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[infinitys_7th]

They are not real.

Documents about these two are hundreds of years older than when they are supposed to have lived. That means a cult invented these characters as figureheads.

Indians say Shiva and Krishna were real and walking around, westerners say they are myths. Indians have GIANT history books about all of these characters and Indians believe they are real. Westerners look at them as mythology books.

The Bible etc are mythology books.

No one there at the time in the mideast, such as Greeks mentioned a magic guy. Mohamed was supposed to have gone on one this sweeping crusade and no one at the time mentions it in any historical text.

I learned about verifying fantastic claims via outside sources by researching religious topics. That is the number one test if something fantastic is claimed.

thousands of years from now people may wonder who went to the moon first. Maybe we will have gone 5,000 times by then. So, if reports exist then they can find that the US claimed it and many others countries had the same reports. If North Korea is currently claim to have invented the car, only they will have those reports, meaning they are false.

Mormons say that Native Americans are the lost tribe of Isreal. If you are Mormon you will believe this. However, there's not outside sources that say Native Americans are mideast people. All evidence indicates they are not. However, if Mormons took over the world, most people would believe it about Native Americans.

If one culture is making fantastic claims, it is probably not true.

So, the US has a LOT of UFO claims and the MILITARY reports a lot of sightings.

The military is the same as a cult/religion as it's a tight knit, elitist, secret, manipulative, group of people. So, that suggests they may generate a lot of lies like religions do. Religious lies are filled with logic holes and so are these UFO stories as they defy human nature. That means a lack of panic, feeling insulted, etc.

Like I have been saying, there's more countries than the US and what are the UFO reports from other countries? Nonwesternized countries would be very important to learn about.

If there are few or none, it means UFOs are some manipulation going on in western culture.

Its the same reason why people defend the existence of Jesus vs Krishna.

Are you an Amazing Randi fan?

 

[Zippitydodaday]

I have had a very weird dream last night where in my dream I was being followed by a floating ship and then went on this weird adventure. Almost like I was on some crazy acid and was fighting something and also had some weird sex lol I turned into something later into it and I had a partner that was going through the same thing and she was the one that I had this weird acid trip sex with. Then I “woke up” but I was actually in a dream still and was in a restaurant of some sort with other people that was going through similar situation and walked outside and saw people fighting and I tried to climb into my vehicle to leave and they wouldn’t let me and they looked like normal people but very tall.

Somehow I was then in an area like a ship and was being chased by this weird diamond shape that looked like it was charging up but I kept running and then escaped. I “woke up” again and then heard a voice click inside my head asking how did it feel being abducted and I replied I replied I don’t recall ever being abducted and then remembering in my dream it freaked me out that they were inside my head and then finally woke up for real. It was very weird dream, I may need to calm down on my ufo research lol

 

[TheAdlerian]

You just unpacked a lot of stuff in one post. Some of this is very logical, but then some of it seems historically... loose. If it was how you say, there'd be no question in dismissing the existence of Jesus. It's not that clean, in other words. The truth is that there are external historical sources that reference Jesus. Additionally, the absence of evidence of something is never the proof that something doesn't exist. I say this in reference to old testament figures such as Moses, et al. It's a fact that there are many historical details that are local to some groups of people you may not find mentioned elsewhere. It's also a fact that historical record keeping was quite limited thousands of years ago. Whether people are big liars or not, these historical anecdotes are the bulk of what we have from those time periods.

Secondly, let's talk about government responses to real things. Take climate change as an example of an instance where government response does not match level of severity of a thing. If we based the reality of climate change purely on government response, you'd have to believe it's not real or that it's misrepresented in size and severity. Right? If people and politicians behaved in a vacuum of sorts, that would be a very logical conclusion. However, the complexity of the situation is huge with an unfathomable amount of factors and variables at play politically. I'm inclined to give your hypothesis as much credence as any other that, perhaps, the UAP is another political war game being played globally. We've seen stories out of China regarding UAP disrupting an air port -- the US lending credibility to the unknown-ness of these objects should only further accelerate the communist chinese government's apprehension that there are these things intruding into their air space and "public space" that would seem to undermine their superiority over their own national space. Right?

That seems awfully darn convenient for the free world, so it makes me wonder, as well. Still, there are these undeniable facts of objects traveling at physically absurd speeds going back to WW2 that would seem to be nearly impossible to explain unless one of these other scenarios have credibility. Furthermore, it can always be a case of two things being correct at once, ie. 1) there are these other technologically advanced beings we didn't know about 2) the US govt decided to use these UAP to freak China out in a covert information war campaign. Seems plausible.

The historical comments I made are a great indicator of emotionally charged thinking and how it affects orientation to reality.

If I said "Krishna never existed" most readers would be like, haha, yes of course. But, the Jesus story is absurd nonsense, but due to the emotions surrounding that and Judaism in the US, typically, people will flip out, insult you, etc if you say it's not real. If you say judaism is nonsense and not real, and stupid to believe in, what will happen to you?

Things that are bad, or you had better be saying it anonymously.

That is just an example of how intensely dedicated people can be to something that is not real and isn't believe in by outside cultures. That's why I brought that up. I want to research what other countries are saying about UFOs.

According to stories, people in the west have been seeing UFOs since the 1500s. But, have Mongolians been seeing them since the 1500s?

Government:

In the west, we use political and economic ideas as neo religions.

They are ideas that are fantasy based. If you read the source material for capitalism and communism, it's highly unlikely that humans will ever do either properly, so they will never work. Allan Watts the Buddhist talks about this kind of thing. He noted that capitalists will not build a hospital due to "money" when a hospital is made by people out of types of dirt.

So, the idea that we "don't have enough money" is a delusion caused by our culture.

Climate change has been an issue since I was very little in the early 70s. An ice age was coming, greenhouse, ozone hole, global warming and now climate change. All of that is largely due to communist delusional beliefs that humans making products are destroying the world.

I have noted that people tend not to react to nonsense in the same way they do real threats.

Last year when the UFO news hit I was astounded. Then, I started noticing the bland presentation and that next to no one is interested. The same goes with climate change. We are stuck in the culture we live in and people aren't going to stop using straws or carry metal ones lol. People will stick with what they have to get through their lives and Greta or whoever aren't going to stop people from using plastic bottles. So, there's a bland reaction to climate change from most people.

I do not see how there could be a bland reaction to UFOs if we are talking about military people and the general public. I do not believe the military believe in it enough to have even a simulated reaction. So, it's like a poorly told lie meant to maybe have some effect.

In addition, you said the craft were moving at super speeds and whatnot, but do we KNOW anyone who saw it? No, we have people telling you they did.

I work in psychology and I'll tell you what, I could invent a new mental health condition, and tell you all about it in Bob Lazar fashion. Many people would believe me even though they never met anyone with that condition. If the government is doing that via a bunch of operatives, many would think it legit.

 

[TheAdlerian]

I used to like him on TV when I was a kid but haven't thought about the guy much in the last couple of decades. He was a good figure to counteract 70s and 80s pop culture mysticism.

 

[TheAdlerian]

Understand this is not a contained phenomenon. By the verbiage used, you want consistency across the world. The US, UK, Peru, Brazil, Russia, Norway, Iran, Canada, and many others all have evidence-based UFO programs, and the information is very similar. Only some of them came out recently with their own information. Go back several posts and look at the Norweigan-based scientific story where a village claimed incredible sightings. Scientists called their bluff and set up a camera for over 30 years that monitored 24/7. Well, the people weren't lying. Absolutely incredible findings that are extremely similar to stuff seen in the US and across the globe and very consistent with WW2 sightings from fighter pilots across 4 nations during the war. Orbs that could accelerate incredibly fast, stop on a dime, and were invulnerable to gunfire in the war. The Norwegian study tracked them at 18000mph. Now, is everyone lying? Is the US paying villagers and scientists across the globe for almost 100 years now?

I am not saying everyone is lying.

However, I don't "need to believe" in UFOs and I'm not going to believe in anything that isn't common knowledge to many people. I don't care what the topic is. If it's not real, like operational right now, I am inclined to believe it's the result of human psychology.

However, what gets me are the constant stories through history.

Also, I find it weird that humans have been on Earth for a huge amount of time but we have only recently developed machines. So, I can easily believe that 100k years ago, or whatever, a pocket of people developed machines we haven't thought of yet.

I can also believe that humans really know nothing about physics and most of it is just delusions to make us feel smart and some alien race can visit Earth easily and we are being studied.

I can see all of it as being true but I'm an Occam's Razor kind of guy and know our media and government constantly reinforces delusions and almost never says anything real about life. If a tornado hits, things get real, but if it's about daily life it's fantasy information. So, I'm inclined to believe people are lying vs a hidden group of Hindus have UFOs.

Can you point me to the Norweigan situation?

I have been interested in this topic for decades never heard of it.

Anyway, my point about outside reports is that I would like to see UFO reports from cultures not friendly to the west. So it would be like your ex mother in-law having to admit you are right, get it?

 

[showernota]

They are not real.

Documents about these two are hundreds of years older than when they are supposed to have lived. That means a cult invented these characters as figureheads.

This is demonstrably false. The surviving manuscript copies of the New Testament can be dated as early as the 2nd century. Considering these are copies, that means the originals are even older.

Beyond that, we have the writings of early church leaders like Polycarp, Ignatius, and Irenaeus from ~108-180 AD.

Beyond that we have Josephus, the Babylonian Talmud, Pliny the Younger, etc all remarking on the existence of a certain Jesus/Yeshua/Christus who was worshipped as a God, or was a sorcerer. I can’t understand someone being so averse to the Bible that they just pretend Jesus never existed.

Its the same reason why people defend the existence of Jesus vs Krishna.

Fun fact, the Krishna mythos wasn’t even established until 400-600 years after Jesus. It borrows heavily from the life of Jesus. Pretty weird for the ‘oldest religion.’

Back on topic, it feels like there has been an uptick in awareness of this soft disclosure going on. It will be interesting to see what the report later this month tells us.

 

[StormCell]

The historical comments I made are a great indicator of emotionally charged thinking and how it affects orientation to reality.

If I said "Krishna never existed" most readers would be like, haha, yes of course. But, the Jesus story is absurd nonsense, but due to the emotions surrounding that and Judaism in the US, typically, people will flip out, insult you, etc if you say it's not real. If you say judaism is nonsense and not real, and stupid to believe in, what will happen to you?

Things that are bad, or you had better be saying it anonymously.

That is just an example of how intensely dedicated people can be to something that is not real and isn't believe in by outside cultures. That's why I brought that up. I want to research what other countries are saying about UFOs.

According to stories, people in the west have been seeing UFOs since the 1500s. But, have Mongolians been seeing them since the 1500s?

Government:

In the west, we use political and economic ideas as neo religions.

They are ideas that are fantasy based. If you read the source material for capitalism and communism, it's highly unlikely that humans will ever do either properly, so they will never work. Allan Watts the Buddhist talks about this kind of thing. He noted that capitalists will not build a hospital due to "money" when a hospital is made by people out of types of dirt.

So, the idea that we "don't have enough money" is a delusion caused by our culture.

Climate change has been an issue since I was very little in the early 70s. An ice age was coming, greenhouse, ozone hole, global warming and now climate change. All of that is largely due to communist delusional beliefs that humans making products are destroying the world.

I have noted that people tend not to react to nonsense in the same way they do real threats.

Last year when the UFO news hit I was astounded. Then, I started noticing the bland presentation and that next to no one is interested. The same goes with climate change. We are stuck in the culture we live in and people aren't going to stop using straws or carry metal ones lol. People will stick with what they have to get through their lives and Greta or whoever aren't going to stop people from using plastic bottles. So, there's a bland reaction to climate change from most people.

I do not see how there could be a bland reaction to UFOs if we are talking about military people and the general public. I do not believe the military believe in it enough to have even a simulated reaction. So, it's like a poorly told lie meant to maybe have some effect.

In addition, you said the craft were moving at super speeds and whatnot, but do we KNOW anyone who saw it? No, we have people telling you they did.

I work in psychology and I'll tell you what, I could invent a new mental health condition, and tell you all about it in Bob Lazar fashion. Many people would believe me even though they never met anyone with that condition. If the government is doing that via a bunch of operatives, many would think it legit.

I just wanted to give you some props. I may not agree with or like everything you say, but I am enjoying this conversation immensely. It's just nice to talk about something as potentially significant as this in an emotionally detached manner. My wife, by comparison, cannot handle topics with such huge stakes or implications, whereas I'm all systems go. If it's this significant and supposedly real, put the cards on the table for the world to see. I'll gladly accept the outcome, so to speak...

 

[Shadowplay1979]

This is demonstrably false. The surviving manuscript copies of the New Testament can be dated as early as the 2nd century. Considering these are copies, that means the originals are even older.

Beyond that, we have the writings of early church leaders like Polycarp, Ignatius, and Irenaeus from ~108-180 AD.

Beyond that we have Josephus, the Babylonian Talmud, Pliny the Younger, etc all remarking on the existence of a certain Jesus/Yeshua/Christus who was worshipped as a God, or was a sorcerer. I can’t understand someone being so averse to the Bible that they just pretend Jesus never existed.

Fun fact, the Krishna mythos wasn’t even established until 400-600 years after Jesus. It borrows heavily from the life of Jesus. Pretty weird for the ‘oldest religion.’

Back on topic, it feels like there has been an uptick in awareness of this soft disclosure going on. It will be interesting to see what the report later this month tells us.

Everyone you mentioned was not a contemporary of when jesus supposedly existed, they were all born half a century after he was supposed to have died. There is zero record in Roman history of Jesus, no the Roman did not "erase history". they kept immaculate documentation of both their accomplishments and failures , friends and enemies. What there IS found in roman history is plenty of mentions of small cults popping up in the empire, of which christianity was one...a love-in cult very different from people would know it as now.

This is really off topic though and prob better left for another discussion.

 

[TheAdlerian]

This is demonstrably false. The surviving manuscript copies of the New Testament can be dated as early as the 2nd century. Considering these are copies, that means the originals are even older.

Beyond that, we have the writings of early church leaders like Polycarp, Ignatius, and Irenaeus from ~108-180 AD.

Beyond that we have Josephus, the Babylonian Talmud, Pliny the Younger, etc all remarking on the existence of a certain Jesus/Yeshua/Christus who was worshipped as a God, or was a sorcerer. I can’t understand someone being so averse to the Bible that they just pretend Jesus never existed.

Fun fact, the Krishna mythos wasn’t even established until 400-600 years after Jesus. It borrows heavily from the life of Jesus. Pretty weird for the ‘oldest religion.’

Back on topic, it feels like there has been an uptick in awareness of this soft disclosure going on. It will be interesting to see what the report later this month tells us.

I'm sorry but you don't know what you're talking about.

The documents regarding Jesus are in Greek, developed hundreds of years after the supposed events, and are cult fantasy writings.

Christians included Christine stuff into Beowolf for instance, to make sure it wasn't destroyed by the cult. So, comments about Jesus from people in Italy are likely to not be real.

Jesus was not a magic human who lives in the mideast. Jesus is a name like "kevin" and lots of people were called that so he wasn't like some modern celeb with a name you never heard of before. He was Kevin, or was he the other Kevin, or did the cult use the name Kevin because it's an everyman name.

I used the point about Jesus to stir people up and prove about about believing nonsense.

In addition, Krishna and Buddha probably inspired the myth of Jesus. There's 10,000 year old drawings of Shiva and many of the Indian stories have been going on far longer than mideast stuff.

Judaism is supposed to by a hybrid of Zoroastrianism and other stuff. That religion is morphed from Indian ideas. Circumcision is an Indian practice for low caste members to take their mind off of sex, for instance. All of that migrated from India up into the mideast.

Getting back to the topic of UFOs, my point again is that if people believe all of this religious mythology and defend it, while casually rejecting outside religion, then it goes to show how poorly the human mind working in the majority of people. That then opens them up to manipulation by people who are smarter and more mentally organized.

I have a feeling that is going on with the UFO story now. In the 60s and 70s psychics were a HUGE thing and that was inspired by the CIA using counterintelligence against the soviets by spreading lies about psychics.

So, what is more likely, UFOs are being seen by mostly military/government agents or they are real and mostly being seen by government agents?

That's my point.

 

[StormCell]

I am not saying everyone is lying.

However, I don't "need to believe" in UFOs and I'm not going to believe in anything that isn't common knowledge to many people. I don't care what the topic is. If it's not real, like operational right now, I am inclined to believe it's the result of human psychology.

However, what gets me are the constant stories through history.

Also, I find it weird that humans have been on Earth for a huge amount of time but we have only recently developed machines. So, I can easily believe that 100k years ago, or whatever, a pocket of people developed machines we haven't thought of yet.

Since you're a psychologist, I would inquire as to whether you have included your model of thinking how people react to situations that are too immense or severe for them to fully understand. I believe that people simply cannot accept that the world they are living in is being damaged in the way that they are hearing. After all, what was suitable for thousands of years of people, generation to generation, should be suitable going forward, right? Call it a form of mass denial. People hear there are aliens, but then how can there suddenly be aliens after thousands of years of no aliens? Or no contact with aliens. Why would it change now? Plus, the implications of such a thing exposes humanity's fragility -- we have been the kings of our dimension all this time, how can there possibly be something else, someone else who is not human, that is superior to us and yet not god?

It destroys the human paradigm. We may not be mentally disposed to accept it. Even our shows about aliens always have humans at the forefront of all the things. Seems rather human RACIST to me, but then I've never met anything else wired to understand and be offended by THAT, so I digress.

 

[TheAdlerian]

I just wanted to give you some props. I may not agree with or like everything you say, but I am enjoying this conversation immensely. It's just nice to talk about something as potentially significant as this in an emotionally detached manner. My wife, by comparison, cannot handle topics with such huge stakes or implications, whereas I'm all systems go. If it's this significant and supposedly real, put the cards on the table for the world to see. I'll gladly accept the outcome, so to speak...

Thanks!

I FUCKING LOVE this topic and am fascinated as HELL about it!!

WHAT THE FUCK is the government doing admitting there's UFO!!??

WHY IS NO ONE INTERESTED!!??

I can't stand it, lol.

If this stuff is real, we either have new technology we are aching to reveal, a hidden civilization, or there are fucking aliens. What the hell, that is amazing and if it is real it is THE MOST interesting thing in human history, even if man made.

However, I'm a psychotherapist and I have been dealing with criminals and mental illness for almost 32 years. So, I am not inclined to trust people or believe in wild stories very much. It's one reason I know a lot about religion, it's verbally transmitted mental illness, like a thought virus.

UFO stuff has the "thought virus" quality about it.

Anything that "some people" experience and may open up a "new world" of ideas is enough to drive certain people crazy. I think men are very susceptible to fake hope and fake discovery while women tend not to care so much. However, if a hurricane s coming, men and women are going to be equally interested.

There a lot of suspicious emotions and lack of them about this topic.

With that being said, I can't wait to find out what happens next. Even if it's lies it's lying on an unprecedented scale, lol.

 

[showernota]

Everyone you mentioned was not a contemporary of when jesus supposedly existed, they were all born half a century after he was supposed to have died. There is zero record in Roman history of Jesus, no the Roman did not "erase history".

Tacitus and Josephus were not born half a century later.

I'm sorry but you don't know what you're talking about.

It looks like you didn’t read anything in my post, and wrote a lot of opinion without anything backing it up. Check out the manuscript evidence of Zoroastrianism sometime, it’s all newer than 100AD.

 

[INC]

WHY IS NO ONE INTERESTED!!??

Because talk is cheap, until they show a piece of the craft or being, it'll stay myth, or a president or prime minister etc etc announce it live on TV

I'm generalising people not into the subject here too

 

[TheAdlerian]

Since you're a psychologist, I would inquire as to whether you have included your model of thinking how people react to situations that are too immense or severe for them to fully understand. I believe that people simply cannot accept that the world they are living in is being damaged in the way that they are hearing. After all, what was suitable for thousands of years of people, generation to generation, should be suitable going forward, right? Call it a form of mass denial. People hear there are aliens, but then how can there suddenly be aliens after thousands of years of no aliens? Or no contact with aliens. Why would it change now? Plus, the implications of such a thing exposes humanity's fragility -- we have been the kings of our dimension all this time, how can there possibly be something else, someone else who is not human, that is superior to us and yet not god?

It destroys the human paradigm. We may not be mentally disposed to accept it. Even our shows about aliens always have humans at the forefront of all the things. Seems rather human RACIST to me, but then I've never met anything else wired to understand and be offended by THAT, so I digress.

That's a great bunch of points.

A small scale version is the "Bystander Effect" where people see a health crisis and just stand there. They are stunned and don't know what they should do, hope someone else will do it, and don't feel competent to fight the crisis.

Also, there some terror to the idea of UFOs. If I got your number and called to say I was coming in your house tonight, you probably wouldn't feel great in the house. If your safe zone is suddenly maybe not safe, now what?

In general life, you could go to a hotel, the cops, etc. But, what if Earth is not safe and we aren't in control and something can watch us and defeat anything we have, the psychological effect would be one never experienced by humans.

I have tested telling this to friends of mine and INSTANTLY the say "BOOOLLSHIT" and I am like, why bullshit, here it is in the New York Times? It's was in the Covid bill, so what do you think. People always go quiet on me.

Since these are loved ones, I don't pres it. But, I have to say as a person who judges reactions and stuff all day, I am puzzled.

If I was Superman I would immediately crash into the Pentagon and demand answers lol. This is news that is way more important than anything else. Even if lies it's the question of why people in government are lying. If truth, I would think they would need to totally spill it and tell the whole truth.

 

[Shadowplay1979]

Everyone you mentioned was not a contemporary of when jesus supposedly existed, they were all born half a century after he was supposed to have died. There is zero record in Roman history of Jesus, no the Roman did not "erase history". they kept immaculate documentation of both their accomplishments and failures , friends and enemies. What there IS found in roman history is plenty of mentions of small cults popping up in the empire, of which christianity was one...a love-in cult very different from people would know it as now.

This is really off topic though and prob better left for another discussion.

Tacitus and Josephus were not born half a century later.



It looks like you didn’t read anything in my post, and wrote a lot of opinion without anything backing it up. Check out the manuscript evidence of Zoroastrianism sometime, it’s all newer than 100AD.

Tacitus was born AD 56

Josephus was born in AD 37

 

[TheAdlerian]

Tacitus and Josephus were not born half a century later.



It looks like you didn’t read anything in my post, and wrote a lot of opinion without anything backing it up. Check out the manuscript evidence of Zoroastrianism sometime, it’s all newer than 100AD.

I have read all of Tacitus.

He was basically a CIA agent for the Romans. He would go to places to learn all about the culture and the goal was learning about it led to undermining it. His books were written ON SITE as reports to his government. He wasn't born when Jesus supposedly lived.

As I mentioned about Beowulf, Christian stuff was added to prevent it from being destroyed. That's a fact.

No one can be sure if what is written is from Tacitus. However, if it is it refers to "christ" which he didn't believe in getting killed. So, we had Jim Jones, the guy from Waco Texas get killed, the Japanese gas bombing dude, and how many more crazy people who claimed to be messiahs have gotten killed? The Christian cult was underway and probably countless messiahs got killed.

I jewish culture it was a business move to make a new cult, come up with a new book of the bible, to be the new prophet, etc. There's many books excluded for the Bible as people concluded they were bullshit.

People had no money, no skills, and no opportunity in that part of the world and so they would hustle magic stories to trick people into giving them money. That's the culture of that place. Some say, it inspired Hollywood, lol.

 

[showernota]

Tacitus was born AD 56

Josephus was born in AD 37

I really don’t want to keep this going, but Jesus was crucified in 30-33 AD. I’m going to assume you know how long half a century is.

I have read all of Tacitus.

He was basically a CIA agent for the Romans. He would go to places to learn all about the culture and the goal was learning about it led to undermining it. His books were written ON SITE as reports to his government. He wasn't born when Jesus supposedly lived.

As I mentioned about Beowulf, Christian stuff was added to prevent it from being destroyed. That's a fact.

No one can be sure if what is written is from Tacitus. However, if it is it refers to "christ" which he didn't believe in getting killed. So, we had Jim Jones, the guy from Waco Texas get killed, the Japanese gas bombing dude, and how many more crazy people who claimed to be messiahs have gotten killed? The Christian cult was underway and probably countless messiahs got killed.

I jewish culture it was a business move to make a new cult, come up with a new book of the bible, to be the new prophet, etc. There's many books excluded for the Bible as people concluded they were bullshit.

People had no money, no skills, and no opportunity in that part of the world and so they would hustle magic stories to trick people into giving them money. That's the culture of that place. Some say, it inspired Hollywood, lol.

Ok then.

 

[TheAdlerian]

Because talk is cheap, until they show a piece of the craft or being, it'll stay myth, or a president or prime minister etc etc announce it live on TV

I'm generalising people not into the subject here too

Yes.

I have worked for the government and tend to respect certain types of people. In addition, I almost never lie, so I tend to believe other "serious" type people are not lying. That's a fault of mine.

I tend to believe if General Smith is saying something, he means it, but that is not how humans typically operate. I know many people who assume everyone is lying, and that's what you are saying causes the reaction.

 

[TheAdlerian]

I really don’t want to keep this going, but Jesus was crucified in 30-33 AD. I’m going to assume you know how long half a century is.



Ok then.

Yeah, we don't need to argue about this.

My point was that I'm curious what outside and unfriendly countries have to say about UFOs.

We can all agree that people once believed in Thor and now he's a cartoon. Pick any god you want, at one point people would have killed you if you said he didn't exist.

A want to know they are reporting cigar shaped UFOs in North Korea and North Koreans can't wait for the US to help them identify what they are. If Kim Jong said, "I'm in to learn about di sheet" then I would be impressed.

 

[Zippitydodaday]

If you haven’t been watching these, I would highly recommend it!

 

[StormCell]

Yeah, we don't need to argue about this.

My point was that I'm curious what outside and unfriendly countries have to say about UFOs.

We can all agree that people once believed in Thor and now he's a cartoon. Pick any god you want, at one point people would have killed you if you said he didn't exist.

A want to know they are reporting cigar shaped UFOs in North Korea and North Koreans can't wait for the US to help them identify what they are. If Kim Jong said, "I'm in to learn about di sheet" then I would be impressed.

Yeah, I also agree there's no point in arguing. I have all the proof in my own life regarding Jesus. It takes that kind of evidence experienced in your own life to come to this conclusion. Mine is mine. I was not someone who wanted to believe, but I have enough experiential evidence to tell you of the truth. It's better served in a different setting.

 

[Burnttips]

The only thing that leaves me questioning aliens is what John Radcliffe said. It very likely that projects are not disclosed to people appointed to positions. Every time Trump was asked about aliens he started talking about the military.

 

[INC]

The only thing that leaves me questioning aliens is what John Radcliffe said. It very likely that projects are not disclosed to people appointed to positions. Every time Trump was asked about aliens he started talking about the military.

Wouldn't surprise me if trump is just spouting shit as normal, and repeating something he heard on cable news and believing he actually done something

 

[Wheeljack539]

The only thing that leaves me questioning aliens is what John Radcliffe said. It very likely that projects are not disclosed to people appointed to positions. Every time Trump was asked about aliens he started talking about the military.

There are supposedly something like 32 levels above Top Secret that the US President does not have access to.

Also, I definitely agree that we have likely had really advanced tech that is still kept under wraps however the Foo Fighters ufo sightings of WWII that does get mentioned a lot is older.

Wasn't there a ufo crash in some rural town in the early 1900s where the locals actually buried "the space man"?

 

[Shadowplay1979]

I really don’t want to keep this going, but Jesus was crucified in 30-33 AD. I’m going to assume you know how long half a century is.



Ok then.

Wait so you are hung up on the "half a century" and the fact that i tossed a random timeframe of half a century. Do you know what first hand accounts are and contemporary mean? None of these people lived contemporary to when jesus was supposed to be alive. I dont care if they were born the next day..its not contemporary.

 

[infinitys_7th]

The only thing that leaves me questioning aliens is what John Radcliffe said. It very likely that projects are not disclosed to people appointed to positions. Every time Trump was asked about aliens he started talking about the military.

You've got heavy compartmentalization, and whatever tech the military or other people got is in the hands of private contractors.

I know a lot of people don't buy Bob Lazar's story, but I genuinely think he had some kind of involvement in research into this tech. One of his stories sticks with me - he remembered getting onto a plane traveling to S4 and then remembers getting off, but with nothing in between. If you accept that, you can't take anything else he says seriously because his memories were likely being fucked with. That sort of discrepancy is interesting to me, and if you apply it to this situation. . .

 

[Romulus]

I am not saying everyone is lying.

However, I don't "need to believe" in UFOs and I'm not going to believe in anything that isn't common knowledge to many people. I don't care what the topic is. If it's not real, like operational right now, I am inclined to believe it's the result of human psychology.

However, what gets me are the constant stories through history.

Also, I find it weird that humans have been on Earth for a huge amount of time but we have only recently developed machines. So, I can easily believe that 100k years ago, or whatever, a pocket of people developed machines we haven't thought of yet.

I can also believe that humans really know nothing about physics and most of it is just delusions to make us feel smart and some alien race can visit Earth easily and we are being studied.

I can see all of it as being true but I'm an Occam's Razor kind of guy and know our media and government constantly reinforces delusions and almost never says anything real about life. If a tornado hits, things get real, but if it's about daily life it's fantasy information. So, I'm inclined to believe people are lying vs a hidden group of Hindus have UFOs.

Can you point me to the Norweigan situation?

I have been interested in this topic for decades never heard of it.

Anyway, my point about outside reports is that I would like to see UFO reports from cultures not friendly to the west. So it would be like your ex mother in-law having to admit you are right, get it?

How can you say on one hand that you won't believe in anything unless it's common human knowledge, yet mock humans for taking so long to create machines and give humans underhanded jabs about delusions of religions or myths? Maybe a lot of common knowledge as we know it is meaningless?

I mean, what isn't more delusional than our current situation with science right now? We think we have it figured out and yet our basic understanding of the basic pillars of physics are literally in question. We choose to believe things based on that though. Sounds like religion in a way. Blindly buying it It would be like the top priests telling their subjects that they're not sure about their bible anymore. lol.

 

[TheAdlerian]

How can you say on one hand that you won't believe in anything unless it's common human knowledge, yet mock humans for taking so long to create machines and give humans underhanded jabs about delusions of religions or myths? Maybe a lot of common knowledge as we know it is meaningless?

I mean, what isn't more delusional than our current situation with science right now? We think we have it figured out and yet our basic understanding of the basic pillars of physics are literally in question. We choose to believe things based on that though. Sounds like religion in a way. Blindly buying it It would be like the top priests telling their subjects that they're not sure about their bible anymore. lo

There's a good philosophy book written a long time ago by Hans Vaihinger called The Philosophy of As If.

It's based on the ideas of the Philosopher Kant. He basically said that since there is no god and no reason for anything, we must lie and pretend there is. That's called the Categorical Imperative.

So, "All men are created equal" is not true, but you believe it's not true, then it makes sense to just kill or enslave inferior people. In Kantian Philosophy it says that you had better say they are equal to avoid that and why are they equal, it's a mystery only god knows.

Vaihinger wrote his book about how all of that plays out in MANY aspects of life. It's about pretending AS IF something is true even though it's not. We do that to explain things and to create pretend order. He talked about how a lot of math and science ideas are not true. We don't know how to solve the problem and so forth but that would spin things out of control psychologically for people, so we lie and say we know.

It's a great but depressing book.

So, I do not believe things unless it's very certain. For instance, cars are amazing but I have plenty of proof they are real. It's crazy that jumbo jets exist and that they are operated by super fans and hold over a hundred people or you can carry tanks in a plane, etc. I don't know how it works, but I know it's real.

I am pretty sure all kinds of dust mites, bacteria, etc live on my skin and that's like the surface of a planet to them with skin dinner areas and pools of oil to jump around in. I am pretty sure that's happening on my body, but if someone told me electron microscope pics were fake, I might believe it.

However, no one can tell me jumbo jets are fake but they are weirder than micro bugs living on me.

My point in this is that UFOs seem to only be seen by certain types of people. The first is maybe crazy people. It's never like a happy go lucky family, it's loners, etc. The second group is military people. They are part of a cult like group even though they are seen as heroes, they aren't. They are a cult of liars and murderers when they have to be.

So, no matter what the results are this June when they come out, I will not believe it until average people of a wide variety make reports and video.

 

[TheAdlerian]

You've got heavy compartmentalization, and whatever tech the military or other people got is in the hands of private contractors.

I know a lot of people don't buy Bob Lazar's story, but I genuinely think he had some kind of involvement in research into this tech. One of his stories sticks with me - he remembered getting onto a plane traveling to S4 and then remembers getting off, but with nothing in between. If you accept that, you can't take anything else he says seriously because his memories were likely being fucked with. That sort of discrepancy is interesting to me, and if you apply it to this situation. . .

I believe Lazare is either lying or is part of psy ops.

I am an excellent lie detector and it does not look like Lazar is lying.

That puzzled the hell out of me until I figured out a way to do that. I have written some science fiction books and if I told you the story, I would not be lying. If I told the story of Star Wars on a lie detector test, I would not come up as lying.

Get it? If I'm telling a story I am not lying about it. I am not lying that Luke Skywalker's dad is Darth Vader, because that's TRUE. However, it's not reality

So, I think Lazar is telling us his science fiction story, and that's why he seems genuine.

or

Psy Ops:

I mentioned that I work in healthcare.

A practice in healthcare is to attract doctors to stay in hospitals. If you have a very good surgeon, you want him to stay because his rep will grow and all of his patients will use your hospital. So, hospitals will pay top salaries and give all kinds of benefits and luxuries to doctors to get them to stay.

Doctors are a dime a dozen compared to scientists who could figure out an alien spaceship.

If the government had ships it would throw money and the best stuff at the scientists. It would keep them in paradise so they never wanted to leave. Also, if you did want to leave, they would probably have to kill you. I would legit kill anyone who didn't want to work on it once they started. You cannot let someone like that loose on society or going to the enemy.

If Lazar is not lying, I believe that he was shown fake things and they let loose on the public to be a dupe of propaganda that he would spread innocently.

A major clue to me was when he said the ship had no bathroom. That made me think of movie sets. No one goes to the bathroom in the movies and so a set maker building a UFO set would not put in a bathroom.

So, if he's telling the truth I think he's being used as someone who could take a lie detector test and pass, because he believes what he saw.

On a side note, Mission Impossible the TV show was all about doing that kind of thing. They were psy ops meant to brainwash people into thinking reality was different than it is. So, would the government do that, sure.

 

[Romulus]

There's a good philosophy book written a long time ago by Hans Vaihinger called The Philosophy of As If.

It's based on the ideas of the Philosopher Kant. He basically said that since there is no god and no reason for anything, we must lie and pretend there is. That's called the Categorical Imperative.

So, "All men are created equal" is not true, but you believe it's not true, then it makes sense to just kill or enslave inferior people. In Kantian Philosophy it says that you had better say they are equal to avoid that and why are they equal, it's a mystery only god knows.

Vaihinger wrote his book about how all of that plays out in MANY aspects of life. It's about pretending AS IF something is true even though it's not. We do that to explain things and to create pretend order. He talked about how a lot of math and science ideas are not true. We don't know how to solve the problem and so forth but that would spin things out of control psychologically for people, so we lie and say we know.

It's a great but depressing book.

So, I do not believe things unless it's very certain. For instance, cars are amazing but I have plenty of proof they are real. It's crazy that jumbo jets exist and that they are operated by super fans and hold over a hundred people or you can carry tanks in a plane, etc. I don't know how it works, but I know it's real.

I am pretty sure all kinds of dust mites, bacteria, etc live on my skin and that's like the surface of a planet to them with skin dinner areas and pools of oil to jump around in. I am pretty sure that's happening on my body, but if someone told me electron microscope pics were fake, I might believe it.

However, no one can tell me jumbo jets are fake but they are weirder than micro bugs living on me.

My point in this is that UFOs seem to only be seen by certain types of people. The first is maybe crazy people. It's never like a happy go lucky family, it's loners, etc. The second group is military people. They are part of a cult like group even though they are seen as heroes, they aren't. They are a cult of liars and murderers when they have to be.

So, no matter what the results are this June when they come out, I will not believe it until average people of a wide variety make reports and video.

Even when it does come around to that "ordinary" people believing in aliens for example, they'll always be a "safe place' to hide psychologically. Even with overwhelming evidence there will be an exodus of "government super hoax" people that will allow people an out, and many will buy into any form of superiority being fake news. Its possible you're already setting yourself up for it. Maybe subconsciously it bothers you and others we might be vastly inferior beings? Or maybe not at all.
I don't understand your military personal statement. I get alot of them are weirdos, violent etc. Those are 95% usually being enlisted, not officers. And fighter pilots are a different breed altogether. Typically cream of the crop intelligence and sensory genetics, not HS drop outs gamers. I think your inability to distinguish, or better yet willingness to lump them all into a "murderer" category could be more revealing about you personally more than you realise. They themselves laugh at the "hero" bullshit but that's not why they do it. Way off base there.

 

[Keihart]

I don't see why that would be the case.

On Earth we have people living in huts made out of mud and at the same time there's a guy piloting a passenger jet that that is basically a robot flying itself. Unless racism is correct, the guy in the mud hut is no different a human than the pilot of the giant jet.

The guy in the mud hut has the same type of brain and senses as the pilot.

well yeah, both are human and in the same planet.
We do not perceive anything in the world in the same way that some other animals do, which is my point. Considering how alien life can be on earth, life in some other planet with more years of evolution and different conditions must be completely different. They would be like Lovecraftian creatures, they would see reality in ways we would probably not relate, have completely different interests than us, perceive time differently, etc.

Proper communication with some alien life form that managed to travel through the galaxy would be a miracle, it would be like trying to communicate with a tree or something, but scarier.

 

[TheAdlerian]

Even when it does come around to that "ordinary" people believing in aliens for example, they'll always be a "safe place' to hide psychologically. Even with overwhelming evidence there will be an exodus of "government super hoax" people that will allow people an out, and many will buy into any form of superiority being fake news. Its possible you're already setting yourself up for it. Maybe subconsciously it bothers you and others we might be vastly inferior beings? Or maybe not at all.
I don't understand your military personal statement. I get alot of them are weirdos, violent etc. Those are 95% usually being enlisted, not officers. And fighter pilots are a different breed altogether. Typically cream of the crop intelligence and sensory genetics, not HS drop outs gamers. I think your inability to distinguish, or better yet willingness to lump them all into a "murderer" category could be more revealing about you personally more than you realise. They themselves laugh at the "hero" bullshit but that's not why they do it. Way off base there.

You aren't getting my points.

Years ago, some blacks believed Popeye's Chicken would make you sterile. It was a plot against the black man! Meanwhile, when Popeyes came to my area, I wanted to try it.

I'm not interested in paranoid nuts or thinking the government made UFO simulations that are over my head while I'm looking at it. If I am looking at UFOs going 40k mph around Philadelphia, then I'm going to believe it. I don't need to take the chicken to a lab to see if it's going to kill my sperm.

I trust popeyes is a business making chicken and that's it. If we can all see UFOs in person or solid test craft or whatever, then I'm going to believe something is real. However, if the military from the US keeps reporting it and many other places on the planet do not do so, I am going to believe it's a hoax.

Military:

If General Johnson arrived at my door and told me they have a Captain America formula, they like my history of public service, and want to make me into a real superhero, I would agree instantly. I would be all about working for SHIELD the CIA or whatever the hell they wanted.

I believe in America and would be very much like the comicbook Cap.

So, being nationalistic is like being in a cult. You are all in for whatever nonsense they want to do.

If you have some jet pilot and the CIA says, hey we need your help. Sun Tzu in the Art of War said a real war is won with ideas, not guns. Guns cost money and people die, but ideas are FREE! So, since you're a great pilot we want you to sell this UFO story to freak out our enemies, okay?

YES!!!

Alternately, a CIA agent becomes a jet pilot and he's ready to do that without question.

Sun Tzu did say that using deception, ideas, fake news, diplomacy, trade, and culture is the way to beat people at war. So, all of the foreign people out there acting like ghetto blacks and having drama and bling bling is better than dropping a nuclear bomb. It gets young people to develop a "fuck it" attitude about achievement and develop petty materialist obsessions, also rap encourages broken homes, which causes insanity in children.

So, exporting grotesque American culture is a Sun Tzu level act of war.

Making people think we have UFO technology is the same.

Military people, probably all of them would be into having secret clearance and part of a psy ops campaign.

So, I don't trust military reports.

The tic tac pilot seemed fake to me. I saw him on Rogan. He was like "gee I want to fly that tic tac!" in a childlike manner. A normal male fighter type I think would be angry at the thing and want to no what the fuck it is or how to blow it up. If it has Russian markings he wouldn't be like "Oh gosh that's cool" so I think he is fake and acting poorly.

 

[TheAdlerian]

well yeah, both are human and in the same planet.
We do not perceive anything in the world in the same way that some other animals do, which is my point. Considering how alien life can be on earth, life in some other planet with more years of evolution and different conditions must be completely different. They would be like Lovecraftian creatures, they would see reality in ways we would probably not relate, have completely different interests than us, perceive time differently, etc.

Proper communication with some alien life form that managed to travel through the galaxy would be a miracle, it would be like trying to communicate with a tree or something, but scarier.

It's a good question.

In psych, there's a lot of study of how language affects the mind.

In some Africans they can't see how an orange is like a ball. They don't get the connection, and orange is food and a ball is a toy. That is due to their language and it's a reason they never invented much.

Someone could have made a wheel out of branches and it's useful for other things and then their dad said, it's branches and that's it. So, no wheels were ever invented.

Italian is very contextual and so "pizza" means "pluck" so you pizza a trig or of your hair, you pizza a think out of your teeth, you pizza a grape form the bunch and you fucking pizza everything. Also, that bread thing is a pizza. So, crappy communication and everyone has to argue the know what the hell the other is saying.

So, different human languages create clarity or confusion and so alien language would probably be crazy. However, there may be only a couple ways to sense things, smell, sight, and sound. If that's the case, there may be very average creatures in the universe.

That would lead them to have a similar intelligence as humans. They want to see things, get things, taste things, etc and that's what our minds are for to keep getting new experiences. So, my point was that maybe on Planet X they have Unobtainium that that makes antigravity easy, and we don't have it. So, Planet X guys builds a ship to go see stuff.

My point is that humans want to go see stuff and if aliens build ships they have to also want to see stuff, and humans and aliens are likely very similar.

It's my guess that sane aliens would never leave their planet nor contact outsiders, but rather work on their planet and develop it to the max. Humans seems like animals that hate each other, hate Earth, hate living by others, hate doing positive things for others, and that's why we dream of going to Mars instead of making our planet awesome. Aliens would have to have a similar mindset to want to come here.

There is no other logical reason to come to Earth other than to see it or take stuff.

 

[Romulus]

You aren't getting my points.

Years ago, some blacks believed Popeye's Chicken would make you sterile. It was a plot against the black man! Meanwhile, when Popeyes came to my area, I wanted to try it.

I'm not interested in paranoid nuts or thinking the government made UFO simulations that are over my head while I'm looking at it. If I am looking at UFOs going 40k mph around Philadelphia, then I'm going to believe it. I don't need to take the chicken to a lab to see if it's going to kill my sperm.

I trust popeyes is a business making chicken and that's it. If we can all see UFOs in person or solid test craft or whatever, then I'm going to believe something is real. However, if the military from the US keeps reporting it and many other places on the planet do not do so, I am going to believe it's a hoax.

Military:

If General Johnson arrived at my door and told me they have a Captain America formula, they like my history of public service, and want to make me into a real superhero, I would agree instantly. I would be all about working for SHIELD the CIA or whatever the hell they wanted.

I believe in America and would be very much like the comicbook Cap.

So, being nationalistic is like being in a cult. You are all in for whatever nonsense they want to do.

If you have some jet pilot and the CIA says, hey we need your help. Sun Tzu in the Art of War said a real war is won with ideas, not guns. Guns cost money and people die, but ideas are FREE! So, since you're a great pilot we want you to sell this UFO story to freak out our enemies, okay?

YES!!!

Alternately, a CIA agent becomes a jet pilot and he's ready to do that without question.

Sun Tzu did say that using deception, ideas, fake news, diplomacy, trade, and culture is the way to beat people at war. So, all of the foreign people out there acting like ghetto blacks and having drama and bling bling is better than dropping a nuclear bomb. It gets young people to develop a "fuck it" attitude about achievement and develop petty materialist obsessions, also rap encourages broken homes, which causes insanity in children.

So, exporting grotesque American culture is a Sun Tzu level act of war.

Making people think we have UFO technology is the same.

Military people, probably all of them would be into having secret clearance and part of a psy ops campaign.

So, I don't trust military reports.

The tic tac pilot seemed fake to me. I saw him on Rogan. He was like "gee I want to fly that tic tac!" in a childlike manner. A normal male fighter type I think would be angry at the thing and want to no what the fuck it is or how to blow it up. If it has Russian markings he wouldn't be like "Oh gosh that's cool" so I think he is fake and acting poorly.

I just find it odd that reports from villagers, scientists, and military folks are so similar. Idk why you think the tic tac "looked fake." Do you have experience with the IR scope on that platform? And to project your way of thinking onto a fighter pilot is hilarious. They're not hive-minded despite being top tier individuals either. "Want to blow it up." Why would all of them have to think like that? lol
So, not only was the pilot fake, but the radar technician is also lying about the same object acceleration to over 15000mph in an instant.

 

[Keihart]

It's a good question.

In psych, there's a lot of study of how language affects the mind.

In some Africans they can't see how an orange is like a ball. They don't get the connection, and orange is food and a ball is a toy. That is due to their language and it's a reason they never invented much.

Someone could have made a wheel out of branches and it's useful for other things and then their dad said, it's branches and that's it. So, no wheels were ever invented.

Italian is very contextual and so "pizza" means "pluck" so you pizza a trig or of your hair, you pizza a think out of your teeth, you pizza a grape form the bunch and you fucking pizza everything. Also, that bread thing is a pizza. So, crappy communication and everyone has to argue the know what the hell the other is saying.

So, different human languages create clarity or confusion and so alien language would probably be crazy. However, there may be only a couple ways to sense things, smell, sight, and sound. If that's the case, there may be very average creatures in the universe.

That would lead them to have a similar intelligence as humans. They want to see things, get things, taste things, etc and that's what our minds are for to keep getting new experiences. So, my point was that maybe on Planet X they have Unobtainium that that makes antigravity easy, and we don't have it. So, Planet X guys builds a ship to go see stuff.

My point is that humans want to go see stuff and if aliens build ships they have to also want to see stuff, and humans and aliens are likely very similar.

It's my guess that sane aliens would never leave their planet nor contact outsiders, but rather work on their planet and develop it to the max. Humans seems like animals that hate each other, hate Earth, hate living by others, hate doing positive things for others, and that's why we dream of going to Mars instead of making our planet awesome. Aliens would have to have a similar mindset to want to come here.

There is no other logical reason to come to Earth other than to see it or take stuff.

Yeah, hard doubt on your viewpoint. There is nothing that guarantees that if a lifeform can travel trough the space they would need to think or see reality like we do. Much of what we perceive as reality it's a product of our senses and how our brains make sense of it. Why even make the assumption that Aliens would need a language even, why would they need to speak, lot of species can communicate in ways that we don't even understand in planet earth, such assumptions are a huge jump in logic.

The only things we could hope do to communicate with a lifeform that we assume it's intelligent in the same way we are it's logic, like math for example, we could maybe hope to find a medium they can interpret and try to communicate trough math and geometry but even then, maybe they don't even care about that because they have some other perspective to which we are not privy to since we are limited by our particular way of seeing reality.

Making contact will probably be like waking up Cthulhu.

 

[TheAdlerian]

I just find it odd that reports from villagers, scientists, and military folks are so similar. Idk why you think the tic tac "looked fake." Do you have experience with the IR scope on that platform? And to project your way of thinking onto a fighter pilot is hilarious. They're not hive-minded despite being top tier individuals either. "Want to blow it up." Why would all of them have to think like that? lol
So, not only was the pilot fake, but the radar technician is also lying about the same object acceleration to over 15000mph in an instant.

Again, you did not read what I said.

I said the PILOT seemed fake in the way he talked about the incident.

I said that he was on Joe Rogan talking about the tic tac and he said he would love to fly one.

I'm pretty sure the Nazis had some great guns and planes but I doubt the Allies were like "I sure would love to fly one!" because they were too busy hating the enemy. If I was a US pilot and I saw what he described I would not be excited.

His reaction was fake or moronically weird.

 

[TheAdlerian]

Yeah, hard doubt on your viewpoint. There is nothing that guarantees that if a lifeform can travel trough the space they would need to think or see reality like we do. Much of what we perceive as reality it's a product of our senses and how our brains make sense of it. Why even make the assumption that Aliens would need a language even, why would they need to speak, lot of species can communicate in ways that we don't even understand in planet earth, such assumptions are a huge jump in logic.

The only things we could hope do to communicate with a lifeform that we assume it's intelligent in the same way we are it's logic, like math for example, we could maybe hope to find a medium they can interpret and try to communicate trough math and geometry but even then, maybe they don't even care about that because they have some other perspective to which we are not privy to since we are limited by our particular way of seeing reality.

Making contact will probably be like waking up Cthulhu.

I don't understand your point of view.

If you invented an antigravity engine that can go faster than the speed of light, you get in it and go.

It's my point about jets before. what scientist 500 years ago would assume that we could fly a craft going the speed of sound at 30k feet?

I remember seeing on a science show called Connects that sciences thought being on a train would kill humans.

Whatever the case, I don't think aliens would have much different motivation to travel to a place than humans.

If you asked a human why they went somewhere they might say:

1. Curiosity.
2. Need.
3. Adventure
4. Duty, etc

But, your aliens say:

1. Zorp.
2. Flirp
3. Chirp

and when they go to explain it to us it's impossible to understand those concepts.

It's possible but I think that would be pretty much on the edge.

By saying aliens are incomprehensible it's a good way to not have to think about it. It's what religious people do.

Can god make an immovable object?

I don't know because god is incomprehensible....

 

[Keihart]

I don't understand your point of view.

If you invented an antigravity engine that can go faster than the speed of light, you get in it and go.

It's my point about jets before. what scientist 500 years ago would assume that we could fly a craft going the speed of sound at 30k feet?

I remember seeing on a science show called Connects that sciences thought being on a train would kill humans.

Whatever the case, I don't think aliens would have much different motivation to travel to a place than humans.

If you asked a human why they went somewhere they might say:

1. Curiosity.
2. Need.
3. Adventure
4. Duty, etc

But, your aliens say:

1. Zorp.
2. Flirp
3. Chirp

and when they go to explain it to us it's impossible to understand those concepts.

It's possible but I think that would be pretty much on the edge.

By saying aliens are incomprehensible it's a good way to not have to think about it. It's what religious people do.

Can god make an immovable object?

I don't know because god is incomprehensible....

You are assuming that every sentient being capable of traveling through the galaxy would have a similar way of "thinking", as we have been taught by our own planet, our way of thinking it's not the only way of being sentient. Would you even think twice about stepping on a ant that you are not sure if it's there because it's too small if the ant was trying to explain to you how non Euclidean geometry looks using it's chemicals and some limb movement? In the same fashion, we could some day arrive to another planet and have a really hard time identifying intelligent life and how to communicate with them, even if possible at all, that would in no form guarantee we could understand each other.

I'm not saying anything wild by the way, the cosmic horror idea it's the most accepted one when looking at possible advanced intelligent Alien life. We are probably better off not making contact with whatever it's out there unless we either have the advantage or get lucky with something very similar to us.

 

[INC]

Again, you did not read what I said.

I said the PILOT seemed fake in the way he talked about the incident.

I said that he was on Joe Rogan talking about the tic tac and he said he would love to fly one.

I'm pretty sure the Nazis had some great guns and planes but I doubt the Allies were like "I sure would love to fly one!" because they were too busy hating the enemy. If I was a US pilot and I saw what he described I would not be excited.

His reaction was fake or moronically weird.

What?.....allies did go i wanna fly those, because they stole all their scientist, thats exactly that they wanted to do

And fake because he wanted to fly it? Of course a top gun fighter pilot would wanna fly an aircraft far superior to his is own. That like saying a racing driver seeing a racing car far superior to his and saying nah I dont wanna try that........of course they would, that human nature 101

How is he meant to sound?

 

[Romulus]

Again, you did not read what I said.

I said the PILOT seemed fake in the way he talked about the incident.

I said that he was on Joe Rogan talking about the tic tac and he said he would love to fly one.

I'm pretty sure the Nazis had some great guns and planes but I doubt the Allies were like "I sure would love to fly one!" because they were too busy hating the enemy. If I was a US pilot and I saw what he described I would not be excited.

His reaction was fake or moronically weird.

You seem to have a bizarre way of looking at certain things you know nothing about. "If you were a fighter pilot." Right.
"Video looked fake." Right, but do you have any experience with IR scopes? Of course not. But everything is this sort of steering the event in the direction you want it to go.
Then, not only do you dismiss that I told you there was radar data on the tic tac, but you continue to focus on the pilot's behavior instead?
The pilot was talking exactly like many pilots do. They're sort of adrenaline junkies. Strapping yourself to a rocket and being slung off an aircraft carrier all the time? That sounds exactly like a person that would want to fly the best aircraft in the world.
It's not that I dont respect your opinion, but I just don't think you have the capability to discern in this case, nor do I think you have the life experience to make any of those claims, yet you do with a certainty that's almost always unreasonable. It's an odd combo, but theres very little objectivity. Gonna put you on ignore for those reasons.

 

[TheAdlerian]

You seem to have a bizarre way of looking at certain things you know nothing about. "If you were a fighter pilot." Right.
"Video looked fake." Right, but do you have any experience with IR scopes? Of course not. But everything is this sort of steering the event in the direction you want it to go.
Then, not only do you dismiss that I told you there was radar data on the tic tac, but you continue to focus on the pilot's behavior instead?
The pilot was talking exactly like many pilots do. They're sort of adrenaline junkies. Strapping yourself to a rocket and being slung off an aircraft carrier all the time? That sounds exactly like a person that would want to fly the best aircraft in the world.
It's not that I dont respect your opinion, but I just don't think you have the capability to discern in this case, nor do I think you have the life experience to make any of those claims, yet you do with a certainty that's almost always unreasonable. It's an odd combo, but theres very little objectivity. Gonna put you on ignore for those reasons.

You might have a fantasy way of looking at life.

You wouldn't have made that comment had I not hurt your feelings, lol.

I actually knew a jet fighter pilot who dated one of my friends years ago.

I have a job with life and death responsibility.

So, I can use my intelligence to extrapolate what a commander or a jet might think and say. I know what I am supposed to say about my job if I was on TV talking about it because there's "professional ethics" and an expected kind of demeanor. In the past I worked for a kind of military organization and even when you are off of work walking down the street you are supposed to abide by the code of ethics.

You could get in trouble for walking down the street in a pink top hat, for instance. That's because someone watching you could conclude that they let weirdos work for the organization I did.

So, I use these ideas and experiences to find the tic tac pilot's comments to be strange. His basic response was "that's neat!" to a craft that could next week blow up New York City.

It's you who think in an odd way, likely as having been influenced by too much TV.

Video:

I assume the video of the tic tac is real, but how do I know this? I have no idea what I'm looking at due to no experience with it. The display is like that of a 1950s TV set and how do I know what's real or simulated?

I'm not saying it's a fake jet display, but almost no one watching it would know either.

I keep mentioning religion, and Americans have a BAD CASE of believing authority figures. I could see that in the corona situation. Don't wear masks, then do wear masks, and really only N95 masks work but people were putting underwear on their heads, you can stand in line back to back to get in a store, but don't stand by each other IN THE STORE, when no one ever does anyway, lol. But standing in line outside, which no one ever does, is a good idea!

If a priest told you Jesus had a magic carpet, you believe it!

If General Johnson says, here's UFO video, you believe it! General Johnson has the same "magic" as a doctor or priest. However, all of those people are notorious liars.

That's why I'm saying the tic tac video is something I sort of have "no opinion" one since I do not know anything about jet displays.

 

[TheAdlerian]

What?.....allies did go i wanna fly those, because they stole all their scientist, thats exactly that they wanted to do

And fake because he wanted to fly it? Of course a top gun fighter pilot would wanna fly an aircraft far superior to his is own. That like saying a racing driver seeing a racing car far superior to his and saying nah I dont wanna try that........of course they would, that human nature 101

How is he meant to sound?

I explained in my last post how he should sound.

I am old enough to have relatives in WWII and none of them admired the enemy, trust me on that one.

Just the same, if you hear about some home invasion where someone comes in and beats everyone to death and shoots them, do you think, "Wow that took a lot of skill and fighting ability. I wish I knew how to fight like that!" because I don't think that way. Cops do not think that way.

If I was in a top jet and this craft came out of the WATER and they I couldn't begin to do anything about the craft and had no way to get near it or fight it AND it was around a major military vessel, I would not be like, "Yeah dats coool" because I would be pissed.

I would not only be angry, I would want to be ALL IN on how we were going to neutralize these things and capture one. I would be highly focused on it as being the biggest threat in the who world.

I think the pilot is lying in some way because he can't be stupid and so he's either making up the entire story or knows that the craft belongs to the US.

The only alternative is that he saw it, it's a real story, and he's like autistically smart and immature not understanding the implications of what he saw. But, he's a commander so I don't know if a guy that impaired could get there.

 

[INC]

I explained in my last post how he should sound.

I am old enough to have relatives in WWII and none of them admired the enemy, trust me on that one.

Just the same, if you hear about some home invasion where someone comes in and beats everyone to death and shoots them, do you think, "Wow that took a lot of skill and fighting ability. I wish I knew how to fight like that!" because I don't think that way. Cops do not think that way.

If I was in a top jet and this craft came out of the WATER and they I couldn't begin to do anything about the craft and had no way to get near it or fight it AND it was around a major military vessel, I would not be like, "Yeah dats coool" because I would be pissed.

I would not only be angry, I would want to be ALL IN on how we were going to neutralize these things and capture one. I would be highly focused on it as being the biggest threat in the who world.

I think the pilot is lying in some way because he can't be stupid and so he's either making up the entire story or knows that the craft belongs to the US.

The only alternative is that he saw it, it's a real story, and he's like autistically smart and immature not understanding the implications of what he saw. But, he's a commander so I don't know if a guy that impaired could get there.

.....we're not in a world war lol

 

[TheAdlerian]

You are assuming that every sentient being capable of traveling through the galaxy would have a similar way of "thinking", as we have been taught by our own planet, our way of thinking it's not the only way of being sentient. Would you even think twice about stepping on a ant that you are not sure if it's there because it's too small if the ant was trying to explain to you how non Euclidean geometry looks using it's chemicals and some limb movement? In the same fashion, we could some day arrive to another planet and have a really hard time identifying intelligent life and how to communicate with them, even if possible at all, that would in no form guarantee we could understand each other.

I'm not saying anything wild by the way, the cosmic horror idea it's the most accepted one when looking at possible advanced intelligent Alien life. We are probably better off not making contact with whatever it's out there unless we either have the advantage or get lucky with something very similar to us.

I know zero about aliens.

I am just saying that, due to logic, there's only a certain number of thoughts one can have a the material world.

If a thousand different aliens look at a rock, it is very probable that many will have very similar conclusions about the rock.

That's what I'm saying and that goes for motives for travel.

 

[TheAdlerian]

.....we're not in a world war lol

Sure we are.

Human psychology and physiology has been the same for about 40,000 years, according to what science says.

So, whether Joe Average was born 20 years ago or 20,000 his reactions are going to be much the same.

 

[INC]

Sure we are.

Human psychology and physiology has been the same for about 40,000 years, according to what science says.

So, whether Joe Average was born 20 years ago or 20,000 his reactions are going to be much the same.

And what's that? They're the enemy and I must therefore have no desire to want fly that craft that bends my perception of flight.......I must hate and destroy it ASAP

 

[TheAdlerian]

And what's that? They're the enemy and I must therefore have no desire to want fly that craft that bends my perception of flight.......I must hate and destroy it ASAP

As I've been saying, if UFOs are real and the descriptions are accurate they are the most serious topic in the entire world. There is no more serious topic than machines that can dominate the entire planet or destroy any civilization on Earth in minutes.

Several craft flying 40,000 MILES PER FUCKING HOUR carrying bombs, or whatever, could send everyone back to the stone age is hours or less.

If you don't get that, you do not have a mature view of life.

A military person, who is a commander, should have a far more grim and determined attitude UNLESS he's trying to sell an idea.

As an example, I think Nazi SS uniforms are cool. I love the black and silver and think it looks sharp, but I don't really want to wear one. If on TV I am not going to say, but gee those uniforms are sharp! Their guns were cool looking! Oh boy!. I would legit wear a sack before I put on an SS uniform.

 

[rofif]

Are you an Amazing Randi fan?

It is healthy to be skeptical really.
Otherwise every idiot runs around on Joe Rogan podcast and tells "ufo stories"... again and again and again.
Randy offered million dollars and suddenly nobody could prove anything

 

[Romulus]

It is healthy to be skeptical really.
Otherwise every idiot runs around on Joe Rogan podcast and tells "ufo stories"... again and again and again.
Randy offered million dollars and suddenly nobody could prove anything

I agree, it is healthy. But I also think most skeptics are just lazy. When you really question why they don't believe certain things, it usually turns out they don't even have most of the information.

And how do you prove anything for a million dollars? Let's say you have a literal alien body in your garage. Or a UFO in your backyard. As extreme and 'definitive' as those examples are, you can bet your ass there would be a host of debunkers that have "reasons" why it's all a setup even if it was completely true. "A humanoid hybrid, not alien." Or "The ship in your backyard is clearly a secret government craft." I mean it would just on and on with "experts" looking at the data with hidden agendas wanting to steer their narrative in their direction.

So all the guy has to do with the 1 million dollars is say "well my people are telling me something different, that this is a government problem to create alien lookalike creatures." It's a never-ending fallback and I know my example is extreme and would be harder to disprove, but you get the point.

The problem with even career debunkers don't have to be rational either. It's not much different from people on the other extreme that believe everything UFOs.

 

[rofif]

I agree, it is healthy. But I also think most skeptics are just lazy. When you really question why they don't believe certain things, it usually turns out they don't even have most of the information.

And how do you prove anything for a million dollars? Let's say you have a literal alien body in your garage. Or a UFO in your backyard. As extreme and 'definitive' as those examples are, you can bet your ass there would be a host of debunkers that have "reasons" why it's all a setup even if it was completely true. "A humanoid hybrid, not alien." Or "The ship in your backyard is clearly a secret government craft." I mean it would just on and on with "experts" looking at the data with hidden agendas wanting to steer their narrative in their direction.

So all the guy has to do with the 1 million dollars is say "well my people are telling me something different, that this is a government problem to create alien lookalike creatures." It's a never-ending fallback and I know my example is extreme and would be harder to disprove, but you get the point.

The problem with even career debunkers don't have to be rational either. It's not much different from people on the other extreme that believe everything UFOs.

That's the other side of he coin. True.
But nowadays it will be extremely difficult to prove anything. With deepfakes, cgi and all type of fake news, I think I would need to see something on national tv to believe it or in person