Time remaining in Day Phase 7:
What do you want to know?At this point lynching a PR versus regular Hope doesn't sound like much of a difference.
So I'll put more pressure on Rest.
Vote: Rest
Well it's not like I can ask if you or anyone else is Despair and expect you to answer yes.What do you want to know?
I am consistent. I go after people whom I believe are Despair. If I don't have strong feelings, I wait to see if anyone else makes a good argument.Why are you so inconsistent?
There is nothing to claim. As vanilla as it gets.
Sawneeks, why not Swamped? Based on reads?
We're sitting around because you are absurdly scummy but you refuse to do address it. Just cut the crap and claim so we can move on. Posting the clock doesn't narrow down our already short suspect list.I am consistent. I go after people whom I believe are Despair. If I don't have strong feelings, I wait to see if anyone else makes a good argument.
Also I do agree with Zipped. If we all have a general idea of who we will vote for and if conversation is slowly coming to a halt I see no reason to really keep this Day going longer than it has to. I may be in the minority on this one though.
I'm in favor of hammering.Also I do agree with Zipped. If we all have a general idea of who we will vote for and if conversation is slowly coming to a halt I see no reason to really keep this Day going longer than it has to. I may be in the minority on this one though.
We don't agree on the issue you've brought up. You say it's scummy that I won't role claim. I say it's anti town to role claim. I'm not going to do it. It can only hurt town to reveal my role if I have one.We're sitting around because you are absurdly scummy but you refuse to do address it. Just cut the crap and claim so we can move on. Posting the clock doesn't narrow down our already short suspect list.
Does anyone besides Rest think it's anti-Town for him to claim? I don't remember anyone saying that. Town is in virtual agreement for today's agenda. If you are the only one obstructing it, you are anti-Town by definition.We don't agree on the issue you've brought up. You say it's scummy that I won't role claim. I say it's anti town to role claim. I'm not going to do it. It can only hurt town to reveal my role if I have one.
Posting the clock is not related to this discussion. I posted the clock so that I don't have to dig back for it if I want to see it. As I said, I posted it for my own convenience.
The agenda is to lynch Despair. This red herring doesn't help us do that, it's just an excuse to not look harder at other people. Role claiming hurts town, the end. If you can't get past that I don't know what to say to you.Does anyone besides Rest think it's anti-Town for him to claim? I don't remember anyone saying that. Town is in virtual agreement for today's agenda. If you are the only one obstructing it, you are anti-Town by definition.
Does anyone besides Rest think it's anti-Town for him to claim? I don't remember anyone saying that. Town is in virtual agreement for today's agenda. If you are the only one obstructing it, you are anti-Town by definition.
Yeah, unless somebody is willing to stick their neck out and defend Rest, I say we hammer him. Nobody is on his side and he refuses to cooperate.The agenda is to lynch Despair. This red herring doesn't help us do that, it's just an excuse to not look harder at other people. Role claiming hurts town, the end. If you can't get past that I don't know what to say to you.
If Despair is one of today's our players they sure won't further decimate the pool of suspects by killing a member of the pool. A role-claim would surely not be Anti-Town
Yeah, unless somebody is willing to stick their neck out and defend Rest, I say we hammer him. Nobody is on his side and he refuses to cooperate.
Yeah, we need 7 votes for majority.I'm ready for vote for him. Do we currently have 4 or 5 votes on him. 7 are majority? Do we want to end early (I have no objections, I don't see this moving anywhere)?
Yeah, unless somebody is willing to stick their neck out and defend Rest, I say we hammer him. Nobody is on his side and he refuses to cooperate.
Defend Rest.VOTE: Makai
If anyone is acting against Hope it's you. You have nothing conclusive on Rest and still want us to turbo him.
Give an argument other than "he doesn't do exactly what I want when I demand it."Defend Rest.
Royal_Flush, you want me to give information? Why? What if I have no information to give? Should I let Despair know that? What if I do have information? Should I give it away, so that Despair knows what I know? Or would it be better to use it in another way?
You were the penultimate vote that let *Splinter hammer himself.Give an argument other than "he doesn't do exactly what I want when I demand it."
Fine with me. Ty needs to give us his thoughts on Rest, too.Christina, as soon as you get a chance, would you mind stating your thoughts on Rest, you seem to be the only one who hasn't posted on the matter.
No one turbo until she posts.
Don't forget that Despair gets no information from a non claim. If they want to kill me at night, there's nothing I could do to stop it. They'll kill for their own reasons, but claiming gives them incentive.Ok, these are the scenarios:
1. You are Ordinary and don't want to claim. You want to make yourself a high priority target for Despair NK. Legit play, but if the plan succeeds, you end up dead anyway tomorrow. Claiming a fake PR btw. would forward that plan. Also, every Ordinary claim could just be made up. Mafia gets relatively little from Ordinary claims.
In neither of these situations does publicly posting any information that I do or do not have help Hope. Giving Despair information helps Despair. Sawneeks has been cited as a reason to role claim, but Sawneeks is a glorified sleepwalker. *Splinter dug his own hole, and by chance Sawneeks had an opportunity to help push him in. *Splinter was on his way out with or without that claim.2. You have a PR that gives us some sort of information. You don't share this information with Town...
a) because you don't want Despair to know you know. Well but Town also doesn't know so it's completely useless until you flip and we can reread your posts as we did with AB
b) you don't have something useful yet but hope to find it soon. Well, a claim would be wrong play here and we as Town currently are making a big mistake.
If I'm Despair I have a secret forum on which to discuss with the other members of despair role claiming strategy. If Despair can't come up with believable roleclaims then there's no chance such an inept team can win.3. You are a Passive, self protecting PR. I don't see the benefit for the rest of Town here honestly, despite maybe giving away a failed NK. I also think that's unlikely if Makai and Kingkitty are telling the truth.
4. You are Despair and can't figure out a useful Roleclaim.
What are your current reads? I looked over your posts, but couldn't find anything recent.Give an argument other than "he doesn't do exactly what I want when I demand it."
My vote for *Splinter was a vote for nearly confirmed hope. I can't control who else votes or when, that's not a good argument.You were the penultimate vote that let *Splinter hammer himself.
You've acted completely oppositely of the other three suspects.
You wanted Pau to prove that you didn't move last night, so I ask if you will move in the future. You refuse to answer...only to answer a few posts later.
Your whole shtick today is keeping targets from Despair even though we're long past that stage of the game and now just need to put the puzzle pieces together.
You're the only one who hasn't claimed. It's Day 7 and if you are some sort of investigatory role you need to give us your intel.
If you have proof one of the claimed Hope players is lying, it will help Town to identify Despair?In neither of these situations does publicly posting any information that I do or do not have help Hope
I also don't buy the idea that we only have one or two Despair left. I think we've got two or three left, and may even have four. Now is not the time to give them anything.
Who would these 2-4 people be in your opinion?
Just noticed a type, *Splinter was nearly confirmed Despair, not Hope.My vote for *Splinter was a vote for nearly confirmed hope. I can't control who else votes or when, that's not a good argument.
If I had any information, I would put it to use, not flaunt it about. If I don't have information, Despair doesn't need to know.If you have proof one of the claimed Hope players is lying, it will help Town to identify Despair?
VOTE: Makai
If anyone is acting against Hope it's you. You have nothing conclusive on Rest and still want us to turbo him.
Don't forget that Despair gets no information from a non claim. If they want to kill me at night, there's nothing I could do to stop it. They'll kill for their own reasons, but claiming gives them incentive.
In neither of these situations does publicly posting any information that I do or do not have help Hope. Giving Despair information helps Despair. Sawneeks has been cited as a reason to role claim, but Sawneeks is a glorified sleepwalker. *Splinter dug his own hole, and by chance Sawneeks had an opportunity to help push him in. *Splinter was on his way out with or without that claim.
If I'm Despair I have a secret forum on which to discuss with the other members of despair role claiming strategy. If Despair can't come up with believable roleclaims then there's no chance such an inept team can win.
I also don't buy the idea that we only have one or two Despair left. I think we've got two or three left, and may even have four. Now is not the time to give them anything.
I agree with you that this four people stuff isn't useful, because I don't feel we've cleared all but four people.Seeing as a turbo may or may not happen at any time ( hopefully not so Christina can get her thoughts in ) and given the fact that I may or may not die tonight I want to voice my agreement with this.
Perhaps it's a bad case of tunneling but, honestly, if Rest and Royal flipped Hope I would look at Makai solely based on his play today. Cornering people into only voting for 4 players, getting angry and threatening to lynch if anyone breaks that rule, and dogging Rest as hard as possible aren't feeling super helpful. The locking it down to only 4 players specifically is what bugs me because it is very possible one of the 'confirmed roles' is lying.
But I'm willing to test this theory later. Seeing as I might not be here in the coming Days I hope someone will take up this mantle if things start to go south.
Actually, everyone dug a large hole around Splinter, Pau, and Ty4on and waited to see who would trip in first. Splinter was the first to falter so we pushed him in and, hey, it worked! He didn't really dig his own grave.
Also what's up with your last line? 4 Despair left? Are you taking notes out of your own book and trying to cause misinformation?
Also, role claiming now would be best, especially if you had information. Either way it looks like you're dying today or some time during the Night, meaning if you have anything valuable for Hope it would be best to spit it out now then let it die with you.
I think you're wrong to assume that we don't need to look at those top three. I think AbsolutBro only stated one person had the title of normal Hope, all he saw were titles, not alignments.Rest, I don't think you understand the situation we are in. Despair doesn't have time to kill all of Hope. Secret power roles are irrelevant. We have all the information we need to win the game. There are three groups - cleared, vetted, and suspects. We search through the suspects first. Despair will not have a majority even if we mislynch so we can move on to testingthe vetted. After lynching one vetted person, we will know what to do with their buddy. Then we move on to the next pair. Case closed.
CLEARED
These people were cleared by AbsolutBro.
This person role-claimed to lynch *Splinter.
VETTED
These people vet each other - if we lynch one, we'll know what to do with the other, so we don't need to test them immediately.
They are valuable power roles - both block night kill attempts.
These people vet each other - if we lynch one, we'll know what to do with the other, so we don't need to test them immediately.
They are valuable power roles - one can see people in the hallways.
SUSPECTS
These people are not vetted, but have cooperated with today's agenda
This person is not vetted and refuses to cooperate with today's agenda.
How can you possibly think the AbsolutBro trio contains Despair? All of them claimed Ordinary Student. If someone has a title of "Ordinary Student," they are Hope. AbsolutBro would have said something if they had a different role.I think you're wrong to assume that we don't need to look at those top three. I think AbsolutBro only stated one person had the title of normal Hope, all he saw were titles, not alignments.
Today's agenda is no different than any other, lynch Despair. I'm cooperating with that fully, as I described before by giving reads, supporting good votes, and arguing against bad ones. Your personal agenda is not Hope's agenda.
If we have four Despair left, it will take two more mislynches for Despair to nearly equal Hope in number, assuming we don't have a third group.
Perhaps it's a bad case of tunneling but, honestly, if Rest and Royal flipped Hope I would look at Makai solely based on his play today. Cornering people into only voting for 4 players, getting angry and threatening to lynch if anyone breaks that rule, and dogging Rest as hard as possible aren't feeling super helpful. The locking it down to only 4 players specifically is what bugs me because it is very possible one of the 'confirmed roles' is lying.
Nah. Imo it's 4>5>3>>>6. If Launch went with the usual styleguides it's about 20-25% Mafia (4.6-5.7 people). Given that 2 of the already removed Despair had really powerful abilities, that has to reflect itself in the numbers.I agree with you that this four people stuff isn't useful, because I don't feel we've cleared all but four people.
My estimate to to the number of despair is based on the size of the game. We had 23 people, there's no way only three were Despair. We had at least four, and I think five is more reasonable. I don't feel that six is outside the realm of possibility, especially if Launch made two people immune to night kills. We're not out of the woods yet.
Gosh claimed Ordinary Student. AbsolutBro investigated him. AbsolutBro didn't counterclaim Gosh. Gosh is cleared.Yup, the next in line after (parts of) us 4 should be goshu (for not having a dedicated clearance post by AB from what I remember) and Makai/Kingkitty.
be real: if I came out, right now, and said I was a Role Cop and that Zip was an Ordinary Student, would anyone honestly believe me? Terrabyte? Goshu? People trust me about as much as they trust them, probably less. I've wandered into the rooms of a bunch of people who aren't generally trusted, and outing Pau and Ty4on didn't exactly endear me to anyone. It's like a sad roulette wheel of Gafia bad luck, where all I'm likely to do is seem even sketchier to people.
I'm advising we play cautiously, and not assume we know everything already. Only Launch knows everything.You are just spreading FUD in an attempt to save yourself.
People have been straight-up cleared and you still think we should consider lynching them? We win this by narrowing the suspect pool. Four people have been cleared. That gives us plenty of time to find the remaining scum among the rest.I'm advising we play cautiously, and not assume we know everything already. Only Launch knows everything.
People have been straight-up cleared and you still think we should consider lynching them? We win this by narrowing the suspect pool. Four people have been cleared. That gives us plenty of time to find the remaining scum among the rest.
That role would suck. Everyone has benign role names. Super High School Level __________. If they show up as Ordinary Student, what do they say when they're seen in the halls? If they just show up as-is they can lie about their abilities and alignment.Considering we have multiple NK immune Hope/Neutral players it wouldn't be a stretch to assume Despair has a role that, when investigated, shows up as an Ordinary Student.
I'm finding myself agreeing with Rest more as time goes on but simply letting those 3 slide by because of AB doesn't feel safe. Until someone flips and their actual role PM is shown I wouldn't automatically trust anyone.
I think you're wrong to assume that we don't need to look at those top three. I think AbsolutBro only stated one person had the title of normal Hope, all he saw were titles, not alignments.
Today's agenda is no different than any other, lynch Despair. I'm cooperating with that fully, as I described before by giving reads, supporting good votes, and arguing against bad ones. Your personal agenda is not Hope's agenda.
If we have four Despair left, it will take two more mislynches for Despair to nearly equal Hope in number, assuming we don't have a third group.
That role would suck. Everyone has benign role names. Super High School Level __________. If they show up as Ordinary Student, what do they say when they're seen in the halls? If they just show up as-is they can lie about their abilities and alignment.
I trusted Czar not because I had proof but because that kind of gambit made it easy for us to test his claims. He got killed on the same day, after all. AbsolutBro is not scum and he cleared three people.It would suck and I'm not saying it does exist but I'm just not feeling the blind trust here and putting all our faith there could be bad. This could also just be me being impartial and not being sure where to go but a blind, 100% trust has burned us in the past ( CzarTim ) and I don't think we want to let it happen again.
Zippedpinhead I can argue as being cleared by AB because of his defense during the time when everyone and their mother tried to lynch Zipped. Goshu/Terra not so much but having AB name drop them has lessened my suspicions of them but not to the point where I would consider them clear.
Either way I won't be voting for Rest today but I'm also not going to stop everyone else from trying to get him lynched.
I trusted Czar not because I had proof but because that kind of gambit made it easy for us to test his claims. He got killed on the same day, after all. AbsolutBro is not scum and he cleared three people.