Did PS4's focus on gaming prove to make a difference between it and Xbox One?
- Thread starter VanWinkle
- Start date
Whose side are you on? Are you looking out for a corporation's bottom dollar or are you for the gamer?
I've spent an entire post outlining why I believe one company will pull a bait and switch and another company has solid proof (architecture choices, past gen output, etc.) of supporting the gamer in every facet.
If you want to argue whether Microsoft is smart financially for money hatting games, than yes, absolutely. If you want to tell me Microsoft has bet its chips on the gamer and wants to cater to their needs long term, I lol.
I think many underestimate the fact that this generation lasted far too long... people were becoming tired of the same old graphics and presentation and needed something new to please their eyes and brains.
This is why exclusives didn't matter at launch: being the first console available on the market with the capability of displaying games in full HD as a de facto standard and with better gfx effects for every multiplatform title was the key, even more so when PS4 main competitor seems so evidently underpowered in comparison.
This is why exclusives didn't matter at launch: being the first console available on the market with the capability of displaying games in full HD as a de facto standard and with better gfx effects for every multiplatform title was the key, even more so when PS4 main competitor seems so evidently underpowered in comparison.
Already happened with Gaikai and OnLive, plus my TV does all the stuff you mentioned. But no one is using it because it's simply garbage, while the PS4 just set a new console record. Why should this change in 10 years? It's not like the games aren't appealing enough but seeing how slowly high speed internet is becoming available in some regions and how fast graphically and performance demanding games are progressing, we always will have a niche for console-gaming.
after ryse will come out...this eveidently underpowered words will remain inside the neogaf walls..and in some other specialized forums
or maybe the mass will think that the xb1 is more powerful
Unknown One
Member
The Wii-U is a ripoff for the amount that is being paid compared to the 350 and PS3.fine, dont add the camera AT ALL! and anyways, kinect is useless to me on xbone too, if my personal opinion has to do with it.
its just that I've been watching ps4 streams, and all guys that didnt have a camera, they all talked about how they are going to get the camera for their streaming purposes...
but even without the camera taken into consideration at all, and the 100 difference kept intact, still I believe what I wrote above
if it didnt have the nunchaku bowling and sports stuff to push the "innovation" card , I think this statement would hold any water... wiiU is not expensive. what about that?
300 vs 200 for barely a better experience or inferior and Nintendo games.
+ expansive exclusive game library
and for those in the know:
- developer friendly
- more powerful
- 1080p
- dual shock 4
& Sony aren't being dicks
You could argue that PS3 needed far longer to built up a decent first partylineup than X360, but we wont go there.
SpinningBirdKick
Banned
Microsoft are always going to be on the backfoot when it comes to prices as they will be lumbered with additional costs of Kinect.
If Microsoft are determined to keep Kinect then they will be fighting an up hill battle. With the less popular system they are unlikely to hit shipping milestones with component manufacturers where lower prices kick in for the parts they require.
Once the system reach mass market prices, the price difference between the xbone and PS4 will be even more important as mass market consumers tend to make decisions on price alone as they either don't know or don't care about the finer details.
Microsoft's only angle they will have available will be to bundle first party software to give the illusion of value at the higher price. Once Microsoft begin chasing those mass market consumers, core gamers will have very slim pickings if the 360 life cycle is anything to go by.
This is why the first 24 months are crucial for the xbone. Gaining a decent sized user base will enable it to limp along for the rest of the generation. But if it fails to do that then the xbone could very easily become the next in a long line of Microsoft products that the company will let whither and die. Microsoft's yet to be appointed CEO will no doubt be ruthless cleaning house when he takes up the position. No one likes poorly performing legacy products on their watch.
you hit the point
samsung voice and motion control in their high end tv ..are garbage..... ( i have one of it with the camera)...lg apps are garbare.......apple tv..is ok but u need to jailbreak it......etc etc.....
gaming on onlive and gaikai will be garbage for long time....ecc ecc
this dosnt mean that the market isnt asking for this...the market is SCREAMING for this stuff
so ms came out with the xbox one.......first at all nice gaming capabilities...and then...best in class motion control and voice recognition (at least seem like this)....best network infrastructure...apps...socials...tvs.....
as i said ms wanna be that conjunction ring
sony is doing the same as they did with the ps3...but this time been more lucky
thats the thing, I am a consumer, one of those that has no problem spending money if he sees fit.
microsoft and sony are not my friends. they are faceless multinationals.
I get into an agreement with them, that as long as I feel good, I will be using their stuff and paying them for it.
I really dont give a shit about what is often discussed as "LONG TERM".
3-4 years from now (let alone longer than that), and if the industry proceeds like it seems there is a possibility to proceed, I think people like me will use either console not very frequently...!
so putting the distant future in my hierarchy of gaming needs way in front of the present, its something I dont like or enjoy doing.
and the "past gen output" as you put it, definitely it shows that xbone MIGHT be offering more at starts, be it exclusives or moneyhats or whatever.
so you are telling me that wiiU has failed to catch like the wii, eventhough no other console was out until yesterday, is because the grandmother and the uncle NOW suddenly has become tech proficient and can recognize the h/w parts used and judge retail vs bill of materials?
I dont think so. you must look for other reasons of it failing....
honestly as "hardcore gamer" (what a stupid name)..i wouldnt buy a ps4 before a year from now...
the os capabilities are what they are..and there arent that "hardcore exclusives"..that should worth the name of hardcore gaming console
after naughty dog will came out ..the things will change
but as now..knack dont fit well in a hardcore machine
Ok? It's still garbage but with an Xbone logo on it. I don't understand what will change.
Prince Vultan
Banned
Yeah. I'll be buying a PS4 but I won't be buying an Xbone, so clearly something was being done right there.
Except you just did, and it doesn't really have anything to do with the point Thuway was making... but I'm guessing you already knew that :/
Except you just did, and it doesn't really have anything to do with the point Thuway was making... but I'm guessing you already knew that :/
that you dont need to buy 4 or 5 devices...and interface urself with 4 or 5 ui....
samsung cant rival kinect capabilities...and the dual core lg tvs or the apple tv...cant rival the media capabilities of the xbox one....
plus the xbox one ...seem to be one of the best gaming console for the hardcore gamerd out there you knoe? ( i think is fightin for the first position :O )
plus a motion controlled tv how much cost? add an apple tv...and a gaming console .a tablet for surfing the web......etc etc add the cost of all of them...i think the xbox one is a fantastic deal
Can Crusher
Banned
Open environment for Indies on day 0, ease of development, more power and cheaper. It seems to me that it really is a console with a "gamers and game developers first" mentality in comparison to the Xbox One. And we've already started seeing the results, with better multiplat versions at a cheaper entry fee.
It helps that they didn't try to get away with DRM too. Nothing has actually changed for PS4, MS has been the one changing its message and its policies. And yes, Xbox One has 3 retail exclusives at launch, one more than PS4. It's also true that Drive Club and Infamous are right around the corner, which will make the typical early drought more bearable, while on Xbox One it's just Titanfall around the corner, a game that will also be available on two more platforms.
Really slick OS though.
It helps that they didn't try to get away with DRM too. Nothing has actually changed for PS4, MS has been the one changing its message and its policies. And yes, Xbox One has 3 retail exclusives at launch, one more than PS4. It's also true that Drive Club and Infamous are right around the corner, which will make the typical early drought more bearable, while on Xbox One it's just Titanfall around the corner, a game that will also be available on two more platforms.
Really slick OS though.
For me its not about now its about 6 months from now.
I think most people buy a launch console based on what they can expect from the future and that's generally exclusives, not to mention that any multiplatforms will most likely look a lot better on PS4, so yea I think Sony focusing on gaming will pay off in the long run.
Seeing as there is only 2 choices, that goes without saying -.-
I think most people buy a launch console based on what they can expect from the future and that's generally exclusives, not to mention that any multiplatforms will most likely look a lot better on PS4, so yea I think Sony focusing on gaming will pay off in the long run.
Seeing as there is only 2 choices, that goes without saying -.-
Roland1979
Junior Member
You say tv is important and tv integration and the old console will disappear for some multi media thing. While it is the other way around: tv is disappearing (you seemed to think it's strange i hardly watch tv? which is strange in itself) and Sony's hardcore gaming console is more popular then ever. The consumer has spoken. And the Xbox is not some perfect all-in-one device. If such a device would exists then maybe the XB1 would be more popular by the casual crowd, kinda like the Wii was. I'm not saying integration in tv is wrong (but i think it would be a long time before it's suitable for hardcore gaming -power, lag, controller, etc- ) but while the demand for that integration, and thus the costs are getting bigger, television itself is getting less popular. Television will still be here for a long time as a device (plus you need a television devise as well for your console -well a monitor is a option) but more and more the internet as a medium is taking over. Whether that's on desktop, laptop, tables, smartphone or the latest device is irrelevant. The classic hardcore console is more popular then ever, with the exception that it needs to have Netflix (a internet, not cable tv fed service).
I'm not arguing whether or not the PS4's launch library is relevant. Killzone / Knack are truly launch efforts, with InFamous + Drive Club probably being the meat and potatoes of early PS4 software.
I am implying that Sony Computer Entertainment has done enough to propose an arguement that their "gamer first" stance is indeed genuine.
hydragonwarrior
Member
It's hard to make it an objective argument when XBone hasn't been released yet
Iacobellis
Junior Member
If Sony wasn't about games, we wouldn't have had the numerous videos from them that brought on great feelings of nostalgia. They absolutely killed it with the marketing before the reveal, E3, and launch.
But I don't want those media capabilities. They're garbage not because they don't work but because they're nothing but useless gimmicks. I don't want to wave with my hands around or talk to my tv, when I can do that more conveniently by pressing a button on my remote/controller. Why on earth should I ever do that? What about disabled people? It's not like Kinect has any advantages.
The beautiful scent of viral marketing. In any case, the angle you described above goes without saying that you are the target market for Xbox One. If a person cares about Kinnect, television integration, and doesn't mind compromising fidelity for titles, than yes, Xbox One makes sense.
Hey bro, have you checked that we are talking about PS4? And fucking lol about mentioning Vita when 3DS is out there.
It seems like a lot of the pro Xbox arguments are based on some fairly major assumptions about the quality of the launch lineup.
A lot of the games in the Xbox One lineup are, of used to be, 360 games. Microsoft may seem to be for the gamer on the One - they are doing so at the expense of their customers on the 360.
A lot of the games in the Xbox One lineup are, of used to be, 360 games. Microsoft may seem to be for the gamer on the One - they are doing so at the expense of their customers on the 360.
This thread is about corporate messaging and whether or not it is genuine. Using an example of brother platforms is somehow a pointless arguement? The Sony first party efforts will start steam rolling in just like they did last generation.
Oh and yes, 3DS is fucking awesome, but Vita still has first party support worth noting.
Nightengale
Member
This thread has devolved into the 147th variation of 'launch line-ups' discussion, all of which ends ugly.
I'm surprised no one gets tired of it.
I'm surprised no one gets tired of it.
Roland1979
Junior Member
Have you checked we have been arguing about customer loyalty and predicting future support and line up based on previous consoles(s)?
PUNKISNOTDEAD
Neo Member
Just buy the system you want and keep it to yourself.
What's with all the viral BS spreading threads?
How is being more expensive, yet 1.5 slower somehow justified with "those in US can watch some stuff if subscribed to XBL"?
And it comes with yet another portion of new shit, why should I subscribe to XBL to open a browser, or watch youtube, pretty please?
And the whole "oh, it's not focusing on non-gaming", "oh, but microsoft is soo good at writing software". Yeah, it damn is, clearly, "windows mobile" is doing so damn good...
Want better sales? DROP THE DAMN PRICE for starters. Want to "compensate" by spreading FUD? Let's see how well it goes, lol...
There neither are "statistic studies" (whatever those are lol) that hitting your head with a hammer is bad for your health.
How is being more expensive, yet 1.5 slower somehow justified with "those in US can watch some stuff if subscribed to XBL"?
And it comes with yet another portion of new shit, why should I subscribe to XBL to open a browser, or watch youtube, pretty please?
And the whole "oh, it's not focusing on non-gaming", "oh, but microsoft is soo good at writing software". Yeah, it damn is, clearly, "windows mobile" is doing so damn good...
Want better sales? DROP THE DAMN PRICE for starters. Want to "compensate" by spreading FUD? Let's see how well it goes, lol...
There neither are "statistic studies" (whatever those are lol) that hitting your head with a hammer is bad for your health.
viral marketing ? lol
here on gaf i read ppl all the day long saying
but i got an iphone and a ipad and i damn payed it 400 or 500 euro to browse the web during a movie I DONT NEED SNAP in the os
or my LG SMART TV have apps i DONT NEED the xbox one apps
or i love motion control and ill buy my samsung es8000 tv for 2k euro with it istead to ruin my gaming experience with the xbox one
.etc etc
..well stuff like this...without thinkin that a person can spend money also buing a pc for 700/800 euro
i dont freakin care how the multiplats will look on this two consoles....i have a 5+ tf pc to play them and it will play them better from now to the end of this entire gen
that said all depend in how much the difference will came out....if ms realize they have less graphical capabilities (and just a stupid wouldnt) maybe they will opt to spend more moeny on exclusives...i dont think they will sleep hard on this point ( i mean they will reac somehow)
as i said if the gpu in the xbox one would be on par of the ps4...there would be nothing to talk about....the xbox one would be the best machine..with the best functionality and the best infrastructure around
this should let ppl think a lots
Roland1979
Junior Member
And never use fora to express your opinion. And now get off my lawn you GAF'ing whippersnappers!
Messaging is really important to generate interest for your product. If you're selling a gaming console and state on the reveal of it, that you want to fuck over the audience for gaming consoles with most the shitty DRM ever, shift your focus on TV shit, kick indie developers in the nuts AND afterwards state to want 500 for this thing, that performs far weaker than your competitor's gaming console, then you've done a terrible job in generating interest for your product. You've made it clear at your reveal that you don't want the gamer, but everyone mildly interested in gaming and mostly TV entertainment.
They can't really change it by yelling "BUT LOOK, WE HAVE GAMES! WOULD YOU PLEASE LOOK AT OUR GAMES NOW AND FORGET THE SHIT WE TOLD YOU YESTERDAY?! GAMES ARE SO IMPORTANT FOR US, TOO!"
Many have already made up their minds because of the reveal and MS's half-assed approach to make it seem like they suddenly care about games, isn't going to change that.
They can't really change it by yelling "BUT LOOK, WE HAVE GAMES! WOULD YOU PLEASE LOOK AT OUR GAMES NOW AND FORGET THE SHIT WE TOLD YOU YESTERDAY?! GAMES ARE SO IMPORTANT FOR US, TOO!"
Many have already made up their minds because of the reveal and MS's half-assed approach to make it seem like they suddenly care about games, isn't going to change that.
The big problem with PS3 was Cell. Games needed a little too much time to be, well playable. That's why Sony first parties have been for PS3 very LTTP. Now based on that stating that the lineup for PS4 will be better, while ignoring what is factually in front of us, is reaching. We dont know, but you already count on it. Factually, the XBone lineup looks better than what the PS4 has. Factually, the 3DS lineup is better than the Vita lineup.
Nightengale
Member
Let's talk perception, focus and impressions for a bit. Ignore games for a bit.
As a consumer, when I look at Playstation, I see them building a ecosystem of gaming.
Cross-Buy. PS+. IGC. Server-compatibility with PC. Gaikai. Games across Playstation platforms. Remote Play. VitaTV.
Regardless of whether or not you think Sony's priorities are skewed by them making games for platforms you don't care about ( Vita or PS3 ), the connective tissue is there, and it's all about games. Looking at the steps Sony is taking Playstation, Steam is where they're heading.
On the other side of the camp though, Xbox is all about 'all-in-one'. They're talking games, but they're also talking movies, TV shows, music, etc.
They want to do fitness, they want to link Xbox to exclusive TV shows ala Netflix, they're doing games, they're building an entertainment ecosystem that has games in it. They want to be iTunes + Netflix + Games.
As a consumer, when I look at Playstation, I see them building a ecosystem of gaming.
Cross-Buy. PS+. IGC. Server-compatibility with PC. Gaikai. Games across Playstation platforms. Remote Play. VitaTV.
Regardless of whether or not you think Sony's priorities are skewed by them making games for platforms you don't care about ( Vita or PS3 ), the connective tissue is there, and it's all about games. Looking at the steps Sony is taking Playstation, Steam is where they're heading.
On the other side of the camp though, Xbox is all about 'all-in-one'. They're talking games, but they're also talking movies, TV shows, music, etc.
They want to do fitness, they want to link Xbox to exclusive TV shows ala Netflix, they're doing games, they're building an entertainment ecosystem that has games in it. They want to be iTunes + Netflix + Games.
MORTALIS
Member
Well said.
Also seeing an awful lot of chatter about features (other than gaming related) people wish Sony hadn't "dropped the ball on."
Seeing threads about people being excited about PS4 voice commands etc.
Also... "fuck kinect" *PS4 camera sells out*
It feels like MS may be poised to demonstrate dat balance being cool and stuff. However as stated, awful early in the game.
Roland1979
Junior Member
As long as i don't get 3 good games a month free you can wave to the camera while checking your Facebook all day long, it's not for me. Plus there's preference of first party titles. Plus the BX1 has a lot of filler, small apps, things you don't really need or a lot of people don't use a lot. Certainly not killer apps.
I do believe camera is getting interesting but i think a large part of that is that streaming is getting very interesting and popular. Controlling your console with it will certainly appeal to some people, but not every gamer, certainly not every hardcore gamer. But it's optional, so people that want them can buy one. Maybe your right though, but i really think streaming will be very popular and the camera will have a role in it.
you are correct, and what they aim for, in order to succeed, it needs a different mentality than what they have right now. and by "right now" I already mean different than it was six months ago.
very difficult task, most probably they will fail to 'offer first' so they can 'benefit later', and they will fall flat on their face.
as long as they provide good games while they are trying that, I will keep using their device.
but if the basic ingredient (games), fail to deliver... off you go xbone, nice knowing ya and all..
Prince Vultan
Banned
Nothing "factual" about any of that. All purely subjective.
Also, nothing "reaching" about actually looking at an upcoming release schedule.
dynamitejim
Member
As others have said, it's a marathon not a sprint. I don't trust MS at this point to run the marathon. As I stopped paying for Live my 360 became worthless. Meanwhile my PS3 saw more and more use. Great games kept coming out even into it's final year and it's still humming along as a great media/Blu-ray player. PS+ has gotten me a bunch of free games and discounts as well. I was 360/PS3 last gen, this gen I'll probably go PS4/Wii U.
you pay for that games....seeing that sony dosnt spend money to improve multiplayers infrastructure...you just pay for them (but i think they get it seeing they turn on the paywall this time)
xbl give u free games too...
the preferences on first party devs will remain forever...and for this reason i buy every gen both console
is stupid to dont admitt that both console have fantastic games to play
for the rest..
"Deprive me of everything, but superfluous..." oscar wilde
To say your point of view is subjective, while not backing up the own stance is subjectivity in its pure form
Roland1979
Junior Member
Nothing is free, i knew you would argue that. So is XBL. But the free games with XBL don't even compare lol. And Sony not investing in online infrastructure is nonsense.
Way to twist things, i never said that.
Yeah... no.
Surely you mean all 3 consoles?
The difference in the "free" games is on sony you are renting them. If u get rid of playstation + then you lose those games. With xbox live they are yours no matter what. So 5 years from now on my 360 all those games for gold games will still be working on my hard drive if I have gold or not.
I want to hate on MS after the DRM thing but the dashboard is looking miles ahead and like you said it always has been.
you renting the game...for this reason you have an higher quality library...the games arent yours...when games on xbl become yours forever..
sony is investing in gaikai...and we dont know how it will work...and expecially HOW...seen the providers cap..and the average speed..around the world....
..you could admitt that xbl have a clearly infrastructure advantage over psn...
well that was just to be clear........i havent any reasonable reason ( is correct?) to prefeer the ps4 over a xbox one...owning an high end pc..where to play multiplats...so the 1080p debate will never touch me this gen..so the only thing that i see is the less capabilities that ps4 have as media hub......exclusives are exclusives and well you can just play them over one system...and you need to have them all to play
as i said before...IMHO there no reason for an harcore gamer that have already a pc to buy the ps4 right now.....knack isnt the type of game an hardcore gamer would play...maybe in 6/12 months will go better
i know oscar wilde ...was an xbox fan
yes sorry ....
Roland1979
Junior Member
But you won't have a PS without PS+ anymore, unless you don't want to play online. Which almost everyone does. However, if you are the are exception i agree. And once i finished a story driven game i rarely get back to it. But again, if you do, and "plan on" leaving the PS+ subscription then it's a valid point. You never know about the future and whether you will changes preference of new consoles. On the other hand we have MS failing to support their entire system after half of a console line, which is way more important to me. But for some people i'm sure the XB1 will look better. And no amount of discussing here will "settle the score" or change each others platform preference most likely.
Again, it's a preference but as a gamer i rather lots of high quality games then end up with a handful of mediocre rejects forever (i exaggerate a little). And it's a point, i just don't know how strong. For certain gamers absolutely. You could argue the same about Netflix, yet it's super popular. It's the convenience, amount and quality offered. I have a gaming PC as well. I agree i don't need a PS4 now. But i do want one not too long from now and will continue to play on my PS3 as well for a while. A lot of multiplats on PC are horrible ports (Battlefield 4 is one example). But it's still a good point and PC has mods. Steam Sales and PS+ "free"games (noticed the brackets?) make gaming really cheap for me.