VGLeaks: First look as Durango XDK (always connected, kinect required, must install)
- Thread starter DieH@rd
- Start date
Maximilian Kolbe
Member
Semantics game to developers,great.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
No, it's semantics. It's not a difference at all.
And, yes, I believe the manufacturers are so disconnected from reality that they don't realize that an always-online console will be a mistake. We've had this discussion for months now. Every rumor we've had points to this happening.
There is a big difference between "maintains" a connection and "must" so come on yourself
Oppo
Member
Yes, I can read. I pointed out that passage to you. I think it is exactly as it says. For clarity see my posts on the previous page.
So we pass off grammar as semantics now
dragonelite
Member
They do with everything, except with the spec battle. Not that ps4 or durango are that special anyway. But that is an other story.
Maximilian Kolbe
Member
They're talking about keep the newest update(games and apps) in low power mode to make the console always ready to play games/apps,when you connected your console.
Let's not get too silly now.
infinityBCRT
Member
Eh. Its probably better this way. Games will be able to take full advantage of being on the HDD. And it seems as though they are also going to ensure that you can play games as they are installing.
And I'm guessing all games will be available for purchase digitally as well, so the whole worry about needing to install it will be moot for those who opt to go all digital.
Also, people are reading WAY too much into the "Always on, always connected". Doesn't mean you have to do it. Just means it will be like that for your convenience. So that if your Xbox is off but then you use your cellphone to play a youtube vid to your xbox, it would be possible for it to turn on and start playing right away.
Well, if you read the image posted, you'd see it isn't as bad as it is on PS3.
I don't mind mandatory installs as I would install the game anyway but I don't want to worry about fridge space. Hopefully they let you use external drives too.
Not even PC (fuck you SC, D3, etc) demanding this.. I don't get why developer think its a good idea even with piracy and such, its a frigging game box. So I don't have internet connected I can't entertain myself with the supposed my entertainment machine? Screw you MS and Nintendo. I bet Sony would do same thing now.
Neuromancer
Member
I agree I think its a good thing. Especially if you can start playing while its installing.
GuitarAtomik
Member
There's a difference between "will" and "must". "Will" means it's capable and "must" means it has to. My computer "will" keep a constant connection to the internet but it might not. "Must" it keep that connection to function though?
I'm willing to bet every rumor about always online is based on the quote "Always on, Always connected" except they ran with it out of context. The Wii's Wiiconnect24 was supposed to be always on, "always connected". Did it function without the internet?
I personally don't think any of the big 3 are so dumb enough to cut off that big of a market.
Interfectum
Member
Mandatory installs are a good thing. Better performance and no spinning disc.
crazygambit
Member
I don't get all the negative reactions from this.
Always on and online means that I never have to wait again for a firmware update when I want to game and don't have a lot of time. The same thing the PS4 will be doing by the way. This is nothing, but good for consumers.
If that results in a requirement to always be online to play, then that's completely different and would suck. However nothing I read here says that.
Regarding mandatory installing, it's a little weird that it's not optional, but understandable. Now developers can code to expect HDD performance instead of the slower BD Drive. It seems pretty similar to the way the PS4 is handling things as well. The PS4 will support play while the game is downloading, much like Durango will while the game installing. They may also support play while the game is downloading. No where does it say that no used games would be allowed, which would of course be terrible. Remember we also don't have confirmation that the PS4 doesn't have a system to block used games as well (remember the shifty answers we got to that question).
The only thing that rubs me the wrong way (but it's not a deal breaker) is requiring kinect to be plugged in to play. It creates another unnecessary point of failure. If my kinect breaks my console is useless. This is all kinds of wrong in my book.
The PS4 has a dedicated chip to stay always online and download updates to both firmware and games. And that's a GOOD thing. It can be turned off, but I can't see a reason why you would want to. (Except the predictive downloading of games they promised if you have bandwidth caps, which I can totally see people turning off).
Always on and online means that I never have to wait again for a firmware update when I want to game and don't have a lot of time. The same thing the PS4 will be doing by the way. This is nothing, but good for consumers.
If that results in a requirement to always be online to play, then that's completely different and would suck. However nothing I read here says that.
Regarding mandatory installing, it's a little weird that it's not optional, but understandable. Now developers can code to expect HDD performance instead of the slower BD Drive. It seems pretty similar to the way the PS4 is handling things as well. The PS4 will support play while the game is downloading, much like Durango will while the game installing. They may also support play while the game is downloading. No where does it say that no used games would be allowed, which would of course be terrible. Remember we also don't have confirmation that the PS4 doesn't have a system to block used games as well (remember the shifty answers we got to that question).
The only thing that rubs me the wrong way (but it's not a deal breaker) is requiring kinect to be plugged in to play. It creates another unnecessary point of failure. If my kinect breaks my console is useless. This is all kinds of wrong in my book.
The PS4 has a dedicated chip to stay always online and download updates to both firmware and games. And that's a GOOD thing. It can be turned off, but I can't see a reason why you would want to. (Except the predictive downloading of games they promised if you have bandwidth caps, which I can totally see people turning off).
FairXchange
Member
I wonder what they plan on doing in the markets where online connectivity is simply not as available.
Two Skus? If this really is what they plan on doing, how do they project their international success?
Two Skus? If this really is what they plan on doing, how do they project their international success?
swordsman720
Banned
Do you think The next gene games are still on 8 GIG? Dream on and look at PS3 games and lots of them are +-20 GIG and up.
Much storage is better, just like now I have to delete some of my install games to make the space.
I honestly don't see the point of even mentioning it if it's not mandatory. Systems will keep a constant connection right now if you leave it on. I get that it has a lower power setting now, so we'll see if that's what they mean.
Honestly, either way it sounds like a potentially bad idea. When I think of launch window for a new Xbox and all the RROD issues they had, the last thing I'd want is to have new systems that are on all the time.
Also, why would Kinect be required all the time if internet isn't? I still think it's really not about gaming, but about making a play for data-mining, advertisers, and integrating this new kind of advertising into cable TV. Maximizing that would require internet, and given all the previous rumors all mentioning this as well, it sounds likely to me.
If it's really nothing more than just background downloads, I don't see it being such a big feature like all rumors have mentioned up until now.
Oppo
Member
My answer to that is in the very first post you quoted me on. I'm not just going to go in circles.
Interpret it however you like; I have a different view.
ElRenoRaven
Member
You're kidding right? Because if not your Wii U does not have to be online and connected to the net.
I agree with this, the rest of it sounds fine, and nothing seems to imply no used games or that your connection breaking would kick you out of the game or anything (like always-online would imply).
My personal problem with needing Kinect is that my gaming setup is a fairly tight space, I do not have room for Kinect or MOVE, I hope if the new sensor is an improvement, it can work in more close up spaces, or at least not be mandatory for menus or games in general.
GuitarAtomik
Member
They mention it because it would have functionality to push and install updates, patches, games without having to prompt you. This functionality is mentioned multiple times in this very doc and is mentioned in the very same line as "always on, always connected". The 360 doesn't have this functionality, the PS3 sort of does it with PS+, and that's the context Nintendo used the very same line with WiiConnect24. That's why it's mentioned.
Aquamarine
Member
Sony has confirmed the part we are actually concerned about, which is that the PS4 will be able to go offline.
That's what all of this is about.
And the crazy parsing of "Always Online, Always Connected" as well as the "will always maintain a network connection" phrase is people mixing up the other features we know are almost certainly in there, which is entirely the point of branding it that way.
You make the bitter pill easy to swallow by wrapping it in sugar, right?
So basically both MS and Sony will have in their next boxes:
- background/low-power downloading
- background/progressive installing
- suspend/resume on games
- day 1 digital
Sony has clarified one thing that MS hasn't yet, which is that it can go offline. If MS says the same thing, we've got no problem. If they get all cagey and basically start speaking like Maxis' spokespeople, we designed it this way, massively connected experience, you want this etc. then we have a potentially Maxis-style problem. It will be billed as A Feature, Not A Bug, because of course you need to be online to have your amazing "connected experience" (more marketing phrasing).
MS wants their audience online for the same reason the publishers want control of that portal experience, so they can flog their wares, and so you can easily buy them. It's just very in-character for them to push for something like this. You know, like paying for online multiplayer
This is the most reasonable answer here. Good post, man.
Oh god no. Then I'm going full on digital downloads. Fuck this noise. You people are resisting the future and that's weird because you are all supposed to be young and progressive technologically. I guarantee I'm older than 99% of all these complainers.
Its happening. dRM and DD future. Accept it already... But no the sky is falling.
I can't wait to hear the crow chomping when Sony announces their operational details and have some very similar systems in place.
JonathanPower
Member
Well, "will" simply means the console is going to stay always connected, which is what the Xbox360 already does once you log into Xboxlive. However, they don't say the console must be connected to the internet in order for the games to play. Otherwise, they would have said "mandatory internet connection for playing games" or something like that.
it can handle 1080p/24/3D which is effectively 1080p/48 in terms of how much data is handled. The spec could probably be updated pretty easily to include that, and I'd also expect the PS3 could be updated to support 1080p/48 in 2D
GuitarAtomik
Member
Exactly. That's what I'm trying to explain to him lol.
Haven't read all 19 pages, but is the Kinect requirement looking true?
Considering all the recent Microsoft patents for tracking your living room for advertisement purposes, if true, this'll be a complete deal-breaker for me.
Even if it starts off relevantly innocuous, you only have to look at the evolution of the Xbox 360 dashboard to see how things will change once the advertising dollars start rolling in.
Plus, the sheer audacity of a always-online, camera-connected box in your living room that never really turns off just to play games? Gimme a break.
Considering all the recent Microsoft patents for tracking your living room for advertisement purposes, if true, this'll be a complete deal-breaker for me.
Even if it starts off relevantly innocuous, you only have to look at the evolution of the Xbox 360 dashboard to see how things will change once the advertising dollars start rolling in.
Plus, the sheer audacity of a always-online, camera-connected box in your living room that never really turns off just to play games? Gimme a break.
Alx
Member
Of course that's what they mean. The second paragraph in the OP picture is explicitly about low power mode, and how it allows for background update. Any connection with DRM is only speculation at this point. Still a possibility, but we can't see that feature as a confirmation.
That's the whole purpose of low power mode : keep an activity while reducing the strain on the hardware. In low power mode, all powerful components will be disabled (especially GPU and (part of) CPU).
Kinect can work offline. Actually still according to rumors, a big part of the 720 hardware is dedicated to sound processing, so if it is for kinect it is probably designed to do a lot of processing offline.
Exactly. Especially since the doc goes out of it's way to state that Kinect and install are mandatory, so why wouldn't it state the same for online connection if that were the case?
FairXchange
Member
But they already said the PS4 can be played offline. Kill dat noise.
Aquamarine
Member
Yes. Microsoft is likening the Kinect 2 requirement to the Wii requiring the sensor bar. For them it's an "integral part" of the Xbox experience, so expect all of their 1st-party games to incorporate it in some way.
but that's just it. You are missing the point. This is a living room machine. It is the evolution of the home telephone and the home version of our cell phones. It will be how in the future most people communicate with others when at home. Video tv/phone. Skype. Voice and gesture controlled media activity and eventually home control, lights DVR recording, heat, AC controlled remotely.
Its the future , an evolution of media and technology.
At least it's the start. I am amazed at the resistance to technologies and change all because of "fear"
nephilimdj
Member
All wii did was check a email server every 6 odd hours
Don't confuse technology with implementation.
I don't want to pay more for the console just to get a Kinect I will never use... a lot of the stuff in this isn't sounding great, but for some reason forcing Kinect down my throat is what really bugs me... when do the GOOD leaks about the next XBOX start coming out?
At this point my only reason to stay with MS next gen is that I have been an Xbox gamer since the beginning... maybe that is coming to an end.
At this point my only reason to stay with MS next gen is that I have been an Xbox gamer since the beginning... maybe that is coming to an end.
BlastProcessing
Member
New panic for new information.
I think this pic pretty much sums up every MS rumor thread lately.
I would go with this one.
It probably won't be that bad. The biggest issue will be HDD limitations as your game collection grows. You'll need to delete and add new games as your collection grows. More of a nuisance.
That being said, I'm not sure why they are mandatory to begin with other than to cut down on piracy/game sharing.
Uno Venova
Banned
Leaks have said exactly that, edge specifically, so not sure why you brought sony into that.
AgentP
Thinks mods influence posters politics. Promoted to QAnon Editor.
People have been trumpeting the positive from full installs, but you cannot have it both ways.
1. Install from disc, never need it again, you can switch between games without getting up.
2. Discs can be lent, traded or sold with no penalty or cost.
Pick #1 or #2, you cannot have both. MS needs the disc inserted for DRM or the game tied to the account online and the disc becomes useless. I think they are risking more taking the latter and the payoff is small for the user (who is already accustomed to getting up to swap games).
1. Install from disc, never need it again, you can switch between games without getting up.
2. Discs can be lent, traded or sold with no penalty or cost.
Pick #1 or #2, you cannot have both. MS needs the disc inserted for DRM or the game tied to the account online and the disc becomes useless. I think they are risking more taking the latter and the payoff is small for the user (who is already accustomed to getting up to swap games).