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[zeomax]

Our conclusion was that even the most extreme advancements in human technology would likely seem indistinguishable to a species that travel the galaxy with ease.

Then it musst be very dumb aliens if they can not distinguish between a wagon with a horse and a rocket.

 

[Romulus]

Then it musst be very dumb aliens if they can not distinguish between a wagon with a horse and a rocket.

Out of my entire post, you cherry-picked out that quote and still didn't get the point. It has nothing to do with "aliens being dumb." Good grief. It's the exact opposite.

 

[INC]

If the supposed 'canon' of the UFO story is to be believed, nuclear power/weapons is main factor, which from sci fi plot PoV makes perfect sense

Thas a big IF tho

 

[INC]

Paradigm-Shifting ‘UFO’ Tech That Alters Space-Time Is “Operable” – U.S. Navy Chief Tech Officer

(Follow me on Instagram here) I was recently scrolling through the twitter feed of Christopher Mellon, the former Deputy Assistant Defense Secretary for Intelligence from 1997 to 2002. In doing so I came across an interesting post from The Drive regarding documents they received via the Freedom...

www.collective-evolution.com

 

[zeomax]

Out of my entire post, you cherry-picked out that quote and still didn't get the point. It has nothing to do with "aliens being dumb." Good grief. It's the exact opposite.

I get your point but i see it different.

It would barely register as progression to them.

If they are not dumb then they would register the progression from travel with horses and flying with rockets into the space. And in my opinion the step between travel with horses/cars and be able to leave the planet is one of the key moments in the development of a species. Therefore would be extremely interessant for observers and they would register it as a huge progression.

 

[Romulus]

I get your point but i see it different.

If they are not dumb then they would register the progression from travel with horses and flying with rockets into the space. And in my opinion the step between travel with horses/cars and be able to leave the planet is one of the key moments in the development of a species. Therefore would be extremely interessant for observers and they would register it as a huge progression.

I just don't see anything we've done as a huge progression to a space-faring species. The difference between going to your own moon and traveling the solar system<galaxy<universe is just an astronomical mind blogging difference between those three. We barely can make it to our moon even decades after the first trip.
But then again it's just speculation because we're literally attempting to "get inside an alien's head" that might not even exist anyway. They could literally be machine-based or something else.

For me, I would akin our progression something like the way we see chimp's use of very simple tools like a stick to pull ants out of a hole. It's interesting and there's definitely a fundamental connection to a "tool" there or technology in this case, but it's not something to get excited about. They would need millions of more years of evolution to even be considered intelligent, and I feel we're probably even further behind than that to a space-faring species. From our perspective though, yeah, it's incredible, space travel! But on an extremely primitive level just like the chimp's tool because we're not really doing anything. It takes us literally years to plan a super risky mission to rocks that are next-door neighbors to us.

I just feel like anything coming here it's literally a part of their DNA at that point to travel through space. All speculation, but just as chimps don't understand 99% of our technology, just imagine what aliens have. Stuff you probably couldn't even understand even if our greatest minds were educated an entire lifetime, at some point, it just becomes an evolutionary brain capacity issue. You can show a chip a cell phone and they might even be able to use it, but understanding it? They don't have the ability.

I mean if we're cloning, knocking on the scientific door of near-immortality, and breaking the sound barrier by 10x or whatever, what in the actual fuck are these things capable of? Traveling to parallel worlds? Creating their own universes?

 

[dan76]

Oops.

 

[StormCell]

I just don't see anything we've done as a huge progression to a space-faring species. The difference between going to your own moon and traveling the solar system<galaxy<universe is just an astronomical mind blogging difference between those three. We barely can make it to our moon even decades after the first trip.
But then again it's just speculation because we're literally attempting to "get inside an alien's head" that might not even exist anyway. They could literally be machine-based or something else.

For me, I would akin our progression something like the way we see chimp's use of very simple tools like a stick to pull ants out of a hole. It's interesting and there's definitely a fundamental connection to a "tool" there or technology in this case, but it's not something to get excited about. They would need millions of more years of evolution to even be considered intelligent, and I feel we're probably even further behind than that to a space-faring species. From our perspective though, yeah, it's incredible, space travel! But on an extremely primitive level just like the chimp's tool because we're not really doing anything. It takes us literally years to plan a super risky mission to rocks that are next-door neighbors to us.

I just feel like anything coming here it's literally a part of their DNA at that point to travel through space. All speculation, but just as chimps don't understand 99% of our technology, just imagine what aliens have. Stuff you probably couldn't even understand even if our greatest minds were educated an entire lifetime, at some point, it just becomes an evolutionary brain capacity issue. You can show a chip a cell phone and they might even be able to use it, but understanding it? They don't have the ability.

I mean if we're cloning, knocking on the scientific door of near-immortality, and breaking the sound barrier by 10x or whatever, what in the actual fuck are these things capable of? Traveling to parallel worlds? Creating their own universes?

Wooo, I saw your train of posts last night and have been waiting for a good opportunity to reply. I think that there are some huge assumption at play in your expectations. For starters, we find it remarkable anytime we discover anything using a tool of some sort, even at a primitive cellular (multi-cellular) level. If we see anything making use of fire it's going to be earth-shattering news as we herald the discovery of the dawn of another intelligence besides our own. And that's setting aside the facts that there are other species on the planet who learn our language and can use it to talk back to us to some degree (primates, dogs, cats, birds, etc). That, itself, is remarkable enough.

Imagine being a rogue space-faring race of intelligent beings who quite possibly haven't come across any other complex lifeforms until they came across Earth and discovered a young fledgling society of intelligent beings. Here we are. We use fire. We craft tools. We create cities, dam rivers, transport water, and even have a very basic electric light bulb of sorts. We have societal structures. We're growing. Our knowledge is expanding. What about this doesn't sound incredibly fascinating? Fast-forward to our present age, and we're in the earliest stages of becoming a space-faring race ourselves. If upon building a functional warp drive that doesn't require a Sun's worth of energy to use it we immediately discover intelligent beings living in basically the equivalent of the Iron Age, it's going to be incredible even if, to us, it's barely a step out of the stone ages.

I don't see how anything about what we've done isn't remarkable when compared against 99% of all other planets. If you removed us from the planet and just left the native americans living here, it's still very remarkable. I think that your opinions rest upon some assumptions that for one, they will have come across other lifeforms and we will be just ho-hum by comparison. The other assumption you make is that they must be so far advanced beyond anything we can comprehend. It's possible, but it's also just as equally possible that they hit a lull in advancement that could have spanned hundreds or even thousands of years. They could have been at their current technical state 10,000 years ago, and due to the complexities and energy requirements for pushing new advancements could literally be stalled. The point is we really shouldn't assume much about them.

EDIT: A third assumption would be that these beings don't have any philosophical interests or pursuits. Are they not asking the same kinds of questions that we are? What can they learn from observing another intelligent race of beings? In Star Trek, they were incredibly fascinated with monitoring primitive races. Why wouldn't these beings be interested?

 

[Romulus]

Wooo, I saw your train of posts last night and have been waiting for a good opportunity to reply. I think that there are some huge assumption at play in your expectations. For starters, we find it remarkable anytime we discover anything using a tool of some sort, even at a primitive cellular (multi-cellular) level. If we see anything making use of fire it's going to be earth-shattering news as we herald the discovery of the dawn of another intelligence besides our own. And that's setting aside the facts that there are other species on the planet who learn our language and can use it to talk back to us to some degree (primates, dogs, cats, birds, etc). That, itself, is remarkable enough.

Imagine being a rogue space-faring race of intelligent beings who quite possibly haven't come across any other complex lifeforms until they came across Earth and discovered a young fledgling society of intelligent beings. Here we are. We use fire. We craft tools. We create cities, dam rivers, transport water, and even have a very basic electric light bulb of sorts. We have societal structures. We're growing. Our knowledge is expanding. What about this doesn't sound incredibly fascinating? If upon building a functional warp drive that doesn't require a Sun's worth of energy to use it we immediately discover intelligent beings living in basically the equivalent of the Iron Age, it's going to be incredible even if, to us, it's barely a step out of the stone ages.

I don't see how anything about what we've done isn't remarkable when compared against 99% of all other planets. If you removed us from the planet and just left the native americans living here, it's still very remarkable.

My post was more progression of a said species. We do find it remarkable that they're using tools but in terms of progressing to an intelligent species chimps would likely need millions of years of evolution. So really theres only very specific people that find those things fascinating. Many blow it off.

My idea was about an alien's possible perspective of human progression and how it might not relate to our own perspective at all. If they've traveled the universe, they could have witnessed lower tier civilianizations before thousands of times, or not. It really depends if the likelyhood of many factors.
I just feel the only reason we might be impressed is because we're literally trapped in our own solar system with no variation to observe. So in that case, it's all very exciting to us. As scientists have discovered recently, Earth seems like a middle tier planet in terms of producing ideal conditions for life. Apparently there are millions of better options, probably billions.

 

[StormCell]

My post was more progression of a said species. We do find it remarkable that they're using tools but in terms of progressing to an intelligent species chimps would likely need millions of years of evolution. So really theres only very specific people that find those things fascinating. Many blow it off.

My idea was about an alien's possible perspective of human progression and how it might not relate to our own perspective at all. If they've traveled the universe, they could have witnessed lower tier civilianizations before thousands of times, or not. It really depends if the likelyhood of many factors.
I just feel the only reason we might be impressed is because we're literally trapped in our own solar system with no variation to observe. So in that case, it's all very exciting to us. As scientists have discovered recently, Earth seems like a middle tier planet in terms of producing ideal conditions for life. Apparently there are millions of better options, probably billions.

I late edited you a couple of times... might be worth checking out what I added.

 

[showernota]

‘It started flying towards us’: Mysterious fireball ignites blaze in Peachland | Globalnews.ca

Firefighters are investigating after a mysterious fireball caught on video floating through the night sky near Peachland sparked a blaze Tuesday night.

globalnews.ca

 

[Romulus]

Dude didn't dance around the question lol

 

[Shadowplay1979]

Dude didn't dance around the question lol

How embarressing that people continue to show footage of that miami ufo video when it was so absolutely fake looking to begin with but yea...was this shitty app...
and still people show that thing as part of thier "what the hell is going on??" approach

UFO Video Camera by Outerspacious Software LLC

UFO Video Camera is a simple to use, augmented reality camera that creates stunning, realistic looking UFO videos

appadvice.com

 

[Kraz]

‘It started flying towards us’: Mysterious fireball ignites blaze in Peachland | Globalnews.ca

Firefighters are investigating after a mysterious fireball caught on video floating through the night sky near Peachland sparked a blaze Tuesday night.

globalnews.ca

So close to landing in the lake. RIP travellers

 

[rofif]

Dude didn't dance around the question lol

well could be russians with better tech, weather or aliens.
Nice seeing him not dodge the topic at all. Who is he?

 

[Romulus]

well could be russians with better tech, weather or aliens.
Nice seeing him not dodge the topic at all. Who is he?

Top intelligence chief for the US.

If the Russians have this tech it's absolutely minded blogging in terms of performance going by the Nimitz radar hits. And then if you completely toss out the WW2 Foo Fighters reports from pilots all over the world, which also had radar hits in the supersonic and hypersonic range.... back when fighter pilots couldn't even break the sound barrier? Just doesn't add up to me when you consider the consistency and timeframe of all the reports.

 

[Romulus]

A wave of UFOs spotted by the military in Brazil apparently tormented and even killed civilians. Well documented by a doctor with photos. Three dead from strokes, over sixty with burn wounds and strange incisions. 3/4 of the people attacked were women.

 

[rofif]

A wave of UFOs spotted by the military in Brazil apparently tormented and even killed civilians. Well documented by a doctor with photos. Three dead from strokes, over sixty with burn wounds and strange incisions. 3/4 of the people attacked were women.

No actual footage and bullshit claims. Probably just some military experiments on population if anything at all

 

[Romulus]

No actual footage and bullshit claims. Probably just some military experiments on population if anything at all

"Probably."

 

[StormCell]

If the supposed 'canon' of the UFO story is to be believed, nuclear power/weapons is main factor, which from sci fi plot PoV makes perfect sense

Thas a big IF tho

I guess I'm still catching up on some posts in this thread. What 'UFO canon' are you referring to? I've heard that sightings and encounters increased substantially during WW2 and around the time that atomic bombs began being tested. However, I would never claim nor accept an assertion that the phenomenon began with the introduction of atomic weapons.

What might actually make a little sense, to me, is that our so-called visitors could have a mutual interest in the habitability of the surface of our planet. It makes a lot more sense if they're actually sharing the planet with us. Whatever occurs on the surface could have implications on the subsurface, especially if they are as reliant on water as we are (ie. irradiated water could be very bad for them too).

It would also explain historical encounters with potential visitors if they've been here all along but for some reason found the subsurface much more suitable for their living arrangements. We actually have very little knowledge of the inside of our planet, and every time there is some discovery of a vast ocean of water underneath densely populated parts of earth, I can't help wondering what actually looks like inside the earth. One can't help but imagine potential sprawling caverns and tunnels of flowing water. There are miles and miles of subsurface. What if...

 

[jufonuk]

 

[sw0mp_d0nk3y]

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2021/03/pentagon-report-details-difficult-to-explain-ufo-sightings.html

UFO report details ‘difficult to explain’ sightings, says US ex-intelligence director

US military pilots and satellites have recorded ‘a lot more’ UFO sightings than have been made public, John Ratcliffe says

www.theguardian.com

“There are a lot more sightings than have been made public,” Ratcliffe told Fox News host Maria Bartiromo. “Some of those have been declassified. When we talk about sightings, we’re talking about objects that have been seen by Navy or Air Force pilots or have been picked up by satellite imagery that frankly engage in actions that are difficult to explain.”

 

[Aggelos]

Elon Musk hits the nail directly on the head

 

[Kraz]

Challenging to photograph interdimensional objects.

 

[Romulus]

Elon Musk hits the nail directly on the head

There are literally UFO vids on reddit daily, a lot of them are never solved.

Anytime it's a good quality video: "Must be CGI."

Anytime they're blurry, "2021 still blurry vids. Seems legit."

Modern cell phones are still not good at filming objects at higher altitudes and moving quickly. Even commercial airplane vids at medium altitude are difficult to get a great shot with brand new Iphones.

And Elon Musk is completely oblivious to the most credible cases in history. He was asked on Joe Rogan recently about them and he simply shrugged. "Never heard of it." He was asking Joe questions about it and didn't have a clue, so yeah.

 

[Romulus]

Government Reports Say UFOs Broke Sound Barrier Without Sonic Boom

Ex-Intelligence Director confirms Navy and Air Force pilots have seen “difficult-to-explain,” “hard-to-replicate” objects.

www.popularmechanics.com

 

[StormCell]

Elon Musk hits the nail directly on the head

Musk doesn't seem like a very reliable source on the subject. He has been schooled before like with covid.

 

[Kraz]

There are literally UFO vids on reddit daily, a lot of them are never solved.

Anytime it's a good quality video: "Must be CGI."

Anytime they're blurry, "2021 still blurry vids. Seems legit."

Modern cell phones are still not good at filming objects at higher altitudes and moving quickly. Even commercial airplane vids at medium altitude are difficult to get a great shot with brand new Iphones.

And Elon Musk is completely oblivious to the most credible cases in history. He was asked on Joe Rogan recently about them and he simply shrugged. "Never heard of it." He was asking Joe questions about it and didn't have a clue, so yeah.

That's surprising to read about Musk. I thought he was making a joke with the tweet. Being in aerospace it seems he'd be more informed on ufos and willing to wildly speculate. Then again, he's got so many other things going on or maybe he's intentionally misleading/fishing and playing dumb by only asking question to not slip up and reveal something. However, that he says he should be the one who should know if there are aliens then afterwards acts like or legitamately doesn't know major recent ufo news undermines his boast. Whatever he got going on, he seems the type to change his mind with new information.

 

[INC]

That's surprising to read about Musk. I thought he was making a joke with the tweet. Being in aerospace it seems he'd be more informed on ufos and willing to wildly speculate. Then again, he's got so many other things going on or maybe he's intentionally misleading/fishing and playing dumb by only asking question to not slip up and reveal something. However, that he says he should be the one who should know if there are aliens then afterwards acts like or legitamately doesn't know major recent ufo news undermines his boast. Whatever he got going on, he seems the type to change his mind with new information.

Why? Because he makes rockets? If its military controlled, why would they inform a private sector boss about anything?

 

[Birdo]

Most modern UFO footage is filmed with phones, which don't have an optical zoom. That's why they look like VHS quality when digitally zoomed in.

That argument would work if everyone carried around a Nikon P1000.

 

[Kraz]

Why? Because he makes rockets? If its military controlled, why would they inform a private sector boss about anything?

Yes, overlapping history and security issues would be some easy speculation. Even in the Rogan interview, if you watched it, he claimed that if anyone should know about UFOS he should be the one. He may have his his own reasons for making that claim.

 

[INC]

Yes, overlapping history and security issues would be some easy speculation. Even in the Rogan interview, if you watched it, he claimed that if anyone should know about UFOS he should be the one. He may have his his own reasons for making that claim.

He also claimed to smoke weed on that show, and didn't inhale

Swings and roundabouts

 

[Kraz]

He also claimed to smoke weed on that show, and didn't inhale

Swings and roundabouts

Not the exact reason why deception was already mentioned, but that's an example of why to take his comments lightly.

He, like everyone, is in a bubble created by the information they're given. In his business it's a fair deduction that with ufo security concerns he's not the one collecting ufo data and putting it together in official docs. Which leaves him to his own investigations which he doesn't appear he's had or made much time to do recently.

 

[INC]

Not the exact reason why deception was already mentioned, but that's an example of why to take his comments lightly.

He, like everyone, is in a bubble created by the information they're given. In his business it's a fair deduction that with ufo security concerns he's not the one collecting ufo data and putting it together in official docs. Which leaves him to his own investigations which he doesn't appear he's had or made much time to do recently.

I'm good whatever the outcome

If its military that means we are more advanced than first thought, which is amazing

If its ufo as in alien, then thats also awesome

Win win for me.

I'd say currently most ufo stopped id say are military, that still don't explain wtf people were seeing hundreds of years ago, that match the same description

Then again they were all off their tits on dmt and god knows what, so thats also an explanation I'm cool with.

I still don't why you think the military would disclose anything to private company tbh, "hay private business be careful with your rocket we have secret test craft flying around, just so know Mr musk or it could be alien Mr musk"......yeh that don't make any sense to me personally.

Odd that ufo are always in nasa feeds and as far as I'm aware none were spotted on space missions

Also you can't fully trust musk, he's had hair transplants, he's living a lie everyday

 

[Romulus]

Bizarre when taking on the consistency on these sightings.

In these vids, they seem to be releasing something into the atmosphere or onto the ground. People in the community call it slag for lack of understanding of what they're doing. I've seen about 30 videos of behavior like this from various militaries, police, and even new station weather cams all over the world, the oldest dating back to the late 60s.












Another thing I've noticed is they seem to be close to volcanoes or after catastrophic events.

 

[StormCell]

I'm good whatever the outcome

If its military that means we are more advanced than first thought, which is amazing

If its ufo as in alien, then thats also awesome

Win win for me.

I'd say currently most ufo stopped id say are military, that still don't explain wtf people were seeing hundreds of years ago, that match the same description

Then again they were all off their tits on dmt and god knows what, so thats also an explanation I'm cool with.

I still don't why you think the military would disclose anything to private company tbh, "hay private business be careful with your rocket we have secret test craft flying around, just so know Mr musk or it could be alien Mr musk"......yeh that don't make any sense to me personally.

Odd that ufo are always in nasa feeds and as far as I'm aware none were spotted on space missions

Also you can't fully trust musk, he's had hair transplants, he's living a lie everyday

First point of contention: as far as I can tell, "most ufo" I see are often seen doing behaviors that break our present understanding of physics. Unless you think there's some totally separate set of physics principles the military is working with that are totally unpublished and peer reviewed, it's hard to conceive in this modern age such technologies existing in the hands of the military that make the rest of air travel looking ancient by comparison. It's not impossible, but that book of physics secrets they're sitting on must be getting sky high.

Second point is that I think you may underestimate the power of NDAs and top secret clearances. We already know some of what happens when somebody dumps classified materials to Wikileaks -- he gets to sit in solitary confinement (not prison, just jail) for years without even a trial. If we didn't know about this guy, would he even still exist? All it takes on a civilian contract job for the defense department is for your boss to lay out clearly to you what is your job and is NOT your job. Things that are beyond your security clearance, you do NOT talk about. UAP could be beyond the security clearance of most at these rocket companies. There's no reason to doubt the DoD would hold everyone to strict confidence on UAPs under the label that they very well could be other high security clearance projects flying around.

And then we have the former what's his face giving us interviews telling us the plain truth that these UAP are doing things we CANNOT presently do with our best military technology... I suppose we'll know a bit more later this year. It's not impossible that it is our crafts, but I also get a very unsettling feeling when I look at this in conjunction with what I see transpiring politically.

 

[INC]

First point of contention: as far as I can tell, "most ufo" I see are often seen doing behaviors that break our present understanding of physics. Unless you think there's some totally separate set of physics principles the military is working with that are totally unpublished and peer reviewed, it's hard to conceive in this modern age such technologies existing in the hands of the military that make the rest of air travel looking ancient by comparison. It's not impossible, but that book of physics secrets they're sitting on must be getting sky high.

Second point is that I think you may underestimate the power of NDAs and top secret clearances. We already know some of what happens when somebody dumps classified materials to Wikileaks -- he gets to sit in solitary confinement (not prison, just jail) for years without even a trial. If we didn't know about this guy, would he even still exist? All it takes on a civilian contract job for the defense department is for your boss to lay out clearly to you what is your job and is NOT your job. Things that are beyond your security clearance, you do NOT talk about. UAP could be beyond the security clearance of most at these rocket companies. There's no reason to doubt the DoD would hold everyone to strict confidence on UAPs under the label that they very well could be other high security clearance projects flying around.

And then we have the former what's his face giving us interviews telling us the plain truth that these UAP are doing things we CANNOT presently do with our best military technology... I suppose we'll know a bit more later this year. It's not impossible that it is our crafts, but I also get a very unsettling feeling when I look at this in conjunction with what I see transpiring politically.

youre preacher to the choir dude

im onboard with UFOs, but i take it all with a pinch of salt as well. did i say that all UFOs doing crazy aerial shit are military? no i said most of what is seen is possibly military, i never said theyre all military

some could just environment, like lighting sprites or ball lighting etc etc

so what are you saying that Musk knows something, but is under a NDA...........?

atm we're closer to an answer than weve been....well ever really. as ive said before if these are all military, then the human race is about to change forever, if this is indeed just tech, but that then raises the question, how long have they had this tech, if its all military, then over 50 years, if not longer. thats a long time for military to hold that tech, and what military, just US military? thats not gonna look good on the US is it, theyve held back the planet and human race for over 50 years...........

lets see, its interesting whatever happens, no doubt itll be nothing tho, probably more swamp gas and weather balloons etc etc etc

 

[StormCell]

youre preacher to the choir dude

im onboard with UFOs, but i take it all with a pinch of salt as well. did i say that all UFOs doing crazy aerial shit are military? no i said most of what is seen is possibly military, i never said theyre all military

some could just environment, like lighting sprites or ball lighting etc etc

so what are you saying that Musk knows something, but is under a NDA...........?

atm we're closer to an answer than weve been....well ever really. as ive said before if these are all military, then the human race is about to change forever, if this is indeed just tech, but theat then raises the question, how long have they had this tech, if its all military, than over 50 years, if not longer. thats a long time for military to hold that tech, and what military, just US military? thats not gonna look good on the US is it, theyve held back the planet and human race for over 50 years...........

lets see, its interesting whatever happens, no doubt itll be nothing tho, probably more swamp gas and weather balloons etc etc etc

Sorry...

I see so many comments that wave off evidence as being easily explained stuff that I get an itchy trigger finger when I see the ol' "it's probably top secret military vehicles" explanation. Unfortunately, I seem to target your posts most of the time. LOL

I believe there is something to the environmental factors surrounding the appearance of some of these objects, such as volcanic eruptions and intense lightning storms. It's just very complicated to even attempt to explain. My best attempt at explaining it would sound something like this: guys... what if aliens have been tending to our planet's habitability since very early in it's geologic life? What if aliens are keeping the earth's core molten and therefore keeping a magnetic field around our planet? What if volcanic eruptions happen because of aliens? What if the whole thing is carefully controlled to keep our planet mostly near-perfect for us?

Rewind that explanation a thousand years and I'd be saying that a great angel or god was responsible for the molten core and volcanic eruptions!

Weird thing is that at present it isn't even that absurd anymore... We know that the chief difference between Earth and Mars is a magnetic field.

Let's propose for a moment that Musk definitely knows things that he absolutely without a doubt cannot even coyly hint about knowing without facing severe penalty (prison, trial by military court, etc). If Musk possesses sensitive information and understands the penalty for sharing it is basically a loss of everything he owns and a lengthy prison sentence, would he bend over backwards to seem completely clueless on a subject in order to avoid even the possibility of violating his security clearance?

Musk is a huge public character, but I would think he understands the full scope of the stakes in play. After all, who else is building a space ship and is getting to plan colonizing Mars?? Fact is, he must know some stuff almost no one else knows to think that they will successfully start a government on Mars during his lifetime...

It already feels like something is way the fuck off kilter in western society. You can even just rewind to 2015 and the present seems just exotic. Thanks for the former Director of National Intelligence, we're already getting footage that the Navy doesn't even think should have ever been released to the public. We ought to get some explanation for that. That footage is almost 20 years old!! Seriously. What on earth are we dealing with? It's something. Not someone. Some thing. Some thing that we may or may not understand. My best guess is we'll be acknowledging a race of beings that we share the planet with, and they've got a huge stake on how we proceed with our environment going forward...

 

[Romulus]

First point of contention: as far as I can tell, "most ufo" I see are often seen doing behaviors that break our present understanding of physics. Unless you think there's some totally separate set of physics principles the military is working with that are totally unpublished and peer reviewed, it's hard to conceive in this modern age such technologies existing in the hands of the military that make the rest of air travel looking ancient by comparison. It's not impossible, but that book of physics secrets they're sitting on must be getting sky high.

Second point is that I think you may underestimate the power of NDAs and top secret clearances. We already know some of what happens when somebody dumps classified materials to Wikileaks -- he gets to sit in solitary confinement (not prison, just jail) for years without even a trial. If we didn't know about this guy, would he even still exist? All it takes on a civilian contract job for the defense department is for your boss to lay out clearly to you what is your job and is NOT your job. Things that are beyond your security clearance, you do NOT talk about. UAP could be beyond the security clearance of most at these rocket companies. There's no reason to doubt the DoD would hold everyone to strict confidence on UAPs under the label that they very well could be other high security clearance projects flying around.

And then we have the former what's his face giving us interviews telling us the plain truth that these UAP are doing things we CANNOT presently do with our best military technology... I suppose we'll know a bit more later this year. It's not impossible that it is our crafts, but I also get a very unsettling feeling when I look at this in conjunction with what I see transpiring politically.

I think the best argument against the "black ops craft" is the number of credible sightings during the 1940s that mirror what is happening today. Radar, fighter pilots from several different nations. Just doesn't make any sense that world powers possessed this tech in the 1940s, but did not use it during a world war. I mean wtf, that's literally for all the marbles and you use your incredible tech just to observe fighter and bomber missions? Then you have the SR71 which was ultra blacks ops, and was only a fraction as fast as the speeds recorded decades before, and the whole goddamn purpose of the SR71 was speed.

 

[Kraz]

I still don't why you think the military would disclose anything to private company tbh, "hay private business be careful with your rocket we have secret test craft flying around, just so know Mr musk or it could be alien Mr musk"......yeh that don't make any sense to me personally.

Need to know involving military is one thing. The stuff that was released by them is more focused on their matters and may not directly impact anything that has to be disclosed in stuff Musk reads. There's also the possibility of encounters with SpaceX vehicles.

I find the most compelling UFO theory to be Interdimensional hypothesis. That could change the world(s). A whole new way to interact with multicosmos(heavens/hells).

These unexplained can range from hoaxes to military in the materialistic human only view to extraterrestrial or interdimensional. Open to all possibilities. We're here and we're aliens.

 

[StormCell]

I think the best argument against the "black ops craft" is the number of credible sightings during the 1940s that mirror what is happening today. Radar, fighter pilots from several different nations. Just doesn't make any sense that world powers possessed this tech in the 1940s, but did not use it during a world war. I mean wtf, that's literally for all the marbles and you use your incredible tech just to observe fighter and bomber missions? Then you have the SR71 which was ultra blacks ops, and was only a fraction as fast as the speeds recorded decades before, and the whole goddamn purpose of the SR71 was speed.

Precisely. Also, we have to consider evidence dating even further back than that. Visitors from above? Visitors from below? Potential evidence and a story that possibly describes an ancient nuclear war?

Whatever these UAP are, they've obviously been around here for thousands of years. You may as well assume they have bases on this planet from where they take off from and return to. It's only logical at this point.

 

[Romulus]

Precisely. Also, we have to consider evidence dating even further back than that. Visitors from above? Visitors from below? Potential evidence and a story that possibly describes an ancient nuclear war?

Whatever these UAP are, they've obviously been around here for thousands of years. You may as well assume they have bases on this planet from where they take off from and return to. It's only logical at this point.

And theres a consistency in the reporting too, and I'm only talking about when it pertains to credible sources going back before the Wright Brothers to after.
I think as humans we try and make a mockery out of things to feel more comfortable but there is definitely something going on beyond our understanding. Which makes sense, we don't even understand most of what makes space(dark matter, conflicting big bag theories and other foundation pillars)work yet many are arrogant enough to claim they know we're alone. Can barely travel to our own moon and we've never seen a single exoplanet out of billions.
We're basically blind, deaf, and dumb. Yep, must be alone.

 

[GloveSlap]

That's surprising to read about Musk. I thought he was making a joke with the tweet. Being in aerospace it seems he'd be more informed on ufos and willing to wildly speculate. Then again, he's got so many other things going on or maybe he's intentionally misleading/fishing and playing dumb by only asking question to not slip up and reveal something. However, that he says he should be the one who should know if there are aliens then afterwards acts like or legitamately doesn't know major recent ufo news undermines his boast. Whatever he got going on, he seems the type to change his mind with new information.

It's also kind of in his best interest not to believe. It would suck to put so much work into SpaceX only to find out your tech is insanely outclassed.

 

[Romulus]

It's also kind of in his best interest not to believe. It would suck to put so much work into SpaceX only to find out your tech is insanely outclassed.

He seems pretty irritated about it. Claims "I would know about aliens if they existed." Yet has no clue about the most credible case in humanity's existence. "Wait, what happened?"

 

[Alright]

Bizarre when taking on the consistency on these sightings.

In these vids, they seem to be releasing something into the atmosphere or onto the ground. People in the community call it slag for lack of understanding of what they're doing. I've seen about 30 videos of behavior like this from various militaries, police, and even new station weather cams all over the world, the oldest dating back to the late 60s.












Another thing I've noticed is they seem to be close to volcanoes or after catastrophic events.

I've seen something similar, at lot closer to home and more explainable: BOZ, BOL and Flare dispensers from jets/drones look exactly like this. I mean, exactly. Not to poo-poo it, but i just thought it was strange for something so pedestrian to be seen as unexplained.

I think the best argument against the "black ops craft" is the number of credible sightings during the 1940s that mirror what is happening today. Radar, fighter pilots from several different nations. Just doesn't make any sense that world powers possessed this tech in the 1940s, but did not use it during a world war. I mean wtf, that's literally for all the marbles and you use your incredible tech just to observe fighter and bomber missions? Then you have the SR71 which was ultra blacks ops, and was only a fraction as fast as the speeds recorded decades before, and the whole goddamn purpose of the SR71 was speed.

Chuck in the F-117 stealth, B2 bomber (Both Delta wing) and a myriad of drone prototypes (some delta wing) from the 80's/90's and you get the same link between 'seeing' a UFO and advanced military tech. There is a boring reason why you wouldn't use super-advance tech in a war; because if you lose that tech behind enemy lines, you've just handed the enemy a huge advantage.


As for aliens and UFO's here are my thoughts:

for 1 billion years, shit knocked about on this planet without having any idea what it was, where it was, or that it was on a rock floating in space. Only 100,000 years ago did a life-form emerge that could wonder and ponder about the great mysteries, but to think we have reached the pinnacle of evolution and understanding is bit a daft. Maybe in another billion years a lifeform will emerge with a '4th' brain that can understand more than we do. Standing behind a door and calling a dogs name is enough to confuse it. It knows your there, but can't figure out why it can't see you. The same could be true for us and advanced lifeforms. They may well be here, we may not just be able to perceive or understand them.

Military tech is decades ahead of what we have now, but it's kept so closely guarded that we don't know about it until years later. Hell, there were self-flying, self-landing jets that could complete a mission without any human interaction, using GPS...IN THE SIXTIES! (The idea for GPS came before that). Darpanet is another, more relatable example.

 

[Romulus]

I've seen something similar, at lot closer to home and more explainable: BOZ, BOL and Flare dispensers from jets/drones look exactly like this. I mean, exactly. Not to poo-poo it, but i just thought it was strange for something so pedestrian to be seen as unexplained.



Chuck in the F-117 stealth, B2 bomber (Both Delta wing) and a myriad of drone prototypes (some delta wing) from the 80's/90's and you get the same link between 'seeing' a UFO and advanced military tech. There is a boring reason why you wouldn't use super-advance tech in a war; because if you lose that tech behind enemy lines, you've just handed the enemy a huge advantage.


As for aliens and UFO's here are my thoughts:

for 1 billion years, shit knocked about on this planet without having any idea what it was, where it was, or that it was on a rock floating in space. Only 100,000 years ago did a life-form emerge that could wonder and ponder about the great mysteries, but to think we have reached the pinnacle of evolution and understanding is bit a daft. Maybe in another billion years a lifeform will emerge with a '4th' brain that can understand more than we do. Standing behind a door and calling a dogs name is enough to confuse it. It knows your there, but can't figure out why it can't see you. The same could be true for us and advanced lifeforms. They may well be here, we may not just be able to perceive or understand them.

Military tech is decades ahead of what we have now, but it's kept so closely guarded that we don't know about it until years later. Hell, there were self-flying, self-landing jets that could complete a mission without any human interaction, using GPS...IN THE SIXTIES! (The idea for GPS came before that). Darpanet is another, more relatable example.

I don't think any of that explains what going on since in ww2. Since the stealth fighter compared to the SR71 just doesn't do anything for me. In fact, the SR71 is leagues more impressive despite being much older. I just don't have that sort of faith in "military advanced tech" in terms of being mindblowing like this. I was around when they revealed the Nighthawk. And as the scientists who studied the UFO tic tac said, this is beyond a generational leap, it's breaking several laws of physics, not just one.
When you look at the nighthawk etc, they're just not doing much, ultra-slow, it is cool looking etc, "wow stars tech" but its not really doing anything that lasts the test of time, in fact they need new stealth tech almost immediately because it was scrubbed. This is far different.
There's no progression with these UFOs, it's just bam, a massive gigantic leap. Doesn't add up at all, especially when all the other technological devices I can understand from the past. GPS, yeah that wouldn't shock me if we had it in the 1950s or eairler, very impressive for sure, but literally going 60,000ft to 0ft in 1 second and stopping on a dime? Do you understand what that would do to hypersonic missiles? They would literally explode from the force. Showing up radar in space and going underwater? That's fucking goddman mind blowing and to think they recorded hypersonic speeds in ww2 with extremely similar reports to what is being seen now. I just don't buy that for 80 years there's some shadow gov joyriding "oh but recon" UFOs at hypersonic speeds just to toy with fighter pilots, makes absolutely no sense, and then you have to discount all the sightings before flight was even possible, which were also very similar going back to the 1600s even.
Something is definitely going on, and I think that it bothers most people to entertain the idea subconsciously.

 

[Alright]

I don't think any of that explains what going on since in ww2. Since the stealth fighter compared to the SR71 just doesn't do anything for me. In fact, the SR71 is leagues more impressive despite being much older. I just don't have that sort of faith in "military advanced tech" in terms of being mindblowing like this. I was around when they revealed the Nighthawk. And as the scientists who studied the UFO tic tac said, this is beyond a generational leap, it's breaking several laws of physics, not just one.
When you look at the nighthawk etc, they're just not doing much, ultra-slow, it is cool looking etc, "wow stars tech" but its not really doing anything that lasts the test of time, in fact they need new stealth tech almost immediately because it was scrubbed. This is far different.
There's no progression with these UFOs, it's just bam, a massive gigantic leap. Doesn't add up at all, especially when all the other technological devices I can understand from the past. GPS, yeah that wouldn't shock me if we had it in the 1950s or eairler, very impressive for sure, but literally going 60,000ft to 0ft in 1 second and stopping on a dime? Do you understand what that would do to hypersonic missiles? They would literally explode from the force. Showing up radar in space and going underwater? That's fucking goddman mind blowing and to think they recorded hypersonic speeds in ww2 with extremely similar reports to what is being seen now. I just don't buy that for 80 years there's some shadow gov joyriding "oh but recon" UFOs at hypersonic speeds just to toy with fighter pilots, makes absolutely no sense, and then you have to discount all the sightings before flight was even possible, which were also very similar going back to the 1600s even.

it's not the levels of tech, more that it's easy to get things mixed up, or confused with something else when there is (usually) a more Earth-bound understanding.

GPS wouldn't work in the 50's, the first satellite was Sputnik 1 in 1957 (I did google that date because I couldn't remember how late in the 50's it was) point being, our understanding and references of technology are only what we see. If we are kept 20 years behind, then military tech is 20 years ahead. In 1990, British TV had 4 channels, by 2010 we had netflix.

Don't even trust RADAR for anything. Seriously. It's so easily fooled (The wedge shape of stealth aircraft is to alter the image represented by the RADAR, to make it appear bigger, smaller, 100ft to the left etc. RADAR tech is from the 40's and has changed very little since and i would take any reports from the War or after the War with a huge pinch of salt. A lot of propaganda and mis-direction was used to keep the enemy in the dark about what tech we had.

There is another possibility; that a foreign government, be it China, NK or Russia, have advanced tech, and what we're seeing is those countries testing it out over foreign soil to gauge the reaction times and detection ability of America. For reference, Russia 'buzzes' Scotland a few times a year to see if we Brits can scramble our jets in time. Russia get a slap on the wrist and we get a training exercise out of it. So it is possible that these craft are Russian or NK in origin. Don't listen to the lies and propaganda of the Americans either, the Russians never have been behind the curve, technologically. Never.

Again, not to poo-poo anything you're saying but I think it's best to leave modern day sightings to one side for now.

Now we're getting interesting. Yeah, the cave drawings, paintings and sculptures of modern tech in ancient times is...fascinating. The antikythera mechanism is my favourite. Some of that stuff is yet to be explained. Not only how did they make it, or why, but why wasn't it put to use across the empire/society that it was found in?

 

[Romulus]

it's not the levels of tech, more that it's easy to get things mixed up, or confused with something else when there is (usually) a more Earth-bound understanding.

GPS wouldn't work in the 50's, the first satellite was Sputnik 1 in 1957 (I did google that date because I couldn't remember how late in the 50's it was) point being, our understanding and references of technology are only what we see. If we are kept 20 years behind, then military tech is 20 years ahead. In 1990, British TV had 4 channels, by 2010 we had netflix.

Don't even trust RADAR for anything. Seriously. It's so easily fooled (The wedge shape of stealth aircraft is to alter the image represented by the RADAR, to make it appear bigger, smaller, 100ft to the left etc. RADAR tech is from the 40's and has changed very little since and i would take any reports from the War or after the War with a huge pinch of salt. A lot of propaganda and mis-direction was used to keep the enemy in the dark about what tech we had.

There is another possibility; that a foreign government, be it China, NK or Russia, have advanced tech, and what we're seeing is those countries testing it out over foreign soil to gauge the reaction times and detection ability of America. For reference, Russia 'buzzes' Scotland a few times a year to see if we Brits can scramble our jets in time. Russia get a slap on the wrist and we get a training exercise out of it. So it is possible that these craft are Russian or NK in origin. Don't listen to the lies and propaganda of the Americans either, the Russians never have been behind the curve, technologically. Never.

Again, not to poo-poo anything you're saying but I think it's best to leave modern day sightings to one side for now.

Now we're getting interesting. Yeah, the cave drawings, paintings and sculptures of modern tech in ancient times is...fascinating. The antikythera mechanism is my favourite. Some of that stuff is yet to be explained. Not only how did they make it, or why, but why wasn't it put to use across the empire/society that it was found in?

Yeah I'm not saying GPS was possible just that it wouldn't blow my mind in the 1950s.

I'm not talking about radar tracks of stealth tech. Almost none of these objects have a wedge shape either. And when you talk about "propaganda" are you thinking all sides are making up the same propaganda? Because literally, all the world powers from WW2 report these events, pilots claiming unbelievable speeds and orbs. So, in the case where radar was tracked they're just wrong every time?
Also, in the case of the Nimtiz, not only was the craft tic-tac shaped, it was tracked on two Aegis class destroyers and viewed by 4 pilots who described it as unfathomable speed. And both radar tracks are wrong? Sonar was wrong also showing it go underwater?
There is just no way in my mind these are "secret craft." We have display nothing even remotely close to this. Then you link it too all the unknowns you were mentioning in your last paragraph and it becomes very clear that they're is something beyond our understanding. Maybe not aliens in the traditional sense.

And your other post and how life might evolve to challenge ours in a billion years. How did you arrive to that conclusion based on nearly a trillion Earth-like planets scientists say now? Are you claiming that all of them had a similar chaotic history because ours has been riddled with disasters? That it is impossible to have a more ideal history, one safer for evolution? I find the number of one trillion hard to understand, much less arriving at any conclusions about how all their histories panned out.

Humans are literally helpless creatures in terms of the true frontier, which is space. We struggle to travel to our own moon and we don't understand the basic pillars of the galaxy. Blind, deaf, and dumb. Of course, we would need to rationalize everything as explainable but when you really look at everything on the whole in terms of the unexplained, it makes more sense to me that much doesn't make sense and never will unless we open our mind.

Also do you have any videos anywhere the "flares" videos I posted, because I never seen anything remotely close to that first video for sure

 

[Alright]

Yeah I'm not saying GPS was possible just that it wouldn't blow my mind in the 1950s.

I'm not talking about radar tracks of stealth tech. Almost none of these objects have a wedge shape either. And when you talk about "propaganda" are you thinking all sides are making up the same propaganda? Because literally, all the world powers from WW2 report these events, pilots claiming unbelievable speeds and orbs. So, in the case where radar was tracked they're just wrong every time?
Also, in the case of the Nimtiz, not only was the craft tic-tac shaped, it was tracked on two Aegis class destroyers and viewed by 4 pilots who described it as unfathomable speed. And both radar tracks are wrong? Sonar was wrong also showing it go underwater?
There is just no way in my mind these are "secret craft." We have display nothing even remotely close to this. Then you link it too all the unknowns you were mentioning in your last paragraph and it becomes very clear that they're is something beyond our understanding. Maybe not aliens in the traditional sense.

And your other post and how life might evolve to challenge ours in a billion years. How did you arrive to that conclusion based on nearly a trillion Earth-like planets scientists say now? Are you claiming that all of them had a similar chaotic history because ours has been riddled with disasters? That it is impossible to have a more ideal history, one safer for evolution? I find the number of one trillion hard to understand, much less arriving at any conclusions about how all their histories panned out.

Humans are literally helpless creatures in terms of the true frontier, which is space. We struggle to travel to our own moon and we don't understand the basic pillars of the galaxy. Blind, deaf, and dumb. Of course, we would need to rationalize everything as explainable but when you really look at everything on the whole in terms of the unexplained, it makes more sense to me that much doesn't make sense and never will unless we open our mind.

Also do you have any videos anywhere the "flares" videos I posted, because I never seen anything remotely close to that first video for sure

Fair enough. It would have blown my mind to think computers (what were they in the 50s?) floating around in space (which was visited by one person a dog and a monkey up to this point) making aircraft fly without people.

The wedge was just one example. There are many basic ways to fool RADAR and AFAIK, all military jets carry ways of countering any RADAR and can counter that RADAR counter. It get's funny because you have counter-counter-counter measures. True story.
There is a lot beyond our traditional understanding, and trying to understand what we don't understand is a better jumping off point than squinting at low-res photos and disagreeing with more obvious explanations.

The theory of Pan-spermia, is that life came to the planet from an extra-terrestrial source, in the strictest definitions of the word. A meteor/asteroid/comet (which ever one of those is classified as a space rock that lands on Earth) apparently carried micro-organisms or the building blocks of life on it, which made us. So i have no problem believing 'life' exists outside of our planet and solar system. Whether that life has been in contact with us, well that's a different discussion. I'm not sure what you mean by disasters and that. I just mean that evolution, life, whatever it all is, existed for a billion years without being aware of it's surroundings. I mean, you could argue that humanity wasn't really self-aware until the great thinkers pondered and answered some of life's simplest questions, only a few 1000 years ago. Then again, the Crocodile hasn't evolved for 200 million years, so maybe we have reached our peak?

As for looking at the unexplainable. First understand the tricks the human mind plays on itself. There's a reason sales is a thing and that marketing and adverts make so much money, and it isn't because you want to buy that product.

The most famous example of aircraft flares are the 'Angel of Death' aka C130/AC130, aka Killstreak on MW2

 

[Romulus]

Fair enough. It would have blown my mind to think computers (what were they in the 50s?) floating around in space (which was visited by one person a dog and a monkey up to this point) making aircraft fly without people.

The wedge was just one example. There are many basic ways to fool RADAR and AFAIK, all military jets carry ways of countering any RADAR and can counter that RADAR counter. It get's funny because you have counter-counter-counter measures. True story.
There is a lot beyond our traditional understanding, and trying to understand what we don't understand is a better jumping off point than squinting at low-res photos and disagreeing with more obvious explanations.

The theory of Pan-spermia, is that life came to the planet from an extra-terrestrial source, in the strictest definitions of the word. A meteor/asteroid/comet (which ever one of those is classified as a space rock that lands on Earth) apparently carried micro-organisms or the building blocks of life on it, which made us. So i have no problem believing 'life' exists outside of our planet and solar system. Whether that life has been in contact with us, well that's a different discussion. I'm not sure what you mean by disasters and that. I just mean that evolution, life, whatever it all is, existed for a billion years without being aware of it's surroundings. I mean, you could argue that humanity wasn't really self-aware until the great thinkers pondered and answered some of life's simplest questions, only a few 1000 years ago. Then again, the Crocodile hasn't evolved for 200 million years, so maybe we have reached our peak?

As for looking at the unexplainable. First understand the tricks the human mind plays on itself. There's a reason sales is a thing and that marketing and adverts make so much money, and it isn't because you want to buy that product.

The most famous example of aircraft flares are the 'Angel of Death' aka C130/AC130, aka Killstreak on MW2

Yeah alot of human technology impresses me but that's because I don't have any perspective other than what we can do. But I'm talking about laws of physics being broken in these cases. I understand radar can be fooled and that's true but when you have several radars bringing back the same data and pilots seeing these things zip off at speeds they can't even understand that's significant. Not only that radar returns seem to show similar speeds dating back many decades. It seems there's a cruising speed of about 4000 miles per hour and an ultra-fast "Let's get the fuck outta here" 50,000mph. And it's instant, no visible proposition, no acceleration, and can stop on a time. Human metals and humans would literally explode with that sort of speed and stop. So, in those cases it would need to be a 1940s hypersonic... drone. With metals, computer systems, and proposition completely unknown. 1940-50s.

The flare vid you posted looks cool, but its not similar to what I'm seeing at all. Especially that first and third video.