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Canadian PoliGAF - 42nd Parliament: Sunny Ways in Trudeaupia
- Thread starter matthewwhatever
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gutter_trash
Banned
CPC failed to garner any interest during this race among average Canadians, zero enthusiasm.
I just don't see any honeymoon momentum.
So uneventful and forgettable.
I just don't see any honeymoon momentum.
So uneventful and forgettable.
Expansion Pack
Member
Oh, in that case never mind. I thought I saw Signh without his turban once and thought maybe Sikhism wasn't super strict about that. Guess not.
matthewwhatever
Member
I saw somewhere else that said that Bernier's healthcare proposals were designed to win Quebec support. I have to admit that, as an Ontarian, I just don't get it. Could you explain the thinking a little more? Has Quebec's management of the QPP and immigration policy been such a rousing success hat you want to repeat it with healthcare? Is it all about devolution and respecting where the 1867 BNA Act said that healthcare was a provincial responsibilty? I honestly want to understand what makes Quebec so unlike the rest of the country on this issue.
If the CPC is at 8 percent in quebec according to Abacus while the NDP is at around 20 percent that means that the liberals are winning more people who voted for the CPC in 2015 in Quebec.then they are winning people who voted for the NDP in Quebec in 2015 . Could see the NDP still having around 2-6 seats in Quebec in 2019 if everything stays the same while the CPC possible ends up winning somewhere between 1-6 seats in Quebec if they are struggling to get past the low teens or drop below 10%.
gutter_trash
Banned
Now on the NDP,
Singh is a super smart, nice guy
but Québec is gonna Quebec.
Quebec's disdain for "other"" religions will be Singh's greatest handicap
Singh is a super smart, nice guy
but Québec is gonna Quebec.
Quebec's disdain for "other"" religions will be Singh's greatest handicap
p_xavier
Authorized Fister
For QPP it has been a resounding success through the CDPQ. Immigration too since most immigrants are speaking French. The QC government has among the lowest cost per user for health care in Canada. The Federal government acts like the "father" and wants to direct money and tell how much money it sends to the province. The QC people gets pissed off at this because it is seen as being patronizing as the QC government would manage its money better. All duplication of services have an enormous cost. Plus the "father knows best" attitude of the federal government is even more ridiculous because the territories have the lowest health care and education services in Canada.
Yep. I can still see the NDP winning a few seats in Quebec even if Singh ends up as their leader.The conservatives are going to end up getting well under 10 seats in Quebec in 2019 and may end up with zero by then.
You have 35-40% separatists who want all the federal powers, and another 15-20% nationalists who wants more power. So theorically, yes, it could get traction with a portion of the population. But not really because why would separatists vote for the CPC in the first place?
edit: Also what Phil-X said.
Anyway, most people have no idea how the healthcare system and/or separation of powers work so...
p_xavier
Authorized Fister
The conservatives were liked in the QC region because they respected the constitution and the provinces responsibilities.
gutter_trash
Banned
Confession: I have no idea how our healthcare system works
matthewwhatever
Member
The math checks out. Looking at the riding-by-riding results, it looks like the CPC have quite a few more safe seats than the NDP. Blaney, Deltell, Paul-Hus, Gourde, Godin, and Bernier all have pretty decent shots at re-election, whereas the NDP only seem to have 3 safe seats (Caron, Brosseau, and Boulerice), and 2 safe-ish seats (Saganash and Moore).
The Liberals won a lot of seats by slim margins too, but that was at 35% of the vote. The NDP in 2011 won all those Quebec seats with 43%. If the LPC gets 50%, then that's a red wave.
In a nutshell, via Angus Reid in April:
Sikhs are gaining acceptance in Quebec, but not nearly as much as they are in the rest of the country.
Interesting. Thanks! As someone who likes a strong central government, I don't agree with that, but at least now I understand it.
Leaving aside how social conservatism and ending public healthcare are not mutually exclusive concepts i.e. limiting abortion clinics via funding being anti-woman, trying to close safe-injection sites as an extension of hard-on crime policies, etc., opposition to the LGBTQ+ community sorely for existing and restricting a woman's autonomy are appalling, among other social conservative positions, but so is making healthcare a luxury rather than a right (and I include dental care since that's not currently covered by the federal government). That aside, it's pointless to debate whether Scheer or Bernier would have been worse when it comes to social issues since both have very socially conservative views.
Pancake Mix
Copied someone else's pancake recipe
See how Quebec does without funding from the rest of Canada. Quebec is the biggest recipient of health, social and general equalization payments.
Source: https://www.fin.gc.ca/fedprov/mtp-eng.asp
Also:
p_xavier
Authorized Fister
Another subject where the feds are hated is the Montreal REM, basically the SkyTrain version in Montreal. The QC government for the first time asked the feds to contribute to a transit project more than a year ago. Feds just started to study it; while non projects in Toronto, Ottawa and Calgary already have the funds secured without a business plan.
The QC proposed the idea of an Infrastructure Bank, feds find it a superb idea and decided to put it in... Toronto instead of Montréal. There wasn't basically any mention of it in the anglo newspapers while it was a frontpage scandal in QC.
p_xavier
Authorized Fister
The federal government is seen as incompetent so that's why most ministries are duplicated in QC, hence more equalization.
Pancake Mix
Copied someone else's pancake recipe
I doubt that's the reason, coming from the province that calls their assembly a national assembly.
p_xavier
Authorized Fister
Nation in French is not the same as in English. BTW I'm not from QC, I work in Montreal but live in Ontario, I just find the Anglo-centric thinking in this thread to be out of the track.
AuthenticM
Member
See how Quebec does without funding from the rest of Canada. Quebec is the biggest recipient of health, social and general equalization payments.
Source: https://www.fin.gc.ca/fedprov/mtp-eng.asp
Also:
Do we know how much money Québec sends to the Federal government each year?
p_xavier
Authorized Fister
Basically yes. The hate of religions is strong in QC. I have a question though, why does the ROC respect religious people so much? Knowning that there's no basis in science of such thoughts.
Paul Hus is probably screwed with a 15 percent Quebec swing towards the Liberals, but since he's an incumbent he probably has a slight advantage.Same with Godin. Deltell, Bernier and Gourde are definitely safe. Steve Blaney is definitely safe to. I think all of the NDP seats you listed probably won't swing at all to the Bloc and the Liberals if they are still polling around 20% in 2019. If the CPC ends up getting around 8% of the vote in Quebec in 2019 they are not winning past 5 seats in Quebec.
gutter_trash
Banned
As a Montrealer seeing how shitty our healthcare service is; The Provincial Government is THE incompetent one.
They have two doctors running the National Assembly but they can't get healthcare right.
Fuck our Province.
Provinces should be abolished
p_xavier
Authorized Fister
Have you gotten health care elsewhere in Canada? Sure emergencies suck in QC but when you are in the system it has the most comptent staff. I've lived in 4 provinces so my mind is much set about services.
AuthenticM
Member
p_xavier
Authorized Fister
About 25% of 298G$ in revenue.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Well, if not Singh, then it's Ashton... so lulz?
p_xavier
Authorized Fister
Well Ashton is a well known poutine fast food restaurant at least lol.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
"Vote for me, I'm like poutine!"
Orange Crush 2019.
Pancake Mix
Copied someone else's pancake recipe
In other words, the NDP is not in amazing shape for 2019, at least for growth.
If they can hold at ~44 seats though they can still be important though.
UberTag
Member
Well, that was fun... how long after 2019 do we get to enjoy the next marathon CPC leadership race with a bunch of underwhelming losers contending for the throne of Biggest Loser? And will they entertain the idea of charting a different path after Harper Jr. flames out? I mean, some of us would like to have an electable candidate outside of Trudeau to consider on election day.
(I say this as an O'Toole voter who helped give Harper Jr. the victory tonight over Mad Max.)
(I say this as an O'Toole voter who helped give Harper Jr. the victory tonight over Mad Max.)
gutter_trash
Banned
the one positive thing about Scheer is that he is one of the 13 Canadians who are banned from Russia.
So an anti-Putin leader is always welcome; as long as the like poutine
So an anti-Putin leader is always welcome; as long as the like poutine
matthewwhatever
Member
The answer to both of these questions: immigration policy. Over the past few decades, Canadian immigration policy has, generally speaking, been geared towards a) bringing in skilled immigrants, and b) family reunification. For a long time, this was weighted towards Western Europeans, especially from the UK, but since the 1970s it's shifted heavily to Asia. Because of this influx of people from diverse backgrounds and religions, I think most of Canada outside Quebec -- but mainly the big cities where immigrants and refugees settled -- has developed a fairly laissez faire attitude towards religion. If you're a Christian or agnostic/atheist, your neighbours could very easily be Sikh, Muslim, etc., so it's just easier to accept what people want to do rather than fight over it.
By contrast, Quebec's immigration policies have had a significant linguistic component, focusing on bringing in immigrants and refugees from places like Haiti and Northern Africa -- in other words, the goal has been bringing in French speakers. Setting aside centuries of history going back to the French Revolution and on through Duplessis and the Quiet Revolution (which, admittedly, are also factors!), I suspect that part of the reason Quebec has such general hostility towards religion is that immigration trends haven't forced them to act otherwise.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
...That's a long commute
Because Canada is a pluralistic, secular society and not an atheist society.
Besides, science is not necessarily anti-religion. Almost all of my PhD-level friends are Catholic...
I was gonna mention that, but perhaps he flies?
gutter_trash
Banned
firehawk12
Subete no aware
I know a professor who lives in Montreal and flies to Toronto and then drives to Guelph 3 days a week. That's some damn commute. lol
What the hell!? Why?!
You think that's crazy, I had a prof named George Elliot Clarke who is a somewhat well known poet that I still keep in touch with, he literally flies out to a different country/part of Canada every week in between his classes for one thing or another. I remember one class came in exhausted, having just got off a flight from London or something.
Yeah I had a prof at U of T this year who took the train in from Montreal every week. Academia is a harsh, painful career.
Pancake Mix
Copied someone else's pancake recipe
Protestant forms of Christianity and Roman Catholic Christianity can be very different. Might be the cause of the disconnect there since Quebec was overwhelmingly Catholic originally, while the rest of Canada was not.
Newfoundland and Labrador still have Orangemen's Day as a provincial holiday.
Edit: Also what mlclmtckr said below
Um respecting people regardless of their religious beliefs is generally considered the decent way to behave. That's not an roc thing it's just a polite adult society thing.
gutter_trash
Banned
Quebec hates religion because a mother in the past had to pop 12 babies out becaue the priest scolded her that she isn't being fruitful enough... in the 1950s and 60s
Quebec then said fuck you to religion in the Hippie Era and did a 180 from being devout Catholics who made lots of babies to being Atheists who make no more babies
Quebec then said fuck you to religion in the Hippie Era and did a 180 from being devout Catholics who made lots of babies to being Atheists who make no more babies
eBay Huckster
Member
so i just saw that Scheer won
which means Trudeau's the only one of the three current major-party leaders I don't have a picture with from my internship on the Hill forever ago
which means Trudeau's the only one of the three current major-party leaders I don't have a picture with from my internship on the Hill forever ago
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Wow, you took a course with Clarke? That must have been really cool.
Wow, he must have some crazy frequent flier points
Yeah, pretty much. lol
I didn't really ask though, but I assume his family just settled in Montreal when he got this job, so he decided to fly in rather than move. I guess at that point the flights are tax deductible or something, because I can't imagine the university covering his transportation costs.
p_xavier
Authorized Fister
Alexandria. I have a pied à terre in Montréal though. It's about an hour train ride to work. I mostly use my loft for parties or meeting clients.
AuthenticM
Member
Québec loathes religion because of hundreds of years of cultural suffocation at the hands of the Catholic Church. Public secularism has been injected in Québec's culture by the Quiet Revolution, and any Public Display of Religion evokes a deep malaise in the Québécois. Female muslims and male sikhs happen to bring about this more often than other groups of religious people, because of their beliefs demanding certain very visible clothing. But make no mistake, they aren't the only ones.
One of the original instigating events of the public debate on reasonable accomodations (which lead to the PQ's Charter of Values a decade later), was the mayor of Saguenay, Jean Tremblay, who did catholic prayers before public reunions. Mouvement laïque québécois brought him to court on behalf of a Saguenay resident. It went all the way to the Supreme Court, and the Court (rightfully) sided with them. Tremblay was then forced to stop that shit.
You can read the Supreme Court's decision here.
One of the original instigating events of the public debate on reasonable accomodations (which lead to the PQ's Charter of Values a decade later), was the mayor of Saguenay, Jean Tremblay, who did catholic prayers before public reunions. Mouvement laïque québécois brought him to court on behalf of a Saguenay resident. It went all the way to the Supreme Court, and the Court (rightfully) sided with them. Tremblay was then forced to stop that shit.
You can read the Supreme Court's decision here.
Silent Chief
Member
I really don't think so. Quebec has its share of minority politicians, especially on the provincial scene. They all speak perfect French.
It comes down to his mastery of the French language.
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