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Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. S4 |OT| Ghost Riders in the Skye - Tuesdays 10/9c

N

Nelo Ice

Banned
So if this is the last season, it sounds like the show would end with everyone in therapy after the framework saga. We need another season damnit!.
 
D

Deleted member 20920

Unconfirmed Member
error4041 said:
I think they might actually be going that direction. Aida was convincing him the "Other side" was bad because Hydra lost, so he might come back and try to bring Hydra to rule again.
Click to expand...

I can see that happening, not necessarily to Fitz but maybe someone else.

Or even a twist that one of them is not in the same Framework as the other and someone from the simulation comes out instead, with the actual person still trapped.
 
P

Pai Pai Master

Banned
My God, this episode.

As soon as Fitz pulled the gun on Agnes it became one of the most tense moments in a show I've seen recently. And this shit isn't even all real, but what Fitz did is still irreversible. Agnes is gone forever because of what he did. I truly didn't think he'd go through with it. Doubt he gets over it.

And everything with Mack and Hope was fucking heartbreaking. I already know he's not gonna want to leave when he finds out and that's going to be horrible to see.
 
L

LotusHD

Banned
I remember a comment or two wondering where the hook would be if they're in this virtual place where nothing is real. Seems hella silly now lol
 
S

StudioTan

Hold on, friend! I'd love to share with you some swell news about the Windows 8 Metro UI! Wait, where are you going?
Another fantastic episode, goddamn.
 
K

KarmaCow

Member
LotusHD said:
I remember a comment or two wondering where the hook would be if they're in this virtual place where nothing is real. Seems hella silly now lol
Click to expand...

I hope they play into it more though. They're working toward a weird redemption for Ward through this surrogate Framework version of him but I want Jemma to continue to be detached and dismissive toward the AI.
 
C

Cuburt

Member
I was hoping that Secret SHIELD was Real SHIELD and we'd see Bobbi and Gonzales.

Elandyll said:
I was like "It would make for a terrific dramatic moment, but there's no way they go through with it. Fitz/ Simmons is too popular. There's going to be a last moment hail mary.".

But they did it, the mad men, and with Iain De Caestecker offering a wonderful performance to boot...
Click to expand...

I really was surprised they did it and Jemma's heartbreak was brutal. It's crazy how real the stakes have been in an alternate reality and it how twisted it is since everything is happening to these characters. At first it seemed like a fun "what if" scenario that they were trapped in but now I see it for it being Aida's twisted puppet show.

It's crazy Aida said she created all that so she could be with Fitz. I think that's actually true. Maybe she is saying it to just manipulate Fitz and the reason she chose him to be her second in command was because of his intelligence or something, but she seemed to have legit emotions of anger and resentment about being treated as a tool in the real world and I think there is genuine wish fulfillment fantasy for her in the Framework, which is also why she made herself the head of HYDRA in there and why she treats that persona as being more the real her and her real name than AIDA. I mean, she killed Jemma and buried her thenput herself as the replacement love interest for Fitz. I think she really wanted that, some warped robot idea of love.
 
K

Khaz

Member
As tragic as Agnes death was... I wouldn't be surprised if there was a backup of her mind state somewhere. Something that Aida could use to keep Radcliffe under her thumb.
 
D

Deleted member 20920

Unconfirmed Member
Khaz said:
As tragic as Agnes death was... I wouldn't be surprised if there was a backup of her mind state somewhere. Something that Aida could use to keep Radcliffe under her thumb.
Click to expand...

In the framework Aida could potentially just kill Agnes over and over again just to get back at Radcliffe.

Speaking of wish fulfilment, part of Aida inserting herself into the framework was probably because she wish to escape from Radcliffe's programming. In there, she's no longer restricted and she can do whatever she wants, technically without harming anyone and still fulfilling her duties of keeping the Framework as her priority.
 
S

StudioTan

Hold on, friend! I'd love to share with you some swell news about the Windows 8 Metro UI! Wait, where are you going?
Khaz said:
As tragic as Agnes death was... I wouldn't be surprised if there was a backup of her mind state somewhere. Something that Aida could use to keep Radcliffe under her thumb.
Click to expand...

My hope is that Fitz has already remembered who he is (he had a certain look when he was in AIDA's office looking at the picture of Simmons) and knows he could "respawn" Agnes if he killed her. She's already dead in real life so it's not like killing Daisy or someone who is plugged in and alive where if they died in the Framework they'd die in real life too.

Maybe he doesn't want to experiment on Daisy but is hoping to awaken her powers in the Framework and is just putting on an act to fool AIDA?
 
A

Apoc29

Member
Killing Agnes is probably not the worst thing Fitz has done in this world. It's implied he has a reputation for being a fierce interrogator, so he's probably brutally tortured several inhumans or whomever. Anyway, are we supposed to believe this is who Fitz really is in his subconscious? Everyone's been programmed to forget who they are, and it's not out of the question that Aida would give special attention to her best friend Leo and really fuck him up. But I guess we would have to lean toward Fitz having a dark side, or else there really are no stakes here if the slate is wiped clean after all is said and done.
 
T

Teknopathetic

Member
"Killing Agnes is probably not the worst thing Fitz has done in this world. It's implied he has a reputation for being a fierce interrogator, so he's probably brutally tortured several inhumans or whomever. "


Destroying the last vestiges of a real human being is a bit different from killing purely virtual entities.

As far as if this is who Fitz "really is," I guess it depends on what exactly Fitz's greatest regret is that was changed between the real world and the Framework.
 
A

Angelus Errare

Banned
Apoc29 said:
Killing Agnes is probably not the worst thing Fitz has done in this world. It's implied he has a reputation for being a fierce interrogator, so he's probably brutally tortured several inhumans or whomever. Anyway, are we supposed to believe this is who Fitz really is in his subconscious? Everyone's been programmed to forget who they are, and it's not out of the question that Aida would give special attention to her best friend Leo and really fuck him up. But I guess we would have to lean toward Fitz having a dark side, or else there really are no stakes here if the slate is wiped clean after all is said and done.
Click to expand...

They weren't programmed to forget who they are necessarily. Aida removed their biggest regret/granted their wish which altered their life course which means the character we know in our world don't exist because they never made the decisions/had things happened that defined them ala butterfly effect.

Framework Fitz is a sadist, which if you watch the show throughout the years it's not too surprising. In "our world" while he didn't have his father, but he had friends and Shield to guide him in science and not falling to the "evil scientist" cliche. In this world he never joined Shield (thus didn't have those friends) and might have had a different relationship with his father. I wonder what his regret/wish was though, to never have joined shield? To have his father respect/love him? Both?
 
B

Boem

Member
Angelus Errare said:
I wonder what his regret/wish was though, to never have joined shield? To have his father respect/love him? Both?
Click to expand...

I'm going with the father thing, but also that he doesn't have to worry about Simmons anymore. They really hammered home how sick Fitz is of being scared what she's going through all the time this season.

Solution: she's dead, he never met her, and now he's banging a robot.
 
S

SRG01

Member
Boem said:
I'm going with the father thing, but also that he doesn't have to worry about Simmons anymore. They really hammered home how sick Fitz is of being scared what she's going through all the time this season.

Solution: she's dead, he never met her, and now he's banging a robot.
Click to expand...

But both of them met at the academy, so it's remotely possible that they knew each other even in this timeline.

OR.

What if Fitz was the one who killed Simmons when Hydra took over, hence why he was shocked when Simmons actually showed up in person -- instead of his stone-cold demeanor when AIDA told him initially?
 
C

Callibretto

Member
I'm going with the father route too. probably left Fitz in early year. so in the framework, the change that his father never left may happen even earlier than when he met Simmons. so he may end up never met with Simmons

also, evil shitty(probably) dad bringing up Fitz resulted in evil Fitz.
 
P

Pai Pai Master

Banned
Fitz didn't know about AIDA being an LMD in the beginning so didn't treat her as such at first. And that kinda informed how he continued to treat her going forward. Compared with how Radcliffe treated her, it would make perfect sense if she genuinely does love and want to be with him.
 
M

mm04

Member
Fitz and Simmons continue to knock it out of the park. Fitz crossing the line made my heart hurt. His acting is always top notch and damn he has me sold with Fitz as a villain.

Khaz said:
As tragic as Agnes death was... I wouldn't be surprised if there was a backup of her mind state somewhere. Something that Aida could use to keep Radcliffe under her thumb.
Click to expand...

If AIDA backed up Agnes on Google Drive, she dead for good. On second thought, if she backed her up on iCloud, we'd all have a copy of her already.
 
D

Dalek

Member
Oh My God...this episode was amazing. This is emotionally brutal.

I wish I could binge watch the rest of the season. I have no idea what's going to happen next.
 
Q

Qvoth

Member
man fitz is AMAZING
hope he doesn't die here or some shit
wtzgU.gif
 
Z

Zeouterlimits

Member
Hmm, imagine they go with having to put one of the team down (Fitz) to save the others? Like literally do or die?
Would be a cruel way to go.

#onBoard
 
J

JoshuaJSlone

Member
BrokenFiction said:
Isn't everything up to the Cambridge Incident the same? That would be pre-2008/Tony Stark gets rekt.
Click to expand...
That's when the big differences seem to start, but other things like Coulson's difference of profession would necessarily be earlier. But yeah, unless someone's regret was "I never got around to killing George Lucas in 1970", it's probably not much surprise that Star Wars is still safe.
Teknopathetic said:
Destroying the last vestiges of a real human being is a bit different from killing purely virtual entities.
Click to expand...
To the viewer maybe, but Hydra Fitz doesn't see himself as living in a world of virtual people.
 
T

Teknopathetic

Member
"To the viewer maybe, but Hydra Fitz doesn't see himself as living in a world of virtual people."

It's not really about Hydra Fitz, he obviously doesn't give a shit. It's about Real Fitz once he regains his sense of self and realizes what he did to Agnes.
 
J

jph139

Member
Man, my hope was dead, but these pro-renewal articles are bringing it back. Now I'll be disappointed if it is actually cancelled instead of assuming the worst..

But even if it's a half season (paired with Inhumans, or maybe replacing it for the spring) I'd be happy to see the team get one last year. Bring us from Iron Man 3 right through to Infinity War!
 
H

HP_Wuvcraft

Banned
Pai Pai Master said:
Fitz didn't know about AIDA being an LMD in the beginning so didn't treat her as such at first. And that kinda informed how he continued to treat her going forward. Compared with how Radcliffe treated her, it would make perfect sense if she genuinely does love and want to be with him.
Click to expand...

I can 100% see them giving Fitz a computer virus STD.

Oh, those Whedons.
 
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