Dave Meltzer
Banned
What are eastern thoughts? I don't understand this argument, are we saying Japanese devs want weak hardware so they can make cheaper games?
Kotaku: The Wii U Won't Be Getting Unreal Engine 4
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What are eastern thoughts? I don't understand this argument, are we saying Japanese devs want weak hardware so they can make cheaper games?
H_Prestige
Banned
PS4 is completely western designed yet it will get much better JP support than Wii U. Nintendo needs to make the same adjustments Sony made if they want to be relevant again.
If the WiiU's hardware/design issues are the result of eastern thoughts, then Nintendo would be better off without that influence.
Dave Meltzer
Banned
This seems like a incredibly broad statement to make considering until this gen I always associated Japanese devs with the best graphics on consoles. Nintendo included at one point.
What a fine point to this discussion.
ColdBlooder
Banned
Catering to both western and eatern devs. Thats what hes saying.
tkscz
Member
JordanN
Banned
I've mentioned why making a less powerful console is a big deal. It's an irresponsible move to developers and gamers.
Do they regret the power or the marketing of the PS3? I've severely doubt anyone at SCEI hated the first option.
So you admit Nintendo can afford to make a high power console? That's all I wanted to hear. Nintendo going through a disaster should be no one's problems because guess what?
Wii U is losing money and it's doing so with weak hardware. It's hypocrisy to ignore this.
metalslimer
Member
Dont they both want the same thing? Nintendo didn't cater to anyone with Wii or Wiiu. The only company that focuses on one is MS
It's vastly different hardware. To run last gen games comfortably at twice the resolution or framerate with little work, you'd need the same last gen hardware - just twice as fast - and mature tools (or vastly more powerful hardware - like, orders of magnitude faster). That's not what Wii U is. Could it run Mass Effect 3 at 1080p, 60FPS? No idea, but certainly not if it's ported by five guys in a couple of months on a shoestring budget, using unfinished tools and hardware and a badly optimized engine designed for completely different systems. To make that perfectly clear: I'm not blaming Straight Right, or EA, or Epic or Nintendo here. There's nothing anyone could have done.
Dave Meltzer
Banned
What do eastern devs want that western devs don't, and vice versa?
I just don't understand the argument. It's just hardware. A more powerful PC isn't less suited to a simplistic game than a weaker one, so what do eastern devs want?
...what.
JordanN
Banned
....what kind of response is that? Come on man, if you can't debate seriously don't debate at all.
Alebrije
Member
Yea, seems ironic but is how it works, look most of japanese oriented games and they are not power monsterns"
That "argument" was simply confusing. To top it off, you put words into my mouth that I did not utter.
The Xbox 360 had a few ports from Xbox running at a higher resolution and superior framerates, it wasn't a question. The Wii U is struggling to run last gen games with modest improvements. This is because it is not very powerful.
It cannot and will never run Mass Effect 3 at 1080 p and 60 fps without losing significant detail. It is not technically possible. It is only a 45 watt system.
If we released an Xbox 360 with a GB of RAM and called it a new console, is running last gen ports with modest improvements really a highlight? Can we really argue that games made for it will just look better and better as it matures? No. The technology is already close to being perfected and it is close to being maxed out.
The Wii U will see improvements but they will not be dramatic. It is designed as a last gen console with power efficiency as the primary goal.
how is it irresponsible to make a console less powerful? ooh you're on the "poor ole developer" mantra. It's not irresponsible. It's their business decision. Developers can choose to make games, or not. You seem to think these guys would make these games if Wii U had a 680 GPU and 8 core cpu? No lol they wouldnt. Let's stop cutting developers slack for not wanting to make games for one of the platforms.
At the end of the day THEY choose to not make the games, period. nothing more to be said.
Lets look back on Japanese exclusive support, we have no idea who will have the better Japanese support, right now the Wii U got Monster Hunter, Bayonetta 2, The Wonderful 101, Dragon Quest X, Shin Megami Tensei X Fire Emblem (two series together).
For PS4 right now we got Final Fantasy (and we aren't sure if it's an exclusive or multiplat title).
So we'll have to see in the future which has the stronger Japanese support.
BurnOutBrighter
Banned
How long are people going to keep this up?
"Well, it's only been six months, the big titles still haven't arrived yet."
"It's only a year! We still have to wait until all the games they announced at E3 arrive."
"Two years, and I know the sales aren't high, but Nintendo have a long term plan."
The Wii U is already literally being laughed at by developers. Unless something huge is done and soon, these arguments will become farcical.
Dave Meltzer
Banned
Games Nintendo publish don't count as third party support. It's not an indication of much other than Nintendo's willingness to spend some money.
JordanN
Banned
No, and you want to know why? Because developers will still support PS4. They know the hardware still fits in their plans.
Wii U is in no way a substitute for alot of developers this coming gen.
Well, we waited a year for the Vita and it has been selling decent the last few weeks.. so...
Fantastic launch, with what 50 thousand units returned in January? It is selling worse than the ps3 or Xbox 360...
EVER DID
They have never sold numbers as low as the Wii U is selling now.
Wii U is a huge bomb right now and turning it around, though not impossible, will be a herculean effort. And if you don't think so then perhaps you should work at Nintendo
Which still leaves us with the biggest games Japan has: MH and DQ
Fantastic launch, with what 50 thousand units returned in January? It is selling worse than the ps3 or Xbox 360...
EVER DID
They have never sold numbers as low as the Wii U is selling now.
Wii U is a huge bomb right now and turning it around, though not impossible, will be a herculean effort. And if you don't think so then perhaps you should work at Nintendo
The system had moved 3 million by late January. That's not to be ignored. The 360 only arrived at 6 million by October 06, btw. (Then followed by a very strong Holiday)
You're having way too much fun talking down on the system. Just sit back and see how things play out over the next year once actual games come out. A system not selling when there are no new games released really is no surprise right now. You can see that reflected by sales picking up right now as new stuff is finally starting to dribble out. Just cut down on these absolutes you keep throwing around.
Alright, so you will have to admit that every Japanese exclusive game published by Sony won't count as well, correct?
(What does this even have to do with UE4 again, I do not know but this is thread derailing)
metalslimer
Member
Latest tweet from Rein.
JordanN
Banned
"They (Ninty) can not simply afford to sink money into that stuff just to appease a very small demographic that might not even get their products in the end."
"Nintendo only does video games. Yes they have a sizable war chest, but they cannot recoup losses from other divisions like MS or Sony can."
Nope, sounds about right. Unless you don't agree Nintendo can pay for the hardware, I said nothing wrong.
BurnOutBrighter
Banned
Which is basically laughing at Wii U because he considers it on par with PS3 and 360.
The damage is already done.
"Sizable war chest" means that they have a pillow for disasters. That doesn't mean they can afford to go insane like Sony did.
It's not even remotely that simple, and your whole premise is completely wrong. Wii U is no overclocked 360, or a 360 with more RAM - it's vastly different hardware. It isn't vastly more powerful overall the way 360 was compared to the first Xbox, or PS3 was compared to PS2. If it were a 360 clocked at 3.6GHz, with 1GB RAM, you'd have a point. That would easily explain what we're seeing with Most Wanted or Trine 2 (though it would beg the question why some games perform worse). But that's not what Wii U is, and nothing is close to perfected or maxed out.
JordanN
Banned
Developers sell games. Gamers want games. Nintendo creates a console that negatively affects both groups. That is irresponsible.
If the Wii U had everything to support developers, why wouldn't they make games for it?
H_Prestige
Banned
Final Fantasy XV is on the ps4 and not the wiiu. Whether it's also on 720 or not is irrelevant.
MGS is also being made for ps4/720.
Those two alone are bigger than anything wiiu has. Capcom is also on board.
At least an overclocked 360 would be superior to a regular 360 in every way. The wiiu actually has performance bottlenecks that the ps3 and 360 don't have.
Fantastic launch, with what 50 thousand units returned in January? It is selling worse than the ps3 or Xbox 360...
EVER DID
They have never sold numbers as low as the Wii U is selling now.
Wii U is a huge bomb right now and turning it around, though not impossible, will be a herculean effort. And if you don't think so then perhaps you should work at Nintendo
Quarter 3 (ending Dec 31, 2006) 1.68M 1.68M (1.84M shipped)
Quarter 4 (ending Mar 31, 2007) 1.93 3.61 (5 million shipped)
2007 fiscal year sales 3.61 million 3.61 million
Quarter 1 (ending Jun 30, 2007) 0.71 4.32
Quarter 2 (ending Sep 30, 2007) 1.31 5.63
Quarter 3 (ending Dec 31, 2007) 4.90 10.53
Quarter 4 (ending Mar 31, 2008) 2.33 12.85
You sure the Wii U won't best these PS3 sales? Absolutely positive it's not tracking to beat those horrid numberS? I think you're just feeding into and buying into the usual hyperbole and history revision of "oh no PS3 and 360 had GREAT launches." they didn't it's a reason both had to be COMBINED to show a number that bested the Wii and it's the reason to this day people still do. Otherwise they have to admit how horrible both did for most of their lives.
JordanN
Banned
Ok, but how does this relate to me saying whether they can build high power consoles or not? Do you believe their "war chest" is not enough for this?
I'm not going to be like "You don't know that! There could be a Wii U version"
But I'm going to say is where did you get the info stating FFXV is not on Wii U (for a fact) and MGS is not on Wii U (for a fact).
From what we got out of the Miiverse leaked list MGS is coming to Wii U, we just don't know which one.
After a price cut and a bunch of games. It'll probably start going down in the next JP sales thread, and will probably settle back to where it was or slightly higher (maybe 10k).
Erm no?
FF XV has not even been announced yet (they just said they have something from FF to show at E3). MGS right now is only on PS360 (though next gen versions are likely of course).
Fact is, DQ and MH are the biggest thing going in Japan. Not MGS or FF.
Man the hits just keep hitting here. When will you realize that this argument is wrong, has been proven wrong about 60 times in this thread, yet you continue to push the same dumb flawed argument over and over again.
Wait, are you Rand Paul?
digoutyoursoul
Member
Laughing at a piece of plastic
Guy has to explain himself
Fuck sake
Guy has to explain himself
Fuck sake
JordanN
Banned
How about proving me wrong instead of beating around the bush?
Just because it is possible to do something doesn't mean it's financially appropriate. Why do you want yet another box that does the same thing as the other two?
There's another box that offers better graphics than what the PS4 and Durango can ever hope to produce. Why aren't you calling MS and Sony irresponsible then?
The WiiU has shipped about 3 million units in nearly 5 months. Sold maybe 2,5 of this, is already heavily discounted and has basically zero relevant software on the horizon for another 4-6 months. Do the math.
eot
Banned
It's not laughing at the WiiU, it's laughing at the implicit assumption in the question.
Guess what, the WiiU is more or less on par with those systems. It's not a crime to admit it.
JordanN
Banned
The finance doesn't matter because I already brought up the Wii U is bleeding money with its weak hardware.
MS and Sony are not irresponsible because they are actually making machines that developers asked for.
I did last night. Several times. Yet you continue to push the same strawman arguments in hopes that people will agree with you if you repost the same statements over and over again. It's pretty hilarious actually.
Sold. Not shipped, sold!
3.06 million as of December 31, 2012.
http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/sales/hard_soft/index.html
Do you have any data that supports that they are bleeding money?
The 3 million is shipped.
Source, please.
H_Prestige
Banned
Yeah, I'm sure it will just be some chocobo spinoff game. It's FFXV. Come on dude.
DQX is an old port of a MMO. And MH is not popular on consoles. Sounds like a real big thing Nintendo's got going over there.
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