Bernie Sanders is officially running for President as a Democrat
- Thread starter WayneMorse
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Wolfgunblood Garopa
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He has great ideas, hopefully we get to hear a lot from him during the process.
Grover Cleveland
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I'm speaking mainly to the left-wingers who beg and plead for a more left-leaning candidate than Clinton.
Like I said, I'm sure that most Democrats will rally around Hillary as the more pragmatic choice and the primaries will only be a formality.
KuwabaraTheMan
Banned
He's pretty much the only Senator who I actually respect. He has no chance of getting the nomination, but if he did, I might actually vote a Democrat for President for the first time.
I'll be rooting for him, even if I don't think there's much of a chance. He's the rarest of politicians who are actually not part of the neoliberal, imperialist shitshow that dominates this country.
I'll be rooting for him, even if I don't think there's much of a chance. He's the rarest of politicians who are actually not part of the neoliberal, imperialist shitshow that dominates this country.
Sad to see the "He won't win" self-fulfilling prophesy in full force on this very forum. You say he won't win, and you scare people into thinking that voting for him is a waste of their vote. Then they don't vote for him when they otherwise would have, thus decreasing his chance to win.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
You don't waste votes in primaries the way you do in general elections though. But the issue is that electability in the general election is a legitimate concern and Hilary's had a hype train since 2008.
Tesseract
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that's probably the plan
Yellowtail
Member
So said the Paulbots in 2012 and Kunichbots in 2008.
Liberals, and particularly self-stylized True Progressives don't make up anywhere near the number of Democratic primary voters that people on the Internet like to like to think exist. A large number of voting Democrats identify as Moderate and even Conservative (although in Clinton's case she's actually more popular with liberals than these groups so there's not many inroads to be made), and this is why even Warren would have a very low chance of winning the nomination.
gutter_trash
Banned
Hillary will never a pick a North-East liberal who is more left than her. She is going to pick a Latino Veep or regional Veep
DragonSworne
Banned
Someone has my vote.
We would get a Clinton/Warren ticket before a Clinton/Sanders.
But I'm hoping for a Clinton/Biden.
Femmeworth
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Clinton having competition would be good.
DragonSworne
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Biden/Clinton you mean
Grover Cleveland
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I don't think people saying Bernie Sanders won't beat Hillary Clinton on Neogaf is going to shift the results of the primaries in any way, shape, or form.
His problem is ultimately electability in a general election as a liberal candidate in a right-leaning electoral climate. Not people talking down on him on the internet.
Warren is staying in the Senate.
The bigger concern is that the entire Democrat Party is moving to the right and we're perpetuating it by voting for the Clintons over this world over the Kucinich's and Sanders'. If you want the general direction of the county to go left, you have to vote for the left candidate. Then others will see the momentum and the left has a better chance in the general election. Otherwise we get two "right" candidates in the general election.
If your views actually align with Clinton then fine, ahead and vote for her. But I always see people saying they'd prefer such and such, but didn't vote for that person in the primaries because they didn't think that person would win in the general election. You miss the point of elections if you don't give a chance to the person who represents your views.
GrotesqueBeauty
Banned
Hmm, I didn't expect to vote in the primaries, but I might throw my vote towards Sanders. He's not perfect, but he's a damn sight better than anyone else since Kucinich retired.
sure sure
unless Hilldawg comes knocking. I feel like a secondary reason for the Draft Warren movement (since the President Warren thing isn't working out) is to at least plant the idea of a VP Warren into Hillary's mind.
but its the truth, he wont win. Same thing goes for Warren. Same thing goes for the Republicans. There is no way a hard left or hard right candidate is going to win a general election.
Sander's far leftist positions sink his electability more than any prophesied Clinton nomination talk. The democratic party is not the party of the far left, but the moderates and centrists of the electorate. If you truly want to vote for someone who represents leftist positions, you should be voting for the Green or Socialist tickets.
If the Republicans do as you suggested, they will lose. If they nominate a "true conservative" like Ted Cruz who shares their values, they will get shellacked.
Grover Cleveland
Member
Yep, the same way the Democrats won't nominate a leftist candidate, the Republicans won't nominate any of the nutjobs and cuckoos that populate their right-wing.
Moderates win general elections
The bigger picture is that if we give the leftist candidate as many votes as possible, it makes a statement that in future elections, leftist candidates are not that far from electability. Then the momentum can continue for the left, and soon the nation isn't afraid to back the leftist candidates. Worked for the right side of the political spectrum. Using Tea Party candidates, conservatives like Boehner looked moderate. If we vote for enough leftists, the "middle" gets redefined a bit more to the left of where it was before.
Sanders is the option to go left without having to fight the two party system.
D
Deleted member 13876
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Not American, but if you support this guy at least do him the courtesy of voting for him in the primaries no matter how much of a closed deal the Hillary seems at this point.
Cameron122
Member
Bernie Sanders for First Citizen of the United States
The Republicans did and does elect cuckoos. They just don't look like cuckoos anymore because the GOP voted for enough of them over time, in Congress and to Presidential nominations.
THANK YOU.
KuwabaraTheMan
Banned
The two party system should be fought, though.
I mean, everyone should support Sanders as well, but if you support his views, then if he loses the nomination it would be far more worthwhile to cast your vote for the Socialist nominee (or even the Green nominee, moderates though they may be), as opposed to Hilary.
Outdoor Miner
Member
Screw that, I want a Sanders/Clinton ticket. She can help his electability in the general election.
I wish people wouldn't be so quick to write him off. Don't underestimate the message he'll have and how it may resonate with people. I think he is a wonderful contrast to the slick-rick walk-over-your-corpse-smiling image that most other candidates seem to project.
Now, if any one group is going to fuck him over, its the media.
I wish people wouldn't be so quick to write him off. Don't underestimate the message he'll have and how it may resonate with people. I think he is a wonderful contrast to the slick-rick walk-over-your-corpse-smiling image that most other candidates seem to project.
Now, if any one group is going to fuck him over, its the media.
Agree 100%. But let's not plan for Sanders to lose. That's part of what I call a self-fulfilling prophesy.
I think people are underestimating how fed up people are over Wall Street, even the middle of the country.
Oppo
Member
He can't win, but I love that he's doing this, just for this reason.
To reiterate: if you want to foment that change in the two-party system, you shouldn't be giving your votes to the big two anyway. The democratic party will never move left as long as it is confident that the base leftists will vote for them, regardless of their candidate. You have to take those votes away from them in order for them to take notice; otherwise, they will confuse voting for a left-leaning establishment democrat as an endorsement of the populist, pro-left rhetoric they trot out in -every- election (and subsequently fail to cash in on) and nothing more.
I am not saying don't pledge your support for Sanders; throw everything you've got at him, for god's sake. Just saying you should take your premise that we should vote for our interests directly to its logical conclusion.
Ivan A Nguyen
Member
I've been getting this guy's emails for months. He's always on the side of issues I am concerned about. Usually I try to vote republican in primaries because my vote counts more for that in texas, but I'll vote in the democratic primaries to show my support.
Sirpopopop
Member
I'll be voting for him in the primary.
Well Sanders DOES represent my interest, and the interests of many people who would normally back the Green Party... he just happens to allow people to not have to worry about fighting the two party system at the same time. Fighting a war with two battlefronts is very tough.
1. If the Democrats nominate Sanders, not only will the Supreme Court be conservative for decades to come, but Obama's legacy will essentially be overturn on day 1 setting back progressive priorities for decades. Health-care as you know it will be over, Republican Governors in conservative states will be backpedaled by the supreme court and Congress will pass all kinds of conservative legislation.
2. Republicans lost Senate seats because of this. Todd Aiken and Richard Murdoch are prime examples of this. The establishment fought back against the tea party in 2014 and won by towing the far-right line.
tdlr; Its better to have someone in the White House who you agree with 60-70% of the time then have someone who you agree with 0% of the time.
I love Bernie Sanders to death, but I think even he must know he can't win. IF by some shock of the imagination he beat out Hillary for the nomination, republicans will rip him apart with all of the Socialist stuff, and unlike Obama, Sanders has referred to himself as a Democratic-Socialist on numerous occasions...So there's really no way.
But as others have said, this will force Hillary to push further left, which is definitely a good thing, as I really did not feel like having her run unopposed, Sanders will challenge her to speak to the liberal base instead of just automatically winning the nomination (and probably the presidency).
But as others have said, this will force Hillary to push further left, which is definitely a good thing, as I really did not feel like having her run unopposed, Sanders will challenge her to speak to the liberal base instead of just automatically winning the nomination (and probably the presidency).
#1 is quite an assumption.. and it's based on the assumption that Sanders can't beat a Republican. That's a self-fulfilling prophesy because saying that scares people from electing him to the nomination to begin with. Then of course he can't win the general election if we don't give him the nomination.
#2 proves my point. The conservatives used the Tea Party to make the GOP more conservative. Now the GOP espouses views previously seen as radical. The left can do something similar with candidates like Sanders and Warren.
RE: Your edit. You are exaggerating the difference between Hillary and the GOP.
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