Picked one up from currys just now. Will set it up tomorrow. Plex really is the killer app for me, I'll buy new hardware that supports it in an attempt to find the best way to integrate it with our living room setup. So far the Xbox one is the best but I have high hopes for Apple TV.
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Apple TV |OT|
- Thread starter wachie
- Start date
tvOS? another app?
Got the Shakes
Member
As someone who has literally owned 5 different streaming devices, a HTPC, XB1, and PS4 I have found that the Apple TV app is my favorite looking. Plex Home Theater of course has the most functionality when it come to native formats supported, but I think the Apple TV app is the best you can get on anything that isn't a full featured HTPC. Hell, even PHT is being abandoned for Plex Media Player so the HTPC experience has taken a step back.
FlyStarJay
Member
Per device? that sucks cause if it was for all device i will pay. but i will not pay for phone and tablet seperately
Got the Shakes
Member
I'm like 99.9% sure that Plex is a universal app. Pay for it once, and you can use it on any device using the same Apple ID.
Marty Chinn
Member
I'd be perfectly fine with this but unfortunately none of these boxes seem to handle Dolby True HD/DTS-MA though in any capacity.
The Apple TV certainly has potential and the eyeballs thanks to the Apple name, but it also has the concern of Apple's restrictions too so I have cautious reservation on how this will pan out.
Like you said Roku is better service wise, Fire TV gives you more flexibility and plenty of potential with the ability to sideload anything. The Apple TV at this point has neither of these factors. I'm just not ready to declare how great the Apple TV4 is or could be after just 4 days. I say this as someone who highly praised the Apple TV2 at the time. I do think it's a bit ironic that you mention how well things will hold over time though when Apple already capped it by not including 4K though. I'm curious where the app development will go, but honestly this isn't a box that at the moment I don't see it needing to do well with things like games or being able to order airplane tickets. I want a great media box so the highest priority to me is what media can it play and stream. The thing about that those is it doesn't take much or thousands of apps to hit those goals even though nobody is hitting them except maybe Roku. You just need all the major streaming services and the ability to stream your own media in whatever format you have with a good interface linking everything together. I'd like Apple to improve on what's out there because there's no perfect box out there right now and anything that gets me closer to that perfect box I'm willing to drop money on in a heart beat. But like I said, Apple isn't there yet or even close to being there yet. Potential doesn't mean much if it never actually materializes. The PlayStation TV speaks volumes of that.
holygeesus
Banned
It's been out less than a week and has already improved massively. Seems a bit nuts to write it off already!
As of its recent 2.0 software update, the Nvidia Shield TV can handle these formats. For an app platform + major streaming services + high-end local media playback, it might be the best single box at the moment. It's more expensive than its major competitors, of course.
I believe you can sideload whatever you like onto the new Apple TV, as long as you have a Mac + XCode. Should eventually allow for some interesting stuff.
Snake29
RSI Employee of the Year
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvKtFYKcBRQ
- No transcoding needed
- Direct play from my NAS (test NAS..waiting for my Synologie
)
- No transcoding needed
- Direct play from my NAS (test NAS..waiting for my Synologie
)
holygeesus
Banned
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvKtFYKcBRQ
- No transcoding needed
- Direct play from my NAS (test NAS..waiting for my Synologie
Yeah there are a couple of basic apps doing similar now, just with different front-ends. For some reason both apps I've tried are down-sampling the audio to stereo though.
Got the Shakes
Member
You can sideload on Apple TV, it takes a Mac and Xcode, but it's technically possible.
One thing I've noticed in the 5 days of having an Apple TV is that the apps that are available (at least the ones I use) are superior to the same apps on other devices. Two examples, first is HBO Go. Comcast isn't supported on some boxes (which I know is more of a Comcast problem than anything, but it is a problem nonetheless), and for some some reason on XB1, PS4 and Fire TV they don't have season pass or watch list support while Comcast supports Apple TV day 1 and watch list/season pass support is there day 1 in version 1.0 on Apple TV. Plex (I know you hate Plex, but plenty of people use it) has the best looking (albeit subjective) and fully featured app of any of the streaming boxes I've tried on Apple TV. Roku's Plex app is slow, Fire TV has no 5.1 support, the Android TV app is playing catch up.
Again everyone's uses are different. For mine, Apple TV has been the best choice for a streaming box especially since I have all of my music in iCloud via iTunes Match. I'm a Prime member, but honestly I just don't use Prime Video often at all except for the upcoming season of Man in the High Castle. I can AirPlay to Apple TV for that if I want although not as elegant as a dedicated Amazon app would be.
But you are ready to write it off after those 4 days? I mean I hope not, but that's sort of how you are coming off, which I'm guessing is why people (including myself once or twice) might seem to be jumping on you
This always come down to licensing. In fact even just an app doing software decoding could get into trouble (IP, patent, etc) for decoding those. So we'll see how this is handled going forward on various devices/apps.
as someone already said, you can sideload apps on iOS9/tvOS9/XCode7. Apple's restrictions will only affect distributing an app on the App Store. The only thing that would need a jailbreak are for things apple is preventing through tvOS/iOS itself (MFi controller requirement, lack of additional surround outputs/passthru, root access, etc)
Is there a Vudu app available for the Shield TV? That's the only thing missing from the Fire TV that I could use. I have a Chromecast for Vudu but I'd rather have everything handled by a single streaming box.
I could be wrong.. I know they IAP says "buy a key for this device to stream plex"... but again, I don't have it installed on iOS, only tvOS.
IAP can however not be "buy once". IAP can either be setup as buy once per device (UDID), buy once for an Apple ID (can be restored to all devices, aka DLC, keys, etc), or buy multiple times (aka currency packs for f2p and stuff). Its up to the dev how they setup IAP.. just not sure how plex's key is set.
I don't actually own a Shield TV, so I can't check, but I don't believe they have an Android TV app at this point.
Ok, I didn't think there was one available. If they decide to make one at that point I could side load and have all streaming services I use in one box.
Barkley's Justice
Member
I have an older Synology Nas with all of my movies on it.
Would the Plex AppleTV app be able to play my mkv's without transcoding?
I have an old Win10 HTPC running Kodi I'd like to sunset if Plex is up for the challenge.
Would the Plex AppleTV app be able to play my mkv's without transcoding?
I have an old Win10 HTPC running Kodi I'd like to sunset if Plex is up for the challenge.
FlyStarJay
Member
i think its been discussed already. i cannot airplay youtube videos from my mac nor airplay anything from my phone. i can only airplay from my tablet.
is this a bug that can be fixed? day 1 i was able to airplay youtube video from mac, never tried iPhone but now can't play from mac.
also i think i could airplay netflix from phone
is this a bug that can be fixed? day 1 i was able to airplay youtube video from mac, never tried iPhone but now can't play from mac.
also i think i could airplay netflix from phone
Got the Shakes
Member
It's $4.99 for app activation (unlock the restrictions of the free app) and $4.99 should you want to purchase a Plex Pass through the app. I've had Plex long enough that when I bought the app on iOS it was $4.99 for the app itself, it wasn't an IAP, and there wasn't a free version. They changed it so that they now offer a free version with restrictions so that people can try it out and if they want the full version then they can pay the $4.99 as an IAP. Pretty sure it's still a pay once and it is available on all of your devices thing though.
infiniteloop
Member
Apple have released a tvOS 9.1 beta (likely be 1.01 or 1.1 when it comes out). " The release notes for tvOS 9.1 indicate improvements coming to WiFi network compatibility, in-app-purchases for App Store apps, and improved scrolling."
http://9to5mac.com/2015/11/03/apple-releases-first-tvos-9-1-beta-for-new-apple-tv/
http://9to5mac.com/2015/11/03/apple-releases-first-tvos-9-1-beta-for-new-apple-tv/
1.
Does anyone else have issues with bad IQ when transcoding content via Plex? The video quality when streaming directly to my Bravia via DLNA seems to be far superior (not nitpicking, it's a noticeable difference). I've only transcoded to iOS devices before, and haven't really noticed any major quality loss, perhaps due to the small screens.
2.
So Siri isn't available yet here in Sweden. In any language. I mean, I was using Siri in English on iOS years before it launched with Swedish language support. But for some reason, on the Apple TV, Siri doesn't work at all unless I set United States as my location in account settings, which renders the App Store half useless and seems to disable Netflix in Universal Search. WTF?
Does anyone else have issues with bad IQ when transcoding content via Plex? The video quality when streaming directly to my Bravia via DLNA seems to be far superior (not nitpicking, it's a noticeable difference). I've only transcoded to iOS devices before, and haven't really noticed any major quality loss, perhaps due to the small screens.
2.
So Siri isn't available yet here in Sweden. In any language. I mean, I was using Siri in English on iOS years before it launched with Swedish language support. But for some reason, on the Apple TV, Siri doesn't work at all unless I set United States as my location in account settings, which renders the App Store half useless and seems to disable Netflix in Universal Search. WTF?
Marty Chinn
Member
But you are ready to write it off after those 4 days? I mean I hope not, but that's sort of how you are coming off, which I'm guessing is why people (including myself once or twice) might seem to be jumping on you
Where did I write it off in 4 days? I'm saying the Apple TV4 doesn't stack up to the others since it's deficient in certain areas. I'm not saying the Apple TV4 will never improve or even surpass; I'm saying it's not there yet and premature to call it the go to box. I'm saying it's simply too soon to praise how great it is since it is still getting it's footing.
Sure it's a license issue, but that doesn't make it being any less of an issue. Right now you need a PC or apparently a Shield TV to handle that type of audio. It's a strike against any of these media boxes.
It's not quite as good though. Can you sideload an iPad app on to the Apple TV and it will work? With the Fire TV (and probably Android TV), you could sideload any Android app, and there's a high probability it will work. Most apps by default have cursor navigation too even though they're designed for touch screens. Certainly some apps just won't work well at all, but many of the media apps do work. So if a service doesn't get supported on the Fire TV, but there is an Android app, I can still potentially use that service. I have high doubts you'll be able to do that on the Apple TV. I'd like to be wrong on that aspect though. Also will Siri work on sideloaded apps or does Siri only work on official apps approved in the app store?
Glass Shark
Banned
.
outside of iPhone -> iPad, apple does not support this with UIKit.. mostly because
yeah...... that is not a good user/customer experience....
I can answer this with an "in theory, yes". Use of Core Spotlight happens at the OS level. Even TopShelf and stuff. So yes, if you sideload or develop your own unreleased app that accesses those APIs, Siri will be able to hit it (unless Apple artificially restricts it to only signed apps... which I can't believe they would do as that would be a major part of testing one would think)
Marty Chinn
Member
Well we're talking about sideloading and not officially released through the store though so good user/customer experience shouldn't matter. So while you can sideload on Apple TV, it's still sounds more restrictive than Android due to the nature of how Apple has splintered the OSs. I understand why they would do that, but it doesn't change that it makes it less flexible to solve certain problems such as adding streaming services that aren't supported on Apple TV. It'll be interesting to see what kind of unofficial apps get developed though.
FlyStarJay
Member
why are they calling it tvOS 9? instead of 1?
My first thought is they were continuing version numbering from previous Apple TV OSes, but the 3rd gen is running Apple TV software 7.2 (based on iOS 8.4), so they must just be trying to kinda align things with iOS versions?
it is an iOS fork. They did the same thing with ATV2/3 up to a point. In iOS release X.y, X is always the same between all devices running the code base, with .y changing on Apple TV (and rarely even between mobile devices once I thought). At some point Apple TV changed completely.. but yeah.. being that devs can now build universal apps between all three devices.. they want them to share the same major revision number. Just easier.
There's nothing preventing them from doing client-side decoding, it's more a question of dev time / expertise since they haven't done it previously. Not sure about the new 4K PC client they released, but their previous playback software on computers was using existing 3rd party libraries as far as I know
Obviously doing client-side decoding is currently against the original rationale for creating Plex, but that doesn't mean things won't move in that direction as the environment continues to change.
On a device with a 10' UI, they're gonna want all or nothing ... not a streaming-only offering. No way they want to give up rentals / purchases, and unless they can get a reasonable rate ... it's untenable. Granted I'm assuming Terrell is incorrect and Amazon actually would like to have their services here if it makes business sense.
I suspect this will be a problem for all of the VOD providers unfortunately. VUDU, Google, Amazon, etc. They all want to have their content show up on searches, and be purchasable within the UI. Either not showing up or clicking on it and getting a 'go buy it online' is a bad for business.
Actually is YouTube on the new AppleTV currently, or reported to be coming? I expect Google to allow views of Play Moves and TV purchases on YouTube as they have with most of the recent clients. They're in a very different position than others though. A view-only app makes sense for them.
While things could change, tvOS is derived from iOS ... and phone is still Apple's primary focus. For that reason you only see codec support in the SDK for what is accelerated on the hardware. They don't want to be personally responsible for the battery life toll software decoding incurs. Also for financial reasons, they're only gonna support licensed codecs that they and their big partners need. For that reason Dolby Digital and Dolby Digital Plus are there. For that same reason, DTS isn't there even though the SoC actually has decoding built in I suspect (at least that's the case for the SoC's used in most of the competition).
As for containers, that comes down to maintenance I'd imagine. If it isn't a container they have control of or is used by them or their partners, they don't want the headache of official support. MKV is being updated all the time, out of their control, and isn't used by any of the providers they care about.
Of course some of this could ultimately change since battery is no longer an issue on this device, but I suspect they'll just let developers deal with it. I should point out that container support is generally no big deal in terms of complexity or processing power. For example, remuxing on even a low powered NAS is viable for Plex. What's important is whether the codecs used inside are supported or not.
For example, I use MKV's with Plex on Roku all the time. There's a few second loading time when you start for it to dump the codecs into a supported container ... then you're off. No impact on fast forwarding, etc. So whether Plex adds more container support to the client itself really isn't a big deal.
31GhostsIV
Banned
Is there anywhere online you can view upcoming tvos apps? I've had a Google but found nothing. I'm just interested to see what's coming down the pipe.
FlyStarJay
Member
on plex when i try to make all eps as watched, it quits the app
sonycowboy
Member
Correct me where I'm wrong, but Xcode isn't a magical bypass for iOS/tvOS. It doesn't allow you to install a packaged binary that's been signed.
What it will allow is for you to do is:
1) build an app assuming you have the source code. I don't think most app developers will give you that even if they allow you to side-load
OR
2) Sign an app binary if your Xcode developer account is associated with the app ID. Again, you aren't likely to have this..
OR
3) Have the developer use your UDID to allow you to run the app outside of the app store.
Otherwise, you can't simply get a binary that's floating around and use Xcode to install it onto an apple device (AFAIK)
acheron_xl
Member
Finally got mine. Seems incredibly promising. I love that the open app ecosystem means I can get some dumb clock app and have a 46-inch clock in my living room.
And I think the ills of the keyboard are overstated. It's not great, but at least it has something resembling inertial scrolling.
And I think the ills of the keyboard are overstated. It's not great, but at least it has something resembling inertial scrolling.
Marty Chinn
Member
The thing I saw made it sound like you could just take binaries you download and push them to the device. So I believe borghe is right about being able to sideload easily.
sonycowboy
Member
I'm not aware of that capability. It doesn't exist for iOS. Can anyone point me somewhere that shows this? I know Provenance will let you do that for emulators.
https://github.com/jasarien/Provenance
"An iOS/tvOS Frontend for multiple emulators, currently supporting Sega Genesis, Game Gear/Master System, Sega CD, SNES, NES, GB/GBC and GBA. http://jamesaddyman.com/provenance?"
But that's downloading the open source Xcode project from github and compiling it (#1 above).
Update: I see Kodi is also open source, you might be able to do it as well (assuming it compiles for TVOS)
no, you cannot sideload binaries.. however there won't be many binaries out there (so to speak). I mean if you have something built into a binary, you're going to release it to the app store.. if you can't release it to the app store (violating terms)... there isn't much sense leaving it in binary form unless you just want to be a dick.. Provenance for example. It will NEVER be on app store. So the XCode project is just freely downloadable from github at which point you can go through the 3-4 steps of building it and loading it to your Apple TV.
I can't even imagine the special person where "my app has no chance in being approved by Apple, but I'm not releasing source code for it".. at least until a jailbreak happens.
edit - oops.. and what sonycowboy is saying about running actual non-app store binaries.. but THAT needs a developer account (the one that signed the binary) and then UDID's added that can run the beta. Not sure what the UDID limit is anymore.. used to be 50 per Apple Developer account.
I can't even imagine the special person where "my app has no chance in being approved by Apple, but I'm not releasing source code for it".. at least until a jailbreak happens.
edit - oops.. and what sonycowboy is saying about running actual non-app store binaries.. but THAT needs a developer account (the one that signed the binary) and then UDID's added that can run the beta. Not sure what the UDID limit is anymore.. used to be 50 per Apple Developer account.
FlyStarJay
Member
This is my 1st device, i am loving it and plex is a GREAT addition. siri voice works on it, going back 10 seconds, "what did he just say"
again this is my 1st device and i love it
again this is my 1st device and i love it
Marty Chinn
Member
Eh? You kinda oversold the ability to side load then.
This link made it sound like you could push binaries over:
http://www.hongkiat.com/blog/sideload-ios-apps-iemulators/
Does the Plex app require a sub like the PS4/XBO?
infiniteloop
Member
It's free.
Kabuki Quantum Lover
Member
FlyStarJay
Member
nah its free on the apple tv. no charge. how much is the ps4/xbo app?
Good, that is essentially how it works on Roku. I think this will be the set top box to end all set top boxes for me. I love my Roku, but Apple TV simply makes more sense given my situation.
It requires a Plex Pass. You cannot pay for the app itself and be done with it. At least, for as long as it remains in beta for those machines.
The Apple TV just got third-party software and now blu wants to take that away ;(
blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
A good nettop/server box for $150.