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‘The Walking Dead’ – Season 6, Part 2 – Sundays on AMC

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To be fair, that revolving door scene was one of the best the show's had to offer so far.

The hospital arc wasn't very interesting. I wasn't a big fan of the Governor either. His season was kind of dull.

But, yeah, that revolving door scene was awesome and I liked Noah. He's now the tech guy on Criminal Minds: Beyond Borders, which is a pretty meh show.

I'm not sure of what to think about how they did the final shot this season, in TWD, but it wasn't awful. I guess it's one of the only ways to keep mystery.
 

TheSeks

Blinded by the luminous glory that is David Bowie's physical manifestation.
The hospital arc would've been interesting if it didn't lead to Beth's death. Beth's death was just stupid writing and you could tell it killed Emily very much to go out in that way when she was basically forgotten for 2-4 seasons after Hershel's farm and her characters suicide attempt.

The fact is, the TV show has been really bad in regards to killing off minor characters and the red-shirts. They don't even bother to give them character development and then when they do (like Beth was starting to get) they just kill them off to where it feels like there's no impact to it. "Oh, Beth died. Wait, who was Beth again?!"

Like that meme about Maggie only caring about Beth RIGHT WHEN SHE DIES but before then she's like "who's Beth!?" image macro. The writers simply can't handle so many characters and plots.
 
The more time I spend away from the finale, the happier I am with the way they handled the cliffhanger. For one thing, the first person shot is still making me queasy and I love it, and secondly, the amount of time it would take to properly handle a major character's death just wasn't there. It's going to be better handled at the start of the next season I think.
 

Pegasus Actual

Gold Member
The finale was so bad that I just started reading the comics. I hate comics but at this point I'm just trying to get a not-stupid version of the story. Not to mention the comic spoilers end up showing up all over the Internet. Probably should have done this years ago!
 
I know "wish it was on HBO/Netflix" has been beaten like a dead horse but it times like this where i really wish it was.

It would help if at least the bl ray was out sooner so we can get Negan in his full uncensored glory.
 

Kickz

Member
It's gotta be Glenn. I doubt the show season would end on a cliffhanger like that if it were Abe.

tumblr_n1rv6bGSiU1sdffexo1_400.gif
 

someday

Banned
If you read the JDM interview he said the only thing he knows for sure is the season 7 will open right where it left off.

Now I am 90% sure that they filmed the whole thing, and the actors are lying about they don't know who died.
The way I've read it, they filmed the scene with only JDM on set after everyone else was done for the night and that he was beating a prop. I assume they are going to replace the prop with a human form for the actual reveal and JDM figured when the final scene was shown on TV that would have been done.
It's not a trope since some other characters were separated by Daryl's decision to go after Dwight? He made that decision out of rage, not gender specific stereotypical weaknesses (i.e. "I need to leave because I just can't take life anymore.. oh and by the way, I need saving to in order to eventually reestablish myself in the group I've grown to love over the course of the zombie apocalypse").

It's about the principle, and how much significance isn't relevant to the issue. Sure, the characters are boneheaded and often idiots in S6, but that doesn't excuse Carol being reduced to a woman pleading for her life after abandoning everything she knows and loves in place of regression of character development and a direct return to who she was in S1/2. They capitalized on her previous weaknesses (typical stereotypes she's already developed passed) and used them to progress the plot in the worst way imaginable (main character, Rick, and Morgan "go out to save her").

She's supposed to be a strong woman who can handle herself, and what we got in the finale was atrociously sexist (weak woman who needs saving from strong men). It's total bullshit, given who she was and who she became. And to add insult to injury, let's just shoot her a bunch while she's on the ground completely defenseless essentially begging to be killed.

Who is this character? Because it sure isn't the Carol who's been with us for six years.
Carol wasn't pleading for her life from the Savior. She was demanding him kill her and told him point blank, if you don't kill me now, I'm not going to die. Basically either kill me outright or leave me the fuck alone. I think the change is sort of out of left field but I don't see at all how it's a sexist portrayal. She certainly wouldn't be the first character in this universe to accept death or even yearn for it.
 

Evolved1

make sure the pudding isn't too soggy but that just ruins everything
I didn't mind the ending. Tbh I liked it... thought it was neat.


Btw can you guys please stop talking about the fucking comics? Thanks.
 

Surfinn

Member
The way I've read it, they filmed the scene with only JDM on set after everyone else was done for the night and that he was beating a prop. I assume they are going to replace the prop with a human form for the actual reveal and JDM figured when the final scene was shown on TV that would have been done.

Carol wasn't pleading for her life from the Savior. She was demanding him kill her and told him point blank, if you don't kill me now, I'm not going to die. Basically either kill me outright or leave me the fuck alone. I think the change is sort of out of left field but I don't see at all how it's a sexist portrayal. She certainly wouldn't be the first character in this universe to accept death or even yearn for it.

I meant pleading for her life to be taken, my mistake. I think it's sexist because, as far as I know, she's the only character to make huge regression in her character development in order to advance the plot; they basically reduced her to a weak woman who is in need of being saved, and not only that, put the entire group at direct risk because of her thorough incompetence.

I don't think it's done purposefully, but it's more of a "see, she's not that strong after all and didn't develop much from the woman who was scared of her own shadow in S1" and a full acceptance of the "women who need to be saved/make stupid decisions"/"begging men for help" trope in entertainment. It pissed me off and was incredibly weak/pathetic of her as a veteran survivor.

Doesn't do justice to her character at all who would realistically never find herself in this position.
 

someday

Banned
I meant pleading for her life to be taken, my mistake. I think it's sexist because, as far as I know, she's the only character to make huge regression in her character development in order to advance the plot; they basically reduced her to a weak woman who is in need of being saved, and not only that, put the entire group at direct risk because of her thorough incompetence.

I don't think it's done purposefully, but it's more of a "see, she's not that strong after all and didn't develop much from the woman who was scared of her own shadow in S1" and a full acceptance of the "women who need to be saved/make stupid decisions"/"begging men for help" trope in entertainment. It pissed me off and was incredibly weak/pathetic of her as a veteran survivor.

Doesn't do justice to her character at all who would realistically never find herself in this position.
I see it more like a bit of character assassination, similar to what they did to Tyrese and to a lesser degree, Morgan. I'm not a fan of it but they have done it to men as well. Tyrese got taken out by a kid walker that he knew was close and Morgan's #allLives mantra has been tedious. I will admit that I think it takes more strength to kill only when necessary but I'm not sure that's where they're going with Carol. I've come around to Morgan more in the last couple of episodes, especially when compared to Rick. I'd actually be happy with Carol and Morgan meeting in the middle and retaining their badass ways but not killing everything that moves.
 
They nailed Negan, he was great, can't wait to see more of him now. The show really needed a really good villain but they should have just had the balls to show the death, which is one of the most iconic in The Walking Dead.

The cliffhanger would have still worked after the death, in a "what the fuck will Rick's group do now" way, but the impact was lessened as we don't see character reactions to this shocking act.

The only way they can redeem the moment now, is pick up the next episode right at that moment, so we can see the effect this death has on everyone. If they skip ahead in time and we don't get character reactions, then this whole scene will be a massive wasted opportunity.

As for who died, maybe it's a fake out and they want us to think it's different to the comic, when really this death will be the same.
 

Surfinn

Member
I see it more like a bit of character assassination, similar to what they did to Tyrese and to a lesser degree, Morgan. I'm not a fan of it but they have done it to men as well. Tyrese got taken out by a kid walker that he knew was close and Morgan's #allLives mantra has been tedious. I will admit that I think it takes more strength to kill only when necessary but I'm not sure that's where they're going with Carol. I've come around to Morgan more in the last couple of episodes, especially when compared to Rick. I'd actually be happy with Carol and Morgan meeting in the middle and retaining their badass ways but not killing everything that moves.

But the difference here is that those characters didn't root from being completely and utterly dominated by the opposite sex and from a position of total weakness. Carol is someone who had essentially been prisoner to her own husband and forced to suffer at the expense of his perceived ownership of her. It's totally different, so that's why I view this scene as being disingenuous to all the change her character has made over the course of six seasons. I saw that scene as a reflection of her many interactions with Ed (begging/pleading for approval, being forced to do things against her will under his power) instead of realistically depicting her character at least as someone who has the power and intelligence to survive on her own. Instead, she's tracked by some dude limping around who's been shot in the shoulder? It was the dumbest scene they've filmed in the series yet and inadvertently sexist. I hated it.
 

someday

Banned
But the difference here is that those characters didn't root from being completely and utterly dominated by the opposite sex and from a position of total weakness. Carol is someone who had essentially been prisoner to her own husband and forced to suffer at the expense of his perceived ownership of her. It's totally different, so that's why I view this scene as being disingenuous to all the change her character has made over the course of six seasons. I saw that scene as a reflection of her many interactions with Ed (begging/pleading for approval, being forced to do things against her will under his power) instead of realistically depicting her character at least as someone who has the power and intelligence to survive on her own. Instead, she's tracked by some dude limping around who's been shot in the shoulder? It was the dumbest scene they've filmed in the series yet and inadvertently sexist. I hated it.
That's fair. Honestly I got pretty tired of him calling her "bitch" during the scene.
 

Surfinn

Member
That's fair. Honestly I got pretty tired of him calling her "bitch" during the scene.
Good point. That's the other part if it that didn't sit well with me. Plus the dude did a God awful job in that role (probably was the content he had to work with). All around just an abysmal addition to an otherwise very good episode.
 
I listened to the leaked clip and screaming at the end is pretty horrifying. Wonder why they cut that out.

It's going to be amazing when we find out it's Aaron. Everything they say doesn't make any sense. "Can't kill a main character in last few min", Ok then don't? Kill him mid episode, you have 90mins. And how the hell is killing a main character in a season opener (possibly the first 5 min) any better? I don't care what anyone says but this is a cheap marketing trick. S6 premier dropped 3 points and they wanted to do something to get a big opener. Simple as that imo.
 
Like that meme about Maggie only caring about Beth RIGHT WHEN SHE DIES but before then she's like "who's Beth!?" image macro. The writers simply can't handle so many characters and plots.
When Rick tells Maggie something like "we all made it, we always made it" I was just thinking: well, except for her dad and sister you know. All her family got killed. But sure, it always worked out, Rick.
 
I listened to the leaked clip and screaming at the end is pretty horrifying. Wonder why they cut that out.

It's going to be amazing when we find out it's Aaron. Everything they say doesn't make any sense. "Can't kill a main character in last few min", Ok then don't? Kill him mid episode, you have 90mins. And how the hell is killing a main character in a season opener (possibly the first 5 min) any better? I don't care what anyone says but this is a cheap marketing trick. S6 premier dropped 3 points and they wanted to do something to get a big opener. Simple as that imo.
Where's the clip?
 

Amikami

Banned
I haven't been in this thread since the finale aired because I just knew comic spoilers were coming with how heated people were so I decided to let this thread rest. Someone brought something up to me outside of this thread tho.

POV had shown up several times all throughout the episode from the perspective of the team members that had been captured. I assumed it was from Daryl's POV. Is it possible that it's Daryl's POV during the Negn kill? Has this been brought up?
 

jroc74

Phone reception is more important to me than human rights
Ok, listening to the audio...it might be Glen.

Or...someone could have been starting to say Michonne. That first syllable in her name sounds almost like Maggie.

I just read some website trying to analysis the scenes when they kept cutting to inside the mobile home. Something about first person shots.

If its someone from inside the mobile home...its either Glenn or Michonne.

It cant be Eugene wasnt he still standing? That also says to me he spilled the beans when he got caught. Whoever got killed was on their knees. Nvm, saw Eugene was on his knees just now.

And I agree the look of fear on Ricks face made that scene so tense. I see it already Rick is gonna retreat into a shell because of this...knowing it was basically his fault.
 

jroc74

Phone reception is more important to me than human rights
Ok, just re watched the scene at the end...

Thats not Glenn or anybody in the group saying anything...thats Negan saying Damn or Thats before he says taking it like a champ.

But it does sound like a male...and it does sound like Glenn making sounds after he got hit.

Its Glenn.
 

icespide

Banned
Ok, just re watched the scene at the end...

Thats not Glenn or anybody in the group saying anything...thats Negan saying Damn.

people should really stop trying to analyze it to figure it out, the person who died will really be anybody minus Rick or Carl, regardless of logistics
 

Evolved1

make sure the pudding isn't too soggy but that just ruins everything
Ok, listening to the audio...it might be Glen.

Or...someone could have been starting to say Michonne. That first syllable in her name sounds almost like Maggie.

I just read some website trying to analysis the scenes when they kept cutting to inside the mobile home. Something about first person shots.

If its someone from inside the mobile home...its either Glenn or Michonne.

It cant be Eugene wasnt he still standing? That also says to me he spilled the beans when he got caught. Whoever got killed was on their knees. Nvm, saw Eugene was on his knees just now.

And I agree the look of fear on Ricks face made that scene so tense. I see it already Rick is gonna retreat into a shell because of this...knowing it was basically his fault.
I don't think he told. He just got caught. An empty RV was enough info for them already.

My guess is Rosita. I believe the fpv thing is correct. And it seems like they intentionally tried to make her seem safe. Plus they gave her scenes recently. And she is a tough enough character to believe she could take a solid shot and not go straight down, as they showed from fpv. It would be seriously fucked up though.
 

pestul

Member
Rosita would be interesting to see the effect it has on Abraham. My guess is either Glenn or Abraham whilst leaning towards Abraham. He talks about babies and has a reconnection with Eugene.. the usual set up for doom on this show.
 
Major Comic spoilers:
I personally think that the major Negan stuff, including the war will go into season 8. A lot of people think they could finish it all up in season 7 and honestly they probably could but dragging this part of the story out makes sense. It gives Kirkman time to get farther ahead with the comics and the gives the show a lot of time to work with Negan's character.

the earliest I see the war ending is first half of season 8. But after the war comes a major time skip and doing that in the middle of the season would be really weird.
what do you mean it makes sense? dragging it out just to milk it for longer isn't cool imo.
This guy is dead:

image.php
wait, you know that for sure?
Pretty much. I'm more inclined to side with AMC for their decision during S2, despite the shenanigans they pulled.



The problem is that the first half of S2 was "filler" by necessity. There were a whole series of events that happened that informed Darabont's choice on what to do, namely:

1) The budget went down something like $400,000 per episode, and as mentioned above, AMC were trying to cut corners because they not only wholly owned the show, but they were in contract negotiations with Matthew Weiner and Vince Gilligan at the time because they were lobbying for an increased budget for their shows. Darabont also alleged after the fact that AMC was pocketing the tax credit (for filming in Georgia) for themselves.

2) The first half was originally intended to be eight episodes, not seven. An entire chunk of the original premiere (originally called "Miles Behind Us") was deleted. Like I've mentioned before, there were allegations that Darabont had turned in unusable footage, but there are shots in the S2 teaser that look far better shot than what we see in the deleted footage found on the boxset. It's my belief that Darabont was deliberately fucking up the editing and choosing bad shots during the Vatos sequence in order to force AMC to beef the budget back up.

3) This was all coming off a first season where Darabont apparently fired his entire writing staff, although I'm still not certain whether he or AMC were telling the truth in the matter.

Then you add the filler like characters repeating the same conversations two or three times in the course of an episode, Madison Lintz's (Sophia) growth spurt - which caused the producers to kill her off, and a lot of scenes where the characters look bored and it all added up to a clusterfuck of a season. Things definitely got better after Darabont left, in my view.
filler by necessity because of a shortened budget? damn. there are a few people who say they like season 2, some people in this thread say so, but this is one of those case how it can sorta be proven, objectively to suck because of what happened behind the curtains.

and like...wtf? sophie was killed off because her budding actress? same is happening with every other child actor on the show. carl is practically a young man now even though it is supposed to be, what, 2 years since season 1 timeline wise?
 
filler by necessity because of a shortened budget? damn. there are a few people who say they like season 2, some people in this thread say so, but this is one of those case how it can sorta be proven, objectively to suck because of what happened behind the curtains.

and like...wtf? sophie was killed off because her budding actress? same is happening with every other child actor on the show. carl is practically a young man now even though it is supposed to be, what, 2 years since season 1 timeline wise?

They said in interviews and making-of footage that the actress who played Sophia hit a growth spurt between seasons, which more or less suggests that this was the reason why she was killed off. Looking at the footage of her from the S2 deleted scenes, she's nearly as tall as Carol. It's a stupid way to be written out, but I can kind of understand where they were coming from. Gets rid of a periphery cast member and provides a great half-season finale - arguably one of the best moments in the show's run.

Chandler Riggs never hit that growth spurt until season 3, and they handwaved it by having it set six or so months later after the final scene of S2.

There are moments I like in the first half of S2, but it's filled with far too much filler. Honestly, I don't think all that highly of Darabont's work on the show. For all the extra money he was spending per episode, the subsequent creators have done better action scenes and general storylines with less.
 
They said in interviews and making-of footage that the actress who played Sophia hit a growth spurt between seasons, which more or less suggests that this was the reason why she was killed off. Looking at the footage of her from the S2 deleted scenes, she's nearly as tall as Carol. It's a stupid way to be written out, but I can kind of understand where they were coming from. Gets rid of a periphery cast member and provides a great half-season finale - arguably one of the best moments in the show's run.

Chandler Riggs never hit that growth spurt until season 3, and they handwaved it by having it set six or so months later after the final scene of S2.

There are moments I like in the first half of S2, but it's filled with far too much filler. Honestly, I don't think all that highly of Darabont's work on the show. For all the extra money he was spending per episode, the subsequent creators have done better action scenes and general storylines with less.
I see. Well, that much doesn't really concern me as a fan coz I didn't start watching till season 4. So it is what it is. I mean, who knows. If they kept Sophia's character alive, many things could've been different. Carol may've been killed already, there may not have been an Enid, etc.

Anyways, Jeremy Jahns posted his review for the season finale and I can't say I agree with him about the cliffhanger. Nothing is going to change my mind about the season finale. It is fucking bullshit through and through.
 
...Most fans were already psychologically prepared to bury an important character that night, and after all that cat-mouse chase in which Rick came to realization he didn’t know shit (in Negan’s words) the tension and the terror were aligned up perfectly to show us Lucille bashing someone’s skull, but they didn’t; we only heard it happening after witnessing the first blow from a POV perspective. Cheap thrills and cheaper cliffhangers, this was a terrible decision from a fan base and artistic stand point, how can you ruin an almost perfect season finale by not paying off the fans patience over the last 16 episodes? Season 6 always came to this scene and they mangled it, chopped it down in half just to secure ratings for Season 7’s premiere; that sad fact is obvious. Why not show us a first death and tease us with a second death instead AMC? Don’t you think it’s time to start listening to the fans before the ratings do fall because of click-bait style kind of writing? Was that cliffhanger really necessary for ratings? Most people seem to agree they would have tuned in anyway in October. Others claim that they are done with the show and their sneaky showrunners. Just when we thought dumpstergate was the season low...
http://moviepilot.com/posts/3854523

Really enjoyed it, I want mullet boy to be the victim.
Why?
 
If you read the issue, you would have a much better understanding of its impact.

Killing someone who's death is going to have a huge impact on the main characters and the audience allows everyone to experience loss, not just the threat of loss (i.e. killing someone we don't care much about).

It diminishes the purpose of introducing Negan to kill off someone the group/audience will be over in an episode. Why even watch if the main Atlanta/farm characters don't ever die? If we know they'll always be protected by the fans' investment in them?

It destroys the impact.

I don't think you understand what I was saying. You want the emotional impact of the comic story, but I'm saying I don't think AMC will actually go through with killing a major character, and thus there will be minimal emotional impact regardless of how it is done. This cliffhanger way of telling it doesn't really change much, assuming AMC will only kill off a B-tier character.
 
Just cannot stand the way he talks and acts, it's silly and shallow but the character does literally nothing for me.
so you just don't like the character. i guess that's fair.
I don't think you understand what I was saying. You want the emotional impact of the comic story, but I'm saying I don't think AMC will actually go through with killing a major character, and thus there will be minimal emotional impact regardless of how it is done. This cliffhanger way of telling it doesn't really change much, assuming AMC will only kill off a B-tier character.
that's not true. even if it wasn't a "main" character that got Lucille'd the shock value and impact would have still hit me. Any one of our Alexandrians. Just the simple fact that it wasn't shown at all, fucked everything up. It was a testament to how fucked up season 6 was, in my opinion.
 
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