You can also try the shield/reflect power. It also works on them.
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Bioshock Infinite |OT| No Gods, Kings, or Irrational Games
- Thread starter Cystm
- Start date
You can also try the shield/reflect power. It also works on them.
Quadraphonic
Member
Also you use Possession on all the vending machines for like $30 every time you find a new one. YAY! MONEY!
Regarding all these comparisons between Bioshock and Infinite, I won't get into the combat, because to me, that's secondary to the narrative. But I would compare Bioshock 1 with X-files season, with a mix of episodes that had their own story arc (surgeon, Cohen) and other episodes that carried the main story forward. While Infinite I would compare with a season of Lost, that almost all episodes are mostly tied to the main plot, with a few exception (on both sides, Lost had Nikki and Paulo and BI had
. I'm not saying anything about the quality, as Cohen story arc is super cool!
I just tend to prefer a more central plot throughout the game, so I definitely prefer the way Infinite is set up. I guess that's why I don't agree with the 2 stories and abrupt change in direction. I think Infinite has a much linear progression than the original Bioshock.
Chen-Lin
I just tend to prefer a more central plot throughout the game, so I definitely prefer the way Infinite is set up. I guess that's why I don't agree with the 2 stories and abrupt change in direction. I think Infinite has a much linear progression than the original Bioshock.
I liked the feeling of controlling a level in Bioshock. It's quite scary so to know that you have cameras, turrets and even Big Daddies on your side is a huge comfort.
You never had any of that but the structure is different.
For what it's worth, I'm on my 4th playthrough of Infinite and I think it's a better game than Bioshock. I prefer it's art direction and atmosphere over it.
You never had any of that but the structure is different.
For what it's worth, I'm on my 4th playthrough of Infinite and I think it's a better game than Bioshock. I prefer it's art direction and atmosphere over it.
http://www.abc.net.au/arts/stories/s3733057.htm
Already been posted in this thread, but it is spot on. I'm only halfway through, but so far there doesn't seem to be a POINT. Racism is actually a relevant topic in 2013 because of its online prevalence. But Bioshock neglects to make use of its own narrative to address prejudice at all and instead just exploits it for aesthetic. It's especially bad the player who chooses the white supremacist path is rewarded with the same outcome as the racial sympathizer.
Already been posted in this thread, but it is spot on. I'm only halfway through, but so far there doesn't seem to be a POINT. Racism is actually a relevant topic in 2013 because of its online prevalence. But Bioshock neglects to make use of its own narrative to address prejudice at all and instead just exploits it for aesthetic. It's especially bad the player who chooses the white supremacist path is rewarded with the same outcome as the racial sympathizer.
People saying Decoy doesn't exist? Possession is basically a better version of it. I don't know that there are any meaningful Bioshock 1/2 plasmids that don't have a vigor analogue.
This is something where playstyle will be the biggest factor. The Skylines led me to be much more aggressive on 1999. I would constantly throttle, immelman, slow down, jump to other rails if available, shoot at various speeds, jump down to platforms or ships and take a bunch out and get back on the Skyline. If that's "conventional" I'd like to know what other games I can do that stuff in.
I looked at any arena with the Skylines as basically my own personal jungle gym.
Not sure if you played on a pad or what, but this is (one of the many) cases where mouse/kb is almost certain have a significant impact. Aiming from a speeding Skyline with a pad is probably a good bit tougher even with whatever auto-aim they give you.
This is something where playstyle will be the biggest factor. The Skylines led me to be much more aggressive on 1999. I would constantly throttle, immelman, slow down, jump to other rails if available, shoot at various speeds, jump down to platforms or ships and take a bunch out and get back on the Skyline. If that's "conventional" I'd like to know what other games I can do that stuff in.
I looked at any arena with the Skylines as basically my own personal jungle gym.
Not sure if you played on a pad or what, but this is (one of the many) cases where mouse/kb is almost certain have a significant impact. Aiming from a speeding Skyline with a pad is probably a good bit tougher even with whatever auto-aim they give you.
I think what frustrated me about the skylines as much as I loved them was they always felt kind of samey throughout. Theres the High rail and the Low rail
I would have liked as the game went on, arenas had more rails with more complex layouts. Maybe they thought of that and it wound up not playing well like the original idea for the Boys of Silence
I would have liked as the game went on, arenas had more rails with more complex layouts. Maybe they thought of that and it wound up not playing well like the original idea for the Boys of Silence
OnlyWonderBoy
Neo Member
I find it interesting that there has been this backlash to Infinite, with people being extra critical after the initial wave of reviews (Like TotalBiscuit's WTF and Leigh Alexander's blogpost). I agree with most of this criticism (combat being just okay, under realized villains, ect) but that just didn't detract from the entire experience for me. Reading and listening to all of this stuff almost makes me feel ashamed for liking the game as much as I do.
DeadRockstar
Member
This is something where playstyle will be the biggest factor. The Skylines led me to be much more aggressive on 1999. I would constantly throttle, immelman, slow down, jump to other rails if available, shoot at various speeds, jump down to platforms or ships and take a bunch out and get back on the Skyline. If that's "conventional" I'd like to know what other games I can do that stuff in.
I looked at any arena with the Skylines as basically my own personal jungle gym.
Not sure if you played on a pad or what, but this is (one of the many) cases where mouse/kb is almost certain have a significant impact. Aiming from a speeding Skyline with a pad is probably a good bit tougher even with whatever auto-aim they give you.
I didn't mean to imply the mechanic is conventional. Just that it encourages attacking from a distance, which I feel is a more conventional shooter style.
I played the game kb+m on 1999. It felt like I was using skylines to get more of a view of the battlefield because it was confusing from ground zero. Like I was compensating for their design, rather than using the mechanic for my enjoyment. I can see why people enjoy the movement it allows. I was raised on Quake and UT where movement is paramount, but I didn't feel like the skylines contributed much to my enjoyment or playstyle. It was just an extension of how the game encourages you to play anyway, which I think is the result of flawed design.
Infinite just didn't feel cohesive to me. It was more a reasonably good job of fitting an existing structure into a new setting.
Part of it is the expectations. The first Bioshock was heralded as the de facto "games as art" example, and perhaps rightly so. It used its multimedia talents to tell a stylish satire on contemporary issues as told through a lens of exaggeration and pomp. It had a novel plot twist which worked on several levels, and what's more, stood up to scrutiny. After, what, 5 years, Infinite has a lot to live up to, and it not only seems shallower and less involving than before, there's a level of intellectual dishonesty to it that seems to undermine everything about it. It's hard to not let that disappointment overtake one's opinions.
Nobody is saying you can't enjoy the game, and more power to you if you do. But I think Infinite has earned its backlash and the resulting discussion about it is probably more interesting than the shallow spectacle it ultimately ended up being.
Incendiary
Banned
I think Yahtzee in his review of Infinite put it best:
I can see people not liking Infinite in comparison to Bioshock, because they really aren't the same game. At no point is Infinite trying to be horror or anything like that. It's much more of an adventure-type game. And the people complaining that it doesn't do enough with the setting or make enough social commentary, well, the Indiana Jones series had Nazis as a backdrop but there wasn't much more commentary beyond "Nazis bad." Not everything that uses controversial ideals as a backdrop needs to have it be the central issue.
Yahtzee said:
I can see people not liking Infinite in comparison to Bioshock, because they really aren't the same game. At no point is Infinite trying to be horror or anything like that. It's much more of an adventure-type game. And the people complaining that it doesn't do enough with the setting or make enough social commentary, well, the Indiana Jones series had Nazis as a backdrop but there wasn't much more commentary beyond "Nazis bad." Not everything that uses controversial ideals as a backdrop needs to have it be the central issue.
Sure it was. Near the end it got pretty creepy as fuck. My wife was watching and even commented a few times about it being total nightmare fuel.
But overall you're right
That is reasonable. I had a different experience, clearly, but such is the nature of subjectivity.
I would have preferred to see the Skylines introduced earlier, as well as be a bit more intricate in navigating them. Probably really fucking hard to design and balance, though.
Also, gear is going to play a part. There is various Skyline-centric gear that can encourage more aggressive play when you're on them. Gear in fact as a whole can potentially have a significant impact on a person's enjoyment of the game. I'm curious just how big a bearing it's had on what have been some wildly differing opinions on the quality of the combat.
I disagree with this, as a lot of the gear is absurdly powerful. Also shows how everyone recommends the go to strategy of melee specs with charge abuse to get through the infamous encoutner, as it literally renders it a joke. That extends beyond this encounter, the entire game can be broken with charge. Even without a spec like that I was able to lock down entire groups of enemies with Storm, as the shock effect kept triggering and retriggering forever stunning groups down.
The saving grace here is the gear is random, but that is also a large complaint in my opinion. This stuff shouldn't be given the huge effect it has on playstyle, and like mentioned above even if there are sets to make skyrails much more effective, skyrails aren't present enough for me to actually wear them all and the act of changing them mid battle is tedium I never felt like going through when I was already so effective. So, Infinite might not turn out that way given the dice rolls, but it also could become even worse if the game gives things like Blood to Salt and Storm within the first 25% of the game like it did for me.
Decoy would have served well for instant relief from the hitscan weapons, while Possession has a travel time. I see both of your points, basically. If anything the existence of the Decoy tear is weird given the activation of it is better suited just possessing instead, though it is barely present like he said.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
Randomized gear is bad and you should feel bad, Irrational.
AlphaStriker
Member
Sure it was. Near the end it got pretty creepy as fuck. My wife was watching and even commented a few times about it being total nightmare fuel.
But overall you're right
You know that creepy wheelchair with like the Ben Franklin head on it? They should have had that wheelchair constantly follow you throughout the hospital. Just keeping its distance and always making a creaking sound.
UltimaPooh
Member
Again the racial and religious themes are explored but they don't have an immediate answer for them nor do they necessarily say hey this is bad and these people should feel bad. And that's because that isn't the focus of the character's narratives or the overall narrative and theme of the story.
Commenting on it would have just been another Bioshock and this is so much more than that.
Hot Coldman
Banned
I got the "SET FIRE TO EVERYTHING" trousers or whatever early doors so I can't complain.
RadarScope1
Member
So I am at
. Can anyone give me a ballpark completion percent to this point?
Lady Comstock's grave
UltimaPooh
Member
2 Hours.
RadarScope1
Member
Thanks.
PRjumpman124
Member
All the cool kids get the blood to salt gear except me
Fine Ham Abounds
Member
Don't be ashamed of your opinions, defend them. Any opinion based on real information and experience is valid. It's ok to like things, and you shouldn't apologize for that. It's also okay if no one else in the world agrees with you.
Heh, I didn't get Blood to Salt until
Emporia
Comstock House
All the cool kids get the blood to salt gear except me
Literally the second piece of gear I got
Hot Coldman
Banned
Literally the second-to-last gear I got... and I thought "fuck NO" when I saw it. I got shot too much for that shit.
What white supremacist path?
Spoilers regarding this upcoming.
I assume you mean throw at the couple vs the announcer. I assumed that in the context of the game, throwing it at the couple was Booker trying not to stir conflict. Also, if you save the couple, they give you a "present" later.
D
Deleted member 80556
Unconfirmed Member
I never got Blood to the Salts either! Damn it game, be fair to me and gimme everything I need!
I blame Shawn!
I think it was my LAST one
My third to last was that one that gives you full health after Elizabeth revives you and I was like "Where the fuck was this the whole entire rest of the game"
I really disagree with that characterization of the choice.
Booker's attitude through the rest of the game makes it read like "endanger yourself to protect others" or "maintain your cover".
clutch.as.it.gets.
Member
I can`t remember but was Bioshock 1 the same? I don`t think so, or?
Omotesando
Member
The story was fine. The first 30 minutes was engaging, storytelling at its finest. It kept up for a few hours then the narrative suddenly fell on its face. The Vox, Slate character, all felt contrived and lacked the magic that started the game.
I was really lost when there were ghosts coming out of the grave. Sure the ending was great though.
The visuals were engaging, on par with the best of this generation. I found the gameplay to be tedious...I'll give it a 7/10.
I was really lost when there were ghosts coming out of the grave. Sure the ending was great though.
The visuals were engaging, on par with the best of this generation. I found the gameplay to be tedious...I'll give it a 7/10.
If you're talking about tonics, no. Some of the tonics were actually context-appropriate for how you found them. For example: photograph enough Houdini splicers and you get Natural Camouflage (which makes you invisible). I always though that was a nice touch.
The more I think about Infinite the less I like it. I started a replay to collect all the audiologs etc. but just kind of gave up for now. It's really boring now that I know the story and can't really deviate.
The Librarian
Banned
I love the contrast early on with
Lincoln being idolized in the progressive home and the John Wilkes Booth love in the Feathered Brothers place.
Bumblebeetuna
Member
Man I cannot beat the end on 1999 mode.
If I destroy the zeps with Songbird, the army of enemies destroys me and my ship eventually. But if I zip line and disable the zeps myself, while I am off doing that, the enemies annihilate the ship. Not sure what I am doing wrong. This thing was a cakewalk for me on Hard mode.
Use Return to Sender mines, which absorb bullets, on the thing you must protect. I can't stress this enough, got me by on the first try. The RtS shield is also useful for avoiding damage.
You should probably spoiler tag your last post.
Bumblebeetuna
Member
Sorry, spoilered.
And yeah, I just read that RtS trick elsewhere and it worked ridiculous easy.
And yeah, I just read that RtS trick elsewhere and it worked ridiculous easy.
It's not really about the twist itself all that much. I got spoiled, but even knowing a few key facts, the way it all played out was really, really well done.
Intellectual dishonesty? WTF are you talking about? An shallowness? Again, where the fuck is this coming from? I mean am I playing a totally different game than you? Narrative wise, this is one of the most complex, yet the most well put together narrative this gen. Make's Kojima look like fan fic writer he is.
Bioshock was fucking shallow as hell as well...so I'm not sure where you trying to go with this either. Especially combat wise, and everything after the plot twist is the definition of bargin bin.
Also, there's hardly been that much backlash, especailly considering backlash always come's with the GAF Cycle of:
Initial Release-Incredible Game. Best game of this gen.
Few months later-It was okay/shit
A few years later LTTP comments-It was pretty good.
The same problem Bio1 had.
Once you know all the plot details, it's impossible to really motivate yourself to do a full replay.
Nah, your totally normal.
It's a great-great game. Does it have flaws? Fuck yeah. But it's still a fantastic piece of work, and I feel people are being "harder" on this game, because:
A. It's a successor to one of the greatest games of all time (bioshock 1)
B. It's been heavily praised in the gaming journalist circle, and there has been a lot of praise on GAF as well.
If this was a new ip, by a new developer, than almost 3/4th of these critiques wouldn't exist.
Buckethead
Banned
The media is treating it like a critical darling, consumers are rightly pointing out it's flaws.
I feel like the pendulum will eventually swing back to a more appropriate position.
It's not a "9.5-10" level game but perhaps an "8.5-9.0".
I'm all for the media hyping it though, games like this need to be bought and played so that more games like it can be put into production (and refined and improved).
Definitly agree.
This game needs to be a stepping stone, rather than a "whipping boy" of games trying to be art.
It tries interesting themes. An yeah, it might not always click together like it fully should. An yeah, the combat should've definitely been more slower paced, than what it was. There's flaws.
But at the same time, in AAA industry, a game that touches these themes with the sense of maturity that Ken sought out, is quite impressive imho, and I hope this will open the floodgates for future developers to take more risks with their themes and narrative.
Estocolmo
Member
From the perspective as a non-american gamer, some parts I just couldn't understand. Because the game is based on american history and patriotism, its hard for me as a european who dont have so much knowledge of Lincoln, Jefferson or Washington to understand certain parts of the game.