150Mhz CPU boost on XBO, now in production
- Thread starter Krakn3Dfx
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sorryon overclocking but the same principles apply.
Overclocking components can only be of noticeable benefit if the component is on the critical path for a process, if it is a bottleneck. If disc access or the speed of an Internet connection limit the speed of a process, even a 20% increase in processor speed is unlikely to be noticed. Overclocking a CPU will not benefit a game limited by the speed of the graphics card.
There will be no noticeable difference to the end user in performance of games, movies, ect.
It's like adding a bucket of water to a river.
Overclocking components can only be of noticeable benefit if the component is on the critical path for a process, if it is a bottleneck. If disc access or the speed of an Internet connection limit the speed of a process, even a 20% increase in processor speed is unlikely to be noticed. Overclocking a CPU will not benefit a game limited by the speed of the graphics card.
There will be no noticeable difference to the end user in performance of games, movies, ect.
It's like adding a bucket of water to a river.
http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1596585&postcount=8044
Two full hardware threads for non-racers. Forza would use more. So >33% of the whole CPU just for audio.
Osiris
I permanently banned my 6 year old daughter from using the PS4 for mistakenly sending grief reports as it's too hard to watch or talk to her
Decoding and mixing multiple streams is the majority of what game audio consists of. Something Mark Cerny has said the PS4's dedicated audio unit handles ""a very large number" of.
(Not the entirety though, EQ and effects are another part, and just about all dedicated audio solutions include these functions)
A belief based on...what exactly?
isnt comparable to cpu flops
but yes they will not try to catch up expecially with games where the audio isnt important (knack?) ...but in gt?
when ps4 gt will come out they will take resource from cpu or maybe gpu ( not sure about it)...and the theory come true
regardless if one jag core is needed in ps4 for similar audio processing, as MaLDo pointed out, 6 cores at 1.75 v 5 cores at 1.6 (assuming correct) is 30% more CPU in game for xbone
correct?
I didn't check his math
dr. apocalipsis
Banned
Not at all. One common misconception in hardware is to assume vacuum raw numbers as feasible real world performance.
Even a mid range GPU like the one of PS4 will be handicapped by such a weak CPU core. Or do you think that GPU performance will be the same if backed up by an Intel core CPU?
That's why trying to compare those GPU's in the PC enviroment is worthless.
I have a feeling that we get the release date today.
I like your feelings.
Translation anyone?
Osiris
I permanently banned my 6 year old daughter from using the PS4 for mistakenly sending grief reports as it's too hard to watch or talk to her
dr. apocalipsis post, translation pointless / redundant.
The guy who said 8Gb of RAM in the PS4 was a bad thing for gamers
cyberheater
PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
First thing. It's not a over clock. The Jaguar microarchitecture is designed to operate between 1Ghz and 2Ghz. It's up to the platform holders to target a thermal/power envelope which dictates CPU speed.
I've never heard such rubbish in a tech thread before. These are closed platforms were the developers have fine grain control of processes. A 10% increase in CPU performance will have a noticeable impact to the game developer. It will allow them to squeeze more out of the hardware.
dr. apocalipsis
Banned
dr. apocalipsis post, translation pointless / redundant.
The guy who said 8Gb of RAM in the PS4 was a bad thing for gamers
Heh, the guy that said 8GB wasn't an upgrade geared toward gaming, months before the 3'5Gb OS reservation DRAMA.
shikamaroooo
Member
I thought PS4 did have a dedicated audio chip
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/191007/inside_the_playstation_4_with_mark_.php?page=3
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/191007/inside_the_playstation_4_with_mark_.php?page=3
it apparently only plays mp3s.
Caayn
Member
Ssst, you're speaking the truth that isn't in advantage of Sony. We can't have that around here on GAF.
In all honesty, I laughed at your post till I realized that your post perfectly reflects neogaf ever since the reveal of the X1.
yes this is the minium needed to be under the voice audio hardware
but nothing that worth to talk about..in fact cerny ...dont do it often
Brad Grenz
Member
That's not the simplest explanation. It's a biased assumption.
It's a faulty belief because developers don't have to make their audio exactly like for like on both systems. They could instead budget a certain amount of CPU time and just get as good quality audio as they can within that limit and live with any fidelity deficit. Or they could choose to exploit ray tracing in the audio simulation on the GPU, something the Xbox One can't do on the dedicated audio hardware resulting in either a quality or performance deficit for the Xbox One version.
The flops number is just added colour on the statement that it would offload somewhere above 1 CPU core. That's a big difference from 8 or 16. Don't confuse early test setups used before dedicated silicon was available to eventual equivalent CPU savings.
Maybe there are corner cases, but I think MS's slide trumps any other source to date in terms of authority.
CPU? Sure. GPU? Not unless they have an excess to play with (highly unlikely).
regardless if one jag core is needed in ps4 for similar audio processing, as MaLDo pointed out, 6 cores at 1.75 v 5 cores at 1.6 (assuming correct) is 30% more CPU in game for bone
correct?
I didn't check his math
That's true. But assuming shape spares a core, some of what shape is doing - decoding, at the very least - is handled elsewhere on PS4 also. We don't know what else is handled by PS4's audio chip beyond that.
Opus Angelorum
Member
This comment probably isn't welcome here:
They will both be awesome!
They will both be awesome!
this pretty much
At 96 kbps only, don't forget.
actually they bumped that up to 128, still mono though.
dragonelite
Member
regardless if one jag core is needed in ps4 for similar audio processing, as MaLDo pointed out, 6 cores at 1.75 v 5 cores at 1.6 (assuming correct) is 30% more CPU in game for xbone
correct?
I didn't check his math
31% actually if im not mistaken
(6 * 1.75) / (5 * 1.6) * 100% = 131.25%
Impeccable
Member
I never realized how many hardcore engineers we had on NeoGAF.
Osiris
I permanently banned my 6 year old daughter from using the PS4 for mistakenly sending grief reports as it's too hard to watch or talk to her
dr. apocalipsis
Banned
Audio playback have little to do with real time audio processing, a beast in their own. Anyway, I don't have any concern either with the capability of PS4 in that regard.
Vacuum numbers of a given chip will be limited by the system in wich it is included.
Emotion Engine, IE, is capable of some crazy polygon numbers. But inside PS2 it is unable to do 1/4 of it's raw power. There are a lot of cases of gimped console architectures in the past, not saying it's the case on any of the next gen machines.
Petalpusher
Banned
Rarely cpu bound at 30/60fps, at 30 i would say never nowadays.
Modern new paradigm is a simple fact. 3D performance is almost exclusively GPU performance. That's why theses consoles are so gpu centric.
Even a game like BF3 is not bound by cpus
Kinda funny how a multi threading capable cpu like the i3 is performing "better" than bigger ones.
The bottleneck in Xbox One is the weak GPU.
This will have little to no impact when the Xbox One will be GPU limited the majority of the time anyway.
The fact that Microsoft is scrambling at the 11th hour to scrape every last MHz out of the bottom of the barrel suggests there's more of a performance deficit to the PS4 than many here assume.
This will have little to no impact when the Xbox One will be GPU limited the majority of the time anyway.
The fact that Microsoft is scrambling at the 11th hour to scrape every last MHz out of the bottom of the barrel suggests there's more of a performance deficit to the PS4 than many here assume.
we should open a thread about it!
And at a limit of 44,100Hz!
But you must disable voice chat and controller speaker for this.
For voice chat you mean? From the vg leaks info it is far more than would be necessary for that.
Here's a thing: Microsoft doesn't talk about these things all that much either.
The people I've seen talking about these things a lot seem to be fans with an eye on trying to find compensation for a perceived lack elsewhere.
For example, making mountains out of the '15 processors' stuff. Most of which are completely ordinary/unspectacular things with analogs in PS4.
That seems to have been a running theme with Xbox One tech speculation - making the extraordinary out of the ordinary. It started early, when we had people hyping up 'extra processors' which turned out to be generic sub elements of any standard GCN GPU. And here we are again, trumping up '15 processors'...many of which are exceptionally vanilla things that are typical on any such SoC.
Maybe Sony or Cerny doesn't do this so much because they feel the system is comfortably more powerful, without needing to enumerate over every little piece of silicon on the die.
i think cerny forget to said this
JonathanPower
Member
Well, we also don't know the PS4 CPU speed, and most importantly, how many cores are reserved for the OS. If the PS4 will use less than 1 core for the OS, then it will have more CPU power.
boredandlazy
Member
Are you Richard Leadbetter attempting to use CBOAT speak?
blitzcloud
Banned
Fixed for you.
We know the frequency was 1.594Ghz earlier in the year (from Killzone demos), and we haven't heard of any upclocks since then.
http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?p=1736008#post1736008
the only things that i know about shape is what bkillian (that seem worked on it) ..wrote on another forum
cerny talked for 1 month without stopping everyday about the "good things" of the ps4..and if he didnt or talked less about the ps4 audio capabilities and if the media dont know nothing about something of special (vgleaks etce tc) in it theres a reason
about this 15 special purpose processor ..and move engines (also if move engines in the slides was under the voice "4 commands processor - 2 graphics 2 compute)are part of it..well is something that HELP the system ..is not clear how much this will help the system coz honestly we dont know what this processors are...
cmon xb1 is getting everyday better and i know most of users here ( i dont know for what reason seen that we should be all gamers) dont like it..
no drm
gpu clock bump
cpu clock bump
a little bit still worth to mention of cloud computing
trying to offload things by coprocessors
etc etc
ps4 still ahead? ..yes i think
something this big to put that console as unique choice for a gamer ? ..def no....not anymore i think this is another ps3 x360 gen...and is worth to have both console..coz xb1 exclusives will be awesome as ps4 exclusives
dr. apocalipsis
Banned
Same core with more frecuency usually performs better at usual PC gaming loads that doesn't make use of more threads or are directly unaware of more hardware resources.
I find your lack of faith in CPU force disturbing.
You made me laugh loud.
But, honestly what you wrote is often true!
I just wish that both systems would come out already so Xbox fans can stop with the silly persecution complexes and confirmation biases.
Underpowered compared to...the future.
They are already lacking and even more so in 2-3 years, yet we'll have to stick with those machines till 2017/18.If this generation is anything to go by, the System Warz don't stop with launch.
JonathanPower
Member
That demo was running on alpha kits, which didn't even have the Jaguar CPU.
if vgleaks is right (and at this point we know it is) ..the cpu clock is that
:/ Isn't helping either with the media trying to pump up the "console war" as well.
That applies to both sides, no?
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