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[jaypah]

Eye for an eye makes the world go blind. Gamers have set a precedent for console distributors to charge for simple P2P gaming. Look at the year to year revenues. It's not Microsoft's fault that Sony is looking at that revenue in envy. It's the gamers that is feeding into that revenue.

And yet the ultimate decision was on Sony. They made that call. They didn't have to, just like they don't have to lock Netflix behind a paywall. I don't personally mind the paywall because PS+ was worth the money anyway but I'm not going to make excuses for them. They saw that money and said "I too wish to make it rain".

 

[Derrick01]

Everything about this system makes me feel so grimy and gross when I read about it. It almost makes me glad MS keeps such a poor stable of exclusives so I don't have to worry about missing out on stuff when I avoid them like the plague.

 

[TheD]

The funniest thing is that this very forum uses cookies to serve ads based on the content of the posts. Most of us spend more time on GAF than we will ever spend in front of a Kinect camera.

Cookies are not a damn camera in your home!

 

[RoboPlato]

Gamification of ads means more games on XBO tailored personally to your tastes! PS4 can't touch innovation like that! Thank you, Microsoft!

 

[SPDIF]

Hey some of those ads will probably play like games.
Maybe you are a huge NFL fan? Football is a game. They got fantasy football covered with NFL.com. Not even being sarcastic here, football is a huge draw for a lot American consumers. They have some great ideas, too bad they were more than ready to shit all over you and your rights.

I'm not an American so as you can probably guess, no, I'm not a huge NFL fan. I'll quite happily stick with the launch games thank you very much.

 

[wildfire]

why do they keep letting shit like this be discussed so readily in the public? Maybe they don't have control over that or something, I dunno. But seriously, what fucking consumer wants to hear that a system they're thinking about buying is made for advertisers to jizz over? I mean, in what universe is that an attractive thing to hear about a potential purchase?

It's like "hey guys there's this new awesome TV channel with 2x the amount of commercials! Tune in soon!"

I seriously don't understand what is wrong with Microsoft. The Xbox Division seems fundamentally broken in this generation or some shit.

This article is exactly meant to raise awareness for potential customers,

Those customers are advertisers, surveyors and businesses.

 

[passthatish]

Who here has said that only MS invades us with ads, or that they're the only ones that want to? Quit with the straw men.

MS happens to have an incredibly advanced tool for advertising in the Kinect right now. Thats what this article and thread is about.

Are we reading the same thread? The reactions here sure make it seem that way.

MS just so happens to have a very successful console on its hands that allowed them to create a new way of advertising, since we have yet to see how this all plays out, lets slow down on the speculation of its straight up bad. The truth is, none of us know what's coming. It's the future of advertising. And the direction that its heading in. We have had to know this was coming, someone was gonna come along and use ads this way. I just don't see why it has so many people disgusted. Would it be better if they didn't charge you? Will forgive it as long as we aren't paying?

I see it as an natural evolution of ads, same way Youtube did it, same way FB did it. Companies want to male money, and as much as possible, this could possible generate a health amount of money for MS. Best believe, and sure its getting old, but Sony does has some sort of plans for this too, and I say good. Get that ad revenue.
But lets not act like we aren't getting invaded each and everyday by ads from all mediums.

 

[fastford58]

It's not? Because it seemed to me that he was saying I should be ashamed of myself for buying an Xbox One (therefore supporting the console). What was his point?

You're not supporting a console. You are supporting a shitty idea/policy that is not confined to one company. Step out of the xbox persecution bubble and realize the ramifications of allowing this to go on on a wider scale.

It is a disgusting technology, and absolutely intrusive.

 

[Aussie Legend]

That is really really lame. Very happy with my PS4 at launch (will pick up an Xbox One later on in the life cycle but this kind of crap was the kind of stuff that had me drifting away from MS in the first place)

 

[jim-jam bongs]

The funniest thing is that this very forum uses cookies to serve ads based on the content of the posts. Most of us spend more time on GAF than we will ever spend in front of a Kinect camera.

How much did you pay for your GAF membership?

 

[Cthulhu_Steev]

The funniest thing is that this very forum uses cookies to serve ads based on the content of the posts. Most of us spend more time on GAF than we will ever spend in front of a Kinect camera.

Do you pay $500 to use this forum?

 

[JABEE]

The funniest thing is that this very forum uses cookies to serve ads based on the content of the posts. Most of us spend more time on GAF than we will ever spend in front of a Kinect camera.

Consumers actually have different expectations of tracking from websites compared to being tracked while in a retail setting or tracked within their home.

Once the tracking becomes intrusive and begins to draw information from cameras watching you in real life, there is a greater sense of apprehension.

Advertisers and businesses in general want to be as intrusive as the public is willing to bear. They will push things to the limit.

 

[Finalizer]

The amount of deliberate missing-the-point in this thread is comical. Anything to defend poor 'ole MS, intrusive privacy infringement be damned.

 

[NullPointer]

The funniest thing is that this very forum uses cookies to serve ads based on the content of the posts. Most of us spend more time on GAF than we will ever spend in front of a Kinect camera.

GAF isn't $500, threads aren't $60 a pop, and posting doesn't require a paid subscription. Its the very model of proper advertising use.

Are we reading the same thread?

Yep. We are. The thing is, we know many of the capabilities of the Kinect, and we know of some of the potential advertising scenarios it can and will be used for, and we have an MS track record we can look to for guidance on how they might roll things out in the future.

And some of us don't like the idea of paying to be advertising test subjects. Offering complete opt-outs, limiting ads to specific storefronts and providing rewards for opting-in are all avenues that could help balance this stuff out.

 

[ironcreed]

The funniest thing is that this very forum uses cookies to serve ads based on the content of the posts. Most of us spend more time on GAF than we will ever spend in front of a Kinect camera.

That's true, but that does not make me OK with a camera infiltrating my living room and data mining me through what used to just be a gaming console. Sure, I can just unplug it, but I should have the option of just not buying the damn thing to begin with. After all, it is not mandatory anymore, so why am I still being forced to buy one if I ever want an Xbox One?

 

[JABEE]

This article is exactly meant to raise awareness for potential customers,

Those customers are advertisers, surveyors and businesses.

Yeah. This is a business publication. They write things in a way to excite people about growth in this technology.

 

[lionkitten]

I think it's funny how the only people who are okay with this are the posters that are firmly in the Xbox One camp. No need to belittle others' privacy concerns because if how your console of choice was designed.

I've always hated ads on my 360, and this just makes them more insidious. I will most certainly be leaving the Kinect unplugged when I'm not using it. Because I definitely don't need yet another device collecting my information.

Who in this thread said "It's ok"? Many of us said it's the price of having an online world. And almost all of us are saying we're willing to flip the "off" button on the Kinect in order to experience all the games of this gen. I know at least 4 of us above "in the Xbox camp" are really all-console (or at least multi-console) users.

Calling anybody with a different viewpoint an Xbot is as mindless as Sony Too! or dismissing all controller-based games as subpar non-PC Master Race gaming.

There really are multiple opinions available!

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

I know every company makes products to make money but Microsoft have entirely created this product for Microsoft.

Just seems the gamer is barely even a consideration.

We know Sony are no bunnies but they seem to have realised making a product with the gamer in mind is the way to make money.

I'm with all the others who want to see the ps4 smash it now.

I really don't understand it when people say this. So stuff like Killer Instinct and Project spark don't exist? forza 5 being demo'd at their Microsoft Stores and being driven around to various places around the US/Canada/Europe for people to try out somehow translates to gamers not being a consideration?

Those things wouldn't be happening if it wasn't a product with gamers in mind.

 

[Into]

The funniest thing is that this very forum uses cookies to serve ads based on the content of the posts. Most of us spend more time on GAF than we will ever spend in front of a Kinect camera.

Can you tell the difference between cookies and a camera in your living room?

Can you tell the difference between a free forum and a 500 dollar console, where 20% of its price is due to the camera being put in the box just to do this?


The funny thing is that either you really cant tell a difference here, which makes me question what the difficult part here is, or you are wilfully doing this on purpose, in a attempt to murk the waters and do the entire "well everyone is doing it, just chill everyone, its gonna be fineeee!"

 

[Slashlen]

I'll stick with the PS4 where I can game in my underwear in peace without getting a bunch of ads about pants.

 

[Shengar]

Are we reading the same thread? The reactions here sure make it seem that way.

MS just so happens to have a very successful console on its hands that allowed them to create a new way of advertising, since we have yet to see how this all plays out, lets slow down on the speculation of its straight up bad. The truth is, none of us know what's coming. It's the future of advertising. And the direction that its heading in. We have had to know this was coming, someone was gonna come along and use ads this way. I just don't see why it has so many people disgusted. Would it be better if they didn't charge you? Will forgive it as long as we aren't paying?

I see it as an natural evolution of ads, same way Youtube did it, same way FB did it. Companies want to male money, and as much as possible, this could possible generate a health amount of money for MS. Best believe, and sure its getting old, but Sony does has some sort of plans for this too, and I say good. Get that ad revenue.
But lets not act like we aren't getting invaded each and everyday by ads from all mediums.

Do you know even know why some sites offer exclusive premium membership that will give you free-ads access? Quit the straw manning. We don't complain how we get bombarded by ads in our live and how ads in video gaming console make it worse. We complained how there still ads in a premium prodcut, priced at $500 and still have advertising. Not too mention that the said product have a pair of eyes that would take your actual face, reaction, and emotion and save it in a database.

 

[NullPointer]

Those things wouldn't be happening if it wasn't a product with gamers in mind.

The suggestion is that the games are the Trojan horse, and Kinect, advertising and the Gold subscription fees are the greek soldiers.

You do need the horse to pull it off.

 

[lionkitten]

GAF isn't $500, threads aren't $60 a pop, and posting doesn't require a paid subscription. Its the very model of proper advertising use.

But see, that's the MS hate infiltrating the argument.

The initial argument has NOTHING to do with how much you are paying. It's about privacy and intrusion.

We buy cable packages and TVs and PCs and phones and Hulu subscriptions and magazines and operating systems and all kinds of things that have these "intrusions" built in.

Yes, we could run our PCs with no cookies and use Linux and whatever, but we don't (largely).

Our phones and PCs and TVs are all more than $500 and we also willingly expose ourselves to marketing and data-mining through these objects. It's no different, other than people are squeamish about the cameras. Money spent for access to the platform has zero to do with it.

And just the idea that we're not paying for google and the like to data-mine is so funny, because we're paying for it in SOOOO many ways. Just because you don't directly use your credit card to buy it doesn't mean you aren't paying for it.

 

[SPDIF]

You're not supporting a console. You are supporting a shitty idea/policy that is not confined to one company. Step out of the xbox persecution bubble and realize the ramifications of allowing this to go on on a wider scale.

It is a disgusting technology, and absolutely intrusive.

Thanks for the advice but I can assure you that I am not in one. Regardless, I'd love to know what you're basing that on.

 

[walltowall]

I know every company makes products to make money but Microsoft have entirely created this product for Microsoft.

Just seems the gamer is barely even a consideration.

We know Sony are no bunnies but they seem to have realised making a product with the gamer in mind is the way to make money.

I'm with all the others who want to see the ps4 smash it now.

So when each system is sold at a loss, and the revenue from dev kits and licensing is cut due to competition where is the making money going to come from? The 70/30 split on digital games and in game purchases for free to play? Sony, nor MS can rely on gamers alone, that would be ignoring a huge part of their user base. They will find ways to get to profitable quickly,ads just represent one avenue.

 

[IvorB]

Even a broken clock is right twice a day

Ha ha! Well said.

 

[snoopers]

I don't understand why Microsoft would let this kind of messaging go out before launch. It's really bad. I'm sure Sony is doing the same kind of stuff with PS4, but you don't fucking hear about it. It comes across as corporate-driven, anti-consumer bullshit. Not the vibes they need right now...

 

[NullPointer]

The initial argument has NOTHING to do with how much you are paying. It's about privacy and intrusion.

Different people, different arguments. Don't make the mistake of thinking that all of GAF, or even the detractors in this thread alone are of one mind on this.

We each have different tolerance levels for advertising. Different points where we find something to be intrusive, or reason enough to skip out on a purchase. Same goes for privacy concerns.

 

[passthatish]

Who even said that MS is the only one doing it? Did you miss the entire NSA scandal? It was pretty much all over TV for months. In that post you quoted as "gold" you missed the part where Microsoft wants to put a camera in your living room, going a step beyond even the worst of the worst companies attempting this.

Someone was bond to do it. That's how it works, whether it be apple, Google, i don't care who, but it was bond to happen. I use my iPad, surface, laptop, cell, about 90% of the day, more than I am playing on Xbox, hell I am thinking of buying a moto x, if the nexus 5 isn't all that, and that thing is always listening! Do I care, Nope. Not one bit.

 

[Kleegamefan]

New article on Xbox one and marketing:




source

Basically falls in line with what was said earlier this year about Xbox One's Dashboard being created “with advertising In mind”

Seriously, Fuck You Microsoft....

 

[ironcreed]

I don't understand why Microsoft would let this kind of messaging go out before launch. It's really bad. I'm sure Sony is doing the same kind of stuff with PS4, but you don't fucking hear about it. It comes across as corporate-driven, anti-consumer bullshit. Not the vibes they need right now...

It really should not be that surprising. Their messaging on the whole since the reveal of the Xbox One has been nothing but a giant clown shoes clusterfuck that has had them tripping over their own greed and hubris all along the way. Even when they finally backtracked on their unbelievable policies they were playing the victim card as they did so. More and more this bloated console reeks of something that was conceived by a bunch of white collar suits sitting in a board room.

 

[SoundofSilence]

Seriously, Fuck You Microsoft....

And all this under the mantle of "progress".

 

[Sword Of Doom]

Explain the always online they were trying to push

 

[artist]

Didnt mortimer caution against this sort of stuff?

 

[UnObtainium17]

wow the real XBOX CULTURE is showing.

 

[Finalizer]

Didnt mortimer caution against this sort of stuff?

Indeed.

Funny that MS personally vindicates him, too.

 

[GribbleGrunger]

Xbox One can essentially work like TV that watches you, bringing marketers a huge new trove of data about what's going on in living rooms, including, as one marketer put it after the speech, unprecedented information about how people engage with TV advertising.

"It could have a big impact on pricing," he said, given Xbox One's capacity for seeing whether people are paying attention or how their bodies respond to the ads, said the marketer, who wasn't authorized by his company to speak for attribution.

But they won't share any information with the NSA ...

 

[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

Didnt one of the mods have a list of all the advertising servers microsoft uses and blocks them from his rooter? I think it was stump that said that or maybe opiate?


Thats what I would be doing if I was buying and X1.

 

[SoundofSilence]

But they won't share any information with the NSA ...

Too late.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/30/microsoft-privacy-chief-nsa

 

[ironcreed]

"Xbox One can essentially work like TV that watches you, bringing marketers a huge new trove of data about what's going on in living rooms, including, as one marketer put it after the speech, unprecedented information about how people engage with TV advertising."

LOL at "unprecedented information about how people engage with TV advertising."

I think most people just 'engage' the remote and change it to another channel. That is, if they are even watching fucking TV to begin with.

 

[TheD]

But see, that's the MS hate infiltrating the argument.

The initial argument has NOTHING to do with how much you are paying. It's about privacy and intrusion.

We buy cable packages and TVs and PCs and phones and Hulu subscriptions and magazines and operating systems and all kinds of things that have these "intrusions" built in.

Yes, we could run our PCs with no cookies and use Linux and whatever, but we don't (largely).

Our phones and PCs and TVs are all more than $500 and we also willingly expose ourselves to marketing and data-mining through these objects. It's no different, other than people are squeamish about the cameras. Money spent for access to the platform has zero to do with it.

And just the idea that we're not paying for google and the like to data-mine is so funny, because we're paying for it in SOOOO many ways. Just because you don't directly use your credit card to buy it doesn't mean you aren't paying for it.

Operating systems do not spy on you for advertisers!
Maybe some shitty program might but that is not in inherently part of the system!

And all the other examples also do not involve a fucking camera trying to gather advertising data on you!!!!

 

[passthatish]

Do you know even know why some sites offer exclusive premium membership that will give you free-ads access? Quit the straw manning. We don't complain how we get bombarded by ads in our live and how ads in video gaming console make it worse. We complained how there still ads in a premium prodcut, priced at $500 and still have advertising. Not too mention that the said product have a pair of eyes that would take your actual face, reaction, and emotion and save it in a database.

Straw manning?
look I pay for hulu plus and still get hit with ads, I got Skype premium, still ads, my Samsung tv with a camera built in by the way, serves me ads when using smarthub.
once appletv hits, they could (will) be service you ads and selling your info as well, as well as as a slew of other devices. Even when sony doesn't this, I won't care.
now if these ads have a negative impact on my gaming experience or life, then i'll be up in arms, until then, I will enjoy the xbox one and whatever else device follows suit.

 

[Vitet]

 

[jem0208]

If this data was used to make adverts more engaging and actually interesting to watch, would you care? The reason I hate adverts is because they are boring and get in the way. However if this was used to make adverts interesting, I wouldn't mind.

 

[CadetMahoney]

Sony will catch wind of the success and implement something similar in the future.

I highly doubt Sony will go down the adverts route MS does/plans to as it's really disgusting tbqh.

XBone is the biggest fucking piece of trash I've seen in my entire life. I am disgusted.

The pre-orders are only and indication of how much marketshare they will lose next-gen.

 

[Sword Of Doom]

That wouldn't be legal in the U.S.

The first day when you accept the license agreement what if you're accepting this too? Most people don't sit and read 20 pages of fine print.

 

[SoundofSilence]

If this data was used to make adverts more engaging and actually interesting to watch, would you care? The reason I hate adverts is because they are boring and get in the way. However if this was used to make adverts interesting, I wouldn't mind.

You don't understand the outrage behind a camera that allow advertisers to monitor the activity in your living room?

I see.

[EDIT: I see you edited your post.]

 

[TetraGenesis]

It always intrigues me how resistant people are to advertising. I use Gmail, I watch television, I buy a lot of things from Amazon, im constantly bombarded by advertisers. I value some of it, like book recommendations, or video recommendations. If the games market explodes with indie titles this gen, I would appreciate Sony or MS recommending titles for me. The ads that bother me are the youtube ads that play videos im forced to watch before the content I selected. If the result of this is a box on my dashboard recommending content, thats great for me, if it becomes forced commercials before loading games or apps, ill squawk.

You'd be praising MS no matter what they did. I don't really take your word for it.

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

The suggestion is that the games are the Trojan horse, and Kinect, advertising and the Gold subscription fees are the greek soldiers.

You do need the horse to pull it off.

Eh. Comparing Kinect and a gold fee to Greek soldiers is overvaluing them. Without the games/xbox those two things aren't worth jack.

 

[jem0208]

You don't understand the outrage behind a camera that allow advertisers to monitor the activity in your living room?

I see.

I don't understand the outrage behind something which sees whether you are actively interested in something or not. If suddenly all the adverts I was seeing became really interesting and something I would enjoy watching rather than being a space to completely ignore, I wouldn't complain.

Also, if you're seriously worried, unplug the camera.