, 98k?, 150k? Did it need to achieve those numbers within 6 months? Or within a year?
This is my main problems with a lot of people in sales age in general. Making definitive statements on what's profitable with having little to information.
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