BotoxAgent
Member
at least those replies are not crazy
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Bernie Sanders endorses Hillary Clinton for president
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at least those replies are not crazy
PanicFreak
Member
Jill Stein has zero chance to win the general. If you want to effect change, start by voting Green in your local elections and then move up. If you have any sort of left leaning bend, you should be voting for Clinton. The Supreme Court nominations alone are worth voting for one of the major party candidates.
Box of Kittens
Banned
This is a strong endorsement from Bernie. He effectively makes the case why Hillary is the far and away the best choice for his supporters. And while I don't put a ton of weight on the party platform, I like that it's more of a consensus document.
Now what I'd really like to see out of this is an end to Hillary-GAF and Bernie-GAF complaining about each other.
Now what I'd really like to see out of this is an end to Hillary-GAF and Bernie-GAF complaining about each other.
It'll pass, just give everyone time to get through the salt and gloating.
PanicFreak
Member
Well duhhhh, the other option is to damage Hillary's chances of beating Donald Trump....
boiled goose
good with gravy
It is fair to remain skeptical. Again, I am not voting third party.
If a third party gets <1%, it is largely irrelevant. If a third party gets double digits, it can DEFINITELY affect the future of political parties. See 1968 election. Granted, the Republican party changed for the worse.
Meh, definitely not a fan of anti Science Woo (dont vote green for that reason), but honestly I am not sure I share in your confidence that the democratic party is less harmful. The democrats are complicit in War, poverty, mass incarceration, stagnant wages, etc. Again, I don't vote green, but would an anti science hippy do more harm than the current pro corporate politician? eh, I think it is debatable.
KefkaPalazzo
Member
That was an amazing speech. Well done Bernie.
CloudyTuba
Member
Anyone paying attention saw him getting his ducks in a row a few weeks ago in preparation for this. Laughing at all the posts I remember a month ago to the tune of "THAT ASSHOLE WILL NEVER STOP BECAUSE HES A MONSTER AND I CANT BELIEVE I EVER THOUGHT HE WAS COOL." Here it is, not too far away from when I expected it.
Well, now that that's over with, stop Trump.
Well, now that that's over with, stop Trump.
Yes. Because Hillary is a politician that will be governing and Stein is a glorified activist that will never, ever bring about any progressive change because of her ego.
She's only a Green-Rainbow because she helped push a very shitty campaign finance law in Massachusetts that got removed because there was no way it could practically work.
Depending on how you're personally catching feelings, they could either be paragons of integrity refusing to support Hillary the Crook, or they could just be so mad their guy lost that they are taking their ball and going home (to vote for the anti-vaxxer).
I mean, considering how electorally useless the Green party is, how much the Democratic platform compromised to Bernie's camp, and how there wasn't a huge difference between the two of them to begin with anyway, it seems closer to the latter to me.
TestOfTide
Banned
The better scenario would be that he uses his support to boost Clinton by energizing his base in Clinton's favor.
There were toxic aspects to Bernie's campaign, but he's still a useful asset.
Prodigal Son
Member
There had to be one.
Do you truly believe Stein will win any states like Wallace did?
Yes it is. If these people actually cared about policy, they'd vote to keep Trump out of office by voting for the candidate that they likely agree with 90% of the time but are too salty and bitter to admit it. "Bu bu bu the establishment!" etc. It's sad and means the rest of us with any common sense have to make up for it by encouraging more people to vote intelligently, but it is what it is.
boiled goose
good with gravy
That is not what "progressive" generally means. It doesn't mean electable.
Also funny when people bring up ego when comparing others to Clinton... :S
I hate that I am suddenly having to defend the green party and Jill Stein when I honestly don't give care at all about them, but come on people, let's stick to honest discussion here.
Probably not given current polling? But that was not the argument. This is a goal post move.
Poster was arguing that voting third party has no effect, that there was no historical basis for claiming that voting third party had an effect on future party platforms, when I was arguing that it can
Being "complicit" on something because they have actually governed is far, far, far removed from actively supporting extremely harmful policies that would directly lead to slashing our food supplies in half. An anti science hippy would absolutely do more harm by doing that than the current crop of democrat politicians, yes.
The Green Party would be immediately complicit with all of that as soon as they were in power -- and they would also be complicit with war, poverty, mass incarceration, and stagnant wages: All of which they have little to no policies that actually diverge from democrats in real and substantial ways. You are imposing an absurd standard on a party that actually had to govern, while dismissing the responsibility of the alternative.
I am suspect of his value as a surrogate to begin with. He is not a good speaker, prepares poorly for interviews and is curmudgeonly as fuck when he doesn't get his way. And he's easy to disarm at the national level due to his self-stated "Democratic socialism", so has limited strategic use.
His little value will be in getting some of those few Bernie supporters still on the edge to return to the team, which...I mean...cool. I sorta feel that they would have returned anyway as history repeatedly shows us, so even that is not big to me. But I'd rather he just fade away and the world moves on, as it is going to anyway.
AntraxSuicide
Banned
Because he's from a hardcore blue state (and it's not even worth a lot of votes), his own state and support base are super white (relative to literally any of the other options), and his key demographics for success from his primary run are demos that vote Republican (white males).
The real ticket has got to do more to either steal white women from the GOP (Warren!) or ramp up Hispanic turnout (Kaine or Perez!). Sanders doesn't bring in a single thing to the ticket that isn't already there on the left.
If we're sticking to honest discussion, you kept repeating how you weren't that much of a Bernie fan while spending more posts than probably any other gaffer defending him over the course of months. :lol
It wasn't a goal posts move, but a genuine question.
And_Gignac
Member
He is never going away Amirox, sorry. He is the most trusted leader by Democratic Voters at large, like Vox well said it. Stay pressedT.
boiled goose
good with gravy
Just because I frequently disagreed with the echo chamber I frequently saw (and still see) on GAF doesn't mean I am a Bernie supporter.
Should I just "fall in line" with a narrative I don't agree with to make people's preferred candidate look better?
If GAF was a pro Bernie forum that kept supporting anti GMO policy and blanket bans on fracking I would be doing the opposite.
That is how honesty works. I call it like I see it. I don't give a pass on one side on something because I agree with them on something else.
poor you
hahaha, OK. lol
I think the smartest thing Clinton has done is embrace Obama/Obama's platform. She's essentially a third term for him.
guess the sanders salt will continue for just a little bit longer
hopefully that will start to fade into irrelevancy as well
TestOfTide
Banned
Which is why he obviously would never be picked for VP or cabinet positions. But if he is simply campaigning for Hillary, then he just needs to provide stump speeches rewritten in a pro-Hillary-anti-Trump way. He won't have to give numerous interviews and any gaffes he makes wouldn't have much of an effect on Hillary because he isn't directly tied to a Hillary White House.
gutter_trash
Banned
those who doubt Hillary being Progressive will be surprised when she ends up being the most progressive President in US history
Just because I frequently disagreed with the echo chamber I frequently saw (and still see) on GAF doesn't mean I am a Bernie supporter.
Should I just "fall in line" with a narrative I don't agree with to make people's preferred candidate look better?
If GAF was a pro Bernie forum that kept supporting anti GMO policy and blanket bans on fracking I would be doing the opposite.
That is how honesty works. I call it like I see it. I don't give a pass on one side on something because I agree with them on something else.
Congrats on being GAF's most powerful concern troll then, I guess? Either that, or you care way more than you're letting on.
minor effort
Banned
He's 74. Most likely he won't opt to run for president again, and without the national spotlight of a presidential campaign attention will shift towards newer progressives.
Intheflorsh
Banned
were you there though
boiled goose
good with gravy
I definitely care about specific political issues. No attachments to specific candidates.
What is this? Bizzarro World? Nobody takes him seriously. Not even the majority of his so called supporters after he lost his grip.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
Johnson is going to be legit because Trump is fucking insane and there are many repunlicans who know it. Some will still vote for him, some wont vote at all some will vote Johnson on princaple, a small fraction will vote Clinton.
Unfortunetly for Stein, Clinton is pretty popular with most democrats, Stein isnt going to get the protest vote, shes going to get the salty vote because only Bernie and Stein are the two true progressives or something. Shes not going to effect the race much, if at all, unlike Johnson.
Unfortunetly for Stein, Clinton is pretty popular with most democrats, Stein isnt going to get the protest vote, shes going to get the salty vote because only Bernie and Stein are the two true progressives or something. Shes not going to effect the race much, if at all, unlike Johnson.
teruterubozu
Member
I think the next grand meltdown is gonna be Johnson supporters. There's a weird trance-like optimism floating around there.
Yeah that's why I am surprised by someone voting Obama and Not wanting to vote for Clinton.
IrishNinja
Member
good
yeah, his feed is what a breakdown looks like - huffpo really can do better than this
Veritigo_X
Member
Oh wow, he's really having a meltdown. His tweets the past two days are something else.
teruterubozu
Member
TYT and the like are just the casualties of a highly contested primary. The body count is expected.
This is another example of something that is actually part of the Jill Stein platform:
This isn't progressive. This isn't looking out for poor people or the disenfranchised, even though the gut reaction is "it would be awesome if people wouldn't be foreclosed on or evicted". This is a complete lack of understanding that policies have an impact other than the one you really, really, really hope for. This is the type of policy that would cause mass poverty.
The Green Party platform doesn't pass the muster of very basic common sense. It is a dangerous platform with zero common sense and zero thought on impact put into it. Yes, it is less progressive than the democrat platform, because "progressiveness" isn't a magic wand of how much you wish things were better and more fair -- if we use that definition, the word has no meaning.
He can and will still do great things for this country.
This isn't progressive. This isn't looking out for poor people or the disenfranchised, even though the gut reaction is "it would be awesome if people wouldn't be foreclosed on or evicted". This is a complete lack of understanding that policies have an impact other than the one you really, really, really hope for. This is the type of policy that would cause mass poverty.
The Green Party platform doesn't pass the muster of very basic common sense. It is a dangerous platform with zero common sense and zero thought on impact put into it. Yes, it is less progressive than the democrat platform, because "progressiveness" isn't a magic wand of how much you wish things were better and more fair -- if we use that definition, the word has no meaning.
He can and will still do great things for this country.
Honestly listening to TYT trying to cover British politics made me realise they are just shit
yeah just look at his career of storied legislative accomplishments
Her stances make logical sense, unlike Stein's. Stein is anti-GMO, anti-nuclear power, and 100% anti-fracking, yet cites scientific consensus as the reason for decisive action to reduce the threat of climate change.
Hillary Clinton believes in the scientific method that is the driving force of our understanding of our world. Jill Stein believes in the parts of it that she finds convenient. I'd say that a true progressive is someone who doesn't distort or hide from scientific evidence to fit their narrative, at the expense of societal progress.
To be fair, if Clinton pulls a Senate majority in with her Bernie Sanders is in line to be the chairman of the senate budget committee. That would be a pretty big deal for him. If she brought along a Dem House he'd even be able to push through a lot of his funding challenged agenda (though incredibly unlikely).
Do you think Bernie is more progressive than Stein?
This is an often ignored fact. I've spent more time than I'd care to admit looking through the post history of a lot of posters who have stood out in the comments section of s4p. I can't tell you how many times someone would post some shit posing as a Bernie supporter and openly wondering "hmmm, guys... maybe Trump isn't so bad compared to hillary!" then, upon further inspection, I find that the poster in question posts more on /r/thedonald than anywhere else.
Every candidate has supporters who aren't worth the time and effort it takes to read/listen to them. It's annoying seeing people acting like this is unique to any one candidate, and it's especially annoying seeing people dig through goddamn reddit (if I wanted to see what was going on at reddit, I'd go there) to shit up this thread despite the tone. Don't let the BernieBro dream die, guys!
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