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[NBtoaster]

No, they are saying the game doesn't have shadows in unlit areas -- not the lit areas. For example, look at

In those gifs, you are in an unlit area and there is still shadows. Not so in AC:Unity.

-M

TLOU is one of the only games to have indirect shadows, it's not fair to criticize ACU for something almost every other game also lacks.

It still uses some form of dynamic ao to give depth within shadowed areas.

 

[riskVSreward]

Yuck, really? Looks awful to me.

I believe him, he has posted before that he prefers the look of crushed blacks....

 

[valkyre]

Naughty Dog showing Ubisoft how it's done. Also can't believe they did on PS3

Indeed... Ps3 last of us has unbelievably good looking and realistic shadow system in unlit areas.

But according to Ubisoft next gen starts here...

 

[quetz67]

No, they are saying the game doesn't have shadows in unlit areas -- not the lit areas. For example, look at

In those gifs, you are in an unlit area and there is still shadows.

Which is probably wrong. In ambient light situations there are no shadows besides contact shadows (AO).

 

[VFX_Veteran]

TLOU is one of the only games to have indirect shadows, it's not fair to criticize ACU for something almost every other game also lacks.

It still uses some form of dynamic ao to give depth within shadowed areas.

True, but it doesn't even look like standard SSAO.

I don't even see this:

on the floors.

 

[valkyre]

Which is probably wrong. In ambient light situations there are no shadows besides contact shadows (AO).

Sorry but you are wrong. Shadows do exist just not as profound as when in very bright areas. Dont tell me you cant see your legs cast a shadow when you are in your house during the day with lights off...

 

[NBtoaster]

True, but it doesn't even look like standard SSAO.

I don't even see this:

on the floors.

Ideally you would never see anything like that because its far too thick and low quality. AO should be subtle.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

Which is probably wrong. In ambient light situations there are no shadows besides contact shadows (AO).

It's not wrong. Have you seen the realworld lately?

Look at that image. You can clearly see shadows in unlit areas.

 

[WinterX]

Got a question? Some interaction with crowds will be available? If not then it's all scripts, just like it was earlier. I don't get it, totally.

 

[Dictator93]

Stealth attack against PS4? Not so stealth actually.
Please mister PC guy, enlighten us how this game is demonstrating to all of us that the hardware inside PS4 isn't capable of more than this, despite plenty of already released games actually are a lot better looking than this POS.

This has nothing to do with AAA super bloated multiplatform development occurring inside Ubisoft right now? Am I right?

It's like taking Bayonetta to demonstrate that PS3's hardware is fucking garbage. But heck, this is console fault, everything will be fine on PC like it was with Watch Dogs for sure. PS4 would melt trying to do better!

I think what I am getting at, is that this game is that there is only so much 1.84 TF can really do. If you have tons of on screen objects, a high LOD, whatever, PBR (like this game has), on top of what looks like a pretty good indirect lighting system... it does make sense that something has to give. In this case it was resolution.

I think the game still looks very good in motion, but it is not surprising that 900p screenshots of an openworld game happen to look shitty at times. That is what I mean. Everyone sure enjoys some Ubisoft bashing (myself included), but this game is by far the first "open world" title with large AI counts along with a very complex renderer.

No stealth PS4 bashing, but asking for a reality check based upon everything we have been shown so far in terms of the graphical prowess in this gen.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

Ideally you would never see anything like that because its far too thick and low quality. AO should be subtle.

AO is subtle.. but it shouldn't be missing altogether.

 

[nOoblet16]

Which is probably wrong. In ambient light situations there are no shadows besides contact shadows (AO).

Nope you are incorrect, have a look around in real life again.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

I think what I am getting at, is that this game is that there is only so much 1.84 TF can really do. If you have tons of on screen objects, a high LOD, whatever, PBR (like this game has), on top of what looks like a pretty good indirect lighting system... it does make sense that something has to give. In this case it was resolution.

I think the game still looks very good in motion, but it is not surprising that 900p screenshots of an openworld game happen to look shitty at times. That is what I mean. Everyone sure enjoys some Ubisoft bashing (myself included), but this game is by far the first "open world" title with large AI counts along with a very complex renderer.

No stealth PS4 bashing, but asking for a reality check based upon everything we have been shown so far in terms of the graphical prowess in this gen.

Can you specify what dynamic GI system they have? I don't see any. Only the typical pre-baked light probes.

 

[dex3108]

Got a question? Some interaction with crowds will be available? If not then it's all scripts, just like it was earlier. I don't get it, totally.

I am not completely sure but they showed couple crowd events like fight between factions, saving some crowd people from execution, stampede etc. How we will interact with this we don't know. Also if guards are chasing you you can use crowd to hide.

 

[MarkV]

 

[M°°nblade]

Not true at all.

Take this picture.
http://i0.wp.com/gearnuke.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/ACUnity-PS4-Leaked-3.jpg

The head of the main character is casting a shadow on his neck. The eyebrows on the eyes.
Why isn't his hair casting a shadow on his forehead?
Like this:
http://www.nowgamer.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/297858.png

The female NPC standing before him is even worse. There is no dept. The texture painted shadowless scapula make her look cartoony.

Shadow effects in unlit places are lacking, inconsistent and/or prebaked.

 

[DarkLordMalik]

This video is from another leaker.

http://vimeo.com/110518121

Shows the very beginning with

Spoiler

Young Arno

PS4 compression (720p) ruins the IQ by a whole lot though.

 

[nOoblet16]

Can you specify what dynamic GI system they have? I don't see any. Only the typical pre-baked light probes.

Light probes are not pre baked though (unless I am incorrectly guessing what you mean by pre baked here), it's just like Farcry 3 I suppose. The game probably has a dynamic TOD so they need light probes rather than lightmaps.

 

[codswallop]

I played the mission at the Notre Dame today on Xbox One, so presumably the same resolution/FPS as this. Looked fine to me, better than Black Flag (mostly high settings on PC, 1200p, or at least letterboxed 1080p), though because the colours are muted I can see why some would prefer Black Flag. Shadows are definitely present when appropriate and suitably soft.

Rogue was right next to Unity and Unity looks way better to me.

 

[Dictator93]

Light probes are not pre baked though (unless I am incorrectly guessing what you mean by pre baked here), it's just like Farcry 3 I suppose. The game probably has a dynamic TOD so they need light probes rather than lightmaps.

Yeah, and they seem to be grid plced everywhere (like Far Cry 3).

IMO, it is perhaps the best indirect lighting we will see in a release game till Tomorrow Children or Deep Down comes out.

 

[CerebralTiger]

I think what I am getting at, is that this game is that there is only so much 1.84 TF can really do.

Well, apparently, the Xbox One version is doing the same (maybe the LOD is pared back a little?) with ~1.3 TF, so I'm not sure if that's the limitation in this case.

 

[flipswitch]

Yeah, and they seem to be grid plced everywhere (like Far Cry 3).

IMO, it is perhaps the best indirect lighting we will see in a release game till Tomorrow Children or Deep Down comes out.

What about Alien: isolation?

 

[UrbanRats]

The screens in the OP don't look good, but some of you using real life as a comparison are really puzzling me here.

Anyway, if it looks on PC like that NVIDIA video they recently released, i'm more than fine with it, looked great.

 

[Dictator93]

What about Alien: isolation?

Forgot about that, yeah that has really cool GI too. Albeit, in much closer spaces.

 

[ninjablade]

Well, apparently, the Xbox One version is doing the same (maybe the LOD is pared back a little?) with ~1.3 TF, so I'm not sure if that's the limitation in this case.

Wait for the DF article. I expect the ps4 version to have advantages and run smoother.

 

[fardeenah]

this gameplay video seems pretty good even in low quality

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9J9sObzVCv8

 

[UrbanRats]

Light probes are not pre baked though (unless I am incorrectly guessing what you mean by pre baked here), it's just like Farcry 3 I suppose. The game probably has a dynamic TOD so they need light probes rather than lightmaps.

The game doesn't have dynamic day/night cycle, but some set TOD, that switches between through loading screens.

FC3 (IIRC) had a dynamic cycle.

 

[M°°nblade]

The screens in the OP don't look good, but some of you using real life as a comparison are really puzzling me here.

Those real life screens were posted because someone defended ACU lighting system by saying that in real life shadows don't exist in ambient light situations either.

 

[quetz67]

Nope you are incorrect, have a look around in real life again.

I am not talking about daylight situations. I talk about ambient light situations like after sunset. If there is no discernable light source there are no shadows. Indoors is always different. Light comes through windows which are a light source even if the light coming in is rather ambient. Outside after sunset the light comes from the sky reflecting it and it is mostly ambient (depending on the clouds it is not always and with a thick cloud cover we might even have ambient light at day).

I can't determine what light situations where present in those tlou movies, so I wrote they "migth" be wrong, but on the other side I can definitely say there are lots of light situation that are completely lacking directed shadows. These will show more contact shadows which I already wrote are missing here and make characters look washed out/feeling off.

 

[NBtoaster]

Take this picture.
http://i0.wp.com/gearnuke.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/ACUnity-PS4-Leaked-3.jpg

The head of the main character is casting a shadow on his neck. The eyebrows on the eyes.
Why isn't his hair casting a shadow on his forehead?
Like this:
http://www.nowgamer.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/297858.png

The female NPC standing before him is even worse. There is no dept. The texture painted shadowless scapula make her look cartoony.

Shadow effects in unlit places are lacking, inconsistent and/or prebaked.

His whole body is in shadow, so self shadowing does not happen (like most other games). His neck is just shaded darker, it's not an actual shadow.

There is some subtle ao in the scene to give depth, such as on the dress of the lady to the far left or between the hand and dress on the lady to the left of him.

 

[UrbanRats]

Those real life screens were posted because someone defended ACU lighting system by saying that in real life shadows don't exist in ambient light situations either.

Of course that makes zero sense (if there's light, there's shadows) but i guess they meant that they're not obvious enough to spend limited HW resources on.
A bit like 2nd bounce indirect light doesn't offer enough of a visual improvement over 1st bounce, given the computational requirements.
And slapping some AO could do the trick well enough.

 

[quetz67]

It's not wrong. Have you seen the realworld lately?

Look at that image. You can clearly see shadows in unlit areas.

Don't know why you post these pics. There are lots of direct light sources here, the opposite of an ambient light situation. Even here in the darker areas we have mostly contact shadows.

 

[M°°nblade]

I am not talking about daylight situations. I talk about ambient light situations like after sunset. If there is no discernable light source there are no shadows.

But these ACU screenshots are daylight situations.
http://i0.wp.com/gearnuke.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/ACUnity-PS4-Leaked-3.jpg

 

[R_Deckard]

I think what I am getting at, is that this game is that there is only so much 1.84 TF can really do. If you have tons of on screen objects, a high LOD, whatever, PBR (like this game has), on top of what looks like a pretty good indirect lighting system... it does make sense that something has to give. In this case it was resolution.

I think the game still looks very good in motion, but it is not surprising that 900p screenshots of an openworld game happen to look shitty at times. That is what I mean. Everyone sure enjoys some Ubisoft bashing (myself included), but this game is by far the first "open world" title with large AI counts along with a very complex renderer.

No stealth PS4 bashing, but asking for a reality check based upon everything we have been shown so far in terms of the graphical prowess in this gen.

You may just want to remember this statement when the PC version ships...and is identical bar resolution ala watchdogs.

This game is in no way shape or form indicative of any platforms performance/peak or ability. Only 1st Party (and maybe Rockstar) can attest to maxing out a console in an "open world" game.

Yeah, and they seem to be grid plced everywhere (like Far Cry 3).

IMO, it is perhaps the best indirect lighting we will see in a release game till Tomorrow Children or Deep Down comes out.

Also Alien Isolation uses probes as does Killzone:SF it is hardly a new process in games all of a sudden.

People losing their sh!t in here is now a common occurrence, if it is not PC specs, it is no leaked poor shots of a game that is sub 1080 and yet to receive a given day 1 patch (hence the 2 week delay).

If you are thinking it will look blurrier and worse than the already seen X1 footage shown then....ah who am I kidding peeps just like to scream/bitch/moan and meltdown now..i just need to grab the......

 

[nOoblet16]

The game doesn't have dynamic day/night cycle, but some set TOD, that switches between through loading screens.

FC3 (IIRC) had a dynamic cycle.

What a bummer ! It's like we've regressed.
They introduced day and night cycle with AC2 (which is why it looked a bit worse than AC1), and now they have gone down to fixed TOD like Infamous.

 

[cormack12]

Someone alluded to it earlier but I think in this screenshots, the main character is 'blending' into the crowd which maybe making him look more washed out and have the weird circle and styrofoam beard. You can see an alert marker in the background, and the light on the upper side of the building is different to the shaded areas where NPC's are:

The rest of the screens look like they're missing something, like fog or haze. But in the following picture, look at the character models arm on the right. Wtf?!? And is that right foot clipping through the wall?

Also the (relevant) metadata from the image:

ImageDescription Assassin's Creed® Unity_20141031004928
Make Sony Computer Entertainment Inc.
Model PlayStation(R)4
Orientation Horizontal (normal)
XResolution 72
YResolution 72
ResolutionUnit inches
Software 1.76
ModifyDate 2014:10:31 00:49:27
YCbCrPositioning Centered
ExifVersion 0221
DateTimeOriginal 2014:10:31 00:49:27
CreateDate 2014:10:31 00:49:27
ColorSpace sRGB
ExifImageWidth 1920
ExifImageHeight 1080
Compression JPEG (old-style)

I've looked at these images and videos and surely these can't be from retail. Honestly, the clipping, pop in and flatness look awful. Have their been any closed betas in the last couple of months these could have been ripped from?

This one doesn't look too bad:

But in a similar stance look at the sword in this one compared to above:

I have a feeling that we may see some of the issues that were present in places like Boston in ACIII performance wise. I thought the point of the engine was it could handle these numbers anyway, because the engine spawned them in as you got closer to them. You'd get like that weird cross animus effect then a couple of NPC's would appear. Are they still using that tech or just making the spawn distance bigger?

I just think that they (Ubi) have have reached beyond their grasp. This quote here:

Keep in mind that previous Assassin’s Creed games could support around 100 to 150 NPCs; Assassin’s Creed Unity has crowds of thousands of NPCs on screen, and you can interact with each and every one them.

- Vincent Pontbriand (Source)

Surely we shouldn't be going from 125 (avg) to 'thousands'. To us, a step up to even 800 NPC's on screen is going to feel much more dense and alive (it's almost 8 times than could previously be done). It reads like a tech test is more important to achieve and they'll compromise core game elements to reach it. We didn't need to shoot from a couple of hundred to a couple of thousand, there is a happy medium I'm sure which will allow the rest of the game to be tweaked and reach higher fidelity.

 

[M°°nblade]

His whole body is in shadow, so self shadowing does not happen (like most other games). His neck is just shaded darker, it's not an actual shadow.

There is some subtle ao in the scene to give depth, such as on the dress of the lady to the far left or between the hand and dress on the lady to the left of him.

Self shadowing and shadowing shading always happen, look at the uncharted screenshot. Can you see how while Nathan is standing in the shadow of the pillar, his ear is still casting a shadow on his face?

The ao is unrealistic. Besides, the hand of the lady to the far left also dissappears in her dress. It almost looks like she is missing a hand because there's no dept.

 

[quetz67]

But these ACU screenshots are daylight situations.
http://i0.wp.com/gearnuke.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/ACUnity-PS4-Leaked-3.jpg

But the buildings already block the direct light so there is no direct light left that the characters can block. It looks bad because of the lack of contact shadows/AO on the characters, not because they don't cast directional shadow.

The characters are lit like they are in direct light, just darker, that's what makes them look wrong/washed out/floaty. Making them even darker or give them them some soft directional shadows would help the look but would not make it more real.

 

[dumbo]

TLOU is one of the only games to have indirect shadows, it's not fair to criticize ACU for something almost every other game also lacks.

But other games haven't attempted such an extreme lighting model.

At the end of the day, the game is trying to make you believe that Paris and it's inhabitants are real. The videos seem to do a very good job of making 'Paris' come alive, but a very poor job of making it's population seem real. (no reflections, no shadows [indirect], some lod/texture/animation pop-in issues).

I do wonder if the engine used for ACU is a step in entirely the wrong direction.

 

[NBtoaster]

Self shadowing and shadowing shading always happen, look at the uncharted screenshot. Can you see how while Nathan is standing in the shadow of the pillar, his ear is still casting a shadow on his face?

The ao is unrealistic. Besides, the hand of the lady to the far left also dissappears in her dress. It almost looks like she is missing a hand because there's no dept.

I think thats a sideburn not a shadow on his face. And he doesnt seem to be in the shadow of the pillar anyway.

 

[dark10x]

Self shadowing and shadowing shading always happen, look at the uncharted screenshot. Can you see how while Nathan is standing in the shadow of the pillar, his ear is still casting a shadow on his face?

The ao is unrealistic. Besides, the hand of the lady to the far left also dissappears in her dress. It almost looks like she is missing a hand because there's no dept.

Wait, you don't mean THIS shot, do you?

http://www.nowgamer.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/297858.png

 

[NBtoaster]

But other games haven't attempted such an extreme lighting model.

At the end of the day, the game is trying to make you believe that Paris and it's inhabitants are real. The videos seem to do a very good job of making 'Paris' come alive, but a very poor job of making it's population seem real. (no reflections, no shadows [indirect], some lod/texture/animation pop-in issues).

I do wonder if the engine used for ACU is a step in entirely the wrong direction.

Main problem imo is the low quality of hair and face assets, not the tech.

 

[Wind's Howling]

Can't we all just stay quiet for a few days before the DF article pops up to truly show what the game looks like?

For all we know these screenshots are ripped from a very old build, or perhaps they are already working on a Day 1 patch (like Black Flag) that will fix everything.

Majority of the posts I am reading here is all about bashing Ubisoft for not being able to deliver a stellar next-gen title. How would you know? Have you actually played the game on your own TV screen?

This is like those days where people say movie A or movie B is absolute crap, and then talk about it with their friends, yet they have not even seen the movie but they want to join the conversation without feeling left out.

 

[omonimo]

I think what I am getting at, is that this game is that is only so much 1.84 TF can really do. If you have tons of on screen objects, a high LOD, whatever, PBR (like this game has), on top of what looks like a pretty good indirect lighting system... it does make sense that something has to give. In this case it was resolution.

I think the game still looks very good in motion, but it is not surprising that 900p screenshots of an openworld game happen to look shitty at times. That is what I mean. Everyone sure enjoys some Ubisoft bashing (myself included), but this game is by far the first "open world" title with large AI counts along with a very complex renderer.

No stealth PS4 bashing, but asking for a reality check based upon everything we have been shown so far in terms of the graphical prowess in this gen.

For the fuck sake the hell has to do TF quantity with this. This game not work in a pc with the double of TF of the ps4. It's just ubisoft who don't know what optimisation means.

 

[CybernatonEvolution]

Nvidia is advertising TXAA in ACU; that is the ultimate form of Vaseline.

 

[dark10x]

Nvidia is advertising TXAA in ACU; that is the ultimate form of Vaseline.

Err, no? Eliminating sub-pixel shimmering improves image quality even if some people perceive it as blurry.

 

[quetz67]

Main problem imo is the low quality of hair and face assets, not the tech.

That is tech related. You just don't have the polys to make hair look good on hundrets of characters.

 

[Rogue_Ledr]

Ummmmmmm this does NOT look like the early footage/release shots.

 

[nOoblet16]

Someone alluded to it earlier but I think in this screenshots, the main character is 'blending' into the crowd which maybe making him look more washed out and have the weird circle and styrofoam beard. You can see an alert marker in the background, and the light on the upper side of the building is different to the shaded areas where NPC's are:

The first picture, look at the ground, there's a circle around the main character which means it indeed is a "blending in" effect.

 

[R3TRO]

That looks great.