Clinton: Trump supporters in "the basket of deplorables" ie - racist, homophobic, etc

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Kyzer said:
None of that has an objective correlation to racism or bigotry. Look im not saying there arent a bunch of racists and bigots supporting Trump, of course there are, obviously. David Duke and all his supporters. im saying how utterly retarded and unprofessional (unacceptable) it is for her to say that thats what they are.
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http://gawker.com/poll-everybodys-racist-but-donald-trump-supporters-are-1782807497

Donald Trump begins political career by popularizing openly racist conspiracy theory. Donald Trump begins official presidential campaign by arguing Mexicans are rapists and murderers. Donald Trump proposes ban on an entire fucking religion. Donald Trump argues Indiana judge is unfit to do job because Mexican. Donald Trump hires white nationalist hack to spearhead flagging campaign.

Ostriches
closet racists
: How can you argue that racism exists here, that's just utterly retarded

edit: banned already, lol. you would figure they would be more subtle
 
Messofanego said:
You keep on contradicting yourself. You agree that a significant percentage of Trump supporters are bigots, then you want objective facts that they are even when figures have been shown to you and now you're confused about how you qualify someone as objectively racist. All over the place.
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Precisely.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/26/obama-muslim_n_1706522.html

17 Percent Of Registered Voters Think Obama Is Muslim, Pew Poll Finds
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http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/08/24/what-americans-want-to-do-about-illegal-immigration/

Republicans were divided: 49% wanted to leave the Constitution as it is, while 47% favored a constitutional amendment to bar birthright citizenship.
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I could probably dig up more that show about 20% of America holding pretty clearly racist or bigoted beliefs about things.

People need to remember that bigotry doesn't require hate. It's just believing that one group is inferior or bad. That's bigotry. You don't have to hate that group, just think that based on their gender / religion / sexuality / whatever that they are inferior to you.
 
I much prefer that type of talk from Clinton's camp than the more accommodating tone we should have to take with the type of people who make up Trump's base.

Quite frankly if we have the election and Trump's support is enough to put him as the most powerful man in the US I'd just have to accept that he would he the face of what the majority of America feels like.

But then I'd feel a lot of sympathy for those who are less fortunate than me and see things like the police shootings as the only way to fight back. If America collectively decides Trump as the way forward you want to convince those oppressed that peace is going to be the way forward? Nah.
 
plagiarize said:
Precisely.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/26/obama-muslim_n_1706522.html



http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/08/24/what-americans-want-to-do-about-illegal-immigration/



I could probably dig up more that show about 20% of America holding pretty clearly racist or bigoted beliefs about things.

People need to remember that bigotry doesn't require hate. It's just believing that one group is inferior or bad. That's bigotry. You don't have to hate that group, just think that based on their gender / religion / sexuality / whatever that they are inferior to you.
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I posted one yesterday too:

miCScr8.png
 
kmfdmpig said:
I'm on board with thinking many Trump supporters are indeed deplorable and hold deplorable views. I think it's perfectly valid to think that.

I don't think there's a political gain from verbalizing it. To me is strikes me as similar to Romney's 47% comment, although with more vitriol. People, rightly, saw that his comment was going to hurt his campaign a bit. I doubt this particularly hurts Hillary, but it is more likely to have a slightly negative effect than a positive effect. The idea that attacking large groups of people will shame them to change seems unlikely to me. Most people get defensive or angry when they feel attacked rather than step back and examine themselves.

A better approach, I think, would be for Hillary to address these types of issues after the election as a way to try to reunify/heal.
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I think there are a few important differences here. Now, like I've said, I think this can hurt Clinton a lot if she apologizes for it instead of doubling down. The problem for Romney was that doubling down was never an option. He needed that 47%. A huge chunk of that was already going to vote for him. He was exposed disrespecting the poor and unemployed behind closed doors with other rich people. Obama's main attack on Romney was that he was a rich person out to only serve rich people. And here's Romney saying that almost half of the country and half of his own base are leeches and so fuck 'em. It was a big problem for Romney that he did not seem to understand that Democrats were not guaranteed the vote of people paying no income tax - he was factually wrong and that hurt a lot.

Clinton doesn't need half of Trump's supporters. She's very clear that she's not talking about anyone who might be persuaded to vote for her. She's clear that half of Trump supporters have sympathetic and possibly good reasons for wanting to shake things up. Nobody can stand up and say that Clinton is both clearly talking about them and clearly wrong, and Democrats can make a pretty strong case that what Clinton said is essentially true.

This is substantially less damaging than even Obama's bitter clingers comment because she's not even being condescending to the people whose votes she actually wants. It's entirely consistent with Clinton's main line of attack on Trump - that he is a crazy bigot.
 
While I agree with her, she shouldn't say this. All it's going to do is enrage the other side further and not do anything for her supporters. Who approved her to say this shit?
 
witness said:
While I agree with her, she shouldn't say this. All it's going to do is enrage the other side further and not do anything for her supporters. Who approved her to say this shit?
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That is what so fucking wrong with America, folks are so scared of offending bigots that you can't call them out on shit.

They say and do bigot shit, but actually calling them a bigot is a bigger offense than them doing bigot shit. It blows my mind
 
Officerrob said:
She's not wrong, but probably not smart to say
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I think it needs to be said over and over and over. I'm going to be incredibly upset if after this election is over, no one looks back to his campaign and point out how disgusting it truly was. I want Trump's campaign to be taught as the hate mongering campaign that it is.
 
Gotchaye said:
I think there are a few important differences here. Now, like I've said, I think this can hurt Clinton a lot if she apologizes for it instead of doubling down. The problem for Romney was that doubling down was never an option. He needed that 47%. A huge chunk of that was already going to vote for him. He was exposed disrespecting the poor and unemployed behind closed doors with other rich people. Obama's main attack on Romney was that he was a rich person out to only serve rich people. And here's Romney saying that almost half of the country and half of his own base are leeches and so fuck 'em. It was a big problem for Romney that he did not seem to understand that Democrats were not guaranteed the vote of people paying no income tax - he was factually wrong and that hurt a lot.

Clinton doesn't need half of Trump's supporters. She's very clear that she's not talking about anyone who might be persuaded to vote for her. She's clear that half of Trump supporters have sympathetic and possibly good reasons for wanting to shake things up. Nobody can stand up and say that Clinton is both clearly talking about them and clearly wrong, and Democrats can make a pretty strong case that what Clinton said is essentially true.
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I hope she doesn't back down. It'll show a sign of weakness and untruthfulness on her part. Trump and Hillary supporters know that she is not far from the truth. My neighbor who is voting for him said that mostly racist whites are voting for him. Granted, he's not the end all be all as it pertains to this information but it's telling that he said that to me. He's a white man that's somewhat racist in his ideals of brown people. We talk every now and then about this election and he has opened my eyes to how some people think.
 
There's a simple way to not be associated with racists and sexists and bigots, don't vote for the racist misogynist buffoon with a bigoted platform and a bigoted running mate, and a campaign run by a white nationalist being coached by a serial sexual harasser, who constantly spouts sexist, racist, bigoted bullshit.

I like that she just came right out and said it, since everyone else seems to just want to tiptoe around it.

The people who it will offend are already in the basket of deplorables. Or can't figure out which basket they're in (so they're probably in the bad one.)
 
shinra-bansho said:
There's a simple way to not be associated with racists and sexists and bigots, don't vote for the racist misogynist buffoon with a bigoted platform and a bigoted running mate, and a campaign run by a white nationalist being coached by a serial sexual harasser, who constantly spouts sexist, racist, bigoted bullshit.

I like that she just came right out and said it, since everyone else seems to just want to tiptoe around it.

The people who it will offend are already in the basket. Or can't figure out which basket they're in (so they're probably in the bad one.)
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Telling the truth and shaming the devil
 
You can't support Donald Trump and find yourself exempt from the racism/xenophobia he launched his campaign with, nor his bitherism he's never apologized for, and you can't claim to not be homophobic when Pence is his VP and Trump himself says he would "strongly consider" electing justices who could overturn same-sex marriage.

I think people should be less offended by some perceived rudeness, and instead be constantly and consistently decrying a candidate that has been normalizing hateful and regressive bullshit for over a year now.
 
witness said:
While I agree with her, she shouldn't say this. All it's going to do is enrage the other side further and not do anything for her supporters. Who approved her to say this shit?
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Watch these links:
http://nyti.ms/2aA3TWn
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mQkOZOeclWo
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KDkeAQe2NOc

And count the number of times you hear the word "nigger". You think this shit doesnt need to be brought up? In fact, just google trump rallies and that word. You'll be surprised.
 
shinra-bansho said:
There's a simple way to not be associated with racists and sexists and bigots, don't vote for the racist misogynist buffoon with a bigoted platform and a bigoted running mate, and a campaign run by a white nationalist being coached by a serial sexual harasser, who constantly spouts sexist, racist, bigoted bullshit.

I like that she just came right out and said it, since everyone else seems to just want to tiptoe around it.

The people who it will offend are already in the basket of deplorables. Or can't figure out which basket they're in (so they're probably in the bad one.)
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Preach
 
BriGuy said:
She may be right, but that's an extremely dumb comment for her to make, and I'm all but certain she's going to pay for it in the polls. The added nuance of "half" or "some" or whatever percentage of his supporters is meaningless; it's not going to be what gets focused on and repeated and chopped into soundbites for attack ads. These kinds of stupid, unforced errors are going to cost us the election.
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A lot of people were harping on or clinging to the "some are good people" line.

It matters. Not to everyone sure but it does matter.
 
I love how the same trump supporters who always say shit like "we're too pc" "he tells it like it is" somehow found this offensive lol
 
Just now, on CNN. Pastor Scott just said that millions of voters will not support Hillary because she is a woman, because they are Black Apostolic's and women shouldn't be preachers much less hold elected office.

Yah, not sexist at all guys.

Doc Holliday said:
I love how the same trump supporters who always say shit like "we're too pc" "he tells it like it is" somehow found this offensive lol
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Cause they feel like you are calling them racist: racist, sexist, homophobic, etc. and that pisses people off.
 
Trump literally has decades of racism, treating women like shit, and just general bigotry.

No firm policy other than building a wall.

So what do people see in him that they support?

decades of racism, treating women like shit, and just general bigotry.
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Arrogant Bastard said:
Just now, on CNN. Pastor Scott just said that millions of voters will not support Hillary because she is a woman, because they are Black Apostolic's and women shouldn't be preachers much less hold elected office.

Yah, not sexist at all guys.



Cause they feel like you are calling them racist: racist, sexist, homophobic, etc. and that pisses people off.
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Then why are they supporting those things?
 
You people who think this wasn't smart to say or it is a net negative, she is not aiming to convert Trump supporters to her. They never were going to. You really believe there are some Trump supporters who could've been convinced at the last minute?

Have you even ever heard a Trump supporter? They're cult-like and would need a full on deprogramming regime to get rid of their delusions. There are no or negligible amount of reasonable and intelligent Trump supporters left who listen to logical reasoning anymore on why they shouldn't vote for him. I honestly can't see any damage coming from this. Trump supporters have been through the thick and thin of dozens of bigotry attributed to Trump and haven't disagreed that much. Nothing will faze them now.
 
Gotchaye said:
I think there are a few important differences here. Now, like I've said, I think this can hurt Clinton a lot if she apologizes for it instead of doubling down. The problem for Romney was that doubling down was never an option. He needed that 47%. A huge chunk of that was already going to vote for him. He was exposed disrespecting the poor and unemployed behind closed doors with other rich people. Obama's main attack on Romney was that he was a rich person out to only serve rich people. And here's Romney saying that almost half of the country and half of his own base are leeches and so fuck 'em. It was a big problem for Romney that he did not seem to understand that Democrats were not guaranteed the vote of people paying no income tax - he was factually wrong and that hurt a lot.

Clinton doesn't need half of Trump's supporters. She's very clear that she's not talking about anyone who might be persuaded to vote for her. She's clear that half of Trump supporters have sympathetic and possibly good reasons for wanting to shake things up. Nobody can stand up and say that Clinton is both clearly talking about them and clearly wrong, and Democrats can make a pretty strong case that what Clinton said is essentially true.

This is substantially less damaging than even Obama's bitter clingers comment because she's not even being condescending to the people whose votes she actually wants. It's entirely consistent with Clinton's main line of attack on Trump - that he is a crazy bigot.
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Logically, I agree with you. My worry is that it's more likely that the few sane Trump voters will see this as her attacking them or misunderstanding their support rather than consider themselves in the non deplorable bucket. People, when attacked, are more likely to respond emotionally rather than logically.

Focusing on the messages Trump is sending and how it is trying to appeal to the worst in people, rather than the best, gets the same idea across without attacking a large portion of the population.
 
Messofanego said:
You people who think this wasn't smart to say or it is a net negative, she is not aiming to convert Trump supporters to her. They never were going to. You really believe there are some Trump supporters who could've been convinced at the last minute?

Have you even ever heard a Trump supporter? They're cult-like and would need a full on deprogramming regime to get rid of their delusions. There are no or negligible amount of reasonable and intelligent Trump supporters left who listen to logical reasoning anymore on why they shouldn't vote for him. I honestly can't see any damage coming from this. Trump supporters have been through the thick and thin of dozens of bigotry attributed to Trump and haven't disagreed that much. Nothing will faze them now.
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Shes not looking to deprogram the racists. Look at the links I posted. She wants to shine a bright light on this dark, paranoid underbelly of Trump support. It is absolutely fueled by racism and bigotry.
 
Slayven said:
Then why are they supporting those things?
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Cause they are X, Y, Z. They just don't want to be called out on it. Everyone is so PC these days, I cannot say openly racist shit anymore without someone calling me racist. Make America great again.

kmfdmpig said:
Logically, I agree with you. My worry is that it's more likely that the few sane Trump voters will see this as her attacking them or misunderstanding their support rather than consider themselves in the non deplorable bucket. People, when attacked, are more likely to respond emotionally rather than logically.

Focusing on the messages Trump is sending and how it is trying to appeal to the worst in people, rather than the best, gets the same idea across without attacking a large portion of the population.
Click to expand...

We are less than 58 days away from the election, people know who they are voting for and they aren't switching. I don't believe people are undecided or can be moved, they just don't want to say I'm voting for X.
 
I don't think she has any intention of backing down from this remark. Now that she's got the spotlight, the next step is to point out who that contingent of "deplorables" are - and not just the random racists at Trump's rallies either. Tie Trump to David Duke, Roger Ailes and other more well-known awful people who are supporting his campaign in one form or another. Use that wedge to separate Trump from the GOP mainstream and keep hammering away at him.
 
Can't say I'm comfortable with the word 'irredeemable' being used about human beings by the candidate who's supposed to be the sane one.

Feels way too much like wartime language being used about a large % of the population. This is the sort of thing you say to get kids fired up to kill the kids from another country.
 
Kyzer said:
None of that has an objective correlation to racism or bigotry. Look im not saying there arent a bunch of racists and bigots supporting Trump, of course there are, obviously. David Duke and all his supporters. im saying how utterly retarded and unprofessional (unacceptable) it is for her to say that thats what they are.
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Unlike some other posters criticizing this action your intent is the mindset as white people telling black people they should've acted differently when confronted by cops.

Clinton only made a disrespectful move after disrespect was inflicted on those who support her.
 
kmfdmpig said:
Logically, I agree with you. My worry is that it's more likely that the few sane Trump voters will see this as her attacking them or misunderstanding their support rather than consider themselves in the non deplorable bucket. People, when attacked, are more likely to respond emotionally rather than logically.

Focusing on the messages Trump is sending and how it is trying to appeal to the worst in people, rather than the best, gets the same idea across without attacking a large portion of the population.
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She is not going at Trump supporters, she is going after those GOP that feel like they been kicked out of their own party.
 
tbm24 said:
I think it needs to be said over and over and over. I'm going to be incredibly upset if after this election is over, no one looks back to his campaign and point out how disgusting it truly was. I want Trump's campaign to be taught as the hate mongering campaign that it is.
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This.
 
kmfdmpig said:
Logically, I agree with you. My worry is that it's more likely that the few sane Trump voters will see this as her attacking them or misunderstanding their support rather than consider themselves in the non deplorable bucket. People, when attacked, are more likely to respond emotionally rather than logically.

Focusing on the messages Trump is sending and how it is trying to appeal to the worst in people, rather than the best, gets the same idea across without attacking a large portion of the population.
Click to expand...

Currently, right now, everyone who says they are going to vote Trump can do so, and he won't win. Polls still have Clinton up about 4 points, remember.

The key thing is, there are *lots* of undecided voters at this point, more than normal (something like 20%). Those are the people Clinton needs to win over. Will this help or hurt her with those is the question.

Anyone who can support Trump given everything he has done and said, is either on board with the bigotry of him and his team, or they don't think it matters enough to prevent them for voting for Trump. Clinton doesn't need to be trying to win people who already took a look at Team Trump and said 'This is my team!'.

She needs to win the votes of the undecided.

Characterizing the type of people who already support Trump could well help her do that.
 
I'm not going to argue what she said, but when I read it I was actually shocked. As a Hillary supporter that statement doesn't sit well with me.
 
Arrogant Bastard said:
Half is pretty damn accurate though, half of his supporters are.

Would it really matter if she said 25% of his supporters or even couched it by saying a solid portion or a portion. It wouldn't matter, at all.
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It does matter

As others have said she is still leading these same people if she wins

Bad strategy
 
Resident_UA said:
What? Why not? Those people already think she is devil. They can't hate her more even if they wanted to.
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tbm24 said:
I think it needs to be said over and over and over. I'm going to be incredibly upset if after this election is over, no one looks back to his campaign and point out how disgusting it truly was. I want Trump's campaign to be taught as the hate mongering campaign that it is.
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You guys are missing the point, the media generally goes after politicians who attack and label segments of the voting populace. Trump gets away with a lot of shit like this, but Hillary isn't Trump.
 
Nick Spencer
@nickspencer
Only in America do we see the rise of white nationalism and agonize over whether or not we're being too rude to it.
 
Kyzer said:
while I doubt this is the blunder of the century, do you not see the problem with her calling a side racist? its a sweeping generalization. its like saying all of hillarys supporters are voting for her cuz shes a woman.
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Oh yeah I totally see how it can be perceived and all that. I also see how a lot of nuances to what she said will totally be lost (paraphrasing here: "There's a lot or angry/upset people out there who want a voice and I'm trying to listen.")

I guess it speaks to a double standard. Trump is allowed to say outlandish/racist things while Hillary is expected to be presidential 24/7.

Which is fine, I guess, except the other guy has a real chance of being elected by a very racist fueled/filled/founded country.
 
CoffeeJanitor said:
It does matter

As others have said she is still leading these same people if she wins

Bad strategy
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Criticizing a certain behavior is one way of leading.

You don't have to accept bigotry to lead the country.

We didn't need the Bernie bros to win the primaries. And we don't need the bigots the win the election.

Appeasing and pandering to bigots is what has turned the GOP into the disaster it is. So no...

I don't care about the feelings of voters we don't need.
 
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