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[xsarien]

Really? That keyboard is going to cost so much that it'll make up the gap of 300 dollars required for the PSP to go from 200 dollars to 500? Man, I didn't know those things would be so expensive!

The larger point is that not everyone's going to buy it, and if the thing is marketed as a gaming device, you can rest assured that people looking for a PDA will look elsewhere. Marketing defines everything, as Nintendo can surely attest to this generation.

Do you honestly think Sony won't have a stellar solution? At worst they'll just require a yearly fee much like a cellphone. This yearly fee will cover most of the big problems with this sort of thing and will allow people to connect much more easily via WiFi. Not to mention people all over the world have already connected online via PSP, so it's not near as difficult as you're making it out to seem.

Unless Sony's going to go ahead and install a global (or national) WiFi hotspot network to rival the coverage of current CDMA or GSM networks, there's no way in hell that the VoIP functionality will replace a cell phone. Ever. You want to talk about this thing being the next convergence device? You've gotta take the whole taco. If it needs to be fit into that definition, it needs to cover all the bases, and as cool, and as much potential as VoIP has, we're not even CLOSE to knocking down those plastic trees that house cellular antennas.

Again, price has ALWAYS been the hinderance of convergance technology. However, your observation fails when PS2, a form of convergance technology, has succeeded. Or when Xbox, another form of convergance technology, has succeeded.

How have the convergence aspects of either succeded in any distinguishable way? Yes, they CAN play DVDs, and people do use them to play DVDs, but the sales numbers pale in comparison to standalone units.

But even if you limit this to handheld products, which is perfectly acceptable, 200 dollar convergance hardware is extremely attractive, not to mention Sony is first and foremost marketing this as a gaming device.

i think your definition is way too broad, to be quite honest.

We'll see, of course, but I'll register my disagreement at the highest possible level.

So noted.

 

[kaching]

I wish I could find the article, because it was one of the most profound observations in a long time. That the last convergence device to ever succeed, to become completely ubiquitous, was the clock radio.

What the hell kind of observation is that? Since when did the criteria for success become so much more stringent for convergence devices than for non-convergence - I don't see anyone not calling DVD a success even though it isn't ubiquitous. And what the hell is their definition of ubiquitous anyway? Apparently not the entire 6 billion + of the entire human population, right?

I hope you're just paraphrasing wrong

 

[xsarien]

What the hell kind of observation is that? Since when did the criteria for success become so much more stringent for convergence devices than for non-convergence - I don't see anyone not calling DVD a success even though it isn't ubiquitous. And what the hell is their definition of ubiquitous anyway? Apparently not the entire 6 billion + of the entire human population, right?

I hope you're just paraphrasing wrong

Throttle it back there son, and read the whole conversation. I was referring to whether or not the PSP can succeed as a convergence device, above succeeding as a gaming platform. It can do the latter quite well, Sony's marketing department can probably phone this shit in. But selling it as an all-in-one widget, that can do everything from play Ridge Racer to schedule your meetings...? That's going to take an effort of Herculian proportions, because there's simply too much market crossover.

 

[Amir0x]

The larger point is that not everyone's going to buy it, and if the thing is marketed as a gaming device, you can rest assured that people looking for a PDA will look elsewhere. Marketing defines everything, as Nintendo can surely attest to this generation.

Not everyone HAS to buy it. But if they're buying the PSP, and the PSP contains these things, then theoretically it still has succeeded on a very basic level. Of course people will need to put the things into good use for it to be viable as a communication type device, but you're looking at things a little too black and white.

How have the convergence aspects of either succeded in any distinguishable way? Yes, they CAN play DVDs, and people do use them to play DVDs, but the sales numbers pale in comparison to standalone units.

I think you may have missed the whole part of this generation about how much PS2 helped expand the DVD universe. The PS2 is a successful convergance device, and there's absolutely zero doubt about that.

 

[neptunes]

Stop talking about media convergence! >.<

 

[duckroll]

I seriously do NOT see the PSP getting rid of cellphones or PDAs. But I do think that all portable media centers from unknown or smaller brands (or even Creative) will suffer a SERIOUS blow when the PSP is out in the US. The price point and Sony brand will crush any appeal the flash driven media devices have. The ones with internal HDDs will still have some appeal for people looking for large storage, but these are usually the people who know what they're buying. The masses which is what flash-driven drives and cheaper no-brand models more appealing are the same people that will now simply go "oh fuck, Sony has that PSP that's cheap and everyone has one, I think I'll get one too."

The iPod, PDAs, cellphones, etc are not going anywhere, but those that were profiting off selling cheaper alternatives to highend portable media players are now pretty much dead.

 

[soundwave05]

Of course its going to be marketed as a game device first.

But people aren't going to say "oh it plays videos and music and does daily planner functions too ... well now I don't want it anymore because of my anti-convergance stance".

DVD playback certainly didn't hurt the PS2.

People will buy it primarily for games, it is after all PLAYSTATION Portable not "Sony Portable Media Player" for a reason.

But I think the other functionality will also become very popular once people get a chance to try it out at home. Most of us don't have one of those fancy schmancy portable Media Players, for many people the PSP will be the first product that lets them watch video on the go in a convienant, high quality fashion. You can even watch TV on it via a software upgrade that Sony is planning.

For a mere $200 or less, this thing dramatically changes the level of entertainment you have access to on the road, at school, on the bus, at your in-laws house, etc. etc. etc.

 

[xsarien]

I think you may have missed the whole part of this generation about how much PS2 helped expand the DVD universe. The PS2 is a successful convergance device, and there's absolutely zero doubt about that.

In the beginning, it helped bring the format legitimacy, but as of today, in the world of $40 DVD players sold near checkout lines (Jesus, who would have thought that day would come?), it's certainly not the cheapest solution for someone who wants to watch a few episodes of Family Guy. In 2000, it arguably was. That's not the case with PDAs and cell phones, both of which can be found at pretty reasonable prices, especially the latter when bought with a signed contract.

 

[Pimpwerx]

Did Sony ever release that PS2 firmware patch for progressive scan DVD output? I'm not holding my breath, although it would seem PSP is much better suited for networking at this point. PEACE.

 

[kaching]

Throttle it back there son, and read the whole conversation.

I wasn't commenting on the larger conversation as I largely agree with the more general points you're trying to make. But I found the particular comment I quoted to be more than a little specious and not the least bit helpful to your argument.

 

[Amir0x]

In the beginning, it helped bring the format legitimacy, but as of today, in the world of $40 DVD players sold near checkout lines (Jesus, who would have thought that day would come?), it's certainly not the cheapest solution for someone who wants to watch a few episodes of Family Guy. In 2000, it arguably was. That's not the case with PDAs and cell phones, both of which can be found at pretty reasonable prices, especially the latter when bought with a signed contract.

You're still conveniently ignoring how much of a success the PS2 was as a convergence device (when Matrix DVD was actually one of the top selling things people purchased with PS2), but that's ok.

PS2 was a successful convergance device. Whether or not PSP will continue this trend is unknown, but Sony definitely is capable of doing this.

 

[soundwave05]

In the beginning, it helped bring the format legitimacy, but as of today, in the world of $40 DVD players sold near checkout lines (Jesus, who would have thought that day would come?), it's certainly not the cheapest solution for someone who wants to watch a few episodes of Family Guy. In 2000, it arguably was. That's not the case with PDAs and cell phones, both of which can be found at pretty reasonable prices, especially the latter when bought with a signed contract.

I think you're looking at things it too much of a black & white extreme.

What Sony understands (and Nintendo has never figured out) is that there's an entertainment "culture" at play here. The kid that likes Gran Turismo probably will also think its cool that he can take a music video from his computer put that on his PSP and take it to school to show his friends.

Stuff like that. Its about making that time you have with the consumer (the ten second at Best Buy when they see that PSP display) and knocking their socks off. They may not go into the store thinking "hey I need a high end portable game player with video playback functionality" ... because that's not how consumer culture works.

But what Sony wants is for people to walk out of that store with a PSP because it just hits all the buttons for them that makes them say "oh cool!".

For one consumer, the game functionality might be just enough to get them to buy it, but the extra addition of video playback or music playback or TV playback or whatever puts them over the edge.

For other people it may be the cool casing/design of the PSP and the attractive screen that makes them break down and shell out the $$$.

It's a good strategy IMO. And there's no reason not to include it. If the PSP is going to have a large screen and video playback for game functionality, why not give the consumer more value by then doubling these features for seperate functionality? If it has the processing power to run Gran Turismo, why not have daily planner or MP3 player functions?

 

[duckroll]

Just to chip in again, I'll have to put a rest to this phone thing. The PSP isn't going to replace cellphones now, and it's not going to replace cellphones in 10 years. Just about anywhere in the world you can get a cellphone that's the size of the PSP's screen (mine is a Sony Ericsson T630) for almost nothing as long as you sign with a line. They're getting cheaper by the day.

Sure if Sony wants to go all out and attack the market aggressively, it could have an addon that accepts SIM cards and act as a phone, and providers will sell the PSP at a very discounted price WITH a line. But so what? the PSP is huge compared to any phone and it has no vibration function. It has a beautiful screen but can you imagine using that to talk? I'm not putting that screen ANYWHERE near my face and sidetalking went out of style with the N-Gage. :lol

There are other possibilities, like a mic+headphone setup, but seriously unless you're some hardcore crazy everything-in-one gadget geek, it's just pushing it. I'm going to keep cellphone use for my cellphone and my PSP can be my gaming and media center on the go. What if someone calls you while you're playing the game? Right now I just pause the game remove my left earphone and take the call with my cellphone, if the PSP was my cellphone it would get more complex. Sure it's possible but it's just not a viable mainstream option.

 

[soundwave05]

PSP won't replace the cell phone because the cell phone is also a neccessity -- you don't want to have your car break down and then realize you can't call AAA because you wasted your batteries playing Ridge Racer earlier on in the day.

But there's no reason Sony can't sell as many PSPs as Nintendo has Game Boys or Apple has i-Pods.

 

[xsarien]

You're still conveniently ignoring how much of a success the PS2 was as a convergence device (when Matrix DVD was actually one of the top selling things people purchased with PS2), but that's ok.

I ignored nothing, in fact, I acknowledged it. What I'm saying is that since then, it's been eclipsed by stand-alone players. Keep in mind that my measure of success is probably off by yours. I'm still on the clock radio, which as a concept, is a success yet to be equaled. No one has since mashed two things together and had the same kind of consumer response. The PS2 can play DVDs, but now, in 2004, the majority of those buying it most likely AREN'T buying it for its movie-playing abilities.

PS2 was a successful convergance device. Whether or not PSP will continue this trend is unknown, but Sony definitely is capable of doing this.

The PS2, in its own matrix, is a sucessful convergence device in that Sony sold 80 million of them to people who wanted to play games and watch movies on the side. Whether - and how - it's measured against past convergence devices requires comparisons to sales numbers that I don't even think Google could find.

 

[Fusebox]

Web-browsing on the PSP around the home using my BB connection via wi-fi?

Priceless!!

 

[duckroll]

PSP won't replace the cell phone because the cell phone is also a neccessity -- you don't want to have your car break down and then realize you can't call AAA because you wasted your batteries playing Ridge Racer earlier on in the day.

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

Seriously this is so fucking true because I kick myself even when I forget the charge my phone the day before and have it die on me in the middle of the night from over usage. The thought of not being able to use it because I used it all playing a GAME just kills me inside.

But there's no reason Sony can't sell as many PSPs as Nintendo has Game Boys or Apple has i-Pods.

Completely agreed. Anyone who thinks convergence = bad is just as dumb as anyone who thinks the PSP can replace cellphones.

 

[xsarien]

Completely agreed. Anyone who thinks convergence = bad is just as dumb as anyone who thinks the PSP can replace cellphones.

Convergence isn't bad, it just has to be relevant. The iPod is also a convergence device, but if you tell me that you actually USE the memo pad or games built into it, you'd be the first I'd know. Why? Well, I'd wager that people buy the iPod to listen to music. A device that would make much more sense would be for Apple to build an FM tuner into the thing. Would I use it? Probably not, I got my iPod to escape Clearchannel, but the point is there.

Camera phones are kind of forced, but they work on some level. I can easily seem them morphing into their own, seperate, but cell-enabled line sometime in the near future.

 

[Fusebox]

My phone has a megapixel CCD cam and takes Sony memory sticks for mp3 playback and has an FM radio inbuilt.

It's been a long time since I took my iPod or my Canon Ixus 400 out for a run - convergance devices are so the future imo.

 

[duckroll]

Convergence isn't bad, it just has to be relevant. The iPod is also a convergence device, but if you tell me that you actually USE the memo pad or games built into it, you'd be the first I'd know. Why? Well, I'd wager that people buy the iPod to listen to music. A device that would make much more sense would be for Apple to build an FM tuner into the thing. Would I use it? Probably not, I got my iPod to escape Clearchannel, but the point is there.

Ok let's be clear here. I think most people are referring to the PSP as a convergence device because it:

a) displays jpegs
b) plays mp3s
c) plays mp4 videos
d) plays games

The whole list of "update junk" that started at the top of this thread are not confirmed and well, may very little difference in the PSP factor in the long run. If they really end up appearing great, maybe they'll be useful maybe not, if they don't end up appearing, no love lost. If you think that the PSP playing music, videos, games and displaying photos/scans are NOT relevent, then well you'll be the first I know.

Camera phones are kind of forced, but they work on some level. I can easily seem them morphing into their own, seperate, but cell-enabled line sometime in the near future.

Hey don't diss camera phones, they are our primary source of pics from Japanese exclusives (pre release mag "scans", TGS "screenshots", etc) and they're completely hot in Asia. I don't know about the cellphone market in the US, but here in Asia it's hot hot property, just about EVERY cellphone you can get is a camera phone now.

 

[soundwave05]

Yeah I see camera/phone integration only increasing, not decreasing.

Consumers love that capability, even if its just to show off with.

Ditto for i-Pod, I see it expanding to do more things, Apple already has introduced the i-Pod Photo.

Convergance as long as its convienant for the consumer, "cool or trendy", and price efficent will be successful.

PSP hits all those marks. The PSP would not cost any more or less if it didn't play videos/music, because the games require a strong processor and a large display and Memory Stick functionality anyway.

You're basically getting all that other stuff for free.

 

[xsarien]

Hey don't diss camera phones, they are our primary source of pics from Japanese exclusives (pre release mag "scans", TGS "screenshots", etc) and they're completely hot in Asia. I don't know about the cellphone market in the US, but here in Asia it's hot hot property, just about EVERY cellphone you can get is a camera phone now.

That wasn't a diss. I'm just mitigating it with a bit of reality. The truth of the matter is that some companies DO actively prevent their employees from owning camera phones, for obvious reasons. What's going to likely happen, what makes sense, and what's already started with one Kodak digital camera is a standalone unit that can talk to a cellular network, but is limited to only taking pictures and sending them wherever, whenever.

A sort of all-in-one phone that can do media downloads, media playback, and media syncing, plus the ability to let you do boring stuff like "talking" looks absolutely great on paper. But before we go there, we need the battery industry to get off their collective, pink bunny asses.

The whole list of "update junk" that started at the top of this thread are not confirmed and well, may very little difference in the PSP factor in the long run. If they really end up appearing great, maybe they'll be useful maybe not, if they don't end up appearing, no love lost. If you think that the PSP playing music, videos, games and displaying photos/scans are NOT relevent, then well you'll be the first I know.

If you'll note, this all started with me wondering how the hell the PSP would ever replace a PDA. As a $200 media Shmoo, I'm sure it will be fine, maybe even better than fine. But convincing people that they NEED it is the key, it's going to be primarily advertised as a gaming unit, ergo the she^H^H^H casual gamer market will likely only use it as such.

(I mean, shit, if I had a dime for every person I've met with a camera phone but has no idea how to take pictures, or the desire to learn...)

 

[duckroll]

That wasn't a diss. I'm just mitigating it with a bit of reality. The truth of the matter is that some companies DO actively prevent their employees from owning camera phones, for obvious reasons. What's going to likely happen, what makes sense, and what's already started with one Kodak digital camera is a standalone unit that can talk to a cellular network, but is limited to only taking pictures.

I don't know what you're talking about. Is the US somewhat backward in phone technology or are you talking about something else. Because here in Asia (HK, Taiwan, Singapore, Korea, Japan in general) just about every cellphone available as "new" on the market has a camera. It has become EXTREMELY difficult to enforce any sort of "no camera phones" system at work places, so much so that at big gala movie premieres if they want to try preventing any sort of leaks they have to confiscate ALL phones at the door. You make it sound like camera phones are something to watch for and you don't think they'll do great, but they already exist in a huge way. It beats grabbing a large digital camera around when all you want are casual pictures with friends, family or if you see something funny on the street or anywhere and you want to snap a pic.

If you'll note, this all started with me wondering how the hell the PSP would ever replace a PDA.

Well then in that case I agree, it won't ever REPLACE PDAs. Nor will it REPLACE cellphones. It will however imo replace any of those lower end to mid range portable media players out there. In fact I think it'll kill them outright once the PSP is readily available. I guess we're just arguing on different frequencies.

(I mean, shit, if I had a dime for every person I've met with a camera phone but has no idea how to take pictures, or the desire to learn...)

O_O Maybe in the US, but you won't get many dimes in Asia for that....

 

[xsarien]

I don't know what you're talking about. Is the US somewhat backward in phone technology or are you talking about something else. Because here in Asia (HK, Taiwan, Singapore, Korea, Japan in general) just about every cellphone available as "new" on the market has a camera. It has become EXTREMELY difficult to enforce any sort of "no camera phones" system at work places, so much so that at big gala movie premieres if they want to try preventing any sort of leaks they have to confiscate ALL phones at the door. You make it sound like camera phones are something to watch for and you don't think they'll do great, but they already exist in a huge way. It beats grabbing a large digital camera around when all you want are casual pictures with friends, family or if you see something funny on the street or anywhere and you want to snap a pic.

We're not "backwards" so much as we are a few steps behind the rest of the world. You can still find plenty of phones that don't have a camera attached to them.

To be honest, our cell system is a bit of a mess. The last major TDMA carrier merged with a GSM-based company; AMPS will be kept up until, oh, '07 (I believe). Right now, though, the CDMA carriers have the best coverage. Plus, U.S. providers charge for damned near everything. If I want to e-mail a picture, that's (for me), $.25. Receiving a text message? $.02, sending? $.10.

It's ridiculous, plus the state and federal taxes that can make your bill jump about $5-$10.

But yeah, you can still easily get a phone without a camera here.

 

[soundwave05]

Yeah also a lot of people don't *need* a PDA or a portable video player.

That said, it doesn't mean they wouldn't use one if they had that functionality availible to them.

That's a big difference.

 

[Amir0x]

Gamespot commented on this rumour today.

RUMOR #2: Sony will upgrade the PSP with a slew of new functionalities, including Web browsing and streaming television.

Source: The PSP information Web site PSP411.com.

The official story: Sony Computer Entertainment America reps declined to comment.

What we heard: The PSP 411 story is one of many which surfaced this week regarding a "dummy updater" found on a playstation.org Web site. Besides linking to a video of the updater in action, the site broke down the new features, which include voice text reading, voice chat, PSP Web browser, e-mail, and word processing and spreadsheet software. The site also references a Gaming Horizons article which quotes Sony Computer COO Ken Kutaragi as saying the PSP will be able to stream television shows via Wi-Fi much like Sony's location-free TV, which was on display alongside the PSP at the Consumer Electronics Show last week. It's strange, then, that American Sony reps refused to comment on the PSP updater or even Kutaragi's comments, for which a reliable source can't be found. Still, given the fact that the PSP has the computing power to handle most of the proposed upgrades and TV streaming, Sony would be foolish not to exploit the handheld to its full potential.

Bogus or not bogus?: Not bogus, though not official--yet.

Interesting.

Or not so interesting. *shrug*

 

[jiggle]

Out of the box functions in the US units, maybe?

 

[TTP]

Yeah probably. As it was the case with the PS2 DVD drivers.

 

[Kutaragi Hirai]

whoa...

PSP is a monster..really I mean it, kaz hirai was right when he said: " PSP will elevate portable entertainment out of the handheld gaming ghetto, and Sony is the only company that can do it "


damn, I want a PSP NOW !!

 

[Amir0x]

whoa...

PSP is a monster..really I mean it, kaz hirai was right when he said: " PSP will elevate portable entertainment out of the handheld gaming ghetto, and Sony is the only company that can do it "


damn, I want a PSP NOW !!

Kutaragi Hirai

Kutaragi

Hirai

Kutaragi Hirai

You sure you don't have any... motivation to say that? *skepticism shifty eyes*

 

[Kutaragi Hirai]

LOL... I dunno what are you talking about, but I am the biggest sony fanboy in the world " or that’s what I am thinking ".I bought the PS2 4 times, I have more than 400 titles for PSone & PS2, my HDTV from sony, my Hi-Fi stereo also form sony and my cell phone is sonyericsson K700i, briefly, all the electronic devices I have are from sony, believe it or not ^^

BTW: Columbia Pictures is my favourite movies producer

 

[Amir0x]

LOL... I dunno what are you talking about, but I am the biggest sony fanboy in the world " or that’s what I am thinking ".I bought the PS2 4 times, I have more than 400 titles for PSone & PS2, my HDTV from sony, my Hi-Fi stereo also form sony and my cell phone is sonyericsson K700i, briefly, all the electronic devices I have are from sony, believe it or not ^^

BTW: Columbia Pictures is my favourite movies producer

Holy shit dude. I think someone needs to tie you to a bed and force you to play Nintendo and Microsoft games for a week until you come out of your self-imposed Sony hypnosis

Plenty of great stuff on a Sony system, but jesus christ... spread yourself out, man!

:lol

 

[Kutaragi Hirai]

LOL... I told you before, I am the BIGGEST sony fanboy in the world !!

don’t worry I also have a Gamecube & Xbox, you can’t stand against titles like Metroid Prime, Zelda and Halo.

But still the biggest sony fanboy

 

[Defensor]

Kutaragi Hirai, you related to sonycowboy?

 

[Kutaragi Hirai]

as sony fanboys, I can say YES !!

 

[cvxfreak]

Hopefully future firmware updates will increase the rate at which the PSP renders images in Photo Viewer. It's not slow by any means, but there's a 2-4 second wait while the system re-renders the image (becoming clearer as time moves on) if you zoom.

I hope the firmware update allows for a wallpaper of some sort (with the color of the month mixed in).

 

[BuddyC]

I hope the firmware update allows for a wallpaper of some sort (with the color of the month mixed in).

I guess you can set a picture to be a temporary background, but it doesn't remain after power off, but seeing as I was about to reference your FAQ, you already knew that.