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[TheUntamedLegend]

Why do you keep ignoring everyone telling you it's not supposed to be a joke?

Yes it is, it is black comedy.
Humor derived from morbid or "off-limits" subject matter.

 

[The Technomancer]

So to summarize, satire should be funny, not require any additional context to understand, explain all the concepts presented therein and what should be felt about them and only use concepts which are agreed upon by literally everyone.

It doesn't have to be funny, but it does have to be distinguishable from the thing its satirizing. You could run this in an a blatantly xenophobic newsletter and no-one reading it would bat an eye

 

[Real Hero]

Do you understand satire? Me walking around with a shirt saying "the holocaust was okay" is not satire no matter how much I don't really mean it

You really don't get it if you think that's the same

 

[GhostTrick]

Do you understand satire? Me walking around with a shirt saying "the holocaust was okay" is not satire no matter how much I don't really mean it

Political satire is about context:
http://www.english.rfi.fr/africa/20150907-french-mayor-says-only-wants-christian-refugees

You walking with that shirt saying "the holocaust was okay" makes no sense. Now if you did that with context, it would have another meaning. For exemple, if a political said "slavery was okay", it would be stupid. And to show how stupid it is, you would make fun of it by wearing your "holocaust was okay" shirt.

It doesn't have to be funny, but it does have to be distinguishable from the thing its satirizing. You could run this in an a blatantly xenophobic newsletter and no-one reading it would bat an eye

Then again, it's about context. If you had an extreme right french magazine, like Minute, with this drawing, it would be racist, because we know their past work, we know the opinion of their writers. Charlie Hebdo is a left/extreme left one.

 

[BaronLundi]

My French fellow countrymen, I am now officially afraid that (USA) GAF ever discovers Desproges.

Maybe I should post the "I've been told that some Jews snuck into the audience" sketch to blow some minds.

Oh, here it is, with English subtitles to boot!

http://www.wat.tv/video/pierre-desproges-jews-english-xngk_2frhb_.html

 

[daviyoung]

It doesn't have to be funny, but it does have to be distinguishable from the thing its satirizing. The fact that you could run this in an a blatantly xenophobic newsletter and no-one reading it would bat an eye is telling

now you're asking for humour to be sanitised to the point that everyone gets it

no thanks, it's not a marketable product

 

[trembli0s]

is this "outrage culture: the thread" ?

Spot on, I'd say.

Kind of sad reading the first two pages.

 

[Siegcram]

It doesn't have to be funny, but it does have to be distinguishable from the thing its satirizing. You could run this in an a blatantly xenophobic newsletter and no-one reading it would bat an eye

Literally shouting "That's the point!" at my screen right now.

 

[MUnited83]

From everything I've seen and heard this isn't extrapolation, this actually reflects what a not insignificant number of people think right now. That's why it doesn't seem particularly funny, because it doesn't seem to be exaggerating

Welcome to satire.

 

[dakun]

as usual satire will be misunderstood and targeted.. you can be a religious fanatic, a liberal, conservative etc. it doesn't matter.

I don't get how anyone can not understand the point that picture was trying to make the second they saw it.. but then again i love satire.

 

[paradise_circus]

For anyone wondering, I pretty sure that reads "We are here for you" or something of that nature. or not. I can't read french. I'm a bad canadian.

I think you can translate it as: You are/arrived at home!

My french est terrible, though.

 

[SummitAve]

ITT, Gaffers sink.

 

[kirblar]

Do you understand satire? Me walking around with a shirt saying "the holocaust was okay" is not satire no matter how much I don't really mean it

Stop. Please stop.

Look at the strip. Look at what it's juxtaposing. Look at what it's highlighting (the "who cares?" reaction to a kid dying.)

This cartoon is not endorsing letting kids die. It is putting Europe on blast for being ok with it.

 

[echoshifting]

It doesn't have to be funny, but it does have to be distinguishable from the thing its satirizing. You could run this in an a blatantly xenophobic newsletter and no-one reading it would bat an eye

I'm not sure this is true. A lot of conservative people watched The Colbert Report unironically, for instance.

 

[Empty]

political cartooning is universally profoundly unfunny but the efforts many people on the left go to wilfully misunderstand and misrepresent charlie hebdo cartoons as some kind of ultra-racist right wing trash instead of a bit vulgar (but no so much more than the revered louis ck) left wing mag making fun of french establishment and public almost as if to imply 'well they sort of deserved it' is really really annoying

 

[Jonnax]

I get that it's shocking. But I don't see how people can go out to condemn this when its message is very applicable to current events in terms of how Hungary said they'd only accept Christian Syrians because of the Ottoman Empire.

But I guess this is ripe for internet controversy.

 

[patapuf]

It doesn't have to be funny, but it does have to be distinguishable from the thing its satirizing. You could run this in an a blatantly xenophobic newsletter and no-one reading it would bat an eye

You are willfully interpreting a racist agenda upon an strongly left-wing satirical magazine ignoring all local political context and the context of the magazine itself because you haven't actually read it (or correct me if i'm wrong).

If you remove all context it's piss easy to misrepresent something, who'd have thought?

 

[TS-08]

I'm not sure this is true. A lot of conservative people watched The Colbert Report unironically, for instance.

Or believe Onion articles are true.

 

[RionaaM]

My first reaction: it's taking a shot at the piss poor response to the refugee crisis by "Christian" nations, not making a joke at the expense of a dead toddler

I thought the same just by reading the quote in the OP, without seeing the cartoon (I block images on GAF when at work). It read like extremely dark satire, and going by other people's posts in this thread that's exactly what it is. It's not making fun of Muslim immigrants or dead kids, it's highlighting the injustice of their current situation.

 

[Surface of Me]

It doesn't have to be funny, but it does have to be distinguishable from the thing its satirizing. You could run this in an a blatantly xenophobic newsletter and no-one reading it would bat an eye

That's always been a risk with satirical and absurdist humor, that the side you are mocking thinks you are praising them. There isn't a way around it, that's just how this stuff works. You dont get it, take the L.

 

[temp]

What the hell is the endgame of this thread?

 

[Jebusman]

It doesn't have to be funny, but it does have to be distinguishable from the thing its satirizing. The fact that you could run this in an a blatantly xenophobic newsletter and no-one reading it would bat an eye is telling

NO IT DOESN'T

THAT IS THE ULTIMATE BEAUTY OF SATIRE. THE CLOSER YOU CAN GET TO THE SUBJECT MATTER, THE MORE THAT SHIT BURNS YOUR SOUL.

The context, the thing that lets you "distinguish" it from real opinion, is the fact that it came from a satirical magazine.

Honest question, where are you from?

If you spent any time in Canada, or spent a lot of time watching Royal Canadian Air Farce and/or This Hour Has 22 Minutes, satire would not be a foreign concept.

 

[Corronchilejano]

political cartoony is universally profoundly unfunny but the efforts many people on the left go to wilfully misunderstand charlie hebdo cartoons as some kind of ultra-racist right wing trash instead of a bit vulgar (but no so much more than the revered louis ck) left wing mag making fun of french establishment and public almost as if to imply 'well they sort of deserved it' is really annoying

Literally no one has made this point in this thread.

 

[SliceSabre]

I want to believe that there is a deeper message here and they aren't being vile just for the sake of being shocking, but the surface level view is so vile I don't desire to look deeper.

 

[Thorgal]

The Technomancer
Satire is a completely foreign concept to me .

 

[entremet]

Great cartoon. I'm shocked that it totally went over the heads of so many.

 

[samn]

So we've got people that cant be bothered to do any interpretation or analysis squealing about how awful these cartoons are. Make an effort to understand what they are saying, THEN complain.

I'm hardly the biggest clever clogs around but even I figured out the point of the cartoon after a quick visit to google translate.

If Jonathan Swift was around today you'd all be aghast that he was promoting eating Irish babies, then once you had his essay explained to you, you'd be inventing other reasons for why it's awful. 'English people might take it seriously and eat our children!' or 'Maybe it does have a point but the surface level view is so upsetting why should I look any deeper!'

 

[Surface of Me]

What the hell is the endgame of this thread?

I think OP is trying to redefine satire.

I want to believe that there is a deeper message here and they aren't being vile just for the sake of being shocking, but the surface level view is so vile I don't desire to look deeper.

"Im so offended that thinking is too hard!"

Nevermind it's been explained probably a hundred times in this thread.

 

[SURGEdude]

Disgusting magazine does another disgusting thing

And they have every right

Pretty much. And I'm willing to cut a lot of slack to people like Louis CK and others because it's usually actually funny and not mean spirited. But this to fail both those criteria.


Edit: and yes I'm aware of what they were trying to say. Maybe it just isn't an angle I can appreciate or something. But I'm not gonna lose sleep or have people stripped of speech because I thought a certain bit of satire wasn't compelling.

 

[PatThePassive]

It doesn't have to be funny, but it does have to be distinguishable from the thing its satirizing. You could run this in an a blatantly xenophobic newsletter and no-one reading it would bat an eye

But The fact that xenophobic people wouldn't see anything wrong with it is the point.

Its for others to see the radical xenophobes beliefs.

 

[trembli0s]

I want to believe that there is a deeper message here and they aren't being vile just for the sake of being shocking, but the surface level view is so vile I don't desire to look deeper.

That's a shocking viewpoint. You'd rather assume that a cartoon that conveys satire doesn't portray something other than the shocking content on its face? Maybe, I dunno, pointing a critical finger toward certain segments?

 

[Mudcrab]

Oh I get it! The Technomancer's posts are actually satire and we are the ones who are, in fact, not understanding it.

 

[echoshifting]

Oh I get it! The Technomancer's posts are actually satire and we are the ones who are, in fact, not understanding it.

Mind blown

 

[KHarvey16]

I want to believe that there is a deeper message here and they aren't being vile just for the sake of being shocking, but the surface level view is so vile I don't desire to look deeper.

Embarrassing. I'm literally in pain reading this and the current back and forth. Where do you people come from and are there more of you? We need to stop whatever this deficiency is at the source before it spreads.

 

[TheUntamedLegend]

It doesn't have to be funny, but it does have to be distinguishable from the thing its satirizing. You could run this in an a blatantly xenophobic newsletter and no-one reading it would bat an eye

No it does not, and sometimes it cannot.
It is a phenomenon referred to as Poe's Law

 

[kirblar]

This cartoon isn't funny in the least. It's not supposed to be.

 

[The Technomancer]

NO IT DOESN'T

THAT IS THE ULTIMATE BEAUTY OF SATIRE. THE CLOSER YOU CAN GET TO THE SUBJECT MATTER, THE MORE THAT SHIT BURNS YOUR SOUL.

The context, the thing that lets you "distinguish" it from real opinion, is the fact that it came from a satirical magazine.

Honest question, where are you from?

If you spent any time in Canada, or spent a lot of time watching Royal Canadian Air Farce and/or This Hour Has 22 Minutes, satire would not be a foreign concept.

It literally does. If its indistinguishable than its, by definition, not satire, its just the thing. Just making something awful that no-one can tell isn't supposed to be sincere isn't insightful

 

[Moze]

Am i missing something? This cartoon is good. Why are people so against it in here?

It's an attack on Europeans and their treatment of outsiders.

 

[freenudemacusers]

Brb opening a kickstarter for a line of "technomancer gets satire" tshirts

 

[Barbacoatl]

What the hell is the endgame of this thread?

Political and social sciences aren't actually sciences.

 

[EdibleExplosives]

Technomancer, is this you?

 

[More Fun To Compute]

The two for one deal seems like a reference to smugglers offering deals where children went for free with parents. Obviously there are very many disgusting examples of human behaviour around at the moment and it isn't the job of satire to stare helpless at the scene with doe eyes.

 

[Real Hero]

I want The Technomancer to start watching south park. Imagine the thread potential.

 

[daviyoung]

It literally does. If its indistinguishable than its, by definition, not satire, its just the thing. Just making something awful that no-one can tell isn't supposed to be sincere isn't insightful

you realise the thing here is that Christians can walk on water, which proves that Europe is Christian?

have you lost the plot?

 

[Siegcram]

It literally does. If its indistinguishable than its, by definition, not satire, its just the thing. Just making something awful that no-one can tell isn't supposed to be sincere isn't insightful

It's weird how every fucking person in here can tell, then.

 

[GhostTrick]

It literally does. If its indistinguishable than its, by definition, not satire, its just the thing. Just making something awful that no-one can tell isn't supposed to be sincere isn't insightful

You can't tell because you lack context. That's all. To understand it, you need to have heard about that mayor claiming to select migrants only if they are truly christians and not muslims becuase there might have terrorists hiding. You also need to know the journal history in term of political preferences, same for the cartoonist.

 

[railGUN]

Guys, this is the internet. There is literally no way to change someone's mind once it is made up.

 

[The Technomancer]

I want The Technomancer to start watching south park. Imagine the thread potential.

South Park is often excellent satire because contained within the text you can actually glean the writers actual viewpoints and how they contrast with the surface level expression.

 

[cackhyena]

Am i missing something? This cartoon is good. Why are people so against it in here?

It's an attack on Europeans and their treatment of outsiders.

I thought it was tacky at first. I've come around.

 

[M0nochromatic]

If you think Charlie Hebdo is right wing racist trash, what is The Onion and Colbert report?