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Animal Crossing Mafia |OT| - Making Animal Friends Is Awesome!

kingkitty

Member
If I go down, Haly should be investigated by franconp. If Haly goes down and it turns out he isn't mafia, then I should be investigated by franconp.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Fine, there's no point keep a wrap on this anymore because it's clearly just causing more friction than it might help, and the HHA probably already knows what's going on.

I'm the Odd-day commuter. I've been triggering Kalor on odd days. Once, LMQ asked me how I could be so brazen with my posts:

Myself said:
LaunchpadMcQ said:
Originally, considering how much he typed, I thought he might not have seen kingkitty's post. But, the timestamp of his post tells me he probably did see the post before writing his. Considering how this puts the special roles at risk, I wouldn't think anyone who was truly town-aligned would want to dwindle down the numbers and get a full count, yet we have this. Either he's a townie who doesn't care, or he's an HHA who doesn't care.
All that said, I knew what you were doing and I don't really care. If you haven't noticed, I have no problem sticking my neck out if it means getting more information out of people. And if you're wondering why suspicion doesn't fall on me, it's because I'm so completely brazen that it's unthinkable I'd be HHA and put myself at risk like this. Funny how that works isn't it? Of course now that I've tipped my hand people will be more suspicious of me now but, again, I don't really care.

None of you really picked up on that, apparently, Or if you did, you never brought it up. Well, that's why. I was baiting the HHA, and it seems I wasn't successful, though I might've been. I thought the no-kill on Night 3 was because I successfully blocked a kill, but this was before we learned about the Traitor. Now I'm pretty confident it's the Traitor that was activated on that night.

Furthermore, at this junction being able to consume a night kill would be extremely advantageous for us, which is why I'm keeping my silence.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Also, if you'll take the time to look over old posts, when the Odd-commuter speculation was at its height, and even though it directly affected my area, I never really gave my thoughts on it.

What I really wanted was for all of you to shut up because that speculation would only make the HHA more cautious about working around that area! But telling you guys to knock off the speculation would've made it obvious I was the Odd-commuter so I just kept silent.
 

squidyj

Member
I've always had a town read from Haly even in spite of his silence on this subject so this claim is not difficult for me to believe.

I don't like how kingkitty has responded to being pressured recently but there's no clear evidence here that there is a mafia amongst them anymore. I'm okay with lynching KK today but I REALLY want to hear more discussion about nin because I think he's the next best target right now.
 

kingkitty

Member
I've always had a town read from Haly even in spite of his silence on this subject so this claim is not difficult for me to believe.

I don't like how kingkitty has responded to being pressured recently but there's no clear evidence here that there is a mafia amongst them anymore. I'm okay with lynching KK today but I REALLY want to hear more discussion about nin because I think he's the next best target right now.

I responded just fine.

If there's no clear evidence that I'm mafia, then don't vote for me.
 

kingkitty

Member
Also, that's a definite Catch-22 you were in Haly, if you are who you say you are of course.

I'm gonna be off for a few hours, but I'll be back.
 
what-the-fuck-is-going-on.gif
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
And for what it's worth, here are my "profiles" of the players left:

Darryl - Villager who's kind of frustrated with the game, the tonality of his posts don't seem forced so the chances are high he's an Ordinary Villager

RobotNinjaHornets - Confirmed Villager by Francorp. And never triggered Kalor on even days or Toma on odd days, it'd be a long stretch to say he's HHA unless an undetectable, fake role name HHA.

Razmos - Hasn't been as talkative but head of one of the gossip networks. Has been almost always pro-Village in his activities

Tomakasatnav - Convincing light sleeper, probably Village

Timeaisis - I was suspicious of him before but then franconp confirmed he was town as Villager so I dropped him from my sight

RetroGamer42 - Still in a gray area

franconp & ultron87 - At least one HHA honestly it doesn't even matter at this point

squidyj & EzekelRAGE - Both (new) players are very enthusiastic about sniffing out HHA and that alone kind of argues for their being Village (because I think most HHA don't like noise), but it could also be a con

nin1000 - He was under pressure during one of the days and didn't crack, he's either a new player who's very suited to being HHA or he's just a Villager trying to get by. I'm inclined to think the latter.

As you can see, I am not really suspicious of anyone except Ouro (who's bluff I want to call). King Kitty has also been acting as a player consistent with someone who's under threat of being exposed but can't work up a defense because, well, my role is being used against him.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Which is to say I believe KK is a villager as well but I think the same of so many people that it's kind of pointless to defend him. Might as well evict him.
 

squidyj

Member
I see you're focusing on living people which is why you didn't include ouro in your analysis :p


I'm going to repeat a call to discussion on the topic of nin, with some of this kingkitty business behind us I think he's our best second lynch today.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Ouro is triggering so many bells you don't even know. We already had one guy claim a pro-Village ability and he turned out to be HHA. He made a serious error in his logic which Ouro is taking care not to but isn't it convenient that when we're under threat of annihilation here is a Villager who can make it worse?

No dice.
 

Ourobolus

Banned
Ouro is triggering so many bells you don't even know. We already had one guy claim a pro-Village ability and he turned out to be HHA. He made a serious error in his logic which Ouro is taking care not to but isn't it convenient that when we're under threat of annihilation here is a Villager who can make it worse?

No dice.
I'm just going with the role I was handed. Just like when KK and the others were questioning you earlier and you roleclaimed (which now definitely means there are 3 power roles in our column).
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
By the way, I know that everyone is very eager to get two evicts going but if no one is really confident in KingKitty anymore, we don't lose much by going Ouro/No-Evict. Assuming Ouro is HHA and Kingkitty isn't (we'd need a miracle to get two HHA on this day), we'd be pushing back the HHA win by one half cycle.

Just something to think about.
 

squidyj

Member
By the way, I know that everyone is very eager to get two evicts going but if no one is really confident in KingKitty anymore, we don't lose much by going Ouro/No-Evict. Assuming Ouro is HHA and Kingkitty isn't (we'd need a miracle to get two HHA on this day), we'd be pushing back the HHA win by one half cycle.

Just something to think about.

So I'm not entirely confident in a kitty lynch today but I do believe in using both lynches because it can put us well ahead if we get 2xmafia and because it can inform us about the game even more, letting mafia kill off another town in the night and only taking one lynch could leave us in essentially the same position but with one more dead town on our hands.

That said I find the lack of discussion surrounding Nin at this point in time to be suspect in and of itself, Razmos has said something even though I don't agree with the logic presented, Nin hasn't really said much of anything, I've made a point or two and made it clear that I believe he's the lost partner, that's all that's really happened with Nin. I've been really hoping to see more people chime in with reads on Nin or to hear Nin give some sort of defense or at least a response.

Like I've suggested before it seems to me that the lack of action here means that mafia has no interest in Nin being discussed.
 
I'm not suspicious of KK, that's all. But I would have to do a lot of work I'm not willing to do to defend him and I'm not sure it would amount to anything. The thing is I don't have a better candidate in mind. if I defend Kingkitty, I need to propose someone else or else what's the point? Kingkitty rang a few alarm bells but not significantly more than anyone else (though less than some).

You still didn't say why King isn't a good candidate for today.


Also Kark putting commuters in both light sleeper's area sucks, because that mean we would be getting guaranteed red herrings everyday.


Also, why did you wait until now to disclose you were the odd numbered commuter? On day 5 when you wouldve been protected why didn't you say you were the odd commuter? I could understand waiting for King's reply to see if he would lie, but after that you could've confessed and cleared up most our things about what happened Night 1.

Think Haly should still be investigated.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Why the fuck would I ever role claim commuter? The role only works if the HHA have no idea it exists. That makes no sense to me whatsoever. When the game is over, and we learn the results of each action taken every Night, if the HHA did indeed waste a kill on me (it was an Odd night), then my strategem was redeemed. I made a lot of noise. I got noticed. I gave us one extra night.

You still didn't say why King isn't a good candidate for today.
Because if my hunch is right and Ultron is HHA and blowing his ability now to advance end game as soon as possible, evicting KK, RNH, Me, whoever, any villager, is a win for them and a loss for us.

Which is to say that now I have revealed my role, your reasoning looks a bit shakier, which is not to say that KK is suddenly free from all suspicion but is he really any more suspicious than any other probable HHA?
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
I mean, by all means, evict KK. I just want to remind people that we're not bound by anything to evict two players this Day, as much as the HHA would like otherwise.
 
Why the fuck would I ever role claim commuter? The role only works if the HHA have no idea it exists. That makes no sense to me whatsoever. When the game is over, and we learn the results of each action taken every Night, if the HHA did indeed waste a kill on me (it was an Odd night), then my strategem was redeemed. I made a lot of noise. I got noticed. I gave us one extra night.


Because if my hunch is right and Ultron is HHA and blowing his ability now to advance end game as soon as possible, evicting KK, RNH, Me, whoever, any villager, is a win for them and a loss for us.

Which is to say that now I have revealed my role, your reasoning looks a bit shakier, which is not to say that KK is suddenly free from all suspicion but is he really any more suspicious than any other probable HHA?

You still haven;t said anything to defend Kingkitty. If you are commuter, that still has nothing to do with King possibly being the lost partner. You made it seem like you had a good defense for King. All you've said is "king isn't suspicious to me"

Also if your plan was to "make noise" to draw HHA to you, why did you quit all of a sudden? The noisiest you've been is when you got Hippie evicted.

Why the fuck would I ever role claim commuter? The role only works if the HHA have no idea it exists.

You just did. Why roleclaim today, when you are not safe, instead of yesterday when it was a topic we were discussing and you were safe.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Also if your plan was to "make noise" to draw HHA to you, why did you quit all of a sudden? The noisiest you've been is when you got Hippie evicted.
Game fatigue. And reevaluating my approach to this game after my false read of Hippiehobo.

You just did. Why roleclaim today, when you are not safe, instead of yesterday when it was a topic we were discussing and you were safe.
Fine, there's no point keep a wrap on this anymore because it's clearly just causing more friction than it might help, and the HHA probably already knows what's going on.
I've been frustrated for a long time now having to people second guess themselves over and over again because of Kalor's detections and it's reached a tipping point for me as a bystander.
 
I'm not suspicious of KK, that's all.

I don't agree with the heat on Kingkitty, that's all I have to say on this.

Why do you think King isn't the lost partner? You go out of your way to say you are not suspicous of him to then not caring if he is evicted the next moment. Is it because you somehow though Ultron was both Timmy and the lost partner?

I think ultron is both Timmy and the Lost partner. I'll explain why when I get back.

I still don't think you have explained how that would worked fully.

Roleclaiming for no reason because of frustration and trying to save townies a headache about the night 1 action is weak imo. Especially since the N1 action wasn't as big of a topic as it was last day phase.

=================
Why the fuck would I ever role claim commuter? The role only works if the HHA have no idea it exists. That makes no sense to me whatsoever.

I've been frustrated for a long time now having to people second guess themselves over and over again because of Kalor's detections and it's reached a tipping point for me as a bystander.
==========


Which is to say that now I have revealed my role, your reasoning looks a bit shakier, which is not to say that KK is suddenly free from all suspicion but is he really any more suspicious than any other probable HHA?

You still haven't explained how your unwarranted role reveal shakes the reasoning I have for KK. Especially since it had hardly anything to do with KK's actions as night. The main thing was KingKitty making himself seem like a power role on Day 3, then there being no kill on night 3.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Matter of fact, no one even asked you to roleclaim. We wanted to hear why you didn't think King was that suspicious.

Let's say I roleclaim "something" or make up a defense for Kingkitty, and it doesn't hold water. I draw more suspicion to myself. The thing is, I know what alignment I am, Villager, but I don't know what alignment Kingkitty is. It's perfectly possible he's HHA. If I took the second eviction instead of KK, that's a 100% chance to falsely evict instead of a 80% chance to falsely evict. You see? I'm not going to concoct an elaborate defense just to justify my being unsuspicious of KK without drawing suspicion to myself. Which of you would be willing to do that?

The scenarios were:

1) I stay silent

The heat leaves KK and switches to me. I get evicted and Ouro gets evicted. That's an 80% chance to get an HHA and a 100% chance to get a Villager.

2a) I create a defense, but it gets poked and I get suspected

The heat leaves KK and switches to me. I get evicted and Ouro gets evicted. Result is 80% chance to get an HHA and a 100% chance to get a Villager.

2b) I create a defense, but it gets poked and I roleclaim to protect myself, successfully

Heat returns to KK. Barring any other surprising developments, Result is 80% chance to get an HHA and 70% chance to get a villager.

2c) I create a miracle defense, and it convinces everyone that neither KK nor I are suspicious

Heat leaves KK, maybe switches to someone else, maybes goes to no evict. Result is 80% chance to get an HHA and anywhere from 0-50% to get another villager depending on the subsequent arguments.

3a) I roleclaim now, and abandon KK

Heat returns to KK. Barring any other surprising developments, Result is 80% chance to get an HHA and 70% chance to get a villager.

3b) I roleclaim and question whether evicting KK is the best move we have by undermining one of the strongest source of suspicions against him.

Heat leaves KK and goes to No Evict. Barring any other surprising developments, Result is 80% chance to get an HHA and anywhere from 0-70% to get another villager depending on how people feel about KK afterwards, and any new arguments against other players.

Now, which of these outcomes do you think is best? 2c) clearly, but I was not confident in my ability to pull off such a defense. The next optimal course of action was 3b) Roleclaim and "defend" KK
 
The scenarios were:

1) I stay silent

The heat leaves KK and switches to me. I get evicted and Ouro gets evicted. That's an 80% chance to get an HHA and a 100% chance to get a Villager.


3b) I roleclaim and question whether evicting KK is the best move we have by undermining one of the strongest source of suspicions against him.


Now, which of these outcomes do you think is best? 2c) clearly, but I was not confident in my ability to pull off such a defense. The next optimal course of action was 3b) Roleclaim and "defend" KK
Which is the best outcome? 1!. Your logic or w/e that is at the bottom of the number makes no sense for 1. The only vote for you when you caused all this was KK, no one else was really lookin at you. Darryl even changed his vote off you. So you lost nothing and gained no heat from staying silent. Also your problem with 3b is that the night actions had basically nothing to do with why KK was a big suspect.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Why do you think King isn't the lost partner? You go out of your way to say you are not suspicous of him to then not caring if he is evicted the next moment. Is it because you somehow though Ultron was both Timmy and the lost partner?
Why would I think he's the lost partner? The assumption rested on the fact that:

1) Kalor detected activity on Night 3
2) KK was in his range
3) Flipping the traitor results in a no kill?

Is that the gist of it? Do I understand your position correctly?

You've been thinking all this time that the only way for there to be a no kill is if someone flipped, but what if they hit me on that night? If, before Hobohodo was evicted, I roleclaimed Odd-commuter, wouldn't you have attributed the no-kill to me? Likely you would have.

This is just a difference in perspective. You've been working under the assumption that the no-kill was a flip, whereas the flip is just a new possibility for me and all this time I've been assuming i was hit that night.

I still don't think you have explained how that would worked fully.
I've already gave my reasoning back when people first confronted me about it. I'm not going to go through it again. I've watched you guys go back and forth over and over again with no one discovering anything new about each other except haphazard finger pointing and I want no part of that.

Roleclaiming for no reason because of frustration and trying to save townies a headache about the night 1 action is weak imo. Especially since the N1 action wasn't as big of a topic as it was last day phase.
This is from your perspective as an Ordinary Villager or some other role. It's very different from my end I assure you.

You still haven't explained how your unwarranted role reveal shakes the reasoning I have for KK. Especially since it had hardly anything to do with KK's actions as night. The main thing was KingKitty making himself seem like a power role on Day 3, then there being no kill on night 3.
If you don't think it's damaged your credibility, fine, I'm not interested in challenging it. Like I said over and over again: I, personally, am not suspicious of kingkitty, but this is a gut feeling on my part. I would not vote for him, but I wouldn't go out of my way to defend him either.

Only that all the speculation about the Kalor-watched area (RNH is included in this as well) has been driving me insane, and not trusting myself to comment on it for fear of neutralizing my own role was getting annoying. So, that's that. I'm now as useful as an Ordinary Villager, and I had hoped with my roleclaim to answer some questions that might've been on people's minds.
Which is the best outcome? 1!.
You're going to have to explain to me how a payout of 0.8HHA and 1.0Villager is better than any of the other payouts I mentioned. You might have to bend the laws of arithmetic to do so.

The only vote for you when you caused all this was KK, no one else was really lookin at you.

KK and RNH. Maybe you should learn to count before you try making long-winded deductions? And if you think I wouldn't get more votes by staying silent you clearly have no idea how suspicions work in this game. We've been consistently evicting and pressuring people at the bottom of the list to get them to talk. Well, this is what happens when you pressure them. Like how we pressured franconp into roleclaiming Investigator when he wasn't even really under threat (whereas I was one vote away from being tied with Kingkitty). And hey, my role isn't even half as good as his is. If I was in his situation I would've tried to keep out of the limelight much harder.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
I kind of want franconp's ability around for one more night, at least. But I agree it's a viable option.
 
KK and RNH. Maybe you should learn to count before you try making long-winded deductions? And if you think I wouldn't get more votes by staying silent you clearly have no idea how suspicions work in this game. We've been consistently evicting and pressuring people at the bottom of the list to get them to talk. Well, this is what happens when you pressure them. Like how we pressured franconp into roleclaiming Investigator when he wasn't even really under threat (whereas I was one vote away from being tied with Kingkitty). And hey, my role isn't even half as good as his is. If I was in his situation I would've tried to keep out of the limelight much harder.

Maybe you should learn to read and pay attention before you try and call someone out on counting. Before you made your post about defending KK, KK was the only vote for you. It wasn't until you said you didn't think KK was suspicious but were too lazy to defend him, that RNH voted on you, to force you to explain why you think KK is innocent.

The fact that you think this:

Why would I think he's the lost partner? The assumption rested on the fact that:

1) Kalor detected activity on Night 3
2) KK was in his range
3) Flipping the traitor results in a no kill?

is the only reason I had for saying KK was the lost partner is a sign you pay no attention or just purposely ignore things. Especially since you mentioned us "going in circles" in your post. Which means you actually read what I typed aobut KK and the main thing was that he made himself stick out Day three. You also made a post about me counting up his votes.

When you quote votes, for Karkador's sanity, break the highlight tags so that it doesn't show up as a false positive when he does a count.


You're going to have to explain to me how a payout of 0.8HHA and 1.0Villager is better than any of the other payouts I mentioned. You might have to bend the laws of arithmetic to do so.
I don't have to use arithmetic, just common sense. I already explained how you didn't have heat on you at the time so you assuming you would gain heat is stupid. Again this is BEFORE you made the post about King. You brought heat to yourself, which made me/squid/RNH question you.
Which is the best outcome? 1!. Your logic or w/e that is at the bottom of the number makes no sense for 1. The only vote for you when you caused all this was KK, no one else was really lookin at you. Darryl even changed his vote off you. So you lost nothing and gained no heat from staying silent. Also your problem with 3b is that the night actions had basically nothing to do with why KK was a big suspect.

You also state it here, that you know you are a villager and dont know what KK is, so staying silent and letting the chips fall where they are on KK makes the most sense in that scenario. Since if we believe you are villager, it's guranteed to get a villager if you get evicited, but a slight chance to get a HHA if KK is evicted.
Let's say I roleclaim "something" or make up a defense for Kingkitty, and it doesn't hold water. I draw more suspicion to myself. The thing is, I know what alignment I am, Villager, but I don't know what alignment Kingkitty is. It's perfectly possible he's HHA. If I took the second eviction instead of KK, that's a 100% chance to falsely evict instead of a 80% chance to falsely evict. You see? I'm not going to concoct an elaborate defense just to justify my being unsuspicious of KK without drawing suspicion to myself. Which of you would be willing to do that?

I, personally, am not suspicious of kingkitty, but this is a gut feeling on my part. I would not vote for him, but I wouldn't go out of my way to defend him either.

You say this, but you are going out of your way to defend him now with the role claim. You couldve eaisly just said "gut feeling" and ppl probably would've bought it. It seems like you roleclaim just to throw a wrench a theory about KingKitty that hardly anyone relied heavily upon.

If you don't think it's damaged your credibility,
1. Why are you trying to discredit me? Your putting a theory on me, that I barely even argued. The main part of my theory was he made himself a huge target on day 3. Which is why I said your role claim really didn't do much for my reasoning on King.
2. Let's say you are commuter. That doesn't mean Kingkitty couldn't have gotten hit as well. Since Kalor/Toma specifically said they can't tell whether more than one action happens at night. So the possibility is still there that the mafia did get a flip on KK that night. Which makes uncalled for roleclaim still silly, even moreso on an even night phase.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Perfect village?

We have no shops...
Turned out to be Timmy, manager of Nookington's.

So according to my role, I get to make important decisions that will shape the fate of mankind...
Turned out to be Mayor.

Hello! I am here, no sleeping through the first day for me this time.
Turned out to be Light Sleeper

You could always dig for fossils, I heard through the grapevine that you can sell them for a high price!
Turned out to be a Gossip.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Maybe you should learn to read and pay attention before you try and call someone out on counting. Before you made your post about defending KK, KK was the only vote for you. It wasn't until you said you didn't think KK was suspicious but were too lazy to defend him, that RNH voted on you, to force you to explain why you think KK is innocent.
RNH had already requested an explanation from me. I have enough sense to know where the wind is blowing.

It has to be either you or Haly?
I'd also like to say that it hasn't gone the other way either, which is just confusing. Haly, why haven't you been going in hard on KK?

All this time I've been keeping a low profile hoping I could get through one more Even-night and, as a long shot, bait an Odd-night kill to give us one more cycle. But I knew it couldn't last forever. Once people started questioning kingkitty they would eventually look at me as well. Darryl didn't reply in time but I'm sure if he was present when people's attention started shifting he would've back them up.

I already explained how you didn't have heat on you at the time so you assuming you would gain heat is stupid.
See above.

staying silent
See above.

You couldve eaisly just said "gut feeling"
I don't agree with the heat on Kingkitty, that's all I have to say on this.
I don't have anything substantial to say about kingkitty
No one takes "gut feelings" seriously. Did you really think that's an adequate defense?

I said this:
I'm not suspicious of KK, that's all. But I would have to do a lot of work I'm not willing to do to defend him and I'm not sure it would amount to anything. The thing is I don't have a better candidate in mind. if I defend Kingkitty, I need to propose someone else or else what's the point? Kingkitty rang a few alarm bells but not significantly more than anyone else (though less than some).
And you said, in response:
Being less talkative and holding stuff in doesn't help
I agreed with this, and I felt like squidyj and RNH had a point, that it would be better all around if I came clean and cleared up any confusion that might've existed due to my silence, and the only convincing way I could do it is if I claimed.

You're really saying if I said "gut feeling" everyone would be like: "Oh okay, we understand haly, gut feelings all around. Not suspicious in the slightest." Do you remember that I claimed Ordinary Villager? If a guy who claimed Villager said he had a "gut feeling" that another guy who was drawing heat wasn't as suspicious as everyone thought he was, while being one of two people who could possibly be triggering a Motion Detector, that he would get away scott-free?

Fuck, if I saw a poster pull this shit I would switch my vote to them immediately.

2. Let's say you are commuter. That doesn't mean Kingkitty couldn't have gotten hit as well. Since Kalor/Toma specifically said they can't tell whether more than one action happens at night. So the possibility is still there that the mafia did get a flip on KK that night. Which makes uncalled for roleclaim still silly, even moreso on an even night phase.

Do you really feel that kingkitty was a more lucrative target than the Investigator? Really? This is the big inconsistency that you never adequately resolved, nor even addressed. Until you do, I cannot take your theory seriously.

I admit kingkitty made some suspicious moves and at one point I had him pegged as 40% chance to be a villager, but if I was HHA there was no way I would ever, ever, let a Role Cop live. Even if it means losing an HHA.

The HHA would have to be very confident that KK was actually a Doctor to prefer him over franconp and though KK made some suspicious movements, it was a far cry from a 100% chance to remove the most powerful role we've seen up to then.

Like, how can you possibly reconcile this? At the time I thought "Well, there's an HHA there they want to use, so it wasn't the right moment to take out the roomies. They went for me instead and ran up against my ability."

But after we learned about the Traitor, that became: "Oh, they must've tried to kill franconp and flipped the Traitor."

It just comes down to the fact that there is no way kingkitty was a better target that day than franconp. Franconp would have to be HHA for that to work, and with ultron's ability mirroring that of Hobohodo's, the chances of that are becoming less and less. Though it's still possible that franconp was the sleeper and his claim was a defense and a signal both, but that wouldn't explain ultron at all.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
you should reread my first post under the microscope and see if you can spot something :p

Hey guys, how's it going?
I don't mean to be a burden or anything but I sort of forgot to do all

my homework for school and there's a civics test coming up so I'm wondering if you can help me out with a cheat sheet.
All you have to do is write a post containing your role (if revealed) and it's action (if known), a short bit describing what you think you've done
for town, to push the town agenda and who your top 2 HHA and top 2 town are right now with a small justification for each.
I woul dreally appreciate it, I don't want to fail on my first day! :(
Anyways, thanks for your help guys.
I thought something was weird with the newlines but I didn't look closely the first time. Anyway me right now:
 

nin1000

Banned
OK guys, I am sorry but I will be able to respond to this thread later today. I am OK with getting some heat again as the game progresses and well, it's been a while since I had been accused of being HHA. Like I said, I will be able to respond 8 hours from now.
 
RNH had already requested an explanation from me. I have enough sense to know where the wind is blowing.

Still doesnt change the fact that you didn't have a vote from RNH until you made the post about KK, so still wrong and trying to call me out on my counting.

See above.
See above.
No one takes "gut feelings" seriously. Did you really think that's an adequate defense?
I said this:
And you said, in response:
For this voting phase? Yep, wouldve took gut feeling. And I also said that in response to you acting like you had some information that casted all doubt away from Kingkitty, which you didn't. It was just some uncalled for roleclaim.

Do you really feel that kingkitty was a more lucrative target than the Investigator? Really? This is the big inconsistency that you never adequately resolved, nor even addressed. Until you do, I cannot take your theory seriously.

I gave a very valid reason to why they would target KingKitty that night. I also shot a big hole in your theory that the roomies were flipped when I posted what Kark specifically said (only entered commands affect both roomies). So just based on that, they didn't target the roomies. Also it was day 3 and villagers heavily outnumber HHA so they probably figured they could wait to deal with him b4 they have to get rid of one of their own along with him.

You keep saying you were so brazen and the HHA were trying to get you the night there was no kill. So what in your mind would make the HHA target you instead of the investigator? I looked at all your posting on day 3 and you did literally nothing to draw any attention to yourself. Of the like 15-18 posts you had that day, a good chunk of them are filler posts. You did nothing to draw attn to yourself.

At the time I thought "Well, there's an HHA there they want to use, so it wasn't the right moment to take out the roomies. They went for me instead and ran up against my ability."

Guess what kingkitty posted that day?

shrug, sure. But whatever role I'm confirmed to be, I rather it not be outed in the thread.

If I happened to be picked by the investigator, I rather he just say "yeah he's a townie" and leave it at that.

if it's me instead of the investigator, I'm fine with that.

So you can wildly assume, after the fact that a sleeper agent is in the game, that the HHA targeted you over the investigator for no reason at all.
But I can't assume the HHA targeted KingKitty over the investigator, even though I plainly used evidences of King making it seem like he had a power role?

But after we learned about the Traitor, that became: "Oh, they must've tried to kill franconp and flipped the Traitor."

It just comes down to the fact that there is no way kingkitty was a better target that day than franconp. Franconp would have to be HHA for that to work, and with ultron's ability mirroring that of Hobohodo's, the chances of that are becoming less and less. Though it's still possible that franconp was the sleeper and his claim was a defense and a signal both, but that wouldn't explain ultron at all.

My point the traitors ability wouldn't save the other room mate. You are wrong about there being a sleeper agent in the roomies.

I pm'd Kark about it. He didn't state whether the lost partner's ability would count as a passive or action, but he did specifically state that any entered command must be performed on both roomies.
 

kingkitty

Member
For now I'm going to

unvote:haly

His placement makes sense. A commuter for each light sleeper. He even borders a light sleeper, like Tucah. Plus, it's not a stretch to think we might have an odd day commuter, to go along with an even day commuter. I'm not saying 100 percent he's not-mafia, but for now, I'm not gonna vote for him at the moment. I'm fine with either going for Ourobolus + no evict. Or even the roomies, although I would prefer at least another day of investigations.

Or you can continue to vote for me. But I prefer you don't, because:

1) I believe it is unlikely to have half of mafia in the same gossip chat (we can argue about this all day, but that's what I believe. You're either jiggy with it or not.)

and

2) I also believe that my behavior doesn't make sense. If I was mafia, then that means I asked franconp to investigate Hobodobo, which would reveal his true nature. This could have been a play to gain trust with the townies. But then in the same day, I completely switched gears and did everything I could to save Hobodobo, nearly causing a tie. Doing it in a way that obviously caused suspicion among the townies. For some reason I believed Hobodobo to be expendable trash, but then I later completely changed my mind and wanted him alive. That's not the behavior of mafia, that's the behavior of an unsure, confused townie.

Of course, I did try to make myself a target for mafia. That is the absolute truth. I thought I was being helpful. If I knew about the sleeper mafia role, I wouldn't have done it. On Night 3 there was no death, which could imply that the sleeper mafia was finally discovered. It could have been someone else (because I'm not mafia), or that possibly they attacked Haly on an odd day.

I hope you look at the whole picture, and not only how I tried to be a martyr. When you look at the whole picture, I believe the pieces don't quite fit enough to suggest that I am scum. I prefer you not to vote for me with the excuse "we can afford to lose a townie", because I'm sure we're going to need breathing room if we consider evicting the roomies in a future day phase. And of course, if Ourobolus is supposedly a vengeful townie.

I'm too worn out to have another long slog of an argument with gentlemen who say I am wrong and I am simply evil scum. Look at my argument, if you think my argument has some merit, then I prefer you don't vote for me. If my argument has given you some doubt, then I would like you to not to vote for me.

I'll be back chatting tomorrowish.
 

RetroMG

Member
A couple of people have called for discussion on Nin, but that's all they've done. Anyone care to explain why you find Nin suspicious? Like I said before, I think it's him or Ouro, bit that is mostly based on the idea that there is probably at least one HHA in my gossip group. (And I know that it isn't me.)
 

nin1000

Banned
Sorry but its not me either. Since i still stand by claim that i am an ordinary villager.
Nothing has changed since i got called out for defending my fellow mate freakzilla and nothing will change if you guys vote for me ( besides me being dead and you killing a villager that would still want to play ).
 

nin1000

Banned
That said I find the lack of discussion surrounding Nin at this point in time to be suspect in and of itself, Razmos has said something even though I don't agree with the logic presented, Nin hasn't really said much of anything, I've made a point or two and made it clear that I believe he's the lost partner, that's all that's really happened with Nin. I've been really hoping to see more people chime in with reads on Nin or to hear Nin give some sort of defense or at least a response.

Sorry , was at work but i could now give you insight on my oh so strange behaviour :)
i will try to give you a response to everything that i have said. Even though i was not very active the last day since i had to do some work.

Nothing of interest has happened to me besides being invited into a dead chat were only me and retro talked for the last night.
 

RetroMG

Member
Sorry but its not me either. Since i still stand by claim that i am an ordinary villager.

I want to be clear that I don't think it's you. (Although it seems likely to be you or Ouro, IMO, but that's just me trying to read the game itself.)

But a couple people have said that they think you're suspicious, and other than Squidy calling out your lurking playstyle*, I haven't heard a good reason to suspect you. Maybe I've missed something. Maybe the HHA is trying to defer suspicion. If some I don't hear some good arguments, I'm inclined to think it's the latter, and then I will be looking at those people.

*and I've been crazy busy, so I'm not about to get on someone's case for not posting very often. I'm hoping to be more active in the game now that the wedding/funeral debacle is over.
 

RetroMG

Member
If some I don't hear some good arguments, I'm inclined to think it's the latter, and then I will be looking at those people.

Rogue word! Be on the lookout! If I were really crazy, I'd put a secret message in all the spelling and grammar errors I call out since I can't edit.
I'm not doing that, please don't wast time looking.

Welcome back, Time. Please help us bring order to this insanity,
or notch it up, and let's see if we can out-do the SW thread.
 
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