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[Heisenberg007]

There's a stream tomorrow and another show with dates and stuff in December, we will know.

But to the greater point, we know of multiple games with an official release date of 2024, not literally 0.

This is what I wrote, and it is true:

There are literally 0 games with an official release date as of today.

If you know of any games with an official release date as of today, please share with us.

And the "stream" is a partner stream for third-party games with "no additional news."

 

[Mr Reasonable]

There's a stream tomorrow and another show with dates and stuff in December, we will know.

But to the greater point, we know of multiple games with an official release date of 2024, not literally 0.

I'm not really bothered if it's exclusive or not, but I'm pleased to be getting Dead Space on Gamepass this week.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

The final calm before the ABK revenue storm.

and management nightmare

 

[adamsapple]

This is what I wrote, and it is true

Saying a game is coming out in 2024 is an official release date, the inverse would be a known project with a trailer that doesn't have any release date/year at all.

I'm not really bothered if it's exclusive or not, but I'm pleased to be getting Dead Space on Gamepass this week.

Same. Callisto being on PS+ gave me a chance to replay it and realize again that despite having a shiny coat, it's just a poor game. Looking forward to replaying DS remake again.

 

[Ozriel]

They didn't just learn they release games on a subscription. They missed their own set targets. That means the consumers weren't as delighted as they thought they would be with the sub and content.

This…makes no sense. What's the relationship between their set targets and satisfaction levels of existing GP subscribers?

 

[CherryFalls]

Time to buy some more new studios, see if something sticks this time

 

[H-I-M]

ZERO POINT SEVEN

 

[tmlDan]

Important to note that the Activision Blizzard acquisition went through at least 6 months later than Microsoft was anticipating as well.

I'm sure those projections anticipated acquiring ActiBlizz much sooner.

what? projections are based on the current not the uncertain future.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

are these numbers taking into account the mega release of the most important RPG of the last 10 years and the best racing game raytraced in gameplay, FM?

If so. this is catastrophic. And yet again showing and proving 'the netflix of games' was just a wet dream and desperate attempt to save Xbox.

 

[diffusionx]

Enough data out there to say that Xbox is not doing what Microsoft wants it to do. These are very large misses.

 

[Three]

This…makes no sense. What's the relationship between their set targets and satisfaction levels of existing GP subscribers?

Just stop Ozriel. I'm not in the mood for your illogical MS stanning. What doesn't make sense is your response.

An already subscribed user isn't "growth". The "consumers" I mention is referring to somebody not spending money to sign up to gamepass or buy some dlc or a game and them missing their growth target because consumers weren't as interested as MS thought they would be in their content or services.

What doesn't make sense is suggesting that they missed targets because they decided to give something for free as if they had targeted to charge for it before. Yet it's my post that doesn't make sense to you.

 

[Mownoc]

are these numbers taking into account the mega release of the most important RPG of the last 10 years and the best racing game raytraced in gameplay, FM?

If so. this is catastrophic. And yet again showing and proving 'the netflix of games' was just a wet dream and desperate attempt to save Xbox.

This info is for the fiscal year ending June 30th 2023.

Microsoft have previously said they expect revenue for Starfield quarter to be about 5% higher compared to the year before so we'll see if they hit that very soon. Forza is the quarter after Starfield.

 

[H-I-M]

We also know from the NPD numbers that Starfield BARELY had any effect on GP. And that's Xbox's biggest release this gen.

 

[Ozriel]

Just stop Ozriel. I'm not in the mood for your illogical MS stanning. What doesn't make sense is your response.

An already subscribed user isn't "growth". The "consumers" I mention is referring to somebody not spending money to sign up to gamepass or buy some dlc or a game and them missing their growth target because they weren't as interested as MS thought they would be in their content or services.

If that's what you meant, it feels illogical for you to present it as some new insight, then, since we already have heard from Phil that Gamepass subscription growth has slowed significantly, and that has been discussed extensively here.

So this was just you stating the obvious?

What doesn't make sense is suggesting that they missed targets because they decided to give something for free as if they had targeted to charge for it before. Yet it's my post that doesn't make sense to you.

I have no idea who you're talking to with this, since this isn't an argument I made. A strawman?

 

[diffusionx]

Just stop Ozriel. I'm not in the mood for your illogical MS stanning. What doesn't make sense is your response.

An already subscribed user isn't "growth". "The consumers" I mention is referring to somebody not spending money to sign up to gamepass or buy some dlc or a game and them missing their growth target because they weren't as interested as MS thought they would be in their content or services.

What doesn't make sense is suggesting that they missed targets because they decided to give something for free as if they had targeted to charge for it before. Yet it's my post that doesn't make sense to you.

This is one of the major flaws with the subscription model in general. First, you get these amazing growth numbers as people sign up for your service, but once it plateaus, you're kind of screwed, and the only way you get more out of a person is by raising the price, which is what everyone is doing now like crazy (Netflix - $23 a month). And, you know, for the type of people who post here, who maybe bought 1-2 games a month, signing up for GP actually saves them money, which means it hurts MS.

This stuff isn't a secret, other people have talked about it, but it was all just masked by the incredible initial growth of these services early on. That said, MS is trying to do this thing by letting GP subscribers buy the game and play it a few days early, which is clever, and worked with Starfield, but the game needs to be massively massively hyped to work - it didnt seem to with FM. I assume that they are going to lean heavily on this model going forward. They might even juice it and give the games a longer "early access" period, although if they go too long then GP users will start rebelling because it's not the "day and date" thing.

 

[Darsxx82]

Enough data out there to say that Xbox is not doing what Microsoft wants it to do. These are very large misses.

And yet Nadella yesterday told that, after ABK, MS is even going to double its commitment to its games division and to be an even more powerful game publisher..... Imagine saying this if the games division were a ruin.

Microsoft CEO Says Company Will Double Down on Game Publishing and Development

Microsoft CEO touches on games-first approach. The post Microsoft CEO Says Company Will Double Down on Game Publishing and Development appeared first on ComingSoon.net - Movie Trailers, TV & Streaming News, and More.

www.yahoo.com

 

[adamsapple]

And yet Nadella yesterday told that, after ABK, MS is even going to double its commitment to its games division and to be an even more powerful game publisher..... Imagine saying this if the games division were a ruin.

Microsoft CEO Says Company Will Double Down on Game Publishing and Development

Microsoft CEO touches on games-first approach. The post Microsoft CEO Says Company Will Double Down on Game Publishing and Development appeared first on ComingSoon.net - Movie Trailers, TV & Streaming News, and More.

www.yahoo.com

"The way games are made, the way the games are delivered, is changing radically. Whether it's mobile, or consoles, or PCs, or even the cloud. So, we're looking forward to really doubling down both as a game producer and a publisher," he said.

RIP "xbox is not doing well" narrative.

 

[Three]

If that's what you meant, it feels illogical for you to present it as some new insight, then, since we already have heard from Phil that Gamepass subscription growth has slowed significantly, and that has been discussed extensively here.

So this was just you stating the obvious?



I have no idea who you're talking to with this, since this isn't an argument I made. A strawman?

For the love of god Ozriel please stop with the bullshit.

Somebody mentioned how offering things for free leads to them missing their growth target. I simply mentioned that that wasn't the reason because they didn't change anything in terms of offering something "free". That it was a result of consumers not being as happy with the content or services on offer to spend what MS thought they would. It's not complicated.

 

[Darsxx82]

RIP "xbox is not doing well" narrative.

"Now we'll be one of the largest game publishers and also as a company that's building platforms for it."
If it is not that narrative, they will invent another one. In fact, they have invented several in different threads created from the same news.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Phil to admasapple and ozriel:

 

[BaneIsPain]

 

[DryvBy]

With economic woes, it's going to be interesting if they hit future goals too.

 

[Three]

With economic woes, it's going to be interesting if they hit future goals too.

I don't think anybody is. I bet Sony is going to post a YoY decline too. You don't have a round of cuts and execs leaving if everything was rosy.

 

[Heisenberg007]

RIP "xbox is not doing well" narrative.

This doesn't necessarily negate that, does it?

Xbox can not be doing well.
And they can be interested in doubling down (and seeing if that works).

This isn't necessarily an either/or scenario.

 

[adamsapple]

This doesn't necessarily negate that, does it?

I think it pretty conclusively does, you don't 'double down' on something if you don't see it as a worthwhile endeavor. It's not a matter of "fuck you money" either, otherwise Zune would be alive and kicking right now.

 

[TheGodfather07]

Gamepass will continue to grow slowly and eventually hit a ceiling. What killer content do Microsoft have coming anytime soon? Most people are waiting on old Activision games. That won't do Jack shit for gamepass or the xbox brand in general.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

The final calm before the ABK revenue storm.

That's a good way to get your 4.4% revenue growth, just pay $70B for it

 

[Sanepar]

I'm so happy subscription services for games are stagnating, gamers are smart than I thought.

 

[Thirty7ven]

I think it pretty conclusively does, you don't 'double down' on something if you don't see it as a worthwhile endeavor. It's not a matter of "fuck you money" either, otherwise Zune would be alive and kicking right now.

When people talk about Xbox, they mean the console. MS is absolutely not doubling down on Xbox console, they are doubling down on increasing their overall gaming revenue and the focus on the console keeps shrinking. This direction could easily lead to more multiolatform games than the Xbox fanbase is willing to accept right now.

 

[Heisenberg007]

I think it pretty conclusively does, you don't 'double down' on something if you don't see it as a worthwhile endeavor. It's not a matter of "fuck you money" either, otherwise Zune would be alive and kicking right now.

One, Microsoft does have "fuck you" money. And they have spent that money in useless, unprofitable ventures for years across different products.

Second, we don't know if Microsoft means doubling down on multiplayer GaaS games instead of single-player games (that didn't work), or vice versa. And what they mean by publishing - do they mean publishing on other platforms? or mobile?

There are too many things to say that one statement destroys another fact.

I think only consistently publishing Xbox P&L can destroy that narrative. Until then, it makes more sense to believe that Xbox is not doing well because Phil has literally said that the business is not strong and it is not doing well.

 

[shaddam]

They need to buy more studios

 

[midnightAI]

Saying a game is coming out in 2024 is an official release date, the inverse would be a known project with a trailer that doesn't have any release date/year at all.

Saying 2024 isnt an official release date, that is an approximate time frame, '2024' is a rather large window (12 months to be exact).

Crap analogy alert: If you took your car to be fixed and you asked for a date to be picked up and they replied '2024', would you accept that? How about 'November'? still not good enough, 'Next Week', still be better if they told you the actual day dont you think.

 

[ByWatterson]

And hardware is declining.

So Xbox is literally shrinking I think. Not just growing slowly. Shrinking.

 

[Snake29]

Xbox Is Prepared To Exit Gaming Business By 2027 If Gamepass Doesnt Growth Doesnt Increase Enough

Also how fast the Starfield hype just sank into the ocean. I have a feeling that this game is already forgotten really fast.

 

[GHG]

I think it pretty conclusively does, you don't 'double down' on something if you don't see it as a worthwhile endeavor. It's not a matter of "fuck you money" either, otherwise Zune would be alive and kicking right now.

You've got to be joking in bringing up zune. Did you own one? Did you follow what they said during it's life cycle?

Allow me to refresh your memory:

2008:

"The subscription model continues to redefine the digital music landscape, and today's announcement is great news for consumers, artists and labels," said Simon Renshaw, chief executive officer of Strategic Artist Management (representing Dixie Chicks, Miranda Lambert, Everclear, Tila Tequila and Aly & AJ).

"This breakthrough offer makes it easier than ever for consumers to discover new music and will encourage deeper engagement in the digital music space, and that is good for the entire industry."

Microsoft Announces New Zune Pass Music Subscription Model - Source

Consumers can now keep the tracks they love.

news.microsoft.com

2009:

Today Microsoft says it's "deeply committed" to the Zune player.
[Adam Sohn, head of Microsoft's Zune marketing division] clarified, "we're not getting out of the hardware business at all," adding that Microsoft is "deeply committed" to continuing to its Zune hardware strategy.

But it gets worse Microsoft is so devoted to its music player the company even hinted it can put the Zune store on Apple's (AAPL) iPhone and get subscribers.

When asked whether developing Zune apps for "certain non-Windows-Mobile phones," he responded, "If you look at the mobile space, there's a lot of opportunity, and I don't think anything's off the table

Microsoft Backpedals Again, Now 'Deeply Committed' To Zune (MSFT)

Microsoft reaffirms its commitment to the struggling Zune hardware, despite ongoing challenges.

www.businessinsider.com

2011:

After years of mediocrity and weak sales, Microsoft is finally killing off its Zune media player, Bloomberg reports.

The Zune Is Finally Dead

www.businessinsider.com

 

[Pelta88]

And hardware is declining.

So Xbox is literally shrinking I think. Not just growing slowly. Shrinking.

They're collapsing. And it's not "just" world wide but collapsing in their strongest territory, the U.S.

Obviously the usual suspects will be here trying to convince us that the 67 Billion they paid for a company that generates 2 Billion in revenue annually is their trump card. But we got a look behind the curtain and it's an actual catastrophe. To the point where their CEO, as rich as he may be, has to account for their failures financially.

Me while reading the hilarious damage control in this thread...

 

[adamsapple]

When people talk about Xbox, they mean the console. MS is absolutely not doubling down on Xbox console, they are doubling down on increasing their overall gaming revenue and the focus on the console keeps shrinking. This direction could easily lead to more multiolatform games than the Xbox fanbase is willing to accept right now.

See three* post above mine as an example of people thinking Xbox is ready to leave the gaming business altogether.

Directly contradicted by Satya saying they're doubling down on it, in the more recent statement.

 

[GHG]

See three* post above mine as an example of people thinking Xbox is ready to leave the gaming business altogether.

Directly contradicted by Satya saying they're doubling down on it, in the more recent statement.

You need to learn that what they say doesn't matter.

 

[ByWatterson]

They're collapsing. And it's not "just" world wide but collapsing in their strongest territory, the U.S.

It's a shame because I love what they've done with Halo and Age 2, the BC work, etc. They have such a great box but so few reasons for a casual player to buy one.

The recreation time needed to make Game Pass worth it is available to college students and few else. Consumers are smart in the aggregate, and it just isn't worth it without day and date third party blockbusters.

I expect Xbox to be a platform-agnostic publisher within a decade, at most.

 

[adamsapple]

You need to learn that what they say doesn't matter.

In some regards, true. Zune had a 5, 6 year life cycle at most. Xbox has been around 20+ years and based on some recent leaks, we know about their plans for at least the rest of this decade.

The biggest difference is that, unlike Zune, they are one of the largest publishers in the industry, with the Activision acquisition.

 

[GeoramA]

MS becomes third-party, Game Pass dies, and SEGA re-enters the console space.

One can dream.

 

[GHG]

In some regards, true. Zune had a 5, 6 year life cycle at most. Xbox has been around 20+ years and based on some recent leaks, we know about their plans for at least the rest of this decade.

The biggest difference is that, unlike Zune, they are one of the largest publishers in the industry, with the Activision acquisition.

Let me just say this - I don't think there is a world where Microsoft ever cease making games, they've always done that to a certain degree and that will continue.

Take comfort in that.

 

[DForce]

The final calm before the ABK revenue storm.

Their internal targets were high even BEFORE the ABK acquisition, and now that they acquired ABK, they're going to expect even more growth.

So it's not about the ABK revenue, it's about the growth of Game Pass. They're going to lose retail sales and now they're going to have to recover those costs in subscription revenue.

 

[X-Wing]

are these numbers taking into account the mega release of the most important RPG of the last 10 years and the best racing game raytraced in gameplay, FM?

If so. this is catastrophic. And yet again showing and proving 'the netflix of games' was just a wet dream and desperate attempt to save Xbox.

Is the bold part sarcasm?

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

The Hype around Game Pass is fading and shrinking

 

[adamsapple]

Let me just say this - I don't think there is a world where Microsoft ever cease making games, they've always done that to a certain degree and that will continue.

Take comfort in that.

Based on what we know their leaked plans are, I don't think there's a chance they don't make console hardware, for at least the next decade, either.

 

[Heisenberg007]

Their internal targets were high even BEFORE the ABK acquisition, and now that they acquired ABK, they're going to expect even more growth.

So it's not about the ABK revenue, it's about the growth of Game Pass. They're going to lose retail sales and now they're going to have to recover those costs in subscription revenue.

This. And their targets are high because that's what they need to make this model work and be profitable.

They keep missing those targets, which are now gonna be even higher because of investment in ABK.

 

[Darsxx82]

One, Microsoft does have "fuck you" money. And they have spent that money in useless, unprofitable ventures for years across different products.

LOL, MS has never bet so much money or time on anything compared to how he is betting on the gaming division.

Second, we don't know if Microsoft means doubling down on multiplayer GaaS games instead of single-player games (that didn't work), or vice versa.

??? The variety of MS projects in development are of all types. There is no more tendency towards one or the other. Among other things because any genre fits under Gamepass.
In the case of Sony we do know where the investment has doubled (Gaas)

And what they mean by publishing - do they mean publishing on other platforms? or mobile?

If I look at it, the amount of time people allocate to gaming is going up and Gen Z is going to do more of that. The way games are made, the way the games are delivered, is changing radically. Whether it's mobile, or consoles, or PCs, or even the cloud. So, we're looking forward to really doubling down both as a game producer and a publisher. Now we'll be one of the largest game publishers and also as a company that's building platforms for it. (S.Nadella)
They are going to publish games for all the platforms they offer (consoles, PC, mobile phones, cloud...). It is not that difficult to understand. The vast majority of acquired Studios create games for PC-Console. What is stupid is to think that they are going to be converted to Mobile Studios.

But Ok, 2027 you say right?

There are too many things to say that one statement destroys another fact.

There are many things to speculate about, yes..... but we already know that you are only going to say those that tend to be negative or create darkness about the present and future of Xbox.

I think only consistently publishing Xbox P&L can destroy that narrative. Until then, it makes more sense to believe that Xbox is not doing well because Phil has literally said that the business is not strong and it is not doing well.

LOL P. Spencer said no such thing. But you can continue to misrepresent.

Imagine proposing 100B investments while you think the business is a ruin

 

[GHG]

Based on what we know their leaked plans are, I don't think there's a chance they don't make console hardware, for at least the next decade, either.

There were new Zune hardware rumours and leaks months before they decided to sunset it.

That's not the indication you need to be looking at for comfort. What's required is a healthy and profitable hardware business with indications that there's opportunity for growth.

 

[SkylineRKR]

I'm so happy subscription services for games are stagnating, gamers are smart than I thought.

I think its because the rate of output of this gen reached a stable level. And then you see most of the big games won't appear on GP day one anyway. Out of Baldurs Gate, RE4, SF6, MK1, Diablo, EA FC, AC6, Cyberpunk PL,Starfield etc only the latter appeared on it. Consumers still need to buy the lions share of games.