LelouchZero
Member
I saw that too, they also have a written review on TechSpot. I probably should have quoted ·feist· and mentioned it as they included a link to it in the post before me. The Ryzen 5 1600 does really well!
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
AMD Ryzen Thread: Affordable Core Act
- Thread starter ·feist·
- Start date
I saw that too, they also have a written review on TechSpot. I probably should have quoted ·feist· and mentioned it as they included a link to it in the post before me. The Ryzen 5 1600 does really well!
Vengeance LPX works great. Use it for all my Ryzen builds
I just finished my new Ryzen 7 1700 build.
Ryzen 7 1700
ASUS PRIME-B350-PLUS motherboard
64GB (4x16) G.Skill Ripjaws V DDR4 2400
(I know probably a lot slower than most here would choose but I wanted 64GB so compromised on the speed somewhat...this was still the most expensive component of the entire build)
Zotac GeForce GTX 1050ti 4GB mini video card
Samsung 850 Evo 500GB SSD
Toshiba 7200RPM 6TB HDD
LG BH16NS40 Blu-Ray/DVD/CD Writer/DVD writer
Corsair CS750M power supply
Corsair SPEC-02 ATX midtower case
Windows 10 64bit Home
$13 Best Buy clearance USB keyboard and mouse (kind of like it though)
https://pcpartpicker.com/list/pDRtTH
My AMD Athlon 64 x2 PC was over 10 years old. Figured it was time for an upgrade. I wanted a system mainly for a media and backup server for home. I'm also planning on running Ubuntu in a VirtualBox VM. Just finished the build and software and driver installation today. I setup a 10GB ram drive that I'm using for my Plex Media Server transcoding temp directory as well as moving my Chrome profile and cache there and then persisting it on the HDD when I shutdown. Plex has never looked so good. Transcoding set to "Make my CPU hurt". It's fun to see all 16 logical cores get to work when I start a stream. (They don't have to work too long...they make short work of it)
So what do you all think? Did I cut too many corners on the motherboard, memory speed, and video?
So far, I'm quite pleased with it. There is a world of difference between it and my decade old previous system.
Ryzen 7 1700
ASUS PRIME-B350-PLUS motherboard
64GB (4x16) G.Skill Ripjaws V DDR4 2400
(I know probably a lot slower than most here would choose but I wanted 64GB so compromised on the speed somewhat...this was still the most expensive component of the entire build)
Zotac GeForce GTX 1050ti 4GB mini video card
Samsung 850 Evo 500GB SSD
Toshiba 7200RPM 6TB HDD
LG BH16NS40 Blu-Ray/DVD/CD Writer/DVD writer
Corsair CS750M power supply
Corsair SPEC-02 ATX midtower case
Windows 10 64bit Home
$13 Best Buy clearance USB keyboard and mouse (kind of like it though)
https://pcpartpicker.com/list/pDRtTH
My AMD Athlon 64 x2 PC was over 10 years old. Figured it was time for an upgrade. I wanted a system mainly for a media and backup server for home. I'm also planning on running Ubuntu in a VirtualBox VM. Just finished the build and software and driver installation today. I setup a 10GB ram drive that I'm using for my Plex Media Server transcoding temp directory as well as moving my Chrome profile and cache there and then persisting it on the HDD when I shutdown. Plex has never looked so good. Transcoding set to "Make my CPU hurt". It's fun to see all 16 logical cores get to work when I start a stream. (They don't have to work too long...they make short work of it)
So what do you all think? Did I cut too many corners on the motherboard, memory speed, and video?
So far, I'm quite pleased with it. There is a world of difference between it and my decade old previous system.
Buggy Loop
Gold Member
I just want to report on the ASRock Fatal1ty AB350 Gaming-ITX/AC
Motherboard bios seems solid. Although I have not played around one since AM3, it detected my Corsair vengeance LPX 3200 Mhz 2x8GB profile, simply selected the XMP profile and it works right away.
Still installing a shitload of stuffs so I have not stressed the system so far. Will report if anything goes wrong.
Motherboard bios seems solid. Although I have not played around one since AM3, it detected my Corsair vengeance LPX 3200 Mhz 2x8GB profile, simply selected the XMP profile and it works right away.
Still installing a shitload of stuffs so I have not stressed the system so far. Will report if anything goes wrong.
If you are prepared to leave the system on overnight running a memory test to check for errors/stability, I would try and see if you can overclock that memory to 2666MT/s. Even if you don't, it seems like it's going to be a massive upgrade over your old system regardless.
It may not even be necessary to increase the voltage, but since it does 2400MT/s at 1.20V I would be surprised if it can't run at 2666MT/s.
If 2666MT/s is not stable at 1.20V, I'd try increasing it by 0.05V at a time up to 1.40V maximum until it is stable overnight.
A 1050Ti may not be the fastest GPU around, but it's still a very nice card.
Not really knowledgeable concerning overclocking in general...I went into the BIOS and changed the memory speed to 2666 without changing anything else.
The system then wouldn't boot. It would just recycle whenever it went to POST. I have to admit, I got the cold sweats thinking I had bricked my system.
After three reboots; luckily, it seems the motherboard detected the problem and allowed me to press F1 to reset to 2133 and get back into the BIOS. I set it back to 2400.
I'm kind of weary to be messing too much with things I don't know much about ... would love to eek out some more cycles from the CPU and memory but without knowing much about it, it is probably best for me to take the defaults. I was at least able to get in the BIOS when I put the thing together and enable the 2400 profile so I'm not stuck with 2133 ;-)
DonMigs85
Member
It boggles the mind. Are their margins this important? Why does a struggling AMD care more about simple TIM?
Hmm I think that quote shows the SKL-X is a monster regardless of the TIM.
With a better TIM transferring more heat, even a 360mm could be in trouble D:
Sheeeit looks like Imma buy a new cooler and OC my 1600 to 4.0 next week
NeOak
Member
X99 CPUs had solder, not toothpaste.
And your second sentence makes no fucking sense. You want the maximum heat transfer in order to dissipate it, not for the heat to stay on the die.
Souldestroyer Reborn
Banned
Wait, is that an additional $380 on-top of the price of the processor for the Sky-X?
Am i going crazy?
Could practically build the rest of a Ryzen rig for that...
Am i going crazy?
Could practically build the rest of a Ryzen rig for that...
Sounds like that board attempts memory training 3 times by default before automatically starting in safe mode.
Since it won't boot at 1.20V at all, you might have to try 1.35V for the DRAM voltage, but I understand if you might not be comfortable doing that with no experience overclocking.
It's not like 2400MT/s is bad, I just thought you might be able to push the memory speed a little higher.
Clearing the CMOS should always get you in a bootable state if the system won't boot at all though, but AM4 seems pretty good about booting into safe mode automatically.
Well...despite my initial trepidation, I tried 2666 at 1.35V and was able to boot. (running that now.) I thought 1.35V might be a big jump from 1.20V so I tried 2666 at 1.3V and it wouldn't boot. Got the same results as when I tried 2666 at 1.20V.
Thanks so much for the suggestion. Is there any concern with running the memory at 1.35V? Is that considered high? Will it generate too much DRAM heat?
I'll run with it a while and see how it does. Thanks again.
DDR4 should generally be safe up to at least 1.40V and some say 1.50V - though I wouldn't push it that far.
Virtually all DDR4 kits over 2666MT/s run at 1.35V, since that's an overclock.
Some newer 2666MT/s kits can run at 1.20V, but 1.35V is not surprising since yours is a 2400MT/s kit being overclocked.
It will run marginally warmer, but RAM generally doesn't get hot. Just be sure to test it for stability.
I don't think it would be a problem since the majority of fast RAM kits run at 1.35V, especially since most memory has a lifetime warranty now, but I suppose you might not want to run it overclocked if you intend on keeping that system for 10 years like your previous one. My old i5-2500K system was overclocked for 7 years without issue, but there's always some level of risk with overclocking, no matter how small.
The problem isn't the paste. The problem is the air gap. The paste itself is pretty decent stuff, in that its got decent thermal conductivity and high stability, but it just isn't making good contact with the IHS so it can't efficiently transfer heat from the die to heatsink. While performance is a big reason people use liquid metal with delids, the main reason that people should is that the majority of conventional TIMs don't stay effective for longer than maybe a year because repeated changes in temperature "pumps" the TIM out.
I have no idea why Intel hasn't solved this issue but evidently they feel that being stable at stock is adequate enough. Maybe enthusiest anger might get them to change, I bought my AMD system because fuck unpredictable temps.
Its a misleading factoid. We've got a Skylake-X system at work and you can cool it with a decent quality cooling solution that doesn't cost $380 (we're using a $100 240 AIO). You just can't overclock it but considering its out of box frequencies (4.5ghz over preferred cores holy moley), we didn't really feel compelled to try.
The Ryzen 7 stock cooling solution is also an absurdly good value add. The fan itself is the same 92mm fan that comes with Coolermaster's MasterLiquid Maker 92 (so a proper heatsink fan) and the heatsink is actually a vapour chamber and not just a mere solid slug.
I've tried it with the Ryzen system I'm using right now. It won't handle all 4ghz overclocks but it'll handle 3.8ghz without any problems. Its worth about as much as a $30-40 aftermarket heatsink. Its that good.
I found a good price for the 1700x on Ebay but was it a mistake to order it over the 1700? Was it a waste of money since the 1700 often overclocks just as well and you can sell the included cooler on ebay? I usually have bad luck when it comes to the silicon lottery so my overclocks tend to require ridiculously high voltages compared to most, so I figured the 1700x would give a leg up on requiring less voltage compared to most 1700 overclocks.
Also, what is the best DDR4 3200 memory to get for compatibility purposes/overclocking? I was thinking of ordering a Taichi x370 Asrock motherboard and read that Samsung B-die memory is well suited for overclocking. But does it need to be the more expensive stuff like 14 CAS and dual ranked? Unfortunately, I think dual ranked B-die is mostly limited to 32 GB kits which I can't afford with the current crappy memory prices.
Also, what is the best DDR4 3200 memory to get for compatibility purposes/overclocking? I was thinking of ordering a Taichi x370 Asrock motherboard and read that Samsung B-die memory is well suited for overclocking. But does it need to be the more expensive stuff like 14 CAS and dual ranked? Unfortunately, I think dual ranked B-die is mostly limited to 32 GB kits which I can't afford with the current crappy memory prices.
With regards to your first paragraph, depends on the price you got for your 1700X. All Ryzen 7 processors basically brick wall at 4.0ghz and hit 3.8ghz at around 1.25v. The 1700X does appear to need less voltage than the 1700 and can hit 4.0ghz more reliably however. There's also some evidence that it can handle higher memory clocks and tighter timings than the 1700.
To get the get clocks/timings, it basically has to be Samsung B-die. Realistically, I wouldn't go too OCD over memory clocks/timings as a lot of the benefits are mostly academic and are amounts that you probably won't notice. From memory, you get diminishing returns past 3000mhz.
I'm using a pair of G.Skill 3200mhz Tridents-Zs and all I had to do was load the 3200mhz XMP settings for the kit to work straight out of the box. I imagine it'll be the case with a lot of Samsung B-die kits.
Just be careful with G.Skill's RGB LED kits if you plan to mess with their LEDs. G.Skill's LED control seems to be tied to a SPD setting and their software, for whatever reason, doesn't not particularly well with the Ryzen platform. Long story short, the software rewrites the SPD setting with garbage and may brick the RAM stick. Its also not covered by warranty apparently.
I got a brand new 1700x for $289, seems like most places are selling it for $330 or so.
Thanks for the advice regarding RAM, I'll just avoid any LED models since I was definitely considering G.skill ram that has Samsung B-die chips.
Also keep in mind that X370 boards in general may not be worth your while. Given the modest power consumption of Ryzen and the fact that any serious overclocking you might do is for 200mhz, a very good B350 board seems more reasonable for the typical consumer.
If you still want the X370 Taichi, just keep in mind the BIOS is a little funny with memory overclocking. My board has a habit of defaulting to really god awful sub-timings that you'd never notice until you benchmark. The sub-timings are so conservative that we're talking about 10% difference in CPU performance.
The solution is pretty simple: find some guy's settings and manually punch in his numbers.
If you still want the X370 Taichi, just keep in mind the BIOS is a little funny with memory overclocking. My board has a habit of defaulting to really god awful sub-timings that you'd never notice until you benchmark. The sub-timings are so conservative that we're talking about 10% difference in CPU performance.
The solution is pretty simple: find some guy's settings and manually punch in his numbers.
Basically if the heat transfer to the IHS is not optimal (due to the TIM), changing from AIO to custom wouldn't have made much difference in the first place.
As someone who value really energy efficient CPUs over raw performance, I'm somewhat annoyed AMD haven't released any 45W TDP desktop Ryzen CPU yet (like the AMD 5050E which I used for plenty of years), and as far as I can tell, there's none in sight either. Maybe I should just go for an Intel i7-7700T instead, and buy my first Intel CPU in about 2 decades.
Why not just take a Ryzen 7 1700 (which is the one desktop Ryzen binned for efficiency) and underclock it to server frequencies (which are all optimized for power efficiency)? Up to 3.3Ghz the efficiency is incredibly linear so you can't go wrong with that and anything lower down to 2.1Ghz:
A vCore of 0.8875v and frequency of 2.8Ghz should be close to the equivalent of 45W TDP.
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
Hardware Unboxed recently completed a 30-game benching test with the Ryzen 5 1600 versus the 7800X and 7700K. Ryzen performance has come right up of late and makes both the Intel's look a really tough sell, especially the 7800X.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfNMn7RWgLw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfNMn7RWgLw
NeOak
Member
Indeed.
Hmm interesting. Gives me as lot more to think about. I might want a more well built motherboard with high quality VRM in case Ryzen 2 are more robust overclockers. In any case, I need lots of rear USB 3.0 ports, quality built in sound with amplified headphone jack, and of course a motherboard with good memory stability/quickly updated when AMD releases new AGESA versions. Right now, I narrowed it down to ASRock Taichi and Gigabyte Gaming K7 boards, but I'll take a closer look at B350 boards. But in general is the Taichi or K7 a better board?
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
I was going to post the Techspot article with the Ryzen 1600 vs the Intel i7s, but I see it's already been brought up. I'm extremely impressed with the Ryzen!
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
Look at the power draw figures too. Ryzen draws less power at stock than both the 7700K and 7800K, and draws less when all are overclocked to their max achievables. By comparison, both Intel chips are hot and power hungry. How the tables have turned. Yikes.
NeOak
Member
I'd say Intel's process ends up with higher leakage current than what AMD uses for Ryzen at GloFo.
Nice also reading here
bios options appears to be 1:1 so minus different wireless module the only other difference is bios support. i.e There are two bios release for the X370 available on online but none for the AB350.
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
Would like to see power draw figures AMD 6-core vs Intel 6-core at the same frequency.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=243647952&postcount=3576
AMD [YouTube] EPYC Facebook Live Tech Talk: Scott Aylor, Forrest Norrod, Kevin Lepak
Tech Showdown [YouTube] Does AMD's B350 Cripple Ryzen's CrossFire Performance?
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=243647952&postcount=3576
TechteamGB [YouTube] Gigabyte AB350M WiFi Review | Ryzen ITX Motherboard
Tek Everything [YouTube] Asrock AB350 Gaming-ITX Ryzen Motherboard Review
Hoosier Hardware [YouTube] My Node 202 Build Dropped 35 Degrees on the CPU with this Mod
Hoosier Hardware [YouTube] Ryzen Mini-ITX Build Performance Benchmarks
Area-51 Threadripper Edition + Socket TR-4 AIO Cooler (Asetek-based)
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=240664316&postcount=3100
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=241391364&postcount=3220
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=243948921&postcount=3584
Alienware [YouTube] Alienware Area-51 Threadripper Edition: E3 Preview
Notebook Italia [YouTube] Alienware Area 51 Threadripper edition with water cooling
AMD [YouTube] EPYC Facebook Live Tech Talk: Scott Aylor, Forrest Norrod, Kevin Lepak
Tech Showdown [YouTube] Does AMD's B350 Cripple Ryzen's CrossFire Performance?
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=243647952&postcount=3576
TechteamGB [YouTube] Gigabyte AB350M WiFi Review | Ryzen ITX Motherboard
Tek Everything [YouTube] Asrock AB350 Gaming-ITX Ryzen Motherboard Review
Hoosier Hardware [YouTube] My Node 202 Build Dropped 35 Degrees on the CPU with this Mod
Hoosier Hardware [YouTube] Ryzen Mini-ITX Build Performance Benchmarks
Area-51 Threadripper Edition + Socket TR-4 AIO Cooler (Asetek-based)
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=240664316&postcount=3100
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=241391364&postcount=3220
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=243948921&postcount=3584
Alienware [YouTube] Alienware Area-51 Threadripper Edition: E3 Preview
Notebook Italia [YouTube] Alienware Area 51 Threadripper edition with water cooling
SapientWolf
Trucker Sexologist
Anectdotally, the B350 boards seem to have a harder time OC to 3200 on the memory.
·feist·;234639923 said:
Somewhat
Uses This Interview: John Romero - Game designer (Doom, Quake), developer
3200mhz is severely overrated and probably isn't really worth the effort. It shows in synthetic benchmarks like 3D Mark Timespy but I don't actually see a huge impact in, say, gaming or my own productivity loads.
Its one of those things that one or two reviewers noticed then "3200mhz is awesome" gets repeated ad nauseum.
Those sort of benchmarks are useless to be quite honest. Now AMD hasn't got a immense deficit in CPU performance, they're going to get similar averages and minimums as Intel.
HardOCP has done a much better review of Ryzen 7 vs. Intel i7 Sandy Bridge/Kaby Lake than any of these scrubs on Youtube. Mere frame rate averages and minimums haven't been good reviewing practice since the most progressive publications changed to measuring frame times and FPS over time graphs.
The problem with Ryzen is NOT a problem with average or even minimum frame rates really. The problem with Ryzen is frame rate stability. Where Ryzen/Intel Sandy Bridge tanks in CPU limited situations, Kaby Lake will maintain a more stable frame rate with a less pronounced dip.
1% lows is basically frametimes presented in a easier to read way. Ryzen has good frame rate stability.
Edit: How can you praise hardocps review of ryzen? They're literally benching with 1080ti only in 4k and use lower end GPUs for lower resolutions, they run into GPU bottlenecks constantly in their CPU comparison.
SapientWolf
Trucker Sexologist
I'm seeing an average 15% improvement in 1080p gaming benches at 3200. Which stacks with a CPU overclock. You might just be GPU limited.
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
Since when?! Literally everyone critical of Ryzen were using lower FPS averages compared to the 7700K. This is frankly a ridiculous moving of the goal posts now that Ryzen has improved so much in gaming performance. Yeah, let's disregard a 30-game bench and instead look at the other one where they benched in 4K resolution...your comments on frame-rate stability is wrong too.
A follow-up post on their Instagram:
Edit: more from their Twitter.https://www.instagram.com/p/BWysDUalr2k/
A warning to those overclocking Core-X CPUs. I just found a burnt contact on my 7800X. It was running 1.25v @ 4.7GHz. Looked worse than this but I stupidly rubbed it with my finger not realizing what it was.
They do say that the CPU and motherboard still work though.https://twitter.com/HardwareUnboxed/status/888604457142861824
Better photo of the CPU. Higher res version shows multiple burn marks. I don't know if this is the result of contaminate or overclocking :S
[H]'s tests basically put Ryzen on-par with an i5-2500K and an i7-7700K far in the lead.
I don't know what they're doing which produces those results, because they don't seem to be replicated anywhere else.
They have always used weird testing methods when reviewing GPUs and other hardware so I just disregarded it.
NeOak
Member
Jesus, how much current is flowing through there?
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
Yeah he says at the end of the video that he needed a very expensive ($380!) custom water loop to get that 7800X to 4.7Ghz because it's such a hot chip. But to hear that this might have actually caused the CPU to fry is crazy. Haven't even heard stories like that for years in the CPU space. This shows that operating Skylake X at 4.7Ghz is probably 200Mhz at least past where it's comfortable unless he was extremely unlucky with his chip. I mean let's be honest - if the only way you can achieve a stable overclock on your CPU is to use a custom water loop, and even a 240mm AIO is not enough, you are operating beyond a safe point for 24/7 use.
I reckon 3.9Ghz 1600 vs 4.5Ghz 7800X is more realistic and the Ryzen wouldn't just draw with the Intel in that scenario but come out just ahead.
RumblingRosco
Member
Sectorseven
Member
Isn't Threadripper for servers and professionals? That packing is awfully elaborate for an industrial product.
That would be Epyc. Threadripper is geared toward "prosumer" types and anyone who simply wants/needs what the HEDT platform and processors offer.
Tech Showdown [YouTube] —— Ryzen 7 1700 vs Intel i7 7820x Showdown - Core to Core Comparison!
Over 30 photos of Asus Zenith Extreme:
以X399之名ROG ZENITH EXTREME开箱图赏
https://www.chiphell.com/thread-1757490-1-1.html
