Comparing Horizon Zero Dawn and TLoZ: BoTW
- Thread starter Neoleo2143
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Nahhhhh. We'll see a Horizon remaster or maybe people will talk about how Horizon was one of the best PS4 games the way people still talk about the best PS2 games.
Assuming that Horizon is good, of course. It does look good, though.
Even if BotW sucks and everyone hates it, everyone will still talk about how much they hate it 5-10 years from now.
Jawbreaker
Member
You should probably read the various previews that are available online from those who've played the game.
Horizon looks just what you would expect of an open world action game today. It has nice visual style and theme, but I fail to see any depth behind the coat of paint.
Zelda is a revered franchise and its take on open world design is very likely a fresh one. Everything they have showed points towards them learning from SS and the mistakes they did with the series.
Zelda is a revered franchise and its take on open world design is very likely a fresh one. Everything they have showed points towards them learning from SS and the mistakes they did with the series.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
Assumption
martino
Member
outside what is cinematic sense of scale in horizon seems not to be the strong aspect of this open world.
and they don't hide it even in interview.
but this also means they will have better control on the story they told.
I can deal with it...it's good games don't focus on same things.
int the end :
sony first party going more the narrative road
nintendo first party going more the interactivity/gameplay one
not so surprising and why you need them both in your life
and they don't hide it even in interview.
but this also means they will have better control on the story they told.
I can deal with it...it's good games don't focus on same things.
int the end :
sony first party going more the narrative road
nintendo first party going more the interactivity/gameplay one
not so surprising and why you need them both in your life
Wishmaster92
Member
This is where I'm at too. The jittery ass combat from botw is such a turn off.
Omnistalgic
Member
Yea but what if that's not really interesting to do? I think too much weight is placed on how open Zelda is, from the large amount of footage I've watched, the mechanics don't seem that much more refined from older Zelda titles and the fighting actually looked a little pedestrian to be honest with all the amounts of weapons showed. Has the potential to be a giant playground full of mediocre things to do like early GTA titles, not sure I really want to play that, would rather fight complex monsters over and over again with various difficulties like Monster Hunter.
But either way that's just first impressions, of mechanics are well done, it should turn out well, for both games really. I'm just not sold on Zelda being this amazing experience because they take the shackles off early. You're still going to die going to gen boss early lol
I have read a few. If you've got any you think I should read, feel free to link them.
wild wild rice
Member
While Horizon definitely seems to have better combat/moment to moment gameplay than the garbage in Rockstar's games and the mecha dinos are awesome, I still think it's going to very much be a by the numbers open world experience. Get quest-> follow waypoint-> kill thing, repeat.
Zelda looks to be far more cerebrally engaging with its focus on gameplay mechanics, exploration and of course puzzles.
I could be wrong either or both ways, but right now Zelda is getting pre-ordered and Horizon is going to have to wait for some impressions from people I trust.
Zelda looks to be far more cerebrally engaging with its focus on gameplay mechanics, exploration and of course puzzles.
I could be wrong either or both ways, but right now Zelda is getting pre-ordered and Horizon is going to have to wait for some impressions from people I trust.
Jawbreaker
Member
http://www.gameinformer.com/b/featu...our-hands-on-time-with-horizon-zero-dawn.aspx
The entire article is a good read.
Barely. It's really minimal stuff inside caves that involve pulling levers to move statues.
Neoleo2143
Member
Partly to lay out my feelings on both titles, partly to think more critically about what each game is trying to do and appreciating that. I mentioned that there's some speculation (the entire themes section) but I tried to think about why the game design in both games would be a particular way and how that could result in different experiences.
Triggerhappytel
Member
And as we all know it's impossible for a developer to improve, even if they have clearly and openly made moves to address previous weaknesses.
QuantumBro
Banned
Guerrilla has shined with multiplayer modes in all there games, but have typically delivered average single player campaigns. There's no problem being cautious about them making a entirely single-player experience and waiting for reviews to come out; you're not getting this game for free.
Though, based on what I've seen, it looks like they've nailed the gameplay aspects. I just hope they don't put too much focus on the story, or at least allow you to skip most of it.
I'll be getting the one without white people with dreads. Yeah.
I was very interested in Horizon at first but some decisions there bother me a lot, and I don't really trust devs like Guerrilla to nail the RPG genre very well... so I guess I'll get it somewhere down the line if it reviews well. Zelda on the other hand looks unbelievably good to me, I haven't had this level of excitement to play one since Twilight Princess (which disappointed heavily but eh).
Thread went full warz pretty quick. Well done, all.
Bullshit. Only games they've made that could realistically be called 'bad' are Killzone 1 and Shadowfall. The rest of their games have been good to great.
Bullshit. Only games they've made that could realistically be called 'bad' are Killzone 1 and Shadowfall. The rest of their games have been good to great.
batman2million
Member
One developer has a record of making great games. The other doesn't.
The only decent game they made was Killzone 2 which was more of a glorified tech demo. Killzone Mercenaries was the only good game they've made. This happens with guerrillas games all the time. Everyone gets super excited b/c their games look great but always have less then stellar gameplay.
The only decent game they made was Killzone 2 which was more of a glorified tech demo. Killzone Mercenaries was the only good game they've made. This happens with guerrillas games all the time. Everyone gets super excited b/c their games look great but always have less then stellar gameplay.
FalsettoVibe
Member
Dat Zelda hype.
Its kinda hard for me to get hyped for Breath of the Wind when the last two console Xelda games where disappointing to me....but we shall see.
Its kinda hard for me to get hyped for Breath of the Wind when the last two console Xelda games where disappointing to me....but we shall see.
After 25mn of Horizon gameplay trailer, I fear I've seen 80% of how the game will play. It's beautiful and techwise impressive. But possibilities seem limited, these hunts as the core gameplay seem repetitive. I said earlier today The Witcher 3 is highly praised yet bored me. Though following the same scripts I don't like, Horizon seems to be a much better action game, so there is that. But this new Zelda is built upon freedom, gameplay possibilities. In 25mn I know I've seen 0.5% of what the game will let me do.
So I have a personal preference, though both games are incomparable by genre and what they try to accomplish.
So I have a personal preference, though both games are incomparable by genre and what they try to accomplish.
WordsintheWater
Member
Why are possibilities limited in Horizon? You've hardly seen anything but you somehow already know. Why is Zelda different in this regard?
Yet I had fun playing those... and KZ3, Liberation and RIGS.
But I digress... we're getting away from the thread's point of making judgements on games we haven't played.
Just read his tag and you'll have your answer.
DriftingSpirit
Member
What a terribly predictable thread. People would rather die at the stake than objectively compare and contrast two games lol.
I'm looking forward to both games.
I'm looking forward to both games.
I'll leave at that, it's an assumption based on pedigrees, genres. Correct me if I'm wrong in March regarding variety. It's likely Horizon will be a better Horizon game than Zelda, and vice versa. The comparison is futile is the main point I wanted to leave there.
Skittzo0413
Member
Very good OP!
If nothing else, it's very nice to see a detailed write-up about the various systems and elements of both games.
If nothing else, it's very nice to see a detailed write-up about the various systems and elements of both games.
Neoleo2143
Member
I appreciate your compliment. I think detailed comparisons really allow digging into understanding the design of these vastly complicated games. For example, I might have not realized how Zelda's cooking system might have worked if I didn't compare it to traditional open world crafting systems. There's an argument to be said about thinking about games on their own terms but I think that's too limited in terms of perspective for my tastes.
AcademicSaucer
Member
They are definitely going for different things.
DriftingSpirit
Member
I keep seeing this get repeated.
Skittzo0413
Member
Well your OP also does highlight the differences and some reasons why they aren't necessarily the best games to compare to one another. But a lot of people have been comparing these two games, so a detailed breakdown is a very good way to explore these similarities and differences.
Also it's fascinating to me in general to see detailed breakdowns in game mechanics regardless of the context. So thanks for the work you put into the OP!
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
I mean we're talking about two unreleased games, one of which hasn't had much in the way of unrehearsed gameplay demonstrations. Leading me to believe that there will be WAY more gameplay opportunities in the world of Zelda:BOTW, Horizon's devs really need to properly show off those emergent systems they've been talking about as the closest thing to it I've seen is a flying dinosaur picking up a smaller one the the eagles in far cry. Meanwhile Zelda has already been examined to hell and back in terms of how the systems interact with one another and that was in a small white orchard sized version of the game with less elements than what will be in the game.
It's because of the way Horizon has been presented, they keep programming demo specific dialogue to explain what's happening in the small slices of the game they're presenting, Zelda devs literally just sat down and played for several hours. >_>
Well... I played Horizon and loved the hell out of it. The combat is tight and the world is very interesting. I also have hope for the story since it is being written by one of the writers of Fallout New Vegas.
I have no doubts that Zelda will be great as well, and will be loved by its fans... however comparing both games seems difficult to me since I actually played one and not the other. The setting for Horizon feels more fresh to me, not to say Zelda looks great too. But to dismiss what Horizon is doing and how it feels seems ridiculous. You can still love both games and compare them without having trash either of them.
I have no doubts that Zelda will be great as well, and will be loved by its fans... however comparing both games seems difficult to me since I actually played one and not the other. The setting for Horizon feels more fresh to me, not to say Zelda looks great too. But to dismiss what Horizon is doing and how it feels seems ridiculous. You can still love both games and compare them without having trash either of them.
Spot on. Horizon is still one of my most anticipated games, but I would be lying if I said I wasn't a little concerned about the moment to moment gameplay. Everything we've seen so far has just been slices. I want a better idea of how everything comes together as a complete package.
Zelda has had several fantastic showings that really show off the numerous different gameplay elements and how they integrate with each other.
Overall, I'm expecting better combat in Horizon and better exploration in Zelda. But both look great so far.
Neoleo2143
Member
Skepticism is warranted but they've shown essentially the whole introduction to the game and it's excellent in every way I can see it, teaching the player by having them engage with mechanics or being shown through NPCs, some fakeouts for veteran players, well timed musical cues, the story is well delivered with more natural gameplay scenarios (the introduction to the Guardians for example is subtle and sublime) delivered with great voice acting and is more dense with information with as few words as possible, gives you a solid amount of freedom to tackle the three main objectives in any order you wish and is littered with secrets (which actually matter because of low durability and limited weapon slots) and opportunities for varied gameplay. They may have shown too much of it at E3, but the design of the Great Plateau is generally excellent with only a couple of empty lots. It's easily up there with the best introductions in the whole series.
If this is the quality to expect from the rest of the game it'll likely be one of the best games of the generation, and the desert area to the side of the plateau looks to continue this level of quality. I genuinely think Nintendo really knows what they're doing with this game. The general mechanics seem nuanced enough to make the open world remain interesting while being spliced in with more defined challenges that are all rather varied.
Getting good writers (and even good side quest designers) is not enough to tell a good videogame story overall. For example, I would say Amy Hennig is a pretty great writer especially coming off her work on Soul Reaver, but I thought that Uncharted 1 - 3 told pretty meh stories. Everyone on the voice acting and Dev team is a part of the story telling process in a game. Obsidian probably has a different process of development than Guerrilla so I suggest not going in with the same expectations.
Neoleo2143
Member
From what I hear, BoTW's combat is hardly jittery. Simple compared to games that explicitly focus on combat such as Ni-Oh or Ninja Gaiden? Definitely but I wouldn't say that it's lacking in depth or feel.
We certainly should be critical of Zelda, as well. Especially in terms of story. Skyward Sword could have been so much more important, but they failed to convey a real sense of danger. I don't trust them to make such an impactful game as OoT once again. But we'll see.
Neoleo2143
Member
I personally found many moments in Twilight Princess to be immensely impacting, the segments where people react to Link in Wolf form were truly brilliant especially with Midna's Lament. The game had issues with pacing but it still told probably the only truly tragic tale in the series (there are tragic events in Majora's Mask but the ending of TP cements the whole game as a Tragedy).
BoTW probably won't tell a tragedy but it does continue the series ethos of using gameplay scenarios to reinforce themes that all the Zelda games excel at and many videogame fail at. It's also not going to influence the future of the industry like OoT did. But it's going to take a lot of what the industry did from OoT to try to splice them all into a mixture which sets a standard for demanding enough nuance and polish from all aspects of the game.
This also could be a pretty fun comparison. RDR's treasure maps were something really special and made me all nostalgic for Wind Waker. The sandbox nature of Rockstars' games could also strike up some similarities. There's lot of appreciation for simply observing the world in RDR that I think Zelda and Horizon will both strive for (and hopefully succeed at)
Yeah, other than some extremely superficial similarities there is hardly anything similar between the two. There is a reason why I'm super excited for one but not the other.
Spyder_Monkey
Banned
One has robot dinosaurs which put Horizon over every other game period.
Fantastical
Death Prophet
I'm quite a bit more excited to play Zelda but very excited for Horizon. Zelda just looks like a lot of fun to play around with the environment and enemies which I'm particularly excited about.
EDIT: Yeah actually why compare the two. They both look great.
EDIT: Yeah actually why compare the two. They both look great.
Sanctuary
Member
Probably Horizon, for starting a new IP. We'll be looking back at the first game, while anticipating the 4th or 5th. Very interested in Zelda (dunno which system I'll get it on though), but it looks like it could get way too easy fast. I'm also a bit worried about the open world layout. I can't think of a single game that transitioned to open world where it previously wasn't that didn't suffer more than not. I don't want to spend time trekking through a vast, open "world" filled with nothing, to finally reach the next group of enemies.
I also never drew any comparisons at all between Horizon and Breath of the Wild. Aside from the open world aspect, they are nothing alike at all to me.
This thread is going to evoke some pretty absurd back and forth between two sets of people. For me, Zelda is a proven experience when it's done right and BotW seems to be in the right direction coming off the really disappointing Skyward Sword. Hopefully they get shit right this time but who knows.
I really, really want Horizon to be awesome and it looks insanely beautiful but I don't see Guerrilla Games as a great developer. Killzone has always looked the part, it just can't compete with its peers for me and I worry Horizon will be the same.
For me at least, both games have a lot to prove and here's to hoping they both do well.
I really, really want Horizon to be awesome and it looks insanely beautiful but I don't see Guerrilla Games as a great developer. Killzone has always looked the part, it just can't compete with its peers for me and I worry Horizon will be the same.
For me at least, both games have a lot to prove and here's to hoping they both do well.
Neoleo2143
Member
I think sequels to Horizon would be totally awesome since they could keep introducing newer and newer robots while keeping the older ones around like the Dead Space games did. This in turn could lead to more and more complex ecosystems and cool interactions.
Spyder_Monkey
Banned
TIL Zelda's never been open world.
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