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[yarden24]

Sure.

Saved

Spoiler

not actually, god knows i wont remember it in the future, just seemed like a ridiculous thing to say to that guy

 

[Chobel]

No need if I'm wrong i'll serve up my own crow. By noticable to us I mean resolution and framerate in particular.

ok, then can we assume from your post that you will eat crow if he is right?

Sure.

Let's agree on the premise: Multiplatform titles will be noticeably superior on the PS4. or at least noticeable to us. By noticable to us, we mean resolution and framerate in particular.

Now go:

Spoiler

SAVED

 

[FeiRR]

I'm with #teamPS4 but no matter who wins, we're just a bit over 2 months away from a very special day.

 

[Appollowexx]

Let's agree on the premise: Multiplatform titles will be noticeably superior on the PS4. or at least noticeable to us. By noticable to us, we mean resolution and framerate in particular.

I think some people on here are way overblowing the capabilities or rather the differences between the two consoles.

I don't think we'll see much difference in resolution and framerate between the multiplats, it'll be subtle things like extra particle effects, bokeh DOF, crazier physics and lighting effects - but again not to the point games look remarkably different.

They'll be a noticeable difference with the PS4 taking the lead in most head to heads but not to the point that casuals will notice (or even to the same extent of PS2 - XBOX back in the day).

My two cent.

 

[ElTorro]

People have said it before, but the first Digital Foundry comparison is going to be a fucking graveyard.

Nah. Nobody can be wrong. If games on the PS4 indeed turn out to have better AA, slightly higher resolution, and/or a more stable framerate (like 99% of time on locked target compared to 95% of time on locked target), people will claim that as a clear victory. Others will argue that 95% of player won't see a difference and claim victory as well.

This crap will never end.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

What if a xbone game looks better then what?

 

[metareferential]

What if a xbone game looks better then what?

Lazy devs, moneyhats, etc.

Just pick one.

xD

Seriously though, a multiplat looking better on the X1 should be an indication that something went wrong during development.

 

[beast786]

What if a xbone game looks better then what?

Obvious answere .

It should, since its 100 bucks more expense

Spoiler

as a ps fan, I already have spin lined up. ;p

 

[ekim]

Seriously though, a multiplat looking better on the X1 should be an indication that something went wrong during development.

here you have your answer.

 

[cyberheater]

What if a xbone game looks better then what?

Then Gaf will explode.

 

[Finalizer]

The most amusing thing I'm getting out of this thread are those silly percentage comparisons - "There will be a 40% difference in graphics." "Naw man, it'll be more like 5-10%." And I'm left wondering, what the fuck does a percentage difference in graphics actually mean? How do you quantify texture resolutions & quality, asset fidelity, particle density & quality, effect implementations, resolution, AA type and amount, and whatever else that goes into a graphical image into a single percentage point? I'm imagining a PC game where, when you go into the graphics options, you're just presented with a slider bar, from 0% (lol blank screen) to 100% (lol everything on) and different variables change arbitrarily throughout the length of the bar. It's kinda hilarious.

In terms of the actual comparisons though, I fully expect to see people running their goal posts all over the place once direct graphical comparisons start coming out of the wood-works, and it'll be a sight to behold.

 

[Kujo]

Not sure there will be a huge difference between the two. However, PS4 is still the cheaper and smaller console. So even if the differences aren't that great, it'll be somewhat of a role reversal compared to this generation.

 

[Durante]

I'm imagining a PC game where, when you go into the graphics options, you're just presented with a slider bar, from 0% (lol blank screen) to 100% (lol everything on) and everything just turns on or off, or changes settings arbitrarily throughout the length of the bar. It's kinda hilarious.

I want this now, for every game.

 

[Chobel]

What if a xbone game looks better then what?

The crow will eat itself. =P

 

[cyberheater]

Lazy devs, moneyhats, etc.

Just pick one.

xD

Seriously though, a multiplat looking better on the X1 should be an indication that something went wrong during development.

Not necessarily.
I would think if PC is the lead platform. Porting code to Xbox One would be simpler and more straightforward as both platforms share a version of DirectX.
The PS4 port could suffer as a result.

 

[Riky]

I can't see launch games being much different, third parties are probably hard pushed just meeting the launch with last gen versions to deliver also.

 

[le.phat]

They'll be a noticeable difference with the PS4 taking the lead in most head to heads but not to the point that casuals will notice (or even to the same extent of PS2 - XBOX back in the day).

My two cent.

So just like this gen, except the other way around.

 

[ElTorro]

Then Gaf will explode.

 

[TheKayle]

Let's agree on the premise: Multiplatform titles will be noticeably superior on the PS4. or at least noticeable to us. By noticable to us, we mean resolution and framerate in particular.

Now go:

Spoiler

SAVED

for noticable u mean more than 10 fps ?..or less than 5?

 

[Finalizer]

I think 2nd or 3rd serving would be more appropriate... Just remembering E3 alone, the feast was lavish. And it sounds like there was plenty of crow to go around when the rumored Xbone specs were essentially confirmed after the reveal, though that was before my time here.

 

[FeiRR]

The most amusing thing I'm getting out of this thread are those silly percentage comparisons - "There will be a 40% difference in graphics." "Naw man, it'll be more like 5-10%." And I'm left wondering, what the fuck does a percentage difference in graphics actually mean? How do you quantify texture resolutions & quality, asset fidelity, particle density & quality, effect implementations, resolution, AA type and amount, and whatever else that goes into a graphical image into a single percentage point? I'm imagining a PC game where, when you go into the graphics options, you're just presented with a slider bar, from 0% (lol blank screen) to 100% (lol everything on) and different variables change arbitrarily throughout the length of the bar. It's kinda hilarious.

Devs have tools to measure performance. Those are not sliders you get in your PC settings menu. Watch a vidoc from Guerilla and see their dev toolkit, profiler, it's all shown there. In fact devs already know the difference between consoles, at least those devs who are working on mutiplats for both know it very well: GPU this fast, memory that speed, you can get as many AI from the CPU here and this less there... You can push so many raw triangles here and so many shaded there... And they also send feedback to the console manufacturers, especially in the early development phase when SDKs aren't mature yet. They also talk to their friends and colleagues and share this knowledge. But they won't share this knowledge with gamers as they're forbidden to do it by NDAs. No sane person shits on their work. The bigger the difference, the more silence you can expect. Many bidets will flow tears this November.

 

[Chobel]

for noticable u mean more than 10 fps ?..or less than 5?

Our first goal post.
Usually any game in both consoles will be locked to 30/60 fps. What we measure is the percentage of that game being 30/60 fps with no dip in fps. ex: PS4 is 30fps 90% of the time, X1 85% (or 95%) of the time in this case we declare PS4 winner (or X1 winner).

So Thekayle what do you suggest the as difference of percentage to declare a winner?

Also don't forget the difference in visuals like resolution and number of object in the scene.

Again Thekayle, how much the difference in visuals there must be in order to declare a winner?

 

[Finalizer]

Devs have tools to measure performance. Those are not sliders you get in your PC settings menu. Watch a vidoc from Guerilla and see their dev toolkit, profiler, it's all shown there.

I already know about all that; I've personally had my share of performance profiling back when I worked on a Crysis mod. Fun times.

My only point is the oversimplifying of graphical fidelity down to percentage differences is comical in being totally misguided in its impracticality.

 

[Primedoughnut]

have you any proof or is just free talking?

you cant be serious


ps. likely most of multiplats games this gen will go also on pcs (seen the similarity with the architectures)..and is that the place where you should play it..if u want a true next gen feeling

Perhaps you can rely on that second GPU to help with the parity....

 

[cyberheater]

Perhaps you can rely on that second GPU to help with the parity....

Shhh. No one is allowed to talk 'bout that second GPU.

 

[Primedoughnut]

Not necessarily.
I would think if PC is the lead platform. Porting code to Xbox One would be simpler and more straightforward as both platforms share a version of DirectX.
The PS4 port could suffer as a result.

Just keep spreading the FUD I'm sure it might stick someday....

 

[TechnicPuppet]

I already know about all that; I've personally had my share of performance profiling back when I worked on a Crysis mod. Fun times.

My only point is the oversimplifying of graphical fidelity down to percentage differences is comical in being totally misguided in its impracticality.

The best way I can describe it is I think it will be unnoticeable to the vast majority and there will be no games on XB1 like the PS3 versions of Bayonetta, Skyrim etc

The games were DF says 'console x has an advantage but controller preference, where your friend are etc is more important to choosing a version to buy'

 

[Caronte]

EA, Activision and co. will develop for the lowest common denominator, as is always done (with the exception of the Wii).

I think the difference will be the same as last gen w/ the PS2/Xbox, just flipped.

I don't think so. I think they will develop for the PC and then port the games to the consoles.

They didn't develop for the 360 because it was the lowest common denominator. They developed for it because it was the easiest one. They didn't develop for the PS1 or the PS2 because they were the lowest common denominator, they did it because the PC at that time was dying and those consoles had 75% of the market share in their generation.

 

[cyberheater]

Just keep spreading the FUD I'm sure it might stick someday....

We will see

 

[Doc Evils]

a lot i think, just watch how microsoft has been releasing this PR claims that said they are improving the clocks of the CPU... just ask yourself why are they doing this?... this is exactly the reason, so the multiplats dont look so different.

These small tweaks still won't save them.

 

[DC R1D3R]

Let's agree on the premise: Multiplatform titles will be noticeably superior on the PS4. or at least noticeable to us. By noticable to us, we mean resolution and framerate in particular.

Now go:

Spoiler

SAVED

What? Like the difference between Bayoneta PS3 vs 360?

Sure.....GO!

 

[AndyD]

This crap will never end.

But that's the beauty of system wars... it lasts forever.

 

[Primedoughnut]

We will see

No we won't...

Your basically implying that somehow the MS DirectX .api's are going to trounce the PS4 equivalent because of some 'secret sauce' or because they'll be using the same on the PC..

There are nemerous examples on this thread alone where people quote developers saying the PS4 .api's are more mature than the equivalent XB1's...

but no, apparently that doesn't mean jack, that somehow this is going to hamfist PS4 development when it clearly won't...

but please keep clutching them straws, it must be really shitty to know that you have the 'inferior' console for a change...(the same shit thrown at PS3 owners from Xbox 360 owners for 7 years...) you like dishing it out, but when the times here to eat crow, you all magically start pulling fairy dust out of your arses with claims of secret GPU's or audio processors that will magically turn the XB1 into a powerhouse...

and now I'm calm again

 

[Omnistalgic]

Hmm..I was under the impression that the real noticeable differences would only come from Sony first party and published games...Isn't that enough?

Uncharted
God of War
Infamous
Gran Turismo
Killzone
The Order
etc...

Isn't Sony's WWS large enough to show the difference in power themselves with there own in-house software? Why does it matter if 3rd parties have parity or not? I would think if all Sony's titles look better, it would push everyone in the industry to work hard on PS4 to match quality...

Dunno, seems a moot point, but I think what Sony does with there platform is far more important.

 

[cyberheater]

No we won't...

Your basically implying that somehow the MS DirectX .api's are going to trounce the PS4 equivalent because of some 'secret sauce' or because they'll be using the same on the PC..

There are nemerous examples on this thread alone where people quote developers saying the PS4 .api's are more mature than the equivalent XB1's...

but no, apparently that doesn't mean jack, that somehow this is going to hamfist PS4 development when it clearly won't...

but please keep clutching them straws, it must be really shitty to know that you have the 'inferior' console for a change...(the same shit thrown at PS3 owners from Xbox 360 owners for 7 years...) you like dishing it out, but when the times here to eat crow, you all magically start pulling fairy dust out of your arses with claims of secret GPU's or audio processors that will magically turn the XB1 into a powerhouse...

and now I'm calm again

LOL. I can feel your rage.

PC's and Xbox One will inevitably share the same code and mostly likely very similar rendering engines due to them both using DirectX. That has to make porting games from a PC to Xbox One a lot easier then porting a PC game to PS4.

I can see if you are against a deadline. The PS4 port could suffer.

 

[Louis Cyphre]

Let's agree on the premise: Multiplatform titles will be noticeably superior on the PS4. or at least noticeable to us. By noticable to us, we mean resolution and framerate in particular.

Now go:

Spoiler

SAVED

Noticeably? Is that to suggest games like Bayonetta where it was clear to most of us there was quite noticeable differences or slight differences like most multiplatform games we seen this generation between the PS3 and XBOX 360?

I think some of you are making it appear like we have 4 different scales. With the Wii U being in it's own class with the PS3 and XBOX 360, then the XBOX One being in a different class to that of current mid-range PC's, then another class of which is the PS4 with current high-end PC's, followed by the top-grade PC's currently on the market. This I don't see. I see marginal differences followed by those who will use exclusive titles instead which makes direct comparisons more difficult.

 

[Finalizer]

Why does it matter if 3rd parties have parity or not?

neogaf.gif

PC's and Xbox One will inevitably share the same code and mostly likely very similar rendering engines due to them both using DirectX. That has to make porting games from a PC to Xbox One a lot easier then porting a PC game to PS4.

For AAA development, I'd assume most devs will opt to use the lower-level "closer to the metal" APIs in both the 'Bone and the PS4 to maximize performance. I'm not sure I can really believe that DirectX compatibility will play a significant role in console game performance.

 

[dragonelite]

Without real world comparisons i will find it hard to believe that the ps4 version will not be better 95+% of the time.

But then again i only have console for their exclusives since like the last 2~3 years.

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

When November 22nd rolls around, I'll Alt + Tab over from enjoying the definitive version of multiplats on PC to check in on what you guys are arguing over in the first next gen digital foundry threads.

 

[Chobel]

Noticeably? Is that to suggest games like Bayonetta where it was clear to most of us there was quite noticeable differences or slight differences like most multiplatform games we seen this generation between the PS3 and XBOX 360?

You're raising an important point. how much of difference is needed so it can be considered noticeable? and how many games with noticeable differences between the two consoles is needed so we can declare a winner?

Suggestions are welcome.

 

[avaya]

LOL. I can feel your rage.

PC's and Xbox One will inevitably share the same code and mostly likely very similar rendering engines due to them both using DirectX. That has to make porting games from a PC to Xbox One a lot easier then porting a PC game to PS4.

I can see if you are against a deadline. The PS4 port could suffer.

If they ported from PC to console the PS4 version will in all liklihood be better since it has a far more similar architecture to a PC, the bone is so esoteric that it would run like ass since you need to code specifically to take advantage of ESRAM and all the other additions that were made to help a gimped GPU/memory architecture. You need to spend more time on the bone to make work, you have to solve some problems. PS4 at its core is simple in comparison.

It's not like thd guy who designed the PS4 hadn't thought about this is it? Oh wait he did.

 

[benny_a]

When November 22nd rolls around, I'll Alt + Tab over from enjoying the definitive version of multiplats on PC to check in on what you guys are arguing over in the first next gen digital foundry threads.

Seems like the epitome of thread shitting.

The OP has well defined boundaries. You yourself have said games "Would look 40% better on PS4" and not elaborating even upon request what that even means and then asking what that is supposed to mean later.

 

[inner-G]

When November 22nd rolls around, I'll Alt + Tab over from enjoying the definitive version of multiplats on PC to check in on what you guys are arguing over in the first next gen digital foundry threads.

That's cool, I'm a keep myself busy until launch replaying some Red Dead and Tales of Xillia, then I'll be on to Killzone and Drive Club.

I'll shoot you a PM once they go up on Steam so you can check them out

 

[Z_Y]

No we won't...

Your basically implying that somehow the MS DirectX .api's are going to trounce the PS4 equivalent because of some 'secret sauce' or because they'll be using the same on the PC..

There are nemerous examples on this thread alone where people quote developers saying the PS4 .api's are more mature than the equivalent XB1's...

but no, apparently that doesn't mean jack, that somehow this is going to hamfist PS4 development when it clearly won't...

but please keep clutching them straws, it must be really shitty to know that you have the 'inferior' console for a change...(the same shit thrown at PS3 owners from Xbox 360 owners for 7 years...) you like dishing it out, but when the times here to eat crow, you all magically start pulling fairy dust out of your arses with claims of secret GPU's or audio processors that will magically turn the XB1 into a powerhouse...

and now I'm calm again

Christ on a cracker. Console wars....serious bidness. People can buy both, you know?



On topic:
I'm just hoping that the versions of BF4 are close. I'm more interested in the XB1 exclusives and multimedia features and I have a gold membership paid up until next August. Launch title parity will save me $450 in the near term and I can wait and pick up a PS4 when a bigger exclusive hits. Console warriors, does this make me an Xbox fanboy?

That's cool, I'm a keep myself busy until launch replaying some Red Dead and Tales of Xillia, then I'll be on to Killzone and Drive Club.

I'll shoot you a PM once they go up on Steam so you can check them out

 

[Usobuko]

Seems like the epitome of thread shitting.

The OP has well defined boundaries. You yourself have said games "Would look 40% better on PS4" and not elaborating even upon request what that even means and then asking what that is supposed to mean later.

GAF getting rowdy as we are nearing console launches. I doubt a PC-also gamer who took the high stance of ignoring meaningless squabbles will put in that much effort for Xbox One in any PS4/Xbox One related thread.

 

[benny_a]

GAF getting rowdy as we are nearing console launches. I doubt a PC-also gamer who took the high stance of ignoring meaningless squabbles will put in that much effort for Xbox One in any PS4/Xbox One related thread.

Except he has participated in lots of PS4 vs. Xbone threads where performance was the topic of the conversation.

Isn't that what the rest of my post after the bolded says? Anyway, there it is again. I'll stop rephrasing it now as to not derail. Shoot me a PM if you want it one more time.

 

[avaya]

Except he has participated in lots of PS4 vs. Xbone threads where performance was the topic of the conversation.

Isn't that what the rest of my post after the bolded says?

Be gentle on him, he is going to find this a tough generation.

 

[cyberheater]

If they ported from PC to console the PS4 version will in all liklihood be better since it has a far more similar architecture to a PC, the bone is so esoteric

Hyperbolic much? In no way is the Xbox One esoteric. A dev could treat it exactly like a PC if they wanted to.
And I would imagine if Devs wanted to make use of that eSRAM then MS would provide an easy to use API addition to facilitate that.

 

[qa_engineer]

This is the first time I've stepped into this thread, and now I'm going to do this

 

[nib95]

When November 22nd rolls around, I'll Alt + Tab over from enjoying the definitive version of multiplats on PC to check in on what you guys are arguing over in the first next gen digital foundry threads.

99% of people who have claimed PS4 multiplatform games would be better have also mentioned there would be little to no difference at launch. I even went so far as to say certain games may even look better on Xbox One.

If you actually read people's posts, most are saying you won't notice differences till a tear or two in, but that differences will get larger as time passes. So I have no idea why people think 22nd November will be indicative of anything. Launches hardly ever are. All we know is that multiplatform games appear to be well behind first party efforts, and why wouldn't they, when they have less insight in to the hardware and have other platforms to worry about.

It will take time for multiplatform devs to get to grips with the new hardware and tools.