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[Axios] Xbox content and services revenue grew by 0.7%, missing Nadella's target of 4.4% for 2023

adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
There were new Zune hardware rumours and leaks months before they decided to sunset it.

That's not the indication you need to be looking at for comfort. What's required is a healthy and profitable hardware business with indications that there's opportunity for growth.

Those are rumors, not leaked official plans. And in my last post said "next decade", i meant the 2020's. Who the fuck knows what will even be around in the 2030s at this point.

But I appreciate you going out of your way to google all these zune articles 🤗

Their internal targets were high even BEFORE the ABK acquisition, and now that they acquired ABK, they're going to expect even more growth.


Ok .. but ..

Disclaimer: Executive pay targets aren't an actual business plan. Nadella's goals don't necessarily indicate the numbers Microsoft needs its divisions to hit to be successful.

Internal targets aren't an actual metric of gauging growth, just that .. an aspirational internal target.

We can safely say that ABK *will* increase their growth from previous reports in a not-so-insignificant way.
 
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kebaldo

Member
And yet Nadella yesterday told that, after ABK, MS is even going to double its commitment to its games division and to be an even more powerful game publisher..... Imagine saying this if the games division were a ruin.

This sounds like the last big push... if it gives some fruits in the next years ok if it doesn't their gonna kill the cow.
 

GHG

Member
Those are rumors, not leaked official plans. And in my last post said "next decade", i meant the 2020's. Who the fuck knows what will even be around in the 2030s at this point.

But I appreciate you going out of your way to google all these zune articles 🤗

You'd do well to read what I linked. That was an individual who was very reliable at the time, and it's important to realise they will have had teams working on and researching new hardware right up until the point that they decided to pull the plug. That's just how it goes.

And no sweat, when you own and invest in a piece of hardware (or ecosystem) that ends up getting discontinued, you tend to remember the bullshit that they fed you at the time.
 

DForce

NaughtyDog Defense Force
Ok .. but ..



Internal targets aren't an actual metric of gauging growth, just that .. an aspirational internal target.

We can safely say that ABK *will* increase their growth from previous reports in a not-so-insignificant way.
We saw the documents from the FTC case and what they wanted to hit within the next 7 years ( documents were from 2020 ).

This isn't about increasing their previous target, this about making the subscription service successful, and they're going to need a certain about of subscribers to achieve that. ABK only sets their targets higher.
 

wolffy66

Member
GP will either have get more expensive or they will need to do away with day 1 gamepass availability.

I think waiting a month or two for games to hit gamepass is perfectly acceptable and would lead to more sales.
 

Danny Dudekisser

I paid good money for this Dynex!
It was an unrealistic goal, and combined with them having a ton of layoffs in the relevant divisions of Xbox, I don't know why they would've expected to achieve that kind of target. So, here we are.
 

GHG

Member
GP will either have get more expensive or they will need to do away with day 1 gamepass availability.

I think waiting a month or two for games to hit gamepass is perfectly acceptable and would lead to more sales.

Or have different tiers of gamepass, a more expensive one (~$25 per month or more) that includes their first party catalogue.
 

DForce

NaughtyDog Defense Force
This. And their targets are high because that's what they need to make this model work and be profitable.

They keep missing those targets, which are now gonna be even higher because of investment in ABK.
People think we're throwing shit at MS for no reason, but people forget that 3-4 years ago, people said Sony was going to be in trouble if they didn't adapt the Game Pass model (day one releses). We can see why it's not a good idea.

It's going to get even harder to reach their goals. If Netflix can struggle with a lot of casual content then it's going to be harder for GP.
 
You'd do well to read what I linked. That was an individual who was very reliable at the time, and it's important to realise they will have had teams working on and researching new hardware right up until the point that they decided to pull the plug. That's just how it goes.

And no sweat, when you own and invest in a piece of hardware (or ecosystem) that ends up getting discontinued, you tend to remember the bullshit that they fed you at the time.

I still have my Zune...lol
 
Revenue, revenue, revenue... what about profit?

489e2623e65ef0e9af6ec02b8196f7884753183658eb98d8b2a83f8537d9efd1_1.jpg
 

midnightAI

Banned
Based on what we know their leaked plans are, I don't think there's a chance they don't make console hardware, for at least the next decade, either.
When you say console hardware do you mean an actual console that plays games locally or do you mean stripped down streaming only 'thin client like' hardware? Because I can certainly see the latter being their end game

Edit: and I'm sure they would LOVE gamepass to be on PlayStation and Nintendo consoles
 
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NickFire

Member
I don't think they would have closed on ABK if the missed target bothered them. My guess is they evolve further into a 3rd party publisher who happens to own a subsidiary division that runs a software / hardware platform.
 

DrFigs

Member
I don't think they would have closed on ABK if the missed target bothered them. My guess is they evolve further into a 3rd party publisher who happens to own a subsidiary division that runs a software / hardware platform.
idk. xbox is still a platform, even if they drop the console (which i don't think they will). but if their goal was to just become a 3rd party publisher, then cancelling ps5 versions of games, like they did w/ Bethesda is counterintuitive.
 
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NickFire

Member
idk. xbox is still a platform, even if they drop the console (which i don't think they will). but if their goal was to just become a 3rd party publisher, then cancelling ps5 versions of games, like they did w/ Bethesda is counterintuitive.
I'm expecting at least one more generation of a hardware based Xbox before they consider all cloud. And I don't believe they will stop making exclusives for it either.

I'm just saying that the growth they want is low hanging fruit if they're hungry.
 

Astray

Member
Strange that Nadella didn't really mention being a platform holder as part of his doubling down on gaming messaging.

Game production and publishing are both things that a 3P publisher can do just fine.
 

Darsxx82

Member
There were new Zune hardware rumours and leaks months before they decided to sunset it.

Xbox console is a brand that goes far beyond what any MS hardware initiative can be. Comparing the size of Zune to what XBox console is makes zero sense.
That's not the indication you need to be looking at for comfort. What's required is a healthy and profitable hardware business with indications that there's opportunity for growth.
Xbox console is a business of (at worst) 50 million user base. Today, the console business is still the main source of revenue for the gaming division and where the main user base of gamepass is located.

It's not a feeling of comfort, it's applying logic. To think that MS is going to end up with its main source of income in gaming in the short to medium term, and lose 30% of every 3rd party game sold on Xbox consoles and promote the flight of those iusers and the revenue they generate for Playstation makes zero sense.

Imagine doing it when you've gathered 50+ Studios that are going to make it easier than ever to support your own platform (reat, main source of income and one of the most important brand that MS own) and that can help you improve the vision that potential new users have of it. Imagine missing that opportunity at the moment when you are most ready to compete.

It makes more sense to think that MS, in case of continuing to grow not enough and given the difficulty of amortizing game developments, would first decide to increase the % of games that will be released as multiplatform on PS, Switch, etc. Or (which it's doing with Xseries (not losing tons of money on console price cuts) but dispensing with the revenue that Xbox console generates... Again, I don't see the logic no matter how much you think about the possibility.
 

Darsxx82

Member
Strange that Nadella didn't really mention being a platform holder as part of his doubling down on gaming messaging.

Game production and publishing are both things that a 3P publisher can do just fine.
The fact is, he has mentioned it

"If I look at it, the amount of time people allocate to gaming is going up and Gen Z is going to do more of that. The way games are made, the way the games are delivered, is changing radically. Whether it's mobile, or consoles, or PCs, or even the cloud. So, we're looking forward to really doubling down both as a game producer and a publisher. Now we'll be one of the largest game publishers and also as a company that's building platforms for it. (S.Nadella)"
 

BbMajor7th

Member
That feeling when you're 84% under target - when you'd have to improve your performance by more than sixfold, just to meet expectations. That's the kind of 'oof' you measure in megatons.
 

NickFire

Member
The fact is, he has mentioned it

"If I look at it, the amount of time people allocate to gaming is going up and Gen Z is going to do more of that. The way games are made, the way the games are delivered, is changing radically. Whether it's mobile, or consoles, or PCs, or even the cloud. So, we're looking forward to really doubling down both as a game producer and a publisher. Now we'll be one of the largest game publishers and also as a company that's building platforms for it. (S.Nadella)"
The doubling down intent was specific to game production and publishing. The platform building was described as something they also do.

How much they care about genuine revenue growth (both existing and purchased revenue streams) will determine everything.
 

SenkiDala

Member
If a huge system seller like Starfield doesn't help you to reach your target, knowing that those Bethesda games (Fallout, Elder Scrolls) are the biggest sellers out there except maybe GTA and Minecraft (and God they OWN Minecraft too)... Nothing will do. Not even ABK.

It's OK MS, start being a 3rd party publisher, we know we can't expect more from you ! :D
 

Fess

Member
People think we're throwing shit at MS for no reason, but people forget that 3-4 years ago, people said Sony was going to be in trouble if they didn't adapt the Game Pass model (day one releses). We can see why it's not a good idea.

It's going to get even harder to reach their goals. If Netflix can struggle with a lot of casual content then it's going to be harder for GP.
They can always do earlier early access Premium editions. I’m thinking that’s how Starfield got up on sales top lists. I was there too, first MS games I’ve bought in I don’t know how many years. It works. Same thing with movies that go up on iTunes before streaming services.
 

MarkMe2525

Banned
They didn't just learn they release games on a subscription. They missed their own set targets. That means the consumers weren't as delighted as they thought they would be with the sub and content.
I would agree that the content isn't where it was suggested it would be by this time. With so many studios (even before the Activision purchase) one has to expect that it will get there eventually. As someone who bought 3 years of gamepass back in 2021, I would have expected it to be here by now.
 

Taycan77

Neophyte
Huge corporations like Microsoft are not averse to making catastrophic strategic mistakes.

When Gamepass launched anyone questioning the long-term commercial viability of the service was brushed aside, accused of sour grapes, stuck in the past, and so on. Gaming is fundamentally different to Music, TV, Film in that it's not only time consuming, it's an interactive medium requiring your full attention. For most people they can only support a couple of games on the go, purchasing maybe half-a-dozen titles a year.

Gamepass is increasingly being used as an extended demo service, which is of limited use once the novelty of hundreds of games at your finger tips fades away. For price sensitive gamers it often makes more sense to purchase the odd game (physical can be traded in, or wait for a sale on digital), rather than being tied to a subscription for years on end.

The fundamental problem is Gamepass is targeting casual gamers, but casual gamers are just that, casual. They don't need access to such an extensive library. I've no doubt Microsoft will make a strategic change and become a third party publisher. It makes sense to support all platforms while still offering Gamepass to those consumers who want it on their own platform.
 
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graywolf323

Member
Same here. They are actually going up in value thanks to guardians of the galaxy putting them back on the map.

No idea where the charger is though.
ironically I’m pretty sure I still have a Zune charger in one of my boxes of cables but I’ve long ago misplaced the Zune itself
 
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IDKFA

I am Become Bilbo Baggins
This and plus they are moving towards the mobile market, which will make them a powerhouse. Doom and gloom is too soon.

Yep. People talk about CoD and Blizzard, but King and the mobile market was the real reason Microsoft purchased Activision.

Microsoft are a software company. They want to sell as much software as possible on as many devices as possible. That means this Activision deal won't mean a ton of Xbox exclusive games (I doubt there will be any at all), but it will mean a huge mobile push.
 

Monkfish877

Member
MS leadership needs to get rid of Spencer, surely his position is becoming untenable now? Bomb after bomb, how long can this guy continue? He looks utterly clueless to me, how can any one at MS trust this guy with ABK, it's crazy to me.
 

Thick Thighs Save Lives

NeoGAF's Physical Games Advocate Extraordinaire
You could just buy it and play it right now on Steam, 10% off at the moment too.
I used to that with with every yearly FM release but... I usually do a save or two around the official launch in Nov and then another save or two after the patch that includes the winter player transfers gets added to the game in March. Usually that's more than enough of a 'fix' to last me the whole year. :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 

Darsxx82

Member
The doubling down intent was specific to game production and publishing. The platform building was described as something they also do.

How much they care about genuine revenue growth (both existing and purchased revenue streams) will determine everything.
I had only replied to someone who said that MS/Nadella hadn't mentioned that they are a platform holder... and the fact is that he had mentioned. Nothing more

That said, doubling down on growing as a game publisher and supporting the games division (which includes the platforms they support, such as their console)... I don't know where this statement indicates or leads to thinking that the console business is going to be downgraded or even shut down in the short or medium term . Quite the opposite, and even more so if you add other reasons already mentioned that make it even more meaningless to expect that.
It is not exclusive to grow in the video game market and your income as a publisher by continuing to manufacture consoles which is also your main source of (even if you do not grow in that section). But apparently there are people who want to believe it
 
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Reckheim

Member
And yet Nadella yesterday told that, after ABK, MS is even going to double its commitment to its games division and to be an even more powerful game publisher..... Imagine saying this if the games division were a ruin.

I'm sure they will be a great publisher for a very long time. No doubt.
 
And let arrogantly Sony to charge 1000$ for console & 150$ for a game ?
No thanks....I love competition & cheap gaming :messenger_beaming:
sometimes cheap gaming is that.....cheap gaming.

Is incredible baffling the lack of quality and quantity coming from Xbox. That's the only thing they need to compete.

Regarding Price Point....Let's talk about Nintendo.....their games don't drop in price. Who is competing with them?....Let that sink in
 

SenkiDala

Member
And let arrogantly Sony to charge 1000$ for console & 150$ for a game ?
No thanks....I love competition & cheap gaming :messenger_beaming:
I'm tired of this answer. It's like the only reason we give to MS to exist on this market, to keep Sony from being "arrogant" and raise the prices.

They should make great games, like on the OG Xbox and 360 and people will praise them again.
 
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Crayon

Member
And let arrogantly Sony to charge 1000$ for console & 150$ for a game ?
No thanks....I love competition & cheap gaming :messenger_beaming:

Some hate to hear it but they will have plenty of pressure competing with nintendo and valve, who have as hig or higher numbers of users. The biggest competition ms provides is helping the other patforms with games just to hurt sony.
 

graywolf323

Member
I'm tired of this answer. It's like the only reason we give to MS to exist on this market, to keep Sony from being "arrogant" and raise the prices.

They should make great games, like on the OG Xbox and 360 and people will praise them again.
yeah, it’s like fine yes Sony needs competition but that doesn’t mean Xbox shouldn’t be BETTER competition than they have been

why can’t we demand more from Xbox? I miss the days of the Xbox OG & early 360 when they were putting out great games which brought people into the ecosystem
 

Metnut

Member
Gamepass phase 1 is ending. Phase 2 is to squeeze these current subscribers for as much as possible while lowering costs.
 

graywolf323

Member
Gamepass phase 1 is ending. Phase 2 is to squeeze these current subscribers for as much as possible while lowering costs.
dunno if that’s going to happen with GamePass just yet but we’re definitely starting to see it from Disney+

I got a notification that my annual plan is going from $80 to $140 (!!!) a year, which is just an insane price hike so I’m going to cancel it instead despite having been a subscriber since day 1 ~4 years ago
 
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Thirty7ven

Banned
I had only replied to someone who said that MS/Nadella hadn't mentioned that they are a platform holder... and the fact is that he had mentioned. Nothing more

That said, doubling down on growing as a game publisher and supporting the games division (which includes the platforms they support, such as their console)... I don't know where this statement indicates or leads to thinking that the console business is going to be downgraded or even shut down in the short or medium term . Quite the opposite, and even more so if you add other reasons already mentioned that make it even more meaningless to expect that.
It is not exclusive to grow in the video game market and your income as a publisher by continuing to manufacture consoles which is also your main source of (even if you do not grow in that section). But apparently there are people who want to believe it

It’s being downgraded before your very eyes and you don’t even notice it. We already had a bunch of known Twitter fanboys crying MS is lowering their focus on the console experience. If losing last gen by a landslide was bad, because it was the worst generation to lose, how do you think it will affect them going into next gen after losing this one even harder.

With no Xbox pro in the cards and a price bump that is only going to help with with you losses, you gotta have a lot of faith to think there will be no adaptation from a company that only cares about growing and that growth is coming outside their own console. A barrage of mediocre games isn’t going to help them, and they have nothing in the pipeline that will generate as much interest as Starfield.

They won’t drop their own console, but they might turn it into the “best way to play Xbox games and GP” type of machine while starting to release their games across all platforms.

We will see, the outlook doesn’t look great for Xbox console as Xbox fans know it. If things don’t dramatically change, Xbox Series will end the generation with a smaller userbase than the last. And that makes no sense when you are producing so many games.
 
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