I would agree that enemy (especially boss) design and combat is superior in DeS. Although it's not on par with DS1. It has a few rough areas (as in not that well designed) but a far cry from all the gank squads and uninspired enemies in DS2.
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Dark Souls II: Scholar of the First Sin |OT| Your weapons are weak, old man
- Thread starter VisceralBowl
- Start date
I would agree that enemy (especially boss) design and combat is superior in DeS. Although it's not on par with DS1. It has a few rough areas (as in not that well designed) but a far cry from all the gank squads and uninspired enemies in DS2.
Moon_frogger
Member
omg 'worth it' is an understatement. the only disclaimer I'd give is that the framerate is a bit hard to handle if you're used to Dark Souls II at rock solid 60 fps. Otherwise pretty much all the other games are a step back in many ways if you ask me. The lore, aesthetic and level design and Encounter difficulty are all superior in Demon's in my opinion. The only thing I'd say is that the Boss AI is pretty easy to cheese in certain parts of the game, maybe moreso than the souls games. Still, for 5 dollars you owe it to yourself to give this game a try.
GreyOcelot
Member
alright, done deal! will give it a shot when i'm done with this game
I don't get the gank squad line people constantly throw out when there are plenty of those situations in dark souls as well.
Augemitbutter
Member
legendary supergame. worth it.
Level design is leagues better than DS2. opening shortcuts and making your way around the world just feel so much more rewarding and valuable. Lots of interesting locations and details and a great cast of characters.
And you won't find yourself constantly wondering if you should just cheese your way through enemies and areas the same way DS2 can make you feel. Combat isn't as refined as DS2, but its still good with some of the very best bosses in the series. Great time to play too since the player base will be up after all the bloodborne and DS2SOTFS hype. Plus this sale. Its a souls game and its still great. You'll have fun.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
So is Bloodborne (probably even more so) for that matter.
Omega Ultimus
Member
Have you tried baiting out that long, rushed overhead attack? You can get 2-3 swings in, and eventually the arm will come off. If fighting him normally doesn't work, this should do it.
I'm going to be the odd man out here and say it's really rough to go back. Once you've tried the more polished titles in the series DeS just feels awkward. I went and tried it after DS1 and DS2, and I couldn't do it. I think it's worse in every way.
now i'm completely fucked. 0 souls, 50% health. No more effigies to buy.
I think I'm giving up
Moon_frogger
Member
bloodborne is pretty on par with demon's souls for framerate although I haven't seen anything as bad as valley of defiled in my playthrough so far (25 hours). I feel like bloodborne has a much worse time during coop though. Dark souls II has me cooping all the time but I'm kind of averse to it in bloodborne because of the framerate in certain areas or when people roll through breakables.
I went back and played through it after beating both Dark Souls 1 and 2. While it's definitely obvious that it's the first game in the series, it's still worth playing through for sure. At 5 dollars, you should definitely buy it.
Moon_frogger
Member
I will say the controls are tuned differently and take some getting used to, more than the other games. They were probably working out kinks, remember it was a completely unique control scheme for action games. I feel your pain but I'm sad you couldn't adjust.
Still, the enemy and level design are in no way worse. They are clearly the best in the series, IMHO. Maybe the lack of bonfires and the hub structure turn some off and I can dig that for sure.
Omega Ultimus
Member
You don't have the ring of binding?
Also, what part of the fight are you stuck on? If you've gotten this far, The Rotten should be doable, with a bit of work.
I'm rolling good, but sometimes I get caught or roll too late and I'm done. Another chunk of health gone. Then I go back, get poisoned because of some bullshit reason, and there I am, trying to heal at the same time. I suck.
and let me check for the binding.
Omega Ultimus
Member
Yeah, getting poisoned makes the whole fight much tougher. Check for any items that reduce or cure poison, pop some lifegems as soon as you get in, or equip a shield with poison resistance before you get in. Also make sure you're at the second bonfire in the area (much closer to the fog gate).
Otherwise, getting hit happens, and you'll eventually get the rhythm of the boss fight down. If too stressed today, try it tomorrow. Getting some rest works well for a lot of people.
Ring of binding is in the chest after the drake (dragon thing) near the Chapel fog gate to the Cathedral of Blue.
The controls, the enemy design, the level design. I think they're all worse. Everyone gushes over Tower of Latria and that is the worst area in any souls game IMO. I'll gladly play through Blighttown or the Gutter over that any day. Everything looks the same and it's so confusing to navigate. I just don't understand the appeal.
I'm guessing you played DeS first? It seems to be a theme from what I've seen. Everyone seems to love the one they played first the best, though I seem to break that mold. I played them DS1 > DS2 > DeS > BB, but in order from best to worst IMO it's DS2 > BB > DS1 >>> DeS.
lowhighkang_LHK
Member
Fuck those ghost guys who wield those dual blades in the sunken king DLC. Any tips? Especially in the lower area with those ground spikes.
Lumpy Onion
Member
Destroy the corpses that are keeping them ghosts. You should see them laying over tombs and they have a reddish smoke coming out of them iirc. Once the corpse is gone they can be killed.
Iced_Eagle
Member
You should definitely do a detour and get that. It limits your HP reduction to 75% from 50% max when hollow. Very useful when you're in a situation like the one you're in.
Location:
Right outside the entrance to the Dragonrider boss there was a heide night sitting down next to a chest. Kill the heide night and get the ring in the chest. By this point I imagine you already beat that boss, so just teleport to the second bonfire in Heide's, and then head down and outside and you should see the chest dead ahead. Video here: http://www.gameinformer.com/b/featu...r-of-the-first-sin-heides-tower-of-flame.aspx
Now, as for the human effigy problem... I would recommend going to the Lost Bastille, and if you know where the blacksmith is there, or the dogs at the bottom of the ladders, then farm those with any armor you may have which increases item discovery. They only have a 3% chance to drop, but according to the wiki, there are 8 dogs, so if you do a few runs, you should at least be able to get one or two. You could also go through the list on the Wiki here and see if there are any free ones you missed. For my method, you only need one to get started.
If you'd rather not farm, you could use a bonfire asthetic at Majula and kill the skeletons below the mansion. They drop effigies.
The other way you can become human is by helping other players as a shade with small white soapstone or regular white soapstone. If you succeed in helping them out, you'll come back as human. You won't have an effigy, but it will essentially reset your life counter at least and you'll be back at 100% and could use other methods to get effigies.
Once you have your human effigy, I think you should just run a PVP fight club. To me, that's the best and most fun way to get effigies. To do this, you'll need to have access to the Iron Keep Bridge (which you should by now). A fight club is just a semi-organized PVP setup. As the host, you continuously bring in red phantoms, and they fight each other for Great Honor And Glory. Each time one dies, you get an effigy. You basically don't have to do shit but keep bringing in phantom's and watching them fight, though if you have an AOE healing spell like Warmth, you should absolutely bring it for the victor who will need some healing (and red invaders can't use healing items).
To run a fight club, do the following:
1) Make sure you have some Prism Stones. Since you farmed dogs previously, you should have some souls now in case you need to buy them from the cat merchant in Majula (I believe that's who sells them at least). Chances are you got some earlier in the game though, and just never used them.
2) If you have the spell Warmth (or any other AOE healing spell), then absolutely equip it, and be sure to have some herbs to recharge spell uses. However, you may not have it, and that's okay. Hopefully someone in the club will have it. This is for when someone finishes their battle they can get back to full health since red invaders can't use estus flasks.
3) In the Iron Keep Bridge, go up from the bonfire and then across the bridge. Halfway across the bridge on your left is a small alcove. Place your prism stones as if you are blocking off the alcove from the rest of the bridge (just place like 5 or 6 stones in a line as if the railing on the bridge kept going straight). This is to mark off that alcove as a safe zone, and is basically the #1 indicator to people you summon that this is a fight club.
4) Okay, once your stones are down, use an effigy and go human. Now, run around the bridge and spawn all red soapstone invaders that you can see. You need to be fast, because there will be a few people doing the exact same thing you are, so you'll get a lot of "Sorry, sign has already been used" errors a lot. Almost everyone on the bridge which uses a red soapstone is there for PVP, and your prism stones are basically the universal signal for a fight club. Unless they're an asshole, even though they're red, they won't attack you.
5) Once you get 2 spawned in, they'll know what's up and start dueling on the bridge. As the host, don't interfere, keep spawning in red soapstone invaders to keep the club rolling, and be sure to gesture and what not for victories for good measure.
For every red invader which dies, you gain one effigy. Assuming you can keep the invaders coming, you'll generally get about 1 effigy every 30-45 seconds. Hang out and enjoy watching some sweet PVP action. If someone ever starts attacking the host, generally the other invaders will defend you, because that's not cool. When you're done with the fight club, the most polite way of ending it, is just to stop summoning, and then when you have the last red invader, challenge him to a duel. By this point you should have a good chunk of effigies to go through, so who cares if you lose and need to use another. Better than just banishing in my opinion.
You do this, you'll have shit ton of effigies, should have fun in PVP to take your mind off the Rotten and also will have a good chunk of souls as well.
ok, I found the ring and it helps a shit load. I'm quitting for the day. Now, I'm constantly getting him to half health and below and the AOE slam is kicking my ass.
toastyToast
Member
It's near the dragon rider fight. There's a heide knight leaning against a chest. It's in there
sweet, definitely going to try this. Thanks for the advice!
Iced_Eagle
Member
You're welcome!
I made a quick edit to my post as well on getting effigies. You can use a bonfire asthetic at Majula and kill skeletons in the basement of the manor as they drop effigies, or you can also become a white phantom and help out someone in multiplayer. When you return to your world, you'll be human again. You won't get an effigy for doing that, but you'll be human and it will help with the health problem.
But if you haven't run a fight club yet, I definitely think you should. It's pretty damn fun IMO to watch how different players do PVP.
Moon_frogger
Member
Hahaha it's cool man. Dark souls 2 is my favorite as well, so we're both in the minority there. Honestly, I see where you're coming from. DSII is the most polished of them all for sure. Even just the way the menus transition is just so...pretty. It's also the only one that really grabbed me with the lore and PVP. yeah, des was my first and I'm willing to admit it probably colors my perception. Dark Souls is my least favorite entry for sure.
i've been dropping my soapstone around the this area and others and no one is clicking it for some reason. I hope I'm not overleveled
Omega Ultimus
Member
i've been dropping my soapstone around the this area and others and no one is clicking it for some reason. I hope I'm not overleveled
What's your soul memory amount (level doesn't matter)?
Moon_frogger
Member
i've been dropping my soapstone around the this area and others and no one is clicking it for some reason. I hope I'm not overleveled
you have the large or small soapstone? also areas appropriate for your level are highlighted in orange on the warp screen.
Schweinehund
Member
Demon Souls is still worth playing through but I don't agree with the sentiment it's the best of the series, even though it was the first one I had played. The upgrade system and world tendency is archaic. Unlike Dark Souls I think you're better off reading some general information about the game on the wiki, because you're not going to find out on your own how world tendency works.
I wouldn't call World Tendency archaic. It's just outright bad and ill-conceived, directly working against several game mechanics for no real reason.
However, anybody that really liked any of the other three games should absolutely, unquestionably, give Demon's Souls a try for $5. Totally worth it. Lots of cool shit in that game.
around 320k last checked around 3PM today
I have both and I never knew that. If it's not orange, then I'm too high?
Don't think I could disagree more, I love the stable 60fps. Seeing all of the architecture and level designs in crisp HD is awesome. There are moments where I have decided just to walk around and admire the scenery, even though I've seen all of these zones many times before in the PS3 version.
And as far as the summons go, I think it was a good idea that they added in extra summons around the place, it will give the game legs if the community ever dwindles. And remember that not every summon makes the encounters easier. Some bosses gain a damage/health boost if you take a certain NPC in to the fight. The Last Giant reacts to Pate for example.
Yes, buy buy buy.
Iced_Eagle
Member
i've been dropping my soapstone around the this area and others and no one is clicking it for some reason. I hope I'm not overleveled
Are you trying to do the fight club, or are you trying to help people out?
If you're trying to run a fight club, you shouldn't be dropping a soapstone at all. What you need to do is summon the red soapstone invaders. You need to be human to see the soapstones other people drop.
If you're doing white soapstone to become human, then just check your bonfire for one which has a gold outline. That shows you where there is the most activity for your soul level. If you've beaten that area, go there and put it down outside a boss fight and you should get summoned within 5 minutes.
*Edit*
No, if it's not orange, it just means it's not the most popular with other players at the moment. Doesn't mean there aren't people there, just that it may take a bit longer to get summoned or to summon someone.
320k is peanuts. You're not too high level. You should definitely be able to find people at that range. Granted, you may not find a whole lot of people interested in PVP which may make the fight club idea a bit harder to pull off. I'm at SL155 ish (around 2.5-3 million SM) and the Iron Keep is always filled with people interested in PVP, but SL150 is the community meta for PVP, so it makes sense why there's so many people there.
Moon_frogger
Member
I'd like to hear more in depth about this. I always thought world tendency to be a stroke of genius, although more in concept than execution. I also don't think throwing yourself off a cliff 50 times or whatever is a valid playstyle by any means. I don't know much about it to be honest other than it was a dynamic way to alter the foundation of the game in interesting ways.
Me too. I like (in retrospect) how this made the game so much less deterministic -- so much less like a game, but at the time I didn't like how I had to unplug the network cable to get things done. =/
Every time you log online, it resets your world tendency to whatever the average player online is at, or something. That's just completely, insanely bad design. I... why? Why would they do that? It strikes me as one of the worst-conceived ideas I've ever seen in a game.
You pretty much have to play in one giant session, or play offline, for it to work as it should. Otherwise, you're at the mercy of whatever the servers are at.
Insight was a better implementation of the basic idea of World Tendency, though even that has its fair share of problems. It keeps some of the same concept, while decoupling it from online play.
sorry if I confused you, but I meant PVE co-op. I've been looking at what I think is popular for help and no one is summoning or choosing my sign. I'll give it a shot tomorrow.
Omega Ultimus
Member
That's weird, because your soul memory seems to be appropriate for that place. Hopefully tomorrow will yield better results.
Cause that covenant system is so well designed.
Yeah, banging your head against a boss: 100/1 odds you will crush Rotten tomorrow in your first 2 tries. Good luck have batman.
lowhighkang_LHK
Member
Yeah, I saw the corpses for the first encounter, but not for the second one. So I just booked it out of there and found the shortcut back to the bonfire. I'll go back and seek my revenge.
iRAWRasaurus
Banned
Late but are you in the covenant of champions?
I was looking for this info a page or two earlier. Has the PvP really moved onto 150? That's disappointing, you can have your cake and eat it there too, compared to 120 (or even lower) where you really need to make some tough decisions around equipment and abilities. SL120 was pretty great in vanilla DSII, both at Dragon Aerie and Iron Keep. Invading had never been better.
Ah well.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
I feel like Bloodborne is their worst effort in terms of performance. It's not like the whole game is Blighttown, but it definitely feels sub-30 more often than not. There are also plenty of weird sound glitches, some hitching, and certain conditions that trigger that trigger the game to go into like 3 fps slow-motion for a few moments.
It's a damn shame, because I think it's a brilliant game and am currently working my way through NG+.
What's your agility? These are the breakpoints for rolling i-frames. It being too low might be the problem.
iRAWRasaurus
Banned
Nah. The covenant of champions prevent you from summoning people. I thought maybe thats why you couldnt summon people to help.
hmm imo you want your agility to be atleast 96 or higher, which is the equivalent of a medium roll in Dark Souls.
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