Next Xbox Reveal Set For May 21, 10:00 A.M. PST, Livestreamed

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Angelus Errare said:
Why can Sony change specs but not MS? MS has alot of money, they can wait until the last minute to change their specs. People want Xbox to be less powerful because they're fanboys. MS always uses hardware a generation ahead of what's on the market. People think MS would use a 7770 based GPU? Less powerful hardware than Sony? haha, so funny!
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MS would use less powerful hardware because they understand most that Sony's approach isn't the best one necessarily. They know the importance of services is much greater. If MS has satisfactory and sufficient hardware, they'll go for it. Will it be grossly underpowered? Hell no. But overpowered for the sake of a bullet point in comparisons only people on forums care about? Hell no.

I think the most striking thing about this all is all the reports on GAF and elsewhere that MS wasn't phased at all by PS Meeting and it only reaffirmed what they were doing was right. Perhaps the spec bomb people are still dying for lies in there somewhere.
 
Angelus Errare said:
Why can Sony change specs but not MS? MS has alot of money, they can wait until the last minute to change their specs. People want Xbox to be less powerful because they're fanboys. MS always uses hardware a generation ahead of what's on the market. People think MS would use a 7770 based GPU? Less powerful hardware than Sony? haha, so funny!
Click to expand...

It's not about a company changing specs, it's about different technology being able to integrate into a system.

It was never Sony can do this because they are Sony, it was GDDR5 can do this because it's GDDR5.
 
onQ123 said:
& that's why they are not going for the console market they are going for the all in one Multimedia Computer Entertainment device market.


& if kinect/voice command can become the next KB/M , touchscreen or Remote control they will be able to sell this product to way more people than they could a video game console.
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so you say that they skip the gamers after frustrating them, and focus instead on general tv guys. (imo, to be monopoly in this sector is even more difficult than in games sector)
ok, this could happen also, and is in line with what I have written earlier about microsoft team being mutated to monkeys. I dont buy it, but it is a possibility.

I will be a little stunned if they really choose to go that way, but what the heck.. I am old enough to have seen many companies that I enjoyed in the past FAIL because somehow they got mixed up in things that should be very clear normally..

tomorrow's conference will be very enjoyable for me, one way or the other :))
 
What does 1.2 FLOPS means, Why are they compared to GGDDR or whatever the name is for the 8 Gigs of Ram Sony has.

How does the weakest rumored Xbox specs compared to the PS4?
 
enzo_gt said:
MS would use less powerful hardware because they understand most that Sony's approach isn't the best one necessarily. They know the importance of services is much greater. If MS has satisfactory and sufficient hardware, they'll go for it. Will it be grossly underpowered? Hell no. But overpowered for the sake of a bullet point in comparisons only people on forums care about? Hell no.

I think the most striking thing about this all is all the reports on GAF and elsewhere that MS wasn't phased at all by PS Meeting and it only reaffirmed what they were doing was right. Perhaps the spec bomb people are still dying for lies in there somewhere.
Click to expand...

MS will have the more powerful console, and if they get major marketshare in N/A then it's over for Sony in NA. MS will have better looking/performing games which means gamers will flock Xbox because of the better games AND services.

travisbickle said:
It's not about a company changing specs, it's about different technology being able to integrate into a system.

It was never Sony can do this because they are Sony, it was GDDR5 can do this because it's GDDR5.
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You're basing it on those old specs that leaked, we don't know if MS is going to even be using that. MS might be using GDDR5, and a better GPU, then everyone is going to look so foolish for doubt MS.
 
Angelus Errare said:
MS will have the more powerful console, and if they get major marketshare in N/A then it's over for Sony in NA. MS will have better looking/performing games which means gamers will flock Xbox because of the better games AND services.



You're basing it on those old specs that leaked, we don't know if MS is going to even be using that. MS might be using GDDR5, and a better GPU, then everyone is going to look so foolish for doubt MS.
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why you changing the mood of your post in this way angelus? :D
 
REMEMBER CITADEL said:
To be honest, I could hardly tell them apart, except for the girl and the Natahan Fillion character.

But there are characters with personality in the Halo universe, especially after Halo 4 and Spartan Ops, and they could always come up with some new faces, human or otherwise. I would actually prefer that, I'd love to play a normal person with no special powers or military background, somebody that doesn't use guns at all. Think Clive Owen's character in Children of Men and how they deliberately made him not pick up a single gun over the course of the entire film. There are plenty of different stories that could be told within the universe, it doesn't all have to be "Oooh, aliens! Shoot!"

Anyway, ONE DAY!
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I dunno, I liked the ODST squad.

Dutch, Romeo, Buck, Mickey, even the Rookie was interesting in a way. Buck and Dare had an interesting relationship and Dutch is just the epitome of badassery. Romeo's basically a dick, but even that was well done in the context of things. The squad and their relations to each other just felt real, a crowning achievement for a game so short.

I agree about Halo-verse at large though, big potential for an RPG/Mass Effect-esque setting just waiting to be abused.
 
Angelus Errare said:
Why can Sony change specs but not MS? MS has alot of money, they can wait until the last minute to change their specs. People want Xbox to be less powerful because they're fanboys. MS always uses hardware a generation ahead of what's on the market. People think MS would use a 7770 based GPU? Less powerful hardware than Sony? haha, so funny!
Click to expand...

because consoles aren't designed/tested/fabricated over night.

We aren't talking about a piece of tech that attaches to each other like lego blocks like a standard pc.

every single part is soldered to the mother board. Every piece in a console is specifically tailored to a specific power envelop and cooling solution.

You can't just magically go in there one day, change it, and send it off to manufacture. No matter how much money MS has, it would be a 1 year delay or more for a "last minute" change. If they changed anything major, it would have been last year. It's far to late to make major changes, minus maybe slight increase in clock speed, to the Durango for a launch in the fall.
 
enzo_gt said:
MS would use less powerful hardware because they understand most that Sony's approach isn't the best one necessarily. They know the importance of services is much greater. If MS has satisfactory and sufficient hardware, they'll go for it. Will it be grossly underpowered? Hell no. But overpowered for the sake of a bullet point in comparisons only people on forums care about? Hell no.

I think the most striking thing about this all is all the reports on GAF and elsewhere that MS wasn't phased at all by PS Meeting and it only reaffirmed what they were doing was right. Perhaps the spec bomb people are still dying for lies in there somewhere.
Click to expand...

It could also mean that they are being arrogant and still riding high from the success of the 360. MS's services are not that competitive anymore. People want more from the companies they patron and people are starting to realize that they are not really gaining that much from the Live Gold service that they can't get elsewhere for free. Plus, even though Sony's specs are high, they are not unreasonably high to the point that they come across as unnecessary. I want MS's to blow everyone (including myself) away tomorrow but I don't want their silence to come across as they have all the answers or that the answer they have is the right one.
 
p3tran said:
so you say that they skip the gamers after frustrating them, and focus instead on general tv guys.
ok, this could happen also, and is in line with what I have written earlier about microsoft team being mutated to monkeys. I dont buy it, but it is a possibility.

I will be a little stunned if they really choose to go that way, but what the heck.. I am old enough to have seen many companies that I enjoyed in the past FAIL because somehow they got mixed up in things that should be very clear normally..

tomorrow's conference will be very enjoyable for me, one way or the other :))
Click to expand...

They are not skipping the gamers 1.23TFLOPS & 8GB of ram in a closed box is going to be good enough for the masses.
 
TheKayle said:
you being ironic but i think a company with deep pockets like ms ...can do lots LOTS of r&d (as they did) and stay on track with different setup ready for everything..
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Why are people constantly thinking that Microsoft is willing to throw an endless amount of money into Durango?

Everyone seems to be forgetting that corporations are not run by gamers, but by people in suits caring only about how much money they can get out of something while investing as little as possible. Microsoft wants a console that isn't too expensive to make. Potentially, such box would be priced so they would take minimal to no hit per unit.

64 MB eSRAM, 12 GB DDR3, top/high tier 7xxx series (as some suggested), Kineckt in every box doesn't fit the bill.

Kayle, I have a feeling you are setting yourself up for a disappointment. It's nice to see someone so passionate for a new console but you should adjust your expectations.
 
SlickShoesRUCrazy said:
because consoles aren't designed/tested/fabricated over night.

We aren't talking about a piece of tech that attaches to each other like lego blocks like a standard pc.

every single part is soldered to the mother board. Every piece in a console is specifically tailored to a specific power envelop and cooling solution.

You can't just magically go in there one day, change it, and send it off to manufacture. No matter how much money MS has, it would be a 1 year delay or more for a "last minute" change. If they changed anything major, it would have been last year. It's far to late to make major changes, minus maybe slight increase in clock speed, to the Durango for a launch in the fall.
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Didn't Sony updated the PS3 this year, is that why they didn't show the PS4?
 
Winterfang said:
What does 1.2 FLOPS means, Why are they compared to GGDDR or whatever the name is for the 8 Gigs of Ram Sony has.

How does the weakest rumored Xbox specs compared to the PS4?
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winterfang, the leaked specs look like a gimped 7790 gpu.
this thing costs right now ~140$ retail, and will be costing less at xmas when consoles launch.

ps4 looks like it has something like a 7850 gpu (~170$ retail), not magnitudes of difference (thats why sony was tooting the gddr5, and not the gpu), and in my opinion,
just the perfect chance for microsoft to one-up sony at power levels.

now if microsoft will kick this opportunity, and not only that, but bring even less powerful h/w than sony's offer, let alone contemporary gaming pc's, that's something I want to see.
 
TheKayle said:
why you changing the mood of your post in this way angelus? :D
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What do you mean? D:

SlickShoesRUCrazy said:
because consoles aren't designed/tested/fabricated over night.

We aren't talking about a piece of tech that attaches to each other like lego blocks like a standard pc.

every single part is soldered to the mother board. Every piece in a console is specifically tailored to a specific power envelop and cooling solution.

You can't just magically go in there one day, change it, and send it off to manufacture. No matter how much money MS has, it would be a 1 year delay or more for a "last minute" change. If they changed anything, it would have been last year. It's far to late to make changes, minus maybe slight increase in clock speed, to the Durango for a launch in the fall.
Click to expand...

You're assuming the specs leaked are even real!...Like I said. MS wouldn't purposefully make weak hardware. They never have and never will, MS has BILLIONS of dollars. They'll have advanced hardware that still does what the need by way of services.
 
enzo_gt said:
MS would use less powerful hardware because they understand most that Sony's approach isn't the best one necessarily. They know the importance of services is much greater. If MS has satisfactory and sufficient hardware, they'll go for it. Will it be grossly underpowered? Hell no. But overpowered for the sake of a bullet point in comparisons only people on forums care about? Hell no.

I think the most striking thing about this all is all the reports on GAF and elsewhere that MS wasn't phased at all by PS Meeting and it only reaffirmed what they were doing was right. Perhaps the spec bomb people are still dying for lies in there somewhere.
Click to expand...

I am pretty sure he is taking piss.

But I agree with you to an extent. Having better performing multiplatform games may make some difference, but if the 720 is cheaper than the PS4 that will make a difference. If the 720 is more powerful, especially with it's more complicated architecture, it will definitely be more expensive. As such, MS will either make a big loss on the hardware and sell it at parity (unlikely) or sell it at a higher price (doubly unlikely). Honestly, if Kinect really is a pack in there has to be a trade off. I wouldnt be surprised at a spec bump, but incorporating say the new mobile GPU (8970m) would drive up the price and the size of the console. I guess we will see tomorrow. But I do think if the console is more powerful, they will specifically mention it. Why wouldn't they? It would give them a competitive advantage.
 
You've probably heard by now.

405606_10151442442236344_1773174547_n.jpg
 
I think it's almost guaranteed that the specs will be different from what we know. That doesn't mean people are assuming it'll come with a 680. I just don't want to see a hundred posts about eating crow if clock speeds have been altered.
 
Sounddeli said:
Built in Kinect
XBox Live being rebranded to XBox Now!
Illumiroom considered an additional Deep Immersion Experience - Projected objects might be interactive - BIG push for this and part of reason why Kinect is installed mandatory
Rare working on a brand new IP for launch
Insomniac announcing exclusive game
Machine will come with Kinect Sports Season 3
Machine is always-on in the sense that it stays in standby mode
Built in Kinect allows machine to kick-start from hibernation with voice command
GPU IS "7000 based" - Definitely not as powerful as PS4 hardware-wise
Subsidy a very big part of Microsoft's pricing strategy

www.xboxnow.com but right now you'll be redirected!
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Dat unprecedented leakage.
 
Angelus Errare said:
What do you mean? D:



You're assuming the specs leaked are even real!...Like I said. MS wouldn't purposefully make weak hardware. They never have and never will, MS has BILLIONS of dollars. They'll have advanced hardware that still does what the need by way of services.
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i'm not assuming anything. I am just stating why what you said isn't physically possible in regards to last minute changes.

I even said if there were any changes, they would have occurred last year and that is totally plausible.

You're right Microsoft has billions of dollars. I'm sure they would love to make billions more. You are assuming that Microsoft wants to spend money and lose money on each console sold. You think they want another RROD on their hands?

Why launch super expensive tech, that may have issues, to a slow economy, and lose money on each device sold, when you can sell a moderately powered device with current technology that will get cheaper and smaller faster then the uber tech AND make you a healthy profit on just each device sold from the moment it lands on store shelves?

I personally think the xbox will be somewhere between the 1.2tflops specs we have seen and up to 2.5tflops base don the Yukon leaks. that's my own personal belief. Question is where does it land.
 
Crazypanda_85 said:
It could also mean that they are being arrogant and still riding high from the success of the 360. MS's services are not that competitive anymore. People want more from the companies they patron and people are starting to realize that they are not really gaining that much from the Live Gold service that they can't get elsewhere for free. Plus, even though Sony's specs are high, they are not unreasonably high to the point that they come across as unnecessary. I want MS's to blow everyone (including myself) away tomorrow but I don't want their silence to come across as they have all the answers or that the answer they have is the right one.
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I agree with their services being less competitive, but I'm not quite sure if they're ready to match PS+ in terms of value for gamers, or even their tiered system so it's as beneficial to gamers as PSN is (I.e. free online gaming at free level), if they do, I think Sony is in a lot of trouble.

I'm super excited to see how they're shaking up XBL. It's what we've heard the least rumours about and it's also the core of MS' Xbox strategy. MS took HUGE strides when the 360 came out and still provides the most complete online featureset, I can't even imagine where they will take it next. Following people like twitter is already a fantastic idea for tens of different reasons. I wonder what they will do to make Xbox more like a modern social network and make it more of an integrated experience. That is something I think nobody is ready for when it comes to the reveal, people are just not talking about the future of XBL and the rumours are glossing over it too.
 
The teraflop debate is the dumbest thing....

But just out of curiosity what if any was the teraflop (or is it gigaflop) difference between the 360 and ps3?
 
funkystudent said:
The teraflop debate is the dumbest thing....

But just out of curiosity what if any was the teraflop (or is it gigaflop) difference between the 360 and ps3?
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~50Gflops in 360's favor (based on a couple articles that have rerated the PS3 GPU from previous numbers), although the 360 GPU also had the significantly better architecture.
 
SlickShoesRUCrazy said:
i'm not assuming anything. I am just stating why what you said isn't physically possible in regards to last minute changes.

I even said if there were any changes, they would have occurred last year and that is totally plausible.

You're right Microsoft has billions of dollars. I'm sure they would love to make billions more. You are assuming that Microsoft wants to spend money and lose money on each console sold. You think they want another RROD on their hands?

Why launch super expensive tech, that may have issues, to a slow economy, and lose money on each device sold, when you can sell a moderately powered device with current technology that will get cheaper and smaller faster then the uber tech AND make you a healthy profit on just each device sold from the moment it lands on store shelves?

I personally think the xbox will be somewhere between the 1.2tflops specs we have seen and up to 2.5tflops base don the Yukon leaks. that's my own personal belief. Question is where does it land.
Click to expand...

Advanced tech and RROD aren't mutually exclusive. Sony didn't have the problems of MS and they had some advanced stuff. MS can easily make advanced hardware and not have another RROD fiasco. MS has billions and they usually put in that much in R&D/Marketing for their new machines and make it up fairly quickly. Now that they have people hooked into XBL and other services the money will come quicker.

And again we don't know the specs so you can't say it's impossible for them to have X and Y within a timeframe when we don't even know what X and Y is in the first place.
 
jaosobno said:
If Durango can't compete with PS4 hardware wise, we'll be hearing only vague expressions such as "8 GB of very fast memory", "truly next gen GPU" with no mention of things like memory type, bandwidth or total system FLOPS.

If Durango is equally or more powerful than PS4 then, logically, they will brag with specs (as they should) and say that "the new Xbox outperforms all competitors and is the single most powerful gaming console ever made".

Remember, if Microsoft fails to go into even basic details about the system, sticking only to vague expression, the rumors (1.2 TFLOPS) are true.
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Really? I don't think so. The games, at least from what will be shown between the event and E3, will more than likely destroy that assumption. If they don't go into explicit detail about the specs, it doesn't have to mean a single thing. Not being more powerful isn't the same as being significantly weaker. And I've said this before, but what exactly stops Microsoft from proclaiming the next Xbox as the most powerful and most advanced videogame console ever created at their event, even if the specs are weaker than the PS4s? It's called marketing.

The Xbox 360 sure as heck didn't win the specs marketing war against the PS3, but none of that mattered in the end. In fact, it wasn't until actual games started showing up that looked undeniably impressive on the 360 that the whole myth that the PS3 was significantly more powerful -- which is precisely what a lot of people on forums believed -- was exposed as nonsense. Even many major gaming sites fell for it.
 
jaosobno said:
Why are people constantly thinking that Microsoft is willing to throw an endless amount of money into Durango?

Everyone seems to be forgetting that corporations are not run by gamers, but by people in suits caring only about how much money they can get out of something while investing as little as possible. Microsoft wants a console that isn't too expensive to make. Potentially, such box would be priced so they would take minimal to no hit per unit.

64 MB eSRAM, 12 GB DDR3, top/high tier 7xxx series (as some suggested), Kineckt in every box doesn't fit the bill.

Kayle, I have a feeling you are setting yourself up for a disappointment. It's nice to see someone so passionate for a new console but you should adjust your expectations.
Click to expand...

Dont think u need 899 dollars to go with 2tf console
 
Angelus Errare said:
Advanced tech and RROD aren't mutually exclusive. Sony didn't have the problems of MS and they had some advanced stuff. MS can easily make advanced hardware and not have another RROD fiasco. MS has billions and they usually put in that much in R&D/Marketing for their new machines and make it up fairly quickly. Now that they have people hooked into XBL and other services the money will come quicker.

And again we don't know the specs so you can't say it's impossible for them to have X and Y within a timeframe when we don't even know what X and Y is in the first place.
Click to expand...

there is nothing advance about the ps4. For the most part it is off the shelves parts with probably some modifications made to them.

You're right Microsoft has billions, doesn't mean they want to spend it. Your assumption is Microsoft has unlimited funds to spend on the xbox. They don't, they have budgets.

Do you know the size of the budget for The entertainment and devices division is? It is somewhere in the 700-800 million dollar range. That's a small number compared to the fact that they spend 9 billion on R&D. Now then you have to device that 700-800 million among all the divisions within the EDD and you get the picture.

the 1.2tflop specs come from official Microsoft documents. The Yokon pdf was official Microsoft documents. So we do know where they came from and that's why I personally believe it will land somewhere in that spectrum.

If you believe this 5tflop nonsense, you should stop. It's not physically possible in a console size box.
 
SlickShoesRUCrazy said:
there is nothing advance about the ps4. For the most part it is off the shelves parts with probably some modifications made to them.

You're right Microsoft has billions, doesn't mean they want to spend it. Your assumption is Microsoft has unlimited funds to spend on the xbox. They don't, they have budgets.

Do you know the size of the budget for The entertainment and devices division is? It is somewhere in the 700-800 million dollar range. That's a small number compared to the fact that they spend 9 billion on R&D. Now then you have to device that 700-800 million among all the divisions within the EDD and you get the picture.

the 1.2tflop specs come from official Microsoft documents. The Yokon pdf was official Microsoft documents. So we do know where they came from and that's why I personally believe it will land somewhere in that spectrum.

If you believe this 5tflop nonsense, you should stop. It's not physically possible in a console size box.
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It's possible, I just think you're being shortsighted. You're doubting MS because you want to see them failz.
 
Flops come and go. Its the programming environment/tools/support that matters. Its the reason I'm excited about the PS4, not the 8GB GDDR5.
 
Angelus Errare said:
It's possible, I just think you're being shortsighted. You're doubting MS because you want to see them failz.
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I don't want to see them "failz." I want to see them at the top of their A game. I want to see the Microsoft from 2001-2007.

and it's not possible for them to have made major changes to the hardware this year. It would have been done last year.

But your expectations are just downright idiotic if you are expecting a 5tflop console.
 
Angelus Errare said:
MS will have the more powerful console, and if they get major marketshare in N/A then it's over for Sony in NA. MS will have better looking/performing games which means gamers will flock Xbox because of the better games AND services.
Click to expand...
So you know the new Xbox specs? Cool, please share.
 
RoboPlato said:
~50Gflops in 360s favor, although the 360 GPU also had the better architecture.
Click to expand...

SlickShoesRUCrazy said:
roughly 100-125 gflops in Sony's favor. problem was the shitty architecture + dev tools didn't allow many devs to take advantage of it.
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THANKS FOR CLEARING THINGS UP GUYS!


But I am having a quick google and I guess people got into this pointless flop fight back in 05 and it goes ether way depending on who wants to win that forum fight lol.

Seems dev tools, time spent on that platform and "strategic partnerships" like Microsoft and Epic count a heck of a lot more then a 10% difference in theoretical maximum performance.

For example with MS partnering with Crytek we can probably guess the CryEngine and games using that engine are going to perform better on the 720 even if the ps4 is more powerful.
 
I'm so hyped now!

I don't care much about Microsoft's 1st party games (so far) but please bring on some awesome tech we can use here in Europe as well.

Oh, and also Midtown Madness.
 
jaosobno said:
Why are people constantly thinking that Microsoft is willing to throw an endless amount of money into Durango?

Everyone seems to be forgetting that corporations are not run by gamers, but by people in suits caring only about how much money they can get out of something while investing as little as possible. Microsoft wants a console that isn't too expensive to make. Potentially, such box would be priced so they would take minimal to no hit per unit.

64 MB eSRAM, 12 GB DDR3, top/high tier 7xxx series (as some suggested), Kineckt in every box doesn't fit the bill.

Kayle, I have a feeling you are setting yourself up for a disappointment. It's nice to see someone so passionate for a new console but you should adjust your expectations.
Click to expand...

Neither does 8GB DDR3, 32MB ESRAM, and 12 CU's either.

You can always take this thinking to the extreme, why not a Tegra 4 then?

the fact is it's a tradeoff. despite how people act ms wasnt out there going "screw power" even if the worst specs are true. that type of insult should be hurled more at nintendo with the wii u imo.

hell, according to interference, ms upped the ram from 4gb to 8gb in late 2011. you dont do that if you dont care.
 
yeap, some guys in here make microsoft look like they designed next xbox on kickstarter funds :D
who knows, maybe come E3 microsoft will be street-fighting with ouya for that parking space :D


ONE DAY MOTHERFUCKERS!!
 
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