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[Sianos]

Because gun ownership itself is a mental illness, born of paranoia and inadequacies.

I wouldn't go as far as to say that gun ownership is intrinsically "a mental illness". The paranoid, the insecure, and the hateful are absolutely attracted by the notion of gun ownership for harmful reasons. However, I think there are some legitimate reasons for the ownership of old-fashioned guns as well: home defense, hunting of invasive species, skeet shooting. I don't think these reasons outweigh the public's right to life, but I am willing to compromise.

I see no reason to allow concealable weapons or modern assault rifles and weapons similarly able to inflict mass carnage efficiently to be possessed by civilians, but I also don't think any attempt to ban them will be successful.

A heavily restricted ownership process consisting of psychological and medical testing, a comprehensive background check, and a mandatory national database of gun owners cross referenced with up-to-date medical and psychological records is necessary. I also think that a ban on the possession of unregistered weapons (so they can be confiscated) and a proliferation of smart gun technology should be pushed too.

 

[FunkyPajamas]

CC class should be two months long at the least followed with a written examination and hands on examination and target portion. Two grand to enroll nonrefundable if you fail, six months to a year waiting period to re enroll and licenses must be renewed every two years finally no more open carry. .

That sounds one step removed from a FEMA camp. /s

 

[MrHoot]

 

[jerry1594]

Thoughts and prayers with the victim. We certainly have a huge mental health issue on our hands. That's it.

Give me a fucking break

 

[commedieu]

Generic "gun violence" equates with CCW holders murderig children everywhere. Ok.

Can you be honest for a moment?

You asked about data specifically referring to 1000's killed. You didn't specify murdering children everywhere. Gun data/violence collection data is lobbied against. Its pretty well known, and documented.

What you ask for is a bit difficult to obtain besides from independent sources that will probably be waived off because they aren't official sources. The ladder is just me making an assumption.

Right to carry is also linked to spikes in violence.
http://news.stanford.edu/news/2014/november/donohue-guns-study-111414.html

Enjoy this happening more and more every day in America.

 

[Doctor West]

But these people need to shoot at targets and murder animals and defend themselves against a science fiction future government!!! So we can't get rid of guns and we can't even talk about gun control because fuck you and fuck your dead loved ones because their fucking hobby is more important than all of that.

 

[FunkyPajamas]

Except that someone did.

You're the only that have posted that in the thread. You are apparently inferring that from somebody's post but I honestly don't know which one.

Just missing a car analogy and then it's ready for mass printing.

 

[Zeke]

That sounds one step removed from a FEMA camp. /s

I hate the loud mouth jack ass gun owners and the fucking nra

 

[EdibleExplosives]

Thoughts and prayers with the victim. We certainly have a huge mental health issue on our hands. That's it.

Now if only there was a way to prevent mentally ill people from getting their hands on guns...hmm, yeah I don't think that's possible.
Oh well, keep on keeping on America!

 

[Sianos]

Yeah, I know what you meant man :/ paranoia is a hard one, because it's a bit like anxiety, in that people who suffer from it can be fine until something gives them a mental attack.

I'm assuming that since the police could give a fairly specific description of the man's frame of mind his symptoms must have been either readily apparent or known by readily accessible people. I can't extrapolate a cause from just the symptoms, but knowing the symptoms should be enough for anyone to see this man shouldn't have a gun.

This is why psychological testing on purchase and frequent renewal of lisence is absolutely necessary - many psychological risk factors are not so apparent.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Except that someone did.

Nope, still can't find it.

I do notice a tendency of pro-gun posters to misrepresent comments along absolutist lines to better shield their point of views and artificially construct an us versus them narrative.

Either intentional, or paranoid. You tell me?

 

[keffri]

https://youtu.be/0rR9IaXH1M0

Never seen this before. Good stuff.

 

[FunkyPajamas]

I hate the loud mouth jack ass gun owners

Sorry, I was being sarcastic (hence the /s). It's probably too much to ask but that would definitely be a step in the right direction.

It's pretty fucking sad that no candidate running for office would DARE talk about gun control while campaigning. It's pretty damning to be honest.

 

[Easy_D]

What's even the fucking point anymore... Schoolchildren are killed en masse and even that can't motivate people to fucking do something.

Welcome to the new status quo, folks.

I dunno, I feel the anger hasn't reached its apex yet, people are getting more angry for for every tragic event that goes down, and that's no time to just pack it up and give up.

 

[Codeblue]

We really need to think about protecting our status quo in difficult times such as these.

 

[Jigorath]

Children are being shot dead at soccer games.

What a country.

 

[Shao Kahn on the Lawn]

You're the only that have posted that in the thread. You are apparently inferring that from somebody's post but I honestly don't know which one.

The first sentence written by the OP implies commonality and kinship between CCW holders and the criminal in this case. The only way to miss it is to try.

Take the San Bernardino massacre as the topic of the OP and frame that sentence with Muslims instead of "CCW holders": what do you think most people would interpret that to mean?

 

[FunkyPajamas]

I dunno, I feel the anger hasn't reached its apex yet, people are getting more angry for for every tragic event that goes down, and that's no time to just pack it up and give up.

I don't know that that's the case. I mean, sure, the president goes on TV, some people talk about this in the news... but... that's it.

 

[commedieu]

The first sentence written by the OP implies commonality and kinship between CCW holders and the criminal in this case. The only way to miss it is to try.

Take the San Bernardino massacre as the topic of the OP and frame that sentence with Muslims instead of "CCW holders": what do you think most people would interpret that to mean?

You got all that..

CCW holders are responsible and citizens and gun owners... until they're not.

From that?

 

[nitekrawlwer]

"The man had recently been experiencing paranoia, thought someone was out to get him and believed someone was trying to control him through mind control, Taylor police Chief Mary Sclabassi told MLive."

Kilgrave at it again. Someone call Alias Investigations.

Sorry I know I'm horrible for joking about this but it's a better coping mechanism than crying over all the lives lost because America keeps choosing to do nothing about the gun problem in this nation.

 

[UFO]

Confiscate the fucking guns already! What the fuck is this madness? How can anyone excuse this fucking bullshit?

THIS IS WHY YOU CAN'T HAVE GUNS.

THIS IS WHY YOU CAN'T HAVE GUNS.

THIS IS WHY YOU CAN'T HAVE GUNS.

This COMPOUNDS PROBLEMS FFS, DO people NOT understand how this works?!

YOU CAN'T HAVE GUNS WHEN ANY FUCK COULD BREAK DOWN AND PULL OFF SOME BULLSHIT LIKE THIS OR A MASSACRE.

The US Government, gun shops and gun manufacturers should get sued into oblivion for every fucking day that goes by and nothing is done. We are all getting exposed to fucking getting EASILY killed by having these weapons available.


For reference.



ANYONE with the right to bear a fucking weapon could break and then everyone else is SOL.

AWESOME.

People like you are the reason change happens so slowly in this country. You're just as ridiculous as the people staunchly opposed to gun control. Nothing ever happens when both sides refuse to meet in the middle. But whatever, keep overreacting, if you feel like it helps.

 

[Slayer-33]

Children are being shot dead at soccer games.

What a country.

People don't get it, no one seems to get it.

A fucking ban on firearms is what will solve this bullshit.

This shit isn't going to stop with more guns, this shit is not going to stop with more regulation, this shit will not stop with other measures.

People like you are the reason change happens so slowly in this country. You're just as ridiculous as the people staunchly opposed to gun control. Nothing ever happens when both sides refuse to meet in the middle. But whatever, keep overreacting, if you feel like it helps.

Am I wrong? Are you fucking serious? You are just another one that doesn't understand the extent of the problem.

 

[Sianos]

In a country where PPACA itself was lambasted as "socialist", the likelihood of socialized medicine is almost nil. This country has done everything it can to dismantle state-run mental healthcare facilities over the past 5 decades.

Aye, the people who dismantled our mental healthcare programs and are attempting to dismantle our halfway complete stopgap measure healthcare reform are now trying to say the problem is mental health. I find that absolutely believable and totally not the most transparent deflection I've ever seen.

To say nothing of their slandering of the mentally ill, demonization of therapy, and ruination of therapy by tying it to insurance companies who push clients through the most banal cbt mockeries on a time frame with no regard for their health.

It's absolutely infuriating.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

Show me where CCW holders have killed thousands.

why are you so worried? your guns will be there tomorrow.
if you want to own a gun in this country you need to be mentally evaluated every month. And take a monthly course on guns (safety/proper shooting, etc)and inform the police how many bullets you have and what kind of gun .

 

[stump sock]

People like you are the reason change happens so slowly in this country. You're just as ridiculous as the people staunchly opposed to gun control. Nothing ever happens when both sides refuse to meet in the middle. But whatever, keep overreacting, if you feel like it helps.

at a certain point, being a "responsible gun owner" means understanding that it's part of your responsibility to make sure that things like this don't happen. even if that means sacrifices on your part.

 

[Yagharek]

It really isn't appropriate to attribute the actions of an individual to an entire group, regardless of your political beliefs. This is an unfathomable and unforgivable crime but one guy is not representative of an entire group no matter how convenient it is to pretend otherwise.

If you are against gun control then you are partly responsible for the status quo where 7yo kids are shot in the head instead of seeing sensible gun restrictions implemented.

 

[commedieu]

People like you are the reason change happens so slowly in this country. You're just as ridiculous as the people staunchly opposed to gun control. Nothing ever happens when both sides refuse to meet in the middle. But whatever, keep overreacting, if you feel like it helps.

But, the anti-gun freaks have no merit, no pull, no lobby, no industry supporting their views. The entire world is 'overreacting' to the violence in america. If that means being amazingly perplexed at how asinine it is that there is a debate going on in a thread about someones kid getting headshotted at a soccer game by an insane person. There is no both sides here. Theres the gigantic gun lobby, and people bitching about being helpless. The gun lobby is going to continue record breaking sales, that hasn't stopped. That is the main problem, there are too many guns in the country. The problem isn't how people frame their anti-gun arguments. The problem is that gun manufacturers are flooding the country with lethal weapons, and sidling up to politicians to prevent any meddling.

why are you so worried? your guns will be there tomorrow.
if you want to own a gun in this country you need to be mentally evaluated every month. And take a monthly course on guns (safety/proper shooting, etc)and inform the police how many bullets you have and what kind of gun .

...hmm.. what do you do when the worlds most funded, most trained, most advanced, military, Tries to take them though? Did you ever think of that??? I mean, hasn't your country just grown into chaos as its clearly a slippery slope to have regulations like that?

How are you typing now, surely your draconian country must have some sort of curfew?

 

[BolognaSoup]

why are you so worried? your guns will be there tomorrow.
if you want to own a gun in this country you need to be mentally evaluated every month. And take a monthly course on guns (safety/proper shooting, etc)and inform the police how many bullets you have and what kind of gun .

You may have missed my post where I said I agree with this stuff.

 

[DECK'ARD]

People like you are the reason change happens so slowly in this country. You're just as ridiculous as the people staunchly opposed to gun control. Nothing ever happens when both sides refuse to meet in the middle. But whatever, keep overreacting, if you feel like it helps.

Utter bollocks.

There is no middle to meet in, the NRA keeps it off-limits.

So all you have is a dam waiting to burst, and it will at some point. One side is on the wrong side of history right now, and they know it.

 

[Ryaaan14]

God fucking dammit. Every fucking day!

Yeah tragedies happen every day. Always have always will.

 

[stump sock]

Yeah tragedies happen every day. Always have always will.

great contribution, thanks for chipping in

 

[Crosseyes]

Indeed it is going to take a lot of work to curb America's gun problem. The first steps should be as peaceful as possible with buyback programs and other positive incentives for the populace to disarm themselves, but at some point you're going to need to bring in those who don't give it up.

I'd go out and volunteer for the first candidate who openly would endorse the use of means both peaceful and forceful to start reigning in gun owners in this country. There are a lot of really crazy holdouts that won't give an inch without blood being spilled first.

 

[commedieu]

Utter bollocks.

There is no middle to meet in, the NRA keeps it off-limits.

So all you have is a dam waiting to burst, and it will at some point. One side is on the wrong side of history right now, and they know it.

+1

There isn't a debate. The anti-gun people aren't even allowed in the parking lot of the auditorium. If only anti-gun people would change their approach, the Gun Lobby would stop making infinite profits. If only.

 

[Culex]

As former military, I really think we should ban guns in the US. There has been so much bloodshed in the past few years, and it's only getting worse. A few of my army friends have been arrested on domestic violence charges with weapons....it's not a pretty picture.

Keep the weapons with police / military.

 

[commedieu]

Indeed it is going to take a lot of work to curb America's gun problem. The first steps should be as peaceful as possible with buyback programs and other positive incentives for the populace to disarm themselves, but at some point you're going to need to bring in those who don't give it up.

I'd go out and volunteer for the first candidate who openly would endorse the use of means both peaceful and forceful to start reigning in gun owners in this country. There are a lot of really crazy holdouts that won't give an inch without blood being spilled first.

Re buy backs:

http://www.npr.org/2013/01/09/168926749/nra-vows-to-stop-tuscon-from-destroying-guns

NRA Vows To Stop Tucson From Destroying Guns

The Tucson Police Department sent 205 weapons to be destroyed Tuesday afternoon. A spokesman for the NRA says he will work with the Arizona legislature to rewrite the law to prevent police from destroying firearms from gun buybacks in the future.

This game is fun.

 

[Ryaaan14]

great contribution, thanks for chipping in

Sorry.

"Fuck everything"

Better or?

 

[smokeandmirrors]

People like you are the reason change happens so slowly in this country. You're just as ridiculous as the people staunchly opposed to gun control. Nothing ever happens when both sides refuse to meet in the middle. But whatever, keep overreacting, if you feel like it helps.

nope people like you are the reason things won't change because you feel there is somehow a fucking middle ground in this case when there's not in order to feel above everyone else.

 

[RPGCrazied]

Repeal the 2nd. Confiscate guns.

Yeah, its time. Outlaw guns I say. But with the NRA still around, and corrupt politicians, its not going to change.

 

[Shao Kahn on the Lawn]

You got all that..


From that?

There really isn't any ambiguity to it whatsoever and I demonstrated that quite succinctly with a reference to current events and the substitution of a noun to the sentence in question.

If you are against gun control then you are partly responsible for the status quo where 7yo kids are shot in the head instead of seeing sensible gun restrictions implemented.

I agree, which is why I am very much in favor of broad reforms to what is seemingly becoming an epidemic of gun violence in this country. None of that makes me any more receptive to thinly-veiled insults implying commonality between myself and the aggressor in the OP.

 

[FunkyPajamas]

The first sentence written by the OP implies commonality and kinship between CCW holders and the criminal in this case. The only way to miss it is to try.

Take the San Bernardino massacre as the topic of the OP and frame that sentence with Muslims instead of "CCW holders": what do you think most people would interpret that to mean?

"CCW holders are responsible and citizens and gun owners... until they're not."
Not it doesn't.
"People that carry guns legally are not planning to do anything illegal until they do."
"People that own guns are not planning to kill anybody with them until it happens."
"People that keep guns do not expect their children to kill each other with their guns but it may occur."

Then again... there is kinship (a sharing of characteristics or origins) among all CCW owners, isn't there? Do you not share the characteristic that you applied for a CCW permit and own one (or more) gun(s)? This guy was a CCW holder.

Let me ask you this though: are you a CCW holder? Would you be opposed to yearly checks to determine your eligibility to keep your permit? If you are, then where (in that direction) would you compromise? Checks every two years? Five? Checks only for more than one gun? Or would you not compromise at all?

Take the San Bernardino massacre as the topic of the OP and frame that sentence with Muslims instead of "CCW holders": what do you think most people would interpret that to mean?

It's not the same, at all. If you were to say "all Scimitar carrying Muslims need to go through yearly checks..." I wouldn't be against that. Owning a gun has you one step removed from using that gun (responsibly or otherwise). Being part of a religion does not have you one step away from getting explosives and strapping them to your chest.

 

[PeterLegend]

After getting shot, finding out your baby was killed. That's heartbreak right there....

 

[Skinpop]

I wouldn't go as far as to say that gun ownership is intrinsically "a mental illness". The paranoid, the insecure, and the hateful are absolutely attracted by the notion of gun ownership for harmful reasons. However, I think there are some legitimate reasons for the ownership of old-fashioned guns as well: home defense, hunting of invasive species, skeet shooting. I don't think these reasons outweigh the public's right to life, but I am willing to compromise.

this is crazy to me. in what other countries is home defense a legitimate reason for owning a gun? You can buy a hunting rifle here in sweden, and probably in most other european countries but you'll never get a license to buy a gun for home defense.

it's such an absurd and idiotic idea, far away from anything resembling reasonable unless you are living in a lawless 3rd world country.

 

[newtypepilot]

pretty sure you'll hear morons say: "if only the girl had a gun of her own, she would've been able to defend herself and exercise her rights. "

RIP

american gun laws are completely outdated and it's time for change.

 

[Freyjadour]

What's even the fucking point anymore... Schoolchildren are killed en masse and even that can't motivate people to fucking do something.

Welcome to the new status quo, folks.

Because your kid is dead, not theirs.

 

[Zeke]

Sorry, I was being sarcastic (hence the /s). It's probably too much to ask but that would definitely be a step in the right direction.

It's pretty fucking sad that no candidate running for office would DARE talk about gun control while campaigning. It's pretty damning to be honest.

I got what you were saying just agreeing with you since its those two groups that prevent anything from happening. There are plenty of gun owners that are willing to make concessions in regards to gun control but the loud mouths always take center stage.

 

[Slayer-33]

After getting shot, finding out your baby was killed. That's heartbreak right there....

This is why I don't understand the pro-gun or half assed solution minded people, they don't fucking GET what you have to do to solve this shit.

NOTHING short of a BAN on guns will solve any of the bullshit happening around the country.

Can we get killed by other means? Bats, knives, etc? YEAH

But a gun facilitates this insane shit by an unbelievable degree. In what mind does an innocent life lost not cause outrage? It boggles my mind why other people don't think about this problem the way I do, I'm not afraid to speak up against this shit. People need to wake the fuck up and demand a ban of fire arms. Grow the fuck up. You know what has to be done.

Go get a subscription to a gun range and call it a day.

This is just unbelievable.

Maybe their mindset will change when something like this happens to them.

 

[Chie Satonaka]

https://youtu.be/0rR9IaXH1M0

This is gold.

 

[Subpar Scrub]

It would, but the Supreme Court recently ruled that the 2nd Amendment was intended to mean that regular citizens could own private arms. And if you read what the Framers (aka the "Founding Fathers" but I hate that term) wrote about it, you'll see that that is the correct interpretation; most of them actually did envision individual, armed citizens.

What the real gun issue is is that after almost 250 years the United States is starting to become a real, distinct culture, and these old rules aren't needed any longer. No one really knows what to do, but honestly having such an old constitution as the basis of our laws is probably kind of stupid anyway.

Oh okay. Yeah I agree that basing the law on such old texts is silly. The argument that the founding fathers could never envision the weapons today is always there.

 

[commedieu]

There really isn't any ambiguity to it whatsoever and I demonstrated that quite succinctly with a reference to current events and the substitution of a noun to the sentence in question.



I agree, which is why I am very much in favor of broad reforms to what is seemingly becoming an epidemic of gun violence in this country. None of that makes me any more receptive to thinly-veiled insults implying commonality between myself and the aggressor in the OP.

I don't think its ambiguous. I think you're reading far too deeply into a sentence that just refers to CCW being a problem as it exists in America with little to no laws allowed to be enforced. That was my take on it, as CCW in america is a problem because there are little to no laws allowed to be enforced for guns here.

Gun laws in america are akin to the honor system at this point. Responsible gun ownership is promoted, but it needs to be a federal requirement. Training/Checks/Everything other nations do that don't have these issues every minute.

 

[Limited Edition]

Because gun ownership itself is a mental illness, born of paranoia and inadequacies.

And comments like this are why I rarely bother to argue with anti-gun itypes on Gaf.