I corrected the bolded to what she is talking about.
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Danganronpa Mafia |OT| Grin and Bear It
- Thread starter LaunchpadMcQ
- Start date
I corrected the bolded to what she is talking about.
I got an award? That makes me unreasonably happy 
Congrats to Swamped for a well deserved scum-mvp. Honestly my last day was so tiring for me and it wasn't even an entire day, I don't know how you kept that up for so long!
Congrats to Ty4on as well, yougotme.gif
I'll stick up for Zipped too, some bad play at the end I guess but you had the best (non-mechanical) points against me on day (whatever it was), I felt you'd absolutely nailed me there and I was just lucky it didn't get more support.
Finally please excuse my bitching in the dead thread, I'm a poor loser
And a massive thanks to Launch for hosting this, I had so much fun!
Congrats to Swamped for a well deserved scum-mvp. Honestly my last day was so tiring for me and it wasn't even an entire day, I don't know how you kept that up for so long!
Congrats to Ty4on as well, yougotme.gif
I'll stick up for Zipped too, some bad play at the end I guess but you had the best (non-mechanical) points against me on day (whatever it was), I felt you'd absolutely nailed me there and I was just lucky it didn't get more support.
Finally please excuse my bitching in the dead thread, I'm a poor loser
And a massive thanks to Launch for hosting this, I had so much fun!
Oh, I misunderstood.
Yep, i can guarantee CM would have killed Makai even if it meant Despair's loss. She was absolutely livid that Makai didn't take up my offer. Throwing tantrums, breaking plates, kicking puppies...it was quite a sight.
Makai made the right move.
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
mmmm okies... a bit confusing. but ok :3 ... i'll just think of it as high noon show down where all the bullets reach the other person at the same time
.............. i like your victory though :> :> :>
FTFY
Spoiled Milk
Banned
I think what Makai is trying to say is that even if he died, he would have satisfied his win condition.
That's not true then. If he dies in the same night where he completes his second kill, he still loses.
I like this logic
CornBurrito
Member
Where's the scum chat link?
Royal_Flush
Member
You were the main reason I stayed alive for so long. In retrospect I should have been much more careful with what I said because they really struggled to figure out what was going on.
Splinter 2189 said:
Splinter 2192 said:
Swamped 2249 said:
Splinter 2274 said:Argh I'm so fucked
Cant kill Pau today, have to kill Saw tomorrow, no way they keep redacted hidden long enough for me to kill Pau, and it seems Ty would still survive that
Christina pushed attacking the empty room and the night before she checked my room and saw that I exited it.
I thought the idea of a disguised person was totally implausible before it was the only thing making sense when Kalor flipped Regular:
Should be obvious how oblivious I was to Despair actually having someone like that on the team despite Launch kinda hinting at it between the lines.Ty4on said:
Also reading through the Empty Room chat, I love how Launch hadn't even decided how your movement was workingImagine our "amusement" when we discovered you were a ninja because reasons
It took a lot of effort from me to discover that I was a Ninja as well
Before that I made maps with steps trying to figure out why I didn't see anyone N1.
Edit:
Edit 2: I can't be bothered to fish it now, but I think Kark revealed in the dead thread that whomever got my role would have the empty room right in front of their room so they could be a Ninja. I'm not sure if it's random that the room got placed on the corner because it would look really suspicious in the middle.
Launch 58 said:"Launch said I was the person in mind regarding what route someone will take if two routes are the same length. That puzzled me a bit because my route isn't like that. "
that's not what I meant
Actually, I decided on something with the mods, so this is technically a backtrack to what I told you, and distance DOES matter for everyone. You're the unique case where the distance is also tied the other players' ability to see you, as the path to the empty dorm from yours is very short. There are very few scenarios where you'll be seen.
Before that I made maps with steps trying to figure out why I didn't see anyone N1.
Edit:
Basically thatAlso reading through the Empty Room chat, I love how Launch hadn't even decided how your movement was working
Edit 2: I can't be bothered to fish it now, but I think Kark revealed in the dead thread that whomever got my role would have the empty room right in front of their room so they could be a Ninja. I'm not sure if it's random that the room got placed on the corner because it would look really suspicious in the middle.
I was incredibly suspicious on you from Day 1, and Crab was a likely target at the moment two, so I had the idea to switch you vote since I realized more roles will go to either side. I was so sad I died so early, I had a theory early on, but after my death I honestly could say it was more fun to watch you all play than to actually play, it was so confusing.
Who did you switch and what were your thoughts D2 about those you saw N1?
I swapped AbsolutBro and goshujinsama, when I realized that the map was vital to the game I tried to get the longest possible route so I could give info to the town.
My main suspect was always swamped, lol.
That was one of the reasons we killed you
Plus you were a PR. I honestly expected some heat on me after your kill, but i guess everyone thought it was WIFOM territory.Man, you would have wrecked D3
It's meaningless, but what about N2?
that was n2, n1 was swamped and crab
Ah, of course. Pau only saw you N2.
AbsolutBro
Member
I wondered if you tried to keep me alive N2. Cause I was pretty sure I was dead that night. <3
Reread days 7-9.
"Gosh, Terrabyte, and Zipped are not cleared. There could be a Role Godfather."
"I'm an investigatory role. Forcing me to role claim is scummy. I could still spot the killer! Oops, I was already hammered. Oops, Pau and Ty were night-killed."
"Hmm...We've narrowed our suspect list to one person but Kingkitty and Makai's roles sound really good. Let's lynch them!"
Hope didn't deserve to win. smh
yes but i was hope
and considering i helped you out as part of the lucky duo, i thought you would help me out by helping the town win
but in the end it's alright, because scum still lost
Spoiled Milk
Banned
This is just so hilarious to read in retrospect.
Rest
All these years later I still chuckle at what a fucking moron that guy is.
I didn't say you were scummy, I said you needed to be lynched.
Star Wars:
Danganronpa:
Well, before I die, I just want to share why I was confident that I would defeat Blarg. While I did read up on play theory, I just let Blarg play against an AI. I've never played Dots and Boxes before. : )
http://www.math.ucla.edu/~tom/Games/dots&boxes.html
Danganronpa:
I was really, really worried that Gosh wasn't going to show up in time to vote.
wait how did I see him then?
LaunchpadMcQ
Banned
Setup wise, I honestly feel like this was heavily slanted towards town. I'm not trying to take away from everyone who played really well, nor am I saying Despair always made the right call with the info we had, but I don't feel like there was a reasonable chance for us from the start.
I think the fight club mechanic would have been 1000 times better if it had just been explained properly at the beginning. There was no reason not to do this, and it heavily benefited town by leaving us in the dark. As I said in the mafia chat, there's no reason for town to lie about these things, but the mafia need to. I pretty much checked out of this game after night one because I felt like we had made our first move in a game of chess only to be told "you can move your pawns backwards," and it's like, wait, I thought we were playing chess? If it had been anybody's role to track / cop me, I wouldn't have minded as that involves a player's skill, but in this case it felt like the game itself pulled the rug out from under us. Town could have revealed all fight club information from the start and been better off. Of course, they didn't know that, but still.
The 'ninja' part of the movement thing was super counter-intuitive, and I don't think anyone figured it out on their own. It also created a situation where the RNG'd placement of the rooms became even more important. In this case, ty won the lottery. Meanwhile Splinter being in the corner to the right of two fight club members and directly to the left of the empty dorm room made it incredibly easy to figure out he was the impostor and thus the RNG screwed us over.
Then there was the empty room mechanic, and why was that even in this game? Three of the rooms were useless. It really only served as a distraction for the mafia, and didn't affect town at all. From our perspective none of the rooms were more important than the others so the fact that we watched the three useless rooms was just bad luck and makes me wonder why they were there?
Which is kind of the problem with all of these mechanics: there was no way for town to misuse any of them and yet there were countless ways for the mafia to misplay. Sure, the doctor could target the big rooms as well, but we know damn well no townie would risk that unless they were sure it wouldn't be a wasted night. Meanwhile, we as scum had to waste three nights on a goose chase for no gain.
Town benefited from these mechanics, and yet the rest of the setup did not reflect the added benefit from the large amount information they received from fight club or added distraction of the empty rooms. Town had a large amount of ways to dodge our kills (switcher, doc, two sets of commuters) for a game without a sk, plus the info received from the role cop (why wasn't swamped just ordinary to counter this?,) lookout, and of course fight club. Once again it was unlikely for town to misuse any of their abilities outside of the THUNDERDOME. Yet we were scrambling constantly. It didn't help that our win condition was wrong from the start given this setup.
And that leaves us with the lucky buddies. Why on earth were they hope aligned from the start? Two sets of confirmed townies was infinitely more powerful than a sk. We basically went through the whole game without any 3p support or additional players getting removed. Even if the sk had been activated, it would have been pretty easy to figure out who the new person in fight club was. Not to mention the sk would have been actively working against us unlike a real sk who plays both sides. This meant a setup that was 19 vs 4. That's incredibly hard to overcome when you consider the high number of ways for us to miss our kill.
So yeah, I think there were a lot of cool ideas here individually, but a lot of the ideas didn't mesh when crammed together in one game. I really don't mind losing, but I want it to feel like it was because I was out played by players and not because of the mechanics.
I think the fight club mechanic would have been 1000 times better if it had just been explained properly at the beginning. There was no reason not to do this, and it heavily benefited town by leaving us in the dark. As I said in the mafia chat, there's no reason for town to lie about these things, but the mafia need to. I pretty much checked out of this game after night one because I felt like we had made our first move in a game of chess only to be told "you can move your pawns backwards," and it's like, wait, I thought we were playing chess? If it had been anybody's role to track / cop me, I wouldn't have minded as that involves a player's skill, but in this case it felt like the game itself pulled the rug out from under us. Town could have revealed all fight club information from the start and been better off. Of course, they didn't know that, but still.
The 'ninja' part of the movement thing was super counter-intuitive, and I don't think anyone figured it out on their own. It also created a situation where the RNG'd placement of the rooms became even more important. In this case, ty won the lottery. Meanwhile Splinter being in the corner to the right of two fight club members and directly to the left of the empty dorm room made it incredibly easy to figure out he was the impostor and thus the RNG screwed us over.
Then there was the empty room mechanic, and why was that even in this game? Three of the rooms were useless. It really only served as a distraction for the mafia, and didn't affect town at all. From our perspective none of the rooms were more important than the others so the fact that we watched the three useless rooms was just bad luck and makes me wonder why they were there?
Which is kind of the problem with all of these mechanics: there was no way for town to misuse any of them and yet there were countless ways for the mafia to misplay. Sure, the doctor could target the big rooms as well, but we know damn well no townie would risk that unless they were sure it wouldn't be a wasted night. Meanwhile, we as scum had to waste three nights on a goose chase for no gain.
Town benefited from these mechanics, and yet the rest of the setup did not reflect the added benefit from the large amount information they received from fight club or added distraction of the empty rooms. Town had a large amount of ways to dodge our kills (switcher, doc, two sets of commuters) for a game without a sk, plus the info received from the role cop (why wasn't swamped just ordinary to counter this?,) lookout, and of course fight club. Once again it was unlikely for town to misuse any of their abilities outside of the THUNDERDOME. Yet we were scrambling constantly. It didn't help that our win condition was wrong from the start given this setup.
And that leaves us with the lucky buddies. Why on earth were they hope aligned from the start? Two sets of confirmed townies was infinitely more powerful than a sk. We basically went through the whole game without any 3p support or additional players getting removed. Even if the sk had been activated, it would have been pretty easy to figure out who the new person in fight club was. Not to mention the sk would have been actively working against us unlike a real sk who plays both sides. This meant a setup that was 19 vs 4. That's incredibly hard to overcome when you consider the high number of ways for us to miss our kill.
So yeah, I think there were a lot of cool ideas here individually, but a lot of the ideas didn't mesh when crammed together in one game. I really don't mind losing, but I want it to feel like it was because I was out played by players and not because of the mechanics.
LaunchpadMcQ
Banned
did I asked for feedback? no? Then STFU.
Honestly though, I agree with most of what you're saying and almost all of it occurred to me while it was happening; I just couldn't see most of it until it was actually in motion. That's why I was saying stuff midway like "I'm never hosting again" or "seeing mechanics blow up in my face".
So, yeah, it's back to basics for me from now on.
Honestly though, I agree with most of what you're saying and almost all of it occurred to me while it was happening; I just couldn't see most of it until it was actually in motion. That's why I was saying stuff midway like "I'm never hosting again" or "seeing mechanics blow up in my face".
So, yeah, it's back to basics for me from now on.
<3 You clearly have a good mind for creative mechanics / roles, I just think it'd be better to focus on one thing at a time. I figured you knew most of that stuff, but I wanted to post it anyway so that future mods can get a sense of why some things don't work. We're still figuring things out as a community so I think it's important to get feedback.
LaunchpadMcQ
Banned
With this particular mechanic, not too much is different; I was trying to find ways to make it more complex, but couldn't find anything solid.
I toyed with adding in some random conditions depending on the circumstances of the murders; for example, on one day, a player would be traumatized by the murder and unable to speak for the day phase (but still able to vote).
You know what I just realized? Makai wouldn't have won if he had gone through with this. He would have MISSED Sawneeks tonight since she would have gone to the pool. Town would have won by simply voting out Makai during the next day!