depths20XX
Member
A chart of words is not data unfortunately. The things on there would have to be factually proven other than just opinions. Also, he didn't provide anything to back it up. You just replied to me with the article he got it from.
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To be white is to be racist, period, a high school teacher told his class
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A chart of words is not data unfortunately. The things on there would have to be factually proven other than just opinions. Also, he didn't provide anything to back it up. You just replied to me with the article he got it from.
Would what the dude said be okay if it turned he was just joking?
depths20XX
Member
So anecdotal evidence from one professor is now proof that all white people are inherently racist? How low the bar has gone.
ThisGuy
Member
NegroNinja
Member
You can't be serious. Since when is 20 years of professional work and research anecdotal evidence?
What a silly question. Having sex with someone of a different race doesn't automatically mean you're not a racist.
Did slave masters love their black children?
As a latino, may i ask why?
Btw, this fucking thread is making me mad the more i read it. Having relatives from different etchnicities,i guess i'll never agree with white people being "born racist". Seriously what the fuck.
I didn't say that sex with another race doesn't make you racist. That kinda has nothing to do with the question. Can a white parent love their black child?
I don't know if slave masters loved their black children. I'd imagine not most of the time.
depths20XX
Member
Yes, she has a strong background in social issues. You just posted a link to her profile with nothing else. That doesn't add any weight to the article I was talking about which had no data.
Basically what I'm getting at is that saying "all white people are racist" is not a good foot to stand on. It can never be proven and has no data to stand on. It's simply not true unless you have some different understanding of racism. A whole race of people will never hold the same belief. It makes much more sense to bring up things that CAN be proven such as the way minorities are treated in the justice system or in job hiring situations.
Prodigal Son
Member
Probably not if he's a teacher. Joking about racial issues doesn't sound advisable.
To the best of my knowledge, he was serious. Seriously stupid too, I should add.
That's a bit different from what you thought about the racism about the Old Navy ad. Interesting.
It's a silly question to ask, especially if you don't think all white people are racist... which you do not.
So either you think white people are all racist or you're just asking the question for the fuck of it.
"For the fuck of it", yes that's correct. I do already know what I think, yes. I'm curious to know. I can do without the snarky bullshit. Why is it silly?
Prodigal Son
Member
Are you, like, able to differentiate what's appropriate for an online shit-poster from what's appropriate for a teacher? You know there's a difference, right?
I jokingly comment on Game Grumps videos about how Danny is a sexy beast whose babies I'd gladly have. Thousands other do as well. It's a joke appropriate for the setting and context. People online swear and say crazy stuff that's outrageous at face value. It doesn't mean a teacher should be saying it to his or her students. You digging up a post from a million years ago that barely fits this context is beyond sad.
KonradLaw
Member
The ridiculous thing is that if we think that just being part of white supermacy system is enough to make white person racist then the only way for a white people to not be racist is to segregate themselves from any non-whites. Either live in a homogenous white country or create a white-only separate city with barely any outside contact, like Orania in South Africa.
So in essence, using those criterias a white american who's sensitive to plight of minorities and tries to help in fight for equality is more racist then a afrikaneer who hates that aperheid ended and decides to just pack his things and start his own city just to avoid living next to black people.
So in essence, using those criterias a white american who's sensitive to plight of minorities and tries to help in fight for equality is more racist then a afrikaneer who hates that aperheid ended and decides to just pack his things and start his own city just to avoid living next to black people.
Nah I am going to continue to be snarky in a thread filled with white fragility.
I get it, being called racist is by far the worst thing you can call someone these day. I mean shit, all that systemic racism white people experience on a daily basis is astounding.
Despite what some people think, I don't agree that all white people are racist, but some of you being up in arms about racism all of a sudden is laughable.
I expect all of you will be in the next thread about some sort of racism directed at a minority, right?
You should be consistent with what you think is acceptable when it comes to racism.
Five months is a million years ago?
F0rneus
Tears in the rain
Maybe it's because english is not my first language but I'm not certain about what you are implying here. Are you saying that white parents of interracial children cannot truly love their partners/kids?
Prodigal Son
Member
Fucking knew I'd get this as I typed the words. I haven't been on GAF too long, guy. 5 months is half my GAF life.
Also, there's a little thing called nuance. If I posted something like: "black people at it again... smh" With obvious tongue-in-cheek sarcasm at play, am I being racist? Of course I'm not. This is the language we speak, dawg. Context matters. Settings matter. Not everything I say on GAF should be said to a classroom of Uni students. If you genuinely think nothing inappropriate in one setting should ever be said, I'm not sure if there's any convincing you.
Yeah, good post. This sums up my view as well.
You should definitely post this in a thread, dawg.
Yeah that's exactly what I was saying... or you know, I answered a ridiculous question with an equally ridiculous question.
Prodigal Son
Member
Where are you, man? Do you know what sarcasm is? Satire? Half of the first few posts in every GAF thread about right wingers is a lazy sarcastic quote from the other side.
Honestly. If someone posted "but I don't see color tho" in response to a thread about someone being racist, do you genuinely think most people wouldn't know they're joking?
Psychoward
Banned
Edit: nvm not worth risking a ban over
I know where I am dawg, but by all means post "black people at it again... smh" in a thread.
I get it, it is unfair being white, you can't say and do things free of consequence and that fucking sucks.
Prodigal Son
Member
Do you actually have a response to any of the questions I'm posing to you? Do you have, like, a position to argue here or did you just really wanna dig that post back up?
Assume whatever you want about me. I'm open to learn. In fact I've learned a lot by lurking this forum for as many years as I have. I think being up in arms about racism is a good thing. If it wasn't for patience, persistence and dialogue I think a lot less white people would give a fuck. Demagoguery is what has no place.
Edit: What I am not saying is that the onus is on minorities. We have to meet in the middle.
Well I'm certainly curious now.
Psychoward
Banned
What the hell is this? You admit to shitposting up the thread about race because you believe we don't care about racism directed at minorities? Uh, ok.
F0rneus
Tears in the rain
I tend to miss the subtlety of some posts sometimes lol. I don't mean to, but it gets hard to fully understand stuff at times. But now I get you.
I wasn't referring to you in particular, I was just explaining why I am being snarky in this thread.
I think it is pretty shitty to say all white people are racists but I am not going to sit here and pretend like it's the end of the world or that it will even negatively affect white people in a society built around white supremacy.
Or maybe I am conflating my annoyance with people trying to make "racist" the de facto bad thing you shouldn't call white people with the anger some are displaying is this thread.. maybe.
I disagree. There is a shitload of information from minorities about our experience with racism so I don't see how one more story or one more education session with change a racist's mind.
KarneeKarnay
Member
I would say that everyone is a little bit racist. The majority of the time, not all the time. Should we condone racism? Absolutely not.
/thread.
/thread.
harriet the spy
Member
The usual racism is prejudice +power nonsense that some like to bleat over and over again.
Not to say that racism and power is not a particularly devastating combination for society however.
Yeah pretty much this.
If someone wants to argue that structural racism is worse, then ok, I definitely agree, but let's not pretend it's the only definition of the word or that racism on the micro scale doesn't matter.
chillybright
Banned
Lol thought the same thing. The difference here is there seems to be no way out for white people, at least for now...
RocknRola
Member
Hmmm... Not being American, at points I feel many of the definitions and arguments presented in this thread apply only in the US/North America and a couple of European countries (in particular, central and western countries). Which is perfectly fine btw, especially since the origin of this discussion is indeed a teacher in the US.
Maybe I'm wrong (and if I am, no problems, feel free to correct me) but it feels like many of stuff discussed here kinda breaks apart when you go outside of the regions I mentioned, though perhaps not so much on a pure racial basis (though it definitely is there) but more on a xenophobic basis.
Even on a historical standpoint these concepts kinda get iffy if we go further back than the Transatlantic Slave Trade (we, as a species, have "played" with the concept of slaves for thousands of years).
Though again, this is just me extrapolating the arguments/definitions here presented to a global scale. On a more regional scale, in particular regarding systemic racism, I'd say they fit (depending on the region in question of course). Wouldn't go as far as to make such a blank a statement as the teacher did, but there is definitely a lot of truth to non-whites in NA/Europe having their life be a lot more difficult than it should be "just because".
Maybe I'm wrong (and if I am, no problems, feel free to correct me) but it feels like many of stuff discussed here kinda breaks apart when you go outside of the regions I mentioned, though perhaps not so much on a pure racial basis (though it definitely is there) but more on a xenophobic basis.
Even on a historical standpoint these concepts kinda get iffy if we go further back than the Transatlantic Slave Trade (we, as a species, have "played" with the concept of slaves for thousands of years).
Though again, this is just me extrapolating the arguments/definitions here presented to a global scale. On a more regional scale, in particular regarding systemic racism, I'd say they fit (depending on the region in question of course). Wouldn't go as far as to make such a blank a statement as the teacher did, but there is definitely a lot of truth to non-whites in NA/Europe having their life be a lot more difficult than it should be "just because".
I raise you Gazi Kodzo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQmriFjA1KU
Be sure to check out other great videos like "Are Interracial Relationships, Rape?", "I'm Anti-Semitic" and "Don't tip white people!"
Mammoth Jones
Member
Go back and read my very first sentence.
Whom_Gods_Annoy
Banned
Top tier shitposting seems to be one of your more obvious qualities.
It is funny watching your "gotcha" fall flat on its ass though.
Dig through my post history. I've said some actual dumb misinformed shit before here. The worst one was probably me going full diet racist 2 years ago. Id like to think ive learned a lot since then.
The teacher's language certainly suggest it is, which does indeed prevent most real discussion and instead encourages the nonsense shitposting seen above.
I won't argue that most if not all white people are at least a little quick to go racist.
Its hard for me to admit and I hate it about myself. But I'm not going to sit here and say I've never been at a sketchy gas station and been automatically a little worried about some black guy in a hoodie.
Now, this lasts for about half a second. Then I mentally punch myself for being a freaking idiot. This guy hasn't done anything to me. He's not even doing anything wrong. And I hate that I've ever done it. But, living with my extremely racist grandparents, it creeps in sometimes.
Its hard for me to admit and I hate it about myself. But I'm not going to sit here and say I've never been at a sketchy gas station and been automatically a little worried about some black guy in a hoodie.
Now, this lasts for about half a second. Then I mentally punch myself for being a freaking idiot. This guy hasn't done anything to me. He's not even doing anything wrong. And I hate that I've ever done it. But, living with my extremely racist grandparents, it creeps in sometimes.
Whom_Gods_Annoy
Banned
Elaborate.
My biggest problem with the idea that "to be white is to be racist" is that it is so absolutist that it completely shuts down all conversation and implies that nothing can be done.
Born white, oops your racist! Always have, always will be.
It ignores that it's a societal issue that is being ignored and can be changed, but instead makes it out to be some inharent trait. Almost as if it can't be changed and could never be changed.
(Though, to note, I would like to say that the quote and lecture is very obviously conflaiting privilege and talking about how most people ignore microagressions and semi-subtle racist acts (and not so subtle racist acts), which isn't a false statement, but I feel should be talked about and not swept under a rug as "inherently a trait of being white". Many comments on this thread seem to assume that thoughtless day-1 old white Baby in an incubator is inherently racist and that just rings as handwaving and moronic. It ignores the issue and instead trivializes racism.)
Born white, oops your racist! Always have, always will be.
It ignores that it's a societal issue that is being ignored and can be changed, but instead makes it out to be some inharent trait. Almost as if it can't be changed and could never be changed.
(Though, to note, I would like to say that the quote and lecture is very obviously conflaiting privilege and talking about how most people ignore microagressions and semi-subtle racist acts (and not so subtle racist acts), which isn't a false statement, but I feel should be talked about and not swept under a rug as "inherently a trait of being white". Many comments on this thread seem to assume that thoughtless day-1 old white Baby in an incubator is inherently racist and that just rings as handwaving and moronic. It ignores the issue and instead trivializes racism.)
White people will inevitably carry the vestiges of racism with them for as long as they benefit from white privilege. This racism can be counter-acted and fixed, but first, it must be acknowledged. If it's denied, then racism will inevitably be perpetuated; this doesn't refer to the blatant, n-word shouting kind of racism, but systemic, structural discrimination against racial minorities that happens without people even realizing it.
That's what the teacher means, and I'm in full agreement.
NegroNinja
Member
Being called a racist is the worst thing that can ever happen to a white person.
electrotonus
Neo Member
Neither are all white people racist nor do all white people have privilege. Would anyone seriously claim that a 10 year old white boy living in poverty that society generally looks down upon as 'trailer trash' or 'white trash' has privilege? Someone that society calls 'trash', human garbage?
This whole white privilege talk is just a petty ploy to distract attention from the real divide in the USA, that of class. The 10 year old boy from above doesn't have privilege, but boy, does the 10 year old boy living in a huge mansion in Beverly Hills.
This whole white privilege talk is just a petty ploy to distract attention from the real divide in the USA, that of class. The 10 year old boy from above doesn't have privilege, but boy, does the 10 year old boy living in a huge mansion in Beverly Hills.
Whom_Gods_Annoy
Banned
That's mostly fair, but when will we know that white privilege is a thing that no longer exists? And do all white people benefit from white privilage?
Also, to say that you are born with something implies it is almost impossible to change it. It is almost impossible you will not be racist. It is far too loaded for me to agree with.
Demoskinos
Member
This. Everyone tends to be more comfortable by default by people who look like them. The question then is do you actively acknowledge this to yourself and continually work on being a better person or just give yourself over to this prejudice out of fear.
Glass Shark
Banned
It's an incredibly complicated issue, but I think the teacher is pretty much right.
There is a difference between holding malicious racist beliefs out of hatred and innate racist ideas due to being misinformed. I think to some degree all people (especially white people) have stereotypical ideas about people of other races that are false but ingrained due to cultural osmosis. People should work to fight those things.
If someone has some of those mild cultural racist ideas, I would not necessarily call that person a "racist," especially if they attempt to resolve them or improve.
There is a difference between holding malicious racist beliefs out of hatred and innate racist ideas due to being misinformed. I think to some degree all people (especially white people) have stereotypical ideas about people of other races that are false but ingrained due to cultural osmosis. People should work to fight those things.
If someone has some of those mild cultural racist ideas, I would not necessarily call that person a "racist," especially if they attempt to resolve them or improve.
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