Support NeoGAF

[Zakalwe]

Man could sell a snake its freshly-shed skin. Takes a lot of personal impetus (if you don't want to call it charisma) to do that.

Blair is one of the most charismatic leaders we've had in the last 50 years. Polling of working class voters who vote Tory now (and I'd under thatcher), show they *still* think he was the best Labour leader we've had.

Maybe it didn't work on you, but Tony Blair was absolutely charismatic. In person it's like being hit by a spotlight as well.

I must be immune to his particular abilities. He's never done anything but make my skin crawl.

Blair developing spontaneous Alzheimer's in 3....2....1....

This is an impressive combo chain, brain damage is probably a given.

 

[Polari]

Remember all those anti-war marches?

Fucking fat lot of good they did.

I disagree. It's possible there would have never been the demand for a report like this without them.

Also, if Tony Blair isn't a war criminal I don't know who is. Deliberately misled the public and instigated an illegal war which resulted in the deaths of hundreds of thousands, if not millions.

 

[finley83]

Holy shit Chilcot isn't pulling any punches here.

 

[Jezbollah]

"military action in Iraq may have been necessary at some point, but in March 2003 there was no imminent threat from Saddam Hussein"

 

[nOoblet16]

I disagree. It's possible there would have never been the demand for a report like this without them.

Also, if Tony Blair isn't a war criminal I don't know who is. Deliberately misled the public and instigated an illegal war which resulted in the deaths of hundreds of thousands, if not millions.

Corbyn must be smiling right now

 

[Jezbollah]

http://www.iraqinquiry.org.uk/

DOWNLOAD THE REPORT HERE ^^ (adding to OP)

 

[KarneeKarnay]

Blair is going to get away with it.

It's always "Overestimating", "Underestimating". Those word don't place blame. They make it sound like a mistake or accident.

My cousin being severely wounded and losing the rest of his mates to an IED is not a mistake. This didn't have to be there. Blair made it so they would and he is going to get away with it.

 

[WhateverItTakes]

Dude on BBC saying it was only the soldiers and civilians in Iraq the come out with any credit. UK government as a whole has been a shambles for a while then. Hopefully we can learn from these mistakes. Or else what's the bloody point?

 

[Maledict]

Corbyn must be smiling right now

So are a vast amount of other people. I don't really see how this benefits Corbyn.

This is publicly confirming what the country already felt. He gets credit for being right, but so do a lot of people.

I dunno, I just don't see this moving the needle much. For the type of person to whom this matters a lot I think a lot of them have already made up their mind about Corbyn one way or the other, and for the floating Centre ground voter I think Blair is ancient history that doesn't impact on current political turmoils.

 

[Nikodemos]

Blair is going to get away with it.

It's always "Overestimating", "Underestimating". Those word don't place blame. They make it sound like a mistake or accident.

My cousin being severely wounded and losing the rest of his mates to an IED is not a mistake. This didn't have to be there. Blair made it so they would and he is going to get away with it.

Well, an official report isn't going to go all "Yo, dis mo'fucka oughtta be in irons". It's all in the way this is worded.

 

[klonere]

I disagree. It's possible there would have never been the demand for a report like this without them.

Also, if Tony Blair isn't a war criminal I don't know who is. Deliberately misled the public and instigated an illegal war which resulted in the deaths of hundreds of thousands, if not millions.

Yes, a report that stated in plain terms stuff that we all knew the moment the war was floated, hence why the marches took place. A report that took 7 years. A report that is going to have exactly zero consequences for the people it points the finger at.

Much like all the post-financial crisis handwringing and the unprecedented Occupy movement, naught will happen and the song will remain the same. It's a rigged fucking game.

 

[JonathanEx]

Guardian's take:

MoD left UK forces in Iraq ill-equipped amid lack of plan, Chilcot report says
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...-of-plan-chilcot-report-says?CMP=share_btn_tw

Spy agencies 'produced flawed information on Saddam's WMDs'
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...ion-saddam-wmds-iraq-chilcot?CMP=share_btn_tw


Also, the Blair/Bush infamous memo:
https://twitter.com/bbcbreaking/status/750639455678173184

 

[uncleniccius]

Not defending it, but the not extinguishing options and lack of foresight are pretty common. Libya is another example of acting whilst peaceful options remained.

 

[ferrasvansen]

Corbyn must be smiling right now

Given the current state of the country and the Labour party, Corbyn should not be smiling. This report clearly says lessons must be learned and none of these mistakes should happen again, it is not a matter for gloating or saying i told you so.

 

[twobear]

PLP to recommend Ted for new leader following the Chilcot Report. Ted was a handyman at the Labour Party offices, and was the only person working in the building at the time not actually involved in the run up to the Iraq War. The PLP is very hopeful about Ted's chances and dismisses any concerns about his electability.

 

[nOoblet16]

Why does the hard copy of the report cost £767, when the report is free to download online ?

That is a huge discrepancy and why would they be trying to profit off a public report by such a margin?

 

[Maledict]

The memo is interesting - Blair even references the Arab street rising up. It reads to me like he knew that this was a mistake going in, overestimated the impact he could make on American policy making, but felt the UK had no option but to back America.

 

[CCS]

Why does the hard copy of the report cost £767, when the report is free to download online ?

That is a huge discrepancy and why would they be trying to profit off a public report by such a margin?

Because it costs a lot to print I imagine.

It is enormous.

 

[unpopularblargh]

I hope this stops people from deciding for war in the future whenever there is another debate in the parliament, rather than dismiss the concerns and claim going to war will bring peace.

I'm so glad Obama was able to make a deal with Iran. He basically negated every right-wing thought experiment of "we need to get them before they get us" through policy.

 

[norinrad]

Tony and his pal Dubya will be free tomorrow having a BBQ, in an ideal world both would be joining the other murderers in prison but they have powerful friends so they will get away with it.

 

[Meadows]

Why does the hard copy of the report cost £767, when the report is free to download online ?

That is a huge discrepancy and why would they be trying to profit off a public report by such a margin?

It's 2.6m words

 

[Meadows]

The memo is interesting - Blair even references the Arab street rising up. It reads to me like he knew that this was a mistake going in, overestimated the impact he could make on American policy making, but felt the UK had no option but to back America.

Even though nobody wanted war here, or in Europe.

So instead of backing down he created a lie to scare the country into joining the war. This is a disgrace.

 

[klonere]

You could make a a similar movie to The Big Short on this and end on the exact same "Nothing changed lol" stinger.

Fucking disgraceful.

 

[2700]

Why does the hard copy of the report cost £767, when the report is free to download online ?

That is a huge discrepancy and why would they be trying to profit off a public report by such a margin?

The report is 2.6m words in length, that costs a lot of money to print and bind. The families of soldiers who died in Iraq receive a copy for free.

 

[the_milkybar_kid]

 

[SlipperyFishes]

Why does the hard copy of the report cost £767, when the report is free to download online ?

That is a huge discrepancy and why would they be trying to profit off a public report by such a margin?

12 volumes, 2.6 million words. Money doesn't grow on trees (but they sure print it)

 

[Zakalwe]

"Tony Blair"

"War Criminal"

 

[nOoblet16]

It's 2.6m words

12 volumes, 2.6 million words. Money doesn't grow on trees (but they sure print it)

I can probably print the entire thing for £350 using my university laser printers available for students in the library. Granted it doesn't include the binding etc (which can't be worth £400). It costs 5P for one page.

Cost to print in an industrial printer would certainly be less than a university library printer.

 

[mclem]

Brix are being shat.

Brixit?

 

[Hazzuh]

Picture of the report lol:

 

[SlipperyFishes]

I can print 7000 pages for £350 using my university laser printers available for students in the library. Granted it doesn't include the binding etc (which can't be worth £400).

Cost to print in a printing press would certainly be less than a university library printer.

Well there you go, you can do that too! Now lets get back to the real important parts of the Chilcot Report, not the cost and LOE to print it for your personal collection.

 

[Doopliss]

Perspective on its length:

 

[twobear]

I can print 7000 pages for £350 using my university laser printers available for students in the library. Granted it doesn't include the binding etc (which can't be worth £400).

Cost to print in a printing press would certainly be less than a university library printer.

I just ran the numbers through a thesis binding service and came out at £733 for a 7000 page document divided into 12 hard bound copies.

[edit] £625 for soft-bound

 

[oti]

Holy shit some reporter just asked a father: "Did your son die in vain?" From iTV or something.

 

[Jezbollah]

Tony Blair "I will take full responsibility for any mistakes without exception or excuse"

 

[Juicy Bob]

Fuck me that's thorough.

Appropriately so, mind.

 

[JonathanEx]

Statement from Rt Hon Tony Blair on Chilcot Report

Responding to the publication of the Chilcot Report Mr Blair said:

“The report should lay to rest allegations of bad faith, lies or deceit. Whether people agree or disagree with my decision to take military action against Saddam Hussein; I took it in good faith and in what I believed to be the best interests of the country.

I note that the report finds clearly:

- That there was no falsification or improper use of Intelligence (para 876 vol 4)

- No deception of Cabinet (para 953 vol 5)

- No secret commitment to war whether at Crawford Texas in April 2002 or elsewhere (para 572 onwards vol 1)

The inquiry does not make a finding on the legal basis for military action but finds that the Attorney General had concluded there was such a lawful basis by 13th March 2003 (para 933 vol 5)

However the report does make real and material criticisms of preparation, planning, process and of the relationship with the United States.

These are serious criticisms and they require serious answers.

I will respond in detail to them later this afternoon.

I will take full responsibility for any mistakes without exception or excuse.

I will at the same time say why, nonetheless, I believe that it was better to remove Saddam Hussein and why I do not believe this is the cause of the terrorism we see today whether in the Middle East or elsewhere in the world.

Above all I will pay tribute to our Armed Forces. I will express my profound regret at the loss of life and the grief it has caused the families, and I will set out the lessons I believe future leaders can learn from my experience.”

ENDS

http://www.tonyblairoffice.org/news/entry/statement-from-tony-blair-on-chilcot-report/

 

[Jezbollah]

Thanks Jonathan - I'll add that to the OP

 

[Hazzuh]

Seems like Chilcot makes clear that the Commons and even in some ways the cabinet were misled and kept in the dark. Almost inconceivable war would have happened in the way it did in Iraq with a different PM.

 

[BanGy.nz]

The executive summary is 150 pages! Beast of a report.

 

[Lashley]

It's a shame he won't be punished

 

[tomtom94]

Blair's response is basically "no u"

 

[Juicy Bob]

Blair was so in love with the idea of helping Bush remove Saddam that he did anything he could to make it happen.

 

[nOoblet16]

Tony Blair "I will take full responsibility for any mistakes without exception or excuse"

"mistakes"

 

[Roberto Larcos]

Looks I've got some new summer reading.

 

[Jackpot]

Pretty much what I expected.

Confirms the general assessment of the war but no smoking gun. "not established beyond doubt", "far from satisfactory". weaksauce. It took 7 years for that?

 

[tomtom94]

"mistakes"

Reminds me of Brown's infamous "I take full responsibility. That's why the person responsible has been fired."

 

[Palette Swap]

It's a shame he won't be punished

No one will ever get punished for this unilateral fuck up of incredible proportions.
At least, it's good that there's a will to inquire into it.

 

[Juicy Bob]

Just an extract from a speech by Robin Cook MP, 17 March 2003:

"The reality is that Britain is being asked to embark on a war without agreement in any of the international bodies of which we are a leading partner - not NATO, not the European Union and, now, not the Security Council.

To end up in such diplomatic weakness is a serious reverse.

Only a year ago, we and the United States were part of a coalition against terrorism that was wider and more diverse than I would ever have imagined possible.

History will be astonished at the diplomatic miscalculations that led so quickly to the disintegration of that powerful coalition.

The US can afford to go it alone, but Britain is not a superpower.

Our interests are best protected not by unilateral action but by multilateral agreement and a world order governed by rules.

Yet tonight the international partnerships most important to us are weakened: the European Union is divided; the Security Council is in stalemate.

Those are heavy casualties of a war in which a shot has yet to be fired.

I have heard some parallels between military action in these circumstances and the military action that we took in Kosovo. There was no doubt about the multilateral support that we had for the action that we took in Kosovo.

It was supported by NATO; it was supported by the European Union; it was supported by every single one of the seven neighbours in the region. France and Germany were our active allies.

It is precisely because we have none of that support in this case that it was all the more important to get agreement in the Security Council as the last hope of demonstrating international agreement.

The legal basis for our action in Kosovo was the need to respond to an urgent and compelling humanitarian crisis.

Our difficulty in getting support this time is that neither the international community nor the British public is persuaded that there is an urgent and compelling reason for this military action in Iraq.

The threshold for war should always be high.

None of us can predict the death toll of civilians from the forthcoming bombardment of Iraq, but the US warning of a bombing campaign that will "shock and awe" makes it likely that casualties will be numbered at least in the thousands."

 

[ruttyboy]

"I will take full responsibility for any mistakes without exception or excuse."

So 'responsibility' will be what in reality, some stern looks at the millionaire's club?