They're going to try. Hopefully they fail stupendously
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Canadian PoliGAF - 42nd Parliament: Sunny Ways in Trudeaupia
- Thread starter matthewwhatever
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They're going to try. Hopefully they fail stupendously
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
This. It's not rocket science.
matthewwhatever
Member
Scheer being described as "Harper with a smile" is so dumb on so many levels.
For one thing, Harper didn't start off being dour and glowering all the time. As opposition leader, he was wooden, but he also made an effort to humanize himself and soften his image. He even told jokes at the Parliamentary Press Gallery dinner! Scheer has never had reason to be too angry, since he was in government within two years of becoming an MP, and he was Speaker for the four years of Harper's majority, meaning he was basically required to be friendly. (Sidenote: this didn't stop him from being a hardcore partisan, since he allowed the Harper government's worst abuses of Parliament to go unchecked.)
For another, Scheer is way, way more socially conservative than Harper. Harper was a so-con, but it wasn't ​his driving motivation. Scheer, by contrast, is deeply religious, and he's never tried to hide his opposition to gay/trans rights and a woman's right to choose. The fact that Trost and Lemieux supporters went to him, and that the Campaign Life Coalition is celebrating his victory, should say a lot about who Scheer is and what he wants to do.
It's early, but so far the coverage of Scheer reminds me of how the media covered Jim Flaherty: when Flaherty was Finance Minister, they were willing to overlook the fact that was implementing wildly regressive policies just because they liked his smile. I wouldn't be surprised if they treat Scheer the same way.
For one thing, Harper didn't start off being dour and glowering all the time. As opposition leader, he was wooden, but he also made an effort to humanize himself and soften his image. He even told jokes at the Parliamentary Press Gallery dinner! Scheer has never had reason to be too angry, since he was in government within two years of becoming an MP, and he was Speaker for the four years of Harper's majority, meaning he was basically required to be friendly. (Sidenote: this didn't stop him from being a hardcore partisan, since he allowed the Harper government's worst abuses of Parliament to go unchecked.)
For another, Scheer is way, way more socially conservative than Harper. Harper was a so-con, but it wasn't ​his driving motivation. Scheer, by contrast, is deeply religious, and he's never tried to hide his opposition to gay/trans rights and a woman's right to choose. The fact that Trost and Lemieux supporters went to him, and that the Campaign Life Coalition is celebrating his victory, should say a lot about who Scheer is and what he wants to do.
It's early, but so far the coverage of Scheer reminds me of how the media covered Jim Flaherty: when Flaherty was Finance Minister, they were willing to overlook the fact that was implementing wildly regressive policies just because they liked his smile. I wouldn't be surprised if they treat Scheer the same way.
gutter_trash
Banned
so Scheer is worse than Harper
matthewwhatever
Member
Way, way worse.
The push by Quebec Conservative MPs to distance themselves from their unilingual new leader begins:
He goes on to voice his support for Scheer, but it sounds incredibly grudging and conditional. It forces Scheer to either come down on him hard (and come off heavy-handed), or let it go (which can lead to "Scheer loses control of caucus"-type stories). Such bizarre timing.
The push by Quebec Conservative MPs to distance themselves from their unilingual new leader begins:
He goes on to voice his support for Scheer, but it sounds incredibly grudging and conditional. It forces Scheer to either come down on him hard (and come off heavy-handed), or let it go (which can lead to "Scheer loses control of caucus"-type stories). Such bizarre timing.
The Blackhawks are named after a US Army regiment from World War I, who took their name from an actual Illinois man, Black Hawk of Sauk Nation. And the logo is a portrait of Black Hawk.
It is nowhere near the ridiculousness of the racist caricature of Chief Wahoo or the racial slur of Redskin.
You might as well bring up the Edmonton Eskimos while you're at it.
gutter_trash
Banned
why are the Edmonton Eskimos called Eskimos?
they should do a rename with something else with the letter E
Interesting article on Andrew Scheer in Le Devoir. They sure aren't falling for his smile like some people here expected. It talks about how the party is starting to be worried behind the scene because of his social conservative bias. How he received the 15,7% vote from Trost and Lemieux who are pro-life people and how these voters will remind him he owes them. As someone who wasn't knowledgeable on the guy it's somewhat terrifying he can function in 2017. He wants to give tax credit for home schooling, is against the bill to project discrimination against trans people, wants to get rid of supervised injection centers, wants prioritize christian refugees over the rest, wants to retire funding to universities that won't allow pure freedom of speech (translation nutjobs peddling hate) and mess up with firearms legislation.
Good Grief.
Hopefully someone wakes him up
Good luck.
Good Grief.
Hopefully someone wakes him up
Good luck.
gutter_trash
Banned
Pat Storgan is the best NDP leadership candidate who is bathed in reality.
He's right when he talked about organized unions who block young workers who are looking for an start.
The union culture needs a shake down
He's right when he talked about organized unions who block young workers who are looking for an start.
The union culture needs a shake down
Indeed. Union are great for work conditions and advantages they bring but sometimes they tend to go a little to far. It's really hard to get a position where unions are strong if you are young and lacking experience because most people with enough seniority will tend to have a cushy position no matter their competency level and the blunders they make as long as they have X years of service into the company. Even at the government level it's like this.
I saw this kind of unfair treatment fairly often unfortunately and at different levels. It's considered to be the norm too.
Barrage
Member
Strogan's very intriguing, he just needs polish.
Strogan with Singh's look/charisma would be a monster.
Hopefully all that social conservatism will hurt the party enough to ensure it will never form a majority government.
And Harper's French actually got quite excellent. Let's see if Scheer is willing to put the same effort.
And Harper's French actually got quite excellent. Let's see if Scheer is willing to put the same effort.
gutter_trash
Banned
Strogan is the only NDP leadership candidate that I like because he does not speak in slogans or in platitudes of tired phrases that gets the Left nowhere.
He goes in and calls out bullshit from the all parties, including his own
He goes in and calls out bullshit from the all parties, including his own
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Guess it wasn't just for Trump either.
Well, no. Women are required to wear mourning clothes when meeting the pope. Because reasons (antiquated patriarchal/misogyny bullshit).
Unless you mean his grim face?
Pretty sure this is about the grim face.
Although, who knows? Maybe this is after Trudeau was saying, "So about that apology for the residential schools..."
UberTag
Member
It's a real shame someone like him won. I mean, it's a golden ticket for Trudeau but Scheer is the kind of guy that will only divide the Conservative party instead of bring it together. We're already seeing signs of it in the fallout from Saturday. That there was such a groundswell of support from the Lemieux, Trost, Leitch factions that all swung his way should be considered a warning sign that there remains a thriving voting base across the country fuelled by intolerance, racism and bigotry that must be purged.
It's a shame that folks like O'Toole, Raitt, Saxton and Chong could never come together before the leadership race transitioned into its final stages.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
But Peter McKay and Rempell both said he was FLUENTLY BILINGUAL.
Do we really need yet another round of Junior Liberals?
If he devides e right, how is that bad for the rest of us? One of the worst things to happen to the country was the right uniting. Let them fight, split that vote more and let the progressives drag the right side of the country into the current century kicking and screaming while they have no power
gutter_trash
Banned
I just heard a clip of Scheer speaking French; he is worse than Harper and Layton.
Scheer is in Rona Ambrose, Lisa Raiit levels of French speaking, rading off a prompter but mis-pronouncing words.
He makes too many mistakes when it pertains to masculin/femin articles and literally reads silent letters when reading off the prompter.
like "état", the last t is silent but he pronounced it.
sounds ending in "ON" with Marcron sound; he prounnonced the N instead of making the ON sound.
Scheer is in Rona Ambrose, Lisa Raiit levels of French speaking, rading off a prompter but mis-pronouncing words.
He makes too many mistakes when it pertains to masculin/femin articles and literally reads silent letters when reading off the prompter.
like "état", the last t is silent but he pronounced it.
sounds ending in "ON" with Marcron sound; he prounnonced the N instead of making the ON sound.
matthewwhatever
Member
From after the first French debate in Montreal, back in January...
A failure to communicate: Anglos flounder in Tory French-language debate:
Deepak Obhrai just started saying bonsoir over and over: A review of the Tory leadership candidates French skills
Some other experts graded his French in the B-C range, but from the videos I've seen, that's being *very* generous.
With a lot of training, he may be better by 2019, but I think functional is a lot more likely than fluent, at this point.
Did anyone watch yesterday's debate? I've just seen commentary on it to the effect that Singh was underwhelming, and Stogran was surprisingly good, if a little rough.
gutter_trash
Banned
Strogan is not a good speaker but he shys away form the usual socialist slogans and tropes. He gets down to the wrelm of reality where he can persuade Liberals
it's nothing to do with Left or Center-Left but more in a manor of talking about issues with going all Bernie Sanders repeating the same tired lines over and over.
Strogan even touched a subject that most NDPers never talk about: the Armed Forces which was interesting hearing a realistic Left wing point about the real planet Earth view on Foreign Affairs.
plus, he is right about Labour Union; they are no friends of young workers.
it's nothing to do with Left or Center-Left but more in a manor of talking about issues with going all Bernie Sanders repeating the same tired lines over and over.
Strogan even touched a subject that most NDPers never talk about: the Armed Forces which was interesting hearing a realistic Left wing point about the real planet Earth view on Foreign Affairs.
plus, he is right about Labour Union; they are no friends of young workers.
Holy shit YES! I've been hoping this would happen.
TemplaerDude
Member
Please fucking send that confidence vote straight up Clark's ass.
Infinite Stars
Member
Fuck yes!
There was a bunch of articles going around that the Greens were going to ally with the Liberals and I was getting worried, but fuck yes at this.
Go eat several piles of Shit, Christy Clark.
matthewwhatever
Member
Before you get too excited, Clark still gets first crack at governing. If she wants, she can have a speech from the throne, and force the other two parties to vote it down -- and then she could go to the LG and ask for another election, since after a Speaker is chosen from the NDP/Greens, they'll have the same number of seats as the Liberals, and Weaver has said that he doesn't believe in whipping votes. It'd be desperate, but it'd be totally viable if she wanted to do so.
gutter_trash
Banned
TemplaerDude
Member
NDP have 41 to the Liberals 43, the Greens 3 seats put them over.
CitizenVectron
Member
That's possible, but isn't speaker elected by the legislature? The NDP and Greens could vote to appoint a Liberal instead. Also, the Speaker generally breaks ties. So even if an NDP or Green was made Speaker, they would simply break all ties in their party's favour.
What is more likely is Clark delaying the new session for 3-6 months and attempting to flip an NDP member in exchange for a cabinet post or other considerations, like what happened with Belinda Stronach federally.
bonesmccoy
Banned
Lol I voted NDP and I think this is going to be a trainwreck.
Yea, not sure how that is going to work. NDP will have 40 votes and then need to rely on the Greens voting in-step with them just to tie it? Unless I'm mistaken...
Or theyre both banking on triggering another election?
Yea, not sure how that is going to work. NDP will have 40 votes and then need to rely on the Greens voting in-step with them just to tie it? Unless I'm mistaken...
Or theyre both banking on triggering another election?
I hope Weaver and Horgan have a back-up plan for Clark and the Liberal trying to delay things. Also, they can appoint a Lib as Speaker in order to maintain the seat advantage, I hope everyone in this thread knows this.
If the Greens and NDP can make this work successfully, then electoral reform in BC will be a go.
Unless it's really unusual in the BC legislature you can't just force someone to be speaker. They have to accept the nomination. Speakers in BC are elected and not appointed.
And speakers are expected to vote only for maintaining the status quo. They're supposed to be impartial, and it'd be a huge breach for them to vote in favour of a bill. This basically means a tie+speaker between government and opposition means a house that can't really pass anything.
matthewwhatever
Member
The Speaker is elected by the Legislature, not appointed, and the candidates have to put their names forward -- they're not forced to do it. Picking a Liberal would be a bad idea, since the Speaker also rules on points of privilege, committee issues, etc., in addition to breaking ties.
The delaying idea is interesting. Any NDPer who does it would be totally vilified, but it'd be a pretty smart move on Clark's part if she wants to stay in power.
EDIT: Beaten by maharg!
TemplaerDude
Member
Stronach was power hungry and never interested in anything other than herself. I can't think of a single NDP bencher that has her deplorable attitude, nor anyone that doesn't hold their nose at the thought of working with Clark.
Ether_Snake
å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®
Who cares about Sheer? He won't beat Trudeau so why waste your breath over him?
The worst that can happen is a minority Trudeau government due to some new NDP head.
The worst that can happen is a minority Trudeau government due to some new NDP head.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
lol wow.
Could BC finally crack electoral reform and do something with a minority government that Trudeau couldn't do with a majority???
My worry is not so much 2019's election, but the one after that (2024?)
The Conservative party will eventually win another election, and I'd prefer Scheer not to be leader when it happens.
killer rin
Member
Can you say that with absolute 100% certainty though? Unless the answer is yes, its a cause for concern
Ah, good point there. I still have faith that this arrangement will work out though...for the sake of electoral reform I have to. I just want Clark to go far away and make tons of money in the private sector or whatever.
Remember that the Liberal Party went through two leaders (Dion, Ignatieff) before they got Trudeau and the PCs/Reform Party went through even more before they merged and got into power. We'll likely see something similar short of a major scandal or an NDP resurgence splitting the vote.
Unless Horgan and Weaver can entice some Liberal backbencher to stand for the speakership (or cross the floor), the new coalition can't pass legislation on its own. Any major movement like electoral reform would require the Liberals' support.
So, then there's no winning here and Clark retains power?
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