One if you just back up a save before the final boss.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Bloodborne Story and Lore Discussion Thread [Unmarked Spoilers]
- Thread starter GorillaJu
- Start date
One if you just back up a save before the final boss.
I thought of doing that because it's the only two trophies I'm missing
But the day I trophy hunt is the day I'm already dead. I'm still the proud owner of zero Platinums
I'm saving the non-fight ending for my Bloodtinge (Katana/claws) and Arcane run
I thought of doing that because it's the only two trophies I'm missing
But the day I trophy hunt is the day I'm already dead. I'm still the proud owner of zero Platinums
I'm saving the non-fight ending for my Bloodtinge (Katana/claws) and Arcane run
Oh look at Mr cool here, too high and mighty to get a platinum like us lowly bottom feeding nerds.
OUTTA PRINCIPLE ODD
I like the theories I'm reading about the story here, even though I think it's much more simpler than some are making it out to be, but that's what I love about the Souls series! We can each form different interpretations by connecting the same dots
Considering the mythos motifs in BB, it's arguably that True Ending is the "best endng". In Lovecraftian mythos, many of its character seeks to commune with the cosmic gods, and perhaps even some of them try to ascend themselves the same plain of existence. So, in someway, ascend to godhood is basically a Lovecraftian wet dream.
Demon's Souls definitely have more Lovecraftian motifs among the three Souls games. Dark Souls deal with the usual fantasy mythos of the changing of ages from the age of the gods to the age of human. But considering what happened to Manus and others who have been greatly touched by "humanity", the element is still there.
it's not wrong to call them alien actually
As far as I know, Lovecraft write his story during the age of scientific discovery where the ocean known to have vast deepness, celestial bodies where discovered and named. Humanity suddenly become so small compared to the vastness of the universe itself. This is why the genre called cosmic horror for some reason and why many of the pantheon resides in cosmic space.
Great Ones doesn't necessarily having the same purpose, it's rather common motifs in the mythos.
Yeah, the Hunters, especially the player character is having too much agency for it to be called a true Lovecraftian Horror where the protagonist mostly fall into the state of helplessness. I guess that is the price we must paid as the game is a action-RPG title. Even the True Ending Trophy description makes it more like an anti-Lovecraftian Mythos since it said that you have ascend humanity to its next stage.
There are these quotes as well
"We are born by the blood. Made by the blood. Undone by blood"
"Blood what makes us human. Blood makes more than human. Blood makes human no longer"
I'm not sure if someone else have noticed this but Yharnam eerily sounds alike the word Jahannam, which is an arabic name for Hell.
Most likely just the inspiration for the name of the city and nothing else, it's a funny and interesting tidbit though.
Most likely just the inspiration for the name of the city and nothing else, it's a funny and interesting tidbit though.
Laurence will be the Artorias of Bloodborne, I'm calling it.
Not like that I'm complaining though. The amount of detail they put on the enviroment is unbelievable. Even with the 2 months delay and 2 and a half years of development , there could be a cut or unfinished content that couldn't make it to the last game. I rather see a DLC that complete the story rather being complete ignored by the rest of the game like the 5th Archstone in Demon's Souls was.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
Karsticles
Member
She talks about the dream, but she also says that hunters "Cannot stop what's coming", which suggests she has knowledge about the Old Ones to some degree.
Oh, totally. No way is Rom an Old One.
So I was just looking at different things in different cathedrals.
One this guy in the back of the witches abode was clearly being interrogated
These guys with bandages appear to become the the guys with bandages falling off of them in the good chalice place.
Also the witches seem to have a more simple style of worship than those of the healing church.
There's almost carholics vs Protestants thing going on.
I think that those hunters that say they no longer dream means that they no longer use blood. Since the rune tool states that runes give power without the use of blood and that a favored Hunter Willem would be proud of this. Just some speculation.
One this guy in the back of the witches abode was clearly being interrogated
These guys with bandages appear to become the the guys with bandages falling off of them in the good chalice place.
Also the witches seem to have a more simple style of worship than those of the healing church.
There's almost carholics vs Protestants thing going on.
I think that those hunters that say they no longer dream means that they no longer use blood. Since the rune tool states that runes give power without the use of blood and that a favored Hunter Willem would be proud of this. Just some speculation.
My thoughts on that true ending:
except you know in the "true" ending you become a god, in the gif you linked you become a gelatinous mass to be tortured for all eternity.
Sephiroth_GR_
Member
Any other speculation about connecting Bloodborne with the other Souls games?(i know of the Beast Soul of the Old One)
Just noticed the pillars in Hunter's Dream:
And this is Ashen Lake from DS :
And this is Dragon Memories from DS 2 :
Just noticed the pillars in Hunter's Dream:
And this is Ashen Lake from DS :
And this is Dragon Memories from DS 2 :
theSlacker
Member
I was under the impression that they were referring to no longer being able to access the Hunter's Dream, and thus not being able to "respawn". Think Eileen mentions or implies that in your last meeting with her when she is hurt outside the Cathedral. She also says that she has taken enough blood to not die there so don't think it is relating to the use of blood, but really don't know why certain hunters would no longer be able to access the Hunter's Dream or what would cause them to lose that access.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
Yea, once I saw the Hunters Dream I instantly thought of Ash Lake.
Altough I never saw Dragon Memories from DS2, at least I don't remember it.
Personally I find the connection... interesting. I don't take things like this as coincidences. But we do know that Demons Souls and Dark Souls are seperate universes... right? And in BB we have the slugs that produce magic, much like Demons Souls.
So who knows, maybe Bloodborne is litterally bridging the two games universes together. I mean, the Great Ones are cosmic horrors, they aren't from this world, so it's possible that they weren't around during the Dark Souls timeline.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
I thought it was because the veil covered up things. So they instead used thier hearing to really tell what's goimg on.
Oh I was taking it as characters that are wrapping there eyes have seen to much are going insane because of it and are wrapping their eyes to avoid being tormented by what they conceive as visions. If we keep with the HP Lovecraftian themes of the game people in those stories tend to see stuff and go mad if o remember correctly there's a story were a dude be living he is having visions or going insane gouges out his own eyes.
heh her demon baby looks like Guts' and Casca's demon child from Berserk :3
SargerusBR
I love Pokken!
My thoughts on that true ending:
This is more fitting in the end where MP puts you in a wheelchair, continuing to have influence over you for all eternity.
MP= AM, Hunter = Ted
Or maybe FROM likes reusing concepts, same way Patches keeps appearing in different games
I wonder what's Willem doing out there near Rom's place. It seems he also lost his thinking capability as well.
Maybe Rom is Laurence, who experimented with the Old Blood in order to stave off the Great Ones and was granted "inside eyes" by Kos (perhaps all the Great Ones are "uplifted" by Kos) and Wilhelm is just hanging out with his old student. I assumed Wilhelm was senile because he was old as fuck.
theSlacker
Member
The helm of the choir set implies that Willem always had his eyes covered, and he seems otherwise obsessed with eyes as well. Don't know what it means though.
"Attire of the Choir, high-ranking members of the Healing Church.
Members of the Choir are both the highest-ranking clerics of the Healing Church, and scholars who continue the work that began at Byrgenwerth.
The eye covering indicates their debt to the teachings of Master Willem, even though their paths diverged."
If Rom is Laurence, why the name change though? Also from how the way Micolash mentioned him it seems Rom name is unchanged before his "ascension".
I heard that some sparkling notes said that the spider abduct and hides their master, which is probably Willem, but even then why abduct him? One thing that I know he can do is restoring your Insight that have been lost to the small cthulhu men.
Darryl M R
Member
His insight is 99+, he went senile with knowledge and now his brain is fried.
theSlacker
Member
That note is near the Cathedral Ward Lantern just back in the room behind the spawn point. It says;
"The Byrgenwerth spider hides all manner of rituals, and keeps our lost master from us. A terrible shame. It makes my head shudder uncontrollably."
What that means is anyone's guess, but doesn't necessarily mean that he is kidnapped or kept there against his will.
People need to start posting in here
Well, Azathoth is more than that and could be an even more disturbing guidepost for what some of the distant Great Ones might represent in this game.
It is said that Azathoth has slept since the beginning of creation. The universe is thought to be nothing but a dream that he is having, which is why he's kept placid even by the other potent evils of the mythos. Should he ever waken, all of creation would simply cease to exist as the dream ends.
So, if Cosmos is an Azathoth equivalent, we cannot and must not ever confront it. Killing it or even attacking it could be completely disastrous.
Also, Nyarlathothep's most common otherworldly face, the red tongue, has a long tentacle jutting out of the head. Looks a lot like the method those little star spawn wannabes use to steal insight from you. So, maybe they put at least a little reference in there in some way.
Sir Ilpalazzo
Member
This is godlike.
MajinSweet4
Member
So I'm thinking that Hunters Dream is entirely made up by a Great One for the sake of getting a surrogate. Which would be you. It's based on the workshop but twisted to suit it's needs. The doll is a puppet, quite literally, used to manipulate you. Making it a pretty interesting connection to Demon's Souls. "The Fools Idol" Which had a Soul titled Doll. Gehrman is enslaved against his will to go along with this. This is why he tries to kill you at the end of the game. It's the only defense against the Great Ones plan. Like the past games, this has probably gone on for a great many years. Perhaps more interesting, I feel Rom might actually be opposing the Great One. If he or she was a human before "ascending" they might have had a change in heart once they gained insight of what the Great Ones are and what they plan to do. The reason why I think this is because the veil may in fact be a way to stop hunters from completing their mission. By hiding the truth and making you more of a target for the monsters and people of the world. The first note that talks about a spider of Byrgenwerth stopping them from finding their master, I believe they mean that in a sense that they are trying to find the hunter that will become a Great One. Also, I believe the title of Vacuous was given to him by people who oppose what he is doing now. Like Micolash. So what do you guys think? How many holes in this line of thinking?
Sephiroth_GR_
Member
Geez...you're reading too much into it
From the Lunarium Key description:
"Key to the lunarium facing the lake on the second floor of Byrgenwerth College.
In his final years, Master Willem was fond of the lookout, and the rocking chair that he kept there for meditation. In the end, it is said, he left his secret with the lake."
My thoughts on that true ending:
But the true ending is basically a happy ending.
Story speculation:
Reposting this from the main thread without spoiler tags
So with the good ending you are reborn as a great one, with this we can assume some of the great ones used to be human. My assumption is that Rom is one of the humans turned great one based on Micolash's dialogue during his fight "grant us eyes, grant us eyes... as you once did the vacuous Rom. this is all said while he is wearing the head armor "Mensis cage" which in the item description was said to be used to communicate with the great ones.[/spoiler]
i don't have access to the game at the moment so this is from memory
Also, i got the Betrothal Ring in chalice dungeons, anything i can do with it besides get turned down by the queen? Tried to give it to Arianna because of what happens in her story line and nothing happened.
Reposting this from the main thread without spoiler tags
So with the good ending you are reborn as a great one, with this we can assume some of the great ones used to be human. My assumption is that Rom is one of the humans turned great one based on Micolash's dialogue during his fight "grant us eyes, grant us eyes... as you once did the vacuous Rom. this is all said while he is wearing the head armor "Mensis cage" which in the item description was said to be used to communicate with the great ones.[/spoiler]
i don't have access to the game at the moment so this is from memory
Also, i got the Betrothal Ring in chalice dungeons, anything i can do with it besides get turned down by the queen? Tried to give it to Arianna because of what happens in her story line and nothing happened.
That's pretty much the name of the game in From RPG lore threads.
I was just thinking that the use of blood or the overuse of blood might be what got you to the hunters dream.
My understanding is that whats left of Laurence is on the altar in the Gran Cathedral in front of Vicar Amelia. Her dialogue is also very interesting, just sit outside of cut scene range and listen to her some time.
"Seek the old blood, so that we may take part in communion, so that we make partake in communion"
Very different from the old adage "fear the old blood"
So why is Laurence on the altar of the church that thinks differently from Willem?
Karsticles
Member
Swiss cheese: the post. It's just a long line of groundless assumptions.
Being a slug isnt a happy ending :V
So...micolash...er....anyone dig anything up on him yet?
MajinSweet4
Member
Really? Why it obviously has a certain amount of speculation, especially the parts about Rom, a lot of is based on stuff that other people in this thread already discussed, I didn't elaborate on those things because I didn't want to waste other peoples time. For example, I just did a quick google search on Gehrman and got...
"It can be assumed that Gehrman's role in the dream would've been Mergo's role. There isn't much else to explain why the Moon Presence would want to replace Gehrman with you. It's clear that the Moon Presence requires this figure in the dream, for whatever reason. This begs the question: Was Gehrman going against the will and biddings of the Moon Presence by freeing hunters from the dream?"
http://bloodborne.wiki.fextralife.com/Gehrman
Only thing I can guess at is that he is trying to commune with the great ones via the Mensis cage (read the item description, I'm in class so I cant grab it atm) and to become a great one just like Rom became a great one. "grant us eyes, grant us eyes, as you once did the Vacuous Rom".
Thats all I've got/speculated.