Support NeoGAF

[sobaka770]

I like Dark Souls 2 a lot more than Dark Souls 1. /shrug

DS2 is anything but a cash grab. The amount of content in this game is staggering, the combat mechanics and build diversity are better than DS1, and while I haven't finished the game I've read that no areas reach the lows that some DS1 areas do (Lost Izalith yuck).

It may have been a better game had Miyazaki been involved, but it's the farthest thing from a cash grab. It's a legitimate attempt to create a good sequel, and I think it succeeded for the most part. Plus every franchise needs to branch out from its original creator sooner or later. Resident Evil is no longer a Mikami game, BioShock is no longer a Levine game, and MGS will no longer be a Kojima game after MGSV (that last one really hurts, though).

I don't get why people hate Lost Izalith? Is it because of huge lava damage

Spoiler

(I got the reduce lava damage ring from the Centipede boss just before so that didn't apply to me)

? The whole level is very short, the path is clearly visible, unless you feel overly brave, and there aren't a lot of enemies.

What I hated though was the n-th run to the area boss

Spoiler

Bed of Chaos

whose mechanics are rubbish and least fun in the game imo.

In any case, maybe in comparison to other areas, this one is not as interesting or imaginative but hardly "terrible". Not every level can be

Spoiler

Painted World of Ariamis <3

, I can't believe that most people will likely never find it.

 

[cleveridea]

Heh a lot of reasons people are trashing DS2 are why I actually like the game.

I have bought CE for demon souls, DS1, DS2 and bloodborne and love the games but DESPITE the difficulty not because of it.

People are entitled to their negative opinions on DS2 but its just opinions - some of the negatives people are posting are positives for me.

For the first 20 hours of BB I thought I couldnt go back to the DS games, but later on I ended up wanting to go back and play DS2 for the different gameplay style (particularly the emphasis of magic, and not late game like BB)

 

[SymbiantXenos]

Bone Lords as weak as pinwheel.

Spoiler

just look out for the horde spawning

 

[JPS Kai]

I just bought this for PS4 and as soon as I get home with it my buddy tells me that he's been playing it and it has the weapon durability bug still. That's hot garbage. I'm not sure I even want to keep it now. I might actually take it back to the store.

Are you talking about the loss of durability when you swing at a corpse? That sounds like it's intentional and is there to prevent people from just mashing the attack button.

 

[XANDER CAGE]

I don't get why people hate Lost Izalith? Is it because of huge lava damage

Spoiler

(I got the reduce lava damage ring from the Centipede boss just before so that didn't apply to me)

? The whole level is very short, the path is clearly visible, unless you feel overly brave, and there aren't a lot of enemies.

What I hated though was the n-th run to the area boss

Spoiler

Bed of Chaos

whose mechanics are rubbish and least fun in the game imo.

In any case, maybe in comparison to other areas, this one is not as interesting or imaginative but hardly "terrible". Not every level can be

Spoiler

Painted World of Ariamis <3

, I can't believe that most people will likely never find it.

That's kind of what sucks about Lost Izalith, though - the path is obvious, it's just tedious. It's short, and feels superfluous, especially with the worst boss in the game at the end. It feels unimaginative and rote compared to the masterful Anor Londo/Painted World combo preceding it.

Also back before DS1's first major patch, there were so many more jumping dragon asses. So many of the fuckers. It wasn't fun.

DS2 is front-loaded with a few Lost Izaliths, in my opinion, something I hope the enemy remixing will sort out. So far I'm not thrilled.

 

[Dance Inferno]

Repost -

All of those franchises will drastically suffer (RE anyone?) with the loss of Mikami, and will surely suffer with the loss of Levine/Kojima.

You might not be able to tell from my avatar, but I absolutely adore Resident Evil, and I think RE5 and RE6 are two of the best games in the series (after REmake, of course).

They're not games that Mikami would have ever made, but I enjoy them a lot more than most of the RE Mikami games. Changes isn't always bad, you know.

 

[Wereroku]

Are you talking about the loss of durability when you swing at a corpse? That sounds like it's intentional and is there to prevent people from just mashing the attack button.

No durability loss is doubled because of the doubled frame rate. Hitting corpses just make it even worse.

 

[ArynCrinn]

You might not be able to tell from my avatar, but I absolutely adore Resident Evil, and I think RE5 and RE6 are two of the best games in the series (after REmake, of course).

They're not games that Mikami would have ever made, but I enjoy them a lot more than most of the RE Mikami games. Changes isn't always bad, you know.

You and me and totally different then, imo, hasn't been a great new RE since RE4. But...opinions and all that.

 

[ironcreed]

I just wanted to note that the durability thing has not been an issue for me so far. Seems like it was before when I played it on PS3. All I am noticing is that having 1080p and 60 fps is a night and day difference and makes playing a Souls game feel better than it ever has.

 

[Dance Inferno]

You and me and totally different then, imo, hasn't been a great new RE since RE4. But...opinions and all that.

Fair enough. Most people shit on RE6 and I understand why, but I appreciate the things it does well and can overlook the things it does badly.

It might be the same situation for DS2.

 

[Spiritreaver]

Hyperbole, hyperbole everywhere.

Pretty easy to spot, this thread is reeking with the stench of it.

 

[Wereroku]

I just wanted to note that the durability thing has not been an issue for me so far. Seems like it was before when I played it on PS3. All I am noticing is that having 1080p and 60 fps is a night and day difference and makes playing a Souls game feel better than it ever has.

Certain weapons got hurt the more than others but I know they upped the durability on several things in this version right?

Fair enough. Most people shit on RE6 and I understand why, but I appreciate the things it does well and can overlook the things it does badly.

It might be the same situation for DS2.

Resident Evil 6 got bit by it's own ambition. They should have just made it into 2 game and fleshed out the parts a bit more.

 

[UpDownLeftRight]

When do the bosses get hard in this game? The first 5 or so have been an absolute joke and I don't remember them being this easy. I have high ADP but hardly any of my other stats have been raised yet and these bosses just seem slow and generally passive coming of the back of BB. I used to find this game too hard honestly. Have bosses been nerfed in this release?

 

[ironcreed]

Certain weapons got hurt the more than others but I know they upped the durability on several things in this version right?

I am not sure if they did or not. I just got a couple of hours in last night, but it was fine. Of course my play style is slow and methodical countering and I don't waste swings. I also rest at bonfires on regular intervals, but not every time I pass one.

 

[Manus]

When do the bosses get hard in this game? The first 5 or so have been an absolute joke and I don't remember them being this easy. I have high ADP but hardly any of my other stats have been raised yet and these bosses just seem slow and generally passive coming of the back of BB. I used to find this game too hard honestly. Have bosses been nerfed in this release?

Have you fought the ruined sentinels solo yet?

 

[Joey Ravn]

What's the sweet spot for AGI for a player who rolls, but mostly depends on the shield to deflect damage? 105 (13 iFrames)? I like having the option to roll away from a blow if I know that I'll get staggered if it lands (because I don't have enough stamina) or that it will still inflict substantial damage (elemental weapons, etc.).

I don't care about PvP. I only play PvE, if that makes any difference.

 

[Moofers]

Are you talking about the loss of durability when you swing at a corpse? That sounds like it's intentional and is there to prevent people from just mashing the attack button.

No I'm talking about an issue with the PC port of DaS2 that I wanted them to fix for this version where weapons decay based on how much contact  they have with enemy hit boxes. Twice the frames of animation, twice the contact. Huge oversight...

The game was one of my favorites last year, but this is just a big enough deal where it could make an already hard game become in enjoyable for me. I'm still mulling it over...

 

[UpDownLeftRight]

Have you fought the ruined sentinels solo yet?

Yep, two tries although in the original release fifty tries wasn't enough to beat them. They're the reason I was wondering if they nerfed them.

 

[ArynCrinn]

What's the sweet spot for AGI for a player who rolls, but mostly depends on the shield to deflect damage? 105 (13 iFrames)? I like having the option to roll away from a blow if I know that I'll get staggered if it lands (because I don't have enough stamina) or that it will still inflict substantial damage (elemental weapons, etc.).

I don't care about PvP. I only play PvE, if that makes any difference.

Get up to 105-115 Agility, then your i-frames should be fine. If only the hitboxes were fixed by this too...

 

[Steel]

Yep, two tries although in the original release fifty tries wasn't enough to beat them. They're the reason I was wondering if they nerfed them.

Bosses are easier on subsequent playthroughs. Once you figure out how to beat them, you don't generally forget. True for all the souls games.

 

[Neoweee]

Yep, two tries although in the original release fifty tries wasn't enough to beat them. They're the reason I was wondering if they nerfed them.

No changes. Knowing what you're doing goes a long way, especially with regards to upgrading early. Like several of the other multi-enemy boss battles in the series, nuking one down fast is the best strategy, and characters built with extensive experience can do so much more damage.

Also, the dull ember relocation makes a huge difference, if you used it.

EDIT: Only like 2 or 3 bosses of the forty were ever needed.

 

[Victrix]

Should I hit the DLC areas before or after finishing up the main story stuff?

 

[cpp_is_king]

I had a chance to play this on PS4 last night. A few of my observations:

* WTF at dodging in this game. iframes are shit. I don't remember it being this bad, maybe Bloodborne has spoiled me. Does anyone know how many iframes you get in Bloodborne? I'm playing a Knight and I'm not putting fuck-all in anything but ADP until I get my AGL up to 92 or so.

* Something is... off about the graphics. I don't know what it is, but the world looks too colorful, too crisp, too.. something. I dont' want to say cartoony, but for some reason I keep thinking of WoW. I mean I know it's not that bad, but I just remember playing this on PS3 and everything looking more gritty. Usually that would be a bad thing, but idk.. I can't put my finger on it but it doesn't feel right.

* Controls are weird. Why did they decide to use Options button instead of R3 for displaying help?

* Why is the sex change coffin blocked off? That's... weird, it seems like such an arbitrary decision. And there's still monsters down there!

 

[Sid]

Should I hit the DLC areas before or after finishing up the main story stuff?

After,they're pretty tough

 

[Sinatar]

* Why is the sex change coffin blocked off? That's... weird, it seems like such an arbitrary decision. And there's still monsters down there!

Because there is an estus flask shard in that area now.

 

[sprinkles]

I never played the DLC on my PC version as it never went on sale. So I am tempted to get the DX11 version for the price of the old Season Pass.

But as I have to start from the beginning again I have one question: how long does it take to reach the DLC areas?

 

[Victrix]

I had a chance to play this on PS4 last night. A few of my observations:

* WTF at dodging in this game. iframes are shit. I don't remember it being this bad, maybe Bloodborne has spoiled me. Does anyone know how many iframes you get in Bloodborne? I'm playing a Knight and I'm not putting fuck-all in anything but ADP until I get my AGL up to 92 or so.

Get your Agility to 100 for DS style fast roll iframes.

 

[Easy_D]

With all the iframe talk it would be neat if they removed iframes completely and relied solely on hitboxes and removed grab attacks. Or refined them. It's a dumb stat to begin with.

 

[Spiritreaver]

With all the iframe talk it would be neat if they removed iframes completely and relied solely on hitboxes and removed grab attacks. Or refined them. It's a dumb stat to begin with.

I actually think invincibility frames look silly as fuck especially when it's paired with rolling. It was why I went tanky in DS1.

Just something off about rolling into an enemy while they attack and not taking any damage.

BB isn't so bad as there's a lot of sidestepping, but just rolling to avoid shit looks awkward as hell.

 

[cpp_is_king]

With all the iframe talk it would be neat if they removed iframes completely and relied solely on hitboxes and removed grab attacks. Or refined them. It's a dumb stat to begin with.

I think that would totally break the mechanics of the game. Every single boss in every game would have to be completely redesigned if there were no iframes, and I'm not convinced at *all* that it would make for a better experience.

 

[Easy_D]

I actually think invincibility frames look silly as fuck especially when it's paired with rolling. It was why I went tanky in DS1.

Just something off about rolling into an enemy while they attack and not taking any damage.

BB isn't so bad as there's a lot of sidestepping, but just rolling to avoid shit looks awkward as hell.

I think that would totally break the mechanics of the game. Every single boss in every game would have to be completely redesigned if there were no iframes, and I'm not convinced at *all* that it would make for a better experience.

I'm willing to compromise. Make it a set defined thing that isn't ruled over by stats, have iframes but only have one "true" value, design bosses after that.

 

[Neoweee]

With all the iframe talk it would be neat if they removed iframes completely and relied solely on hitboxes and removed grab attacks. Or refined them. It's a dumb stat to begin with.

I'd like to see that as well, but I think the DS2 system is the best way to achieve build variety. Tons of free invincibility for all pushes melee strats, while no invincibility ends up pushing ranged and zoning builds. Making it stat based allows people to specialize in either style, but the underlying mechanics are not portrayed well, and people will have giant preferences for play styles they used in the other games.

BB is the first "Souls" game to have set invincibility, but it led to poor build variety without making boss fights more interesting and balanced.

 

[Steel]

I'm willing to compromise. Make it a set defined thing that isn't ruled over by stats, have iframes but only have one "true" value, design bosses after that.

Like every other souls game?

 

[Neoweee]

Like every other souls game?

No, DS and DeS have it depend on gear weight %, at cutoffs for roll types.

 

[Steel]

No, DS and DeS have it depend on gear weight %, at cutoffs for roll types.

Ah, that's what you mean. I thought he was talking about agility governing Iframes. I think weight % with poise was the best way to do it. That way if you go with a tanky build you dodge worse but can shrug off hits.

 

[Easy_D]

No, DS and DeS have it depend on gear weight %, at cutoffs for roll types.

Damn, I completely blanked out on that when I made my post, it is kind of a mess to deal with the different rolls depending on armour sets. Man what a hot mess, I'm glad I don't work at From, I'd mess the games up :lol

 

[addyb]

lmao, the DS2 hate is seriously so ridiculous. The game is incredible.

Glad to see most of you guys are enjoying it. Hope those who were swayed against it because of absurd downplaying of its quality picked it up anyways and is enjoying it.

Can't wait to pick up a copy soon and play through it for the billionth time.

Hows it run on PS4? Any issues?

I'm baffled by the hate. I've sunk around 15 hours into it since Sunday. Went in with low expectations due to numerous people saying it was poor and to be honest it's blown me away. Ok the opening couple of areas aren't exactly inspiring and a couple of boss fights have been less than epic but to me it's just more souls which is always a good thing.

Finished no man's wharf and bastille earlier and now in sinners rise. Just got the strength to wield the bastard sword and halberd. Really enjoying it.

 

[gelf]

No durability loss is doubled because of the doubled frame rate. Hitting corpses just make it even worse.

Its actually looking to me that the behavior at sub 30fps was the unintended design otherwise they would have likely fixed it by now. I think they want weapons to degrade fast so your forced to have more then one ready to use at all times.

 

[phoenixyz]

Its actually looking to me that the behavior at sub 30fps was the unintended design otherwise they would have likely fixed it by now. I think they want weapons to degrade fast so your forced to have more then one ready to use at all times.

Wat? And why is this not "fixed" in vanilla DS2 then? Which was released in march last year?

<e> and of course the DX9 version of SotFS

 

[Hugstable]

Just started playing this last night and I'm really enjoying it. It felt much better to me than Vanilla and I remember always having trouble with lots of enemies just randomly trying to kill me, but in FotFG I was able to pull many of the enemies solo. It seems overall much better to me. Also they give you so many weapons right at the start of the game that you can switch out that I don't see how anyone could be complaining about the durability, let alone the fact that there are bonfires everywhere.

 

[sobaka770]

I'm baffled by the hate. I've sunk around 15 hours into it since Sunday. Went in with low expectations due to numerous people saying it was poor and to be honest it's blown me away. Ok the opening couple of areas aren't exactly inspiring and a couple of boss fights have been less than epic but to me it's just more souls which is always a good thing.

Finished no man's wharf and bastille earlier and now in sinners rise. Just got the strength to wield the bastard sword and halberd. Really enjoying it.

I've only "started" DS2 as I've finished my 50+ hour first run at DS. I can tell you already after just 5 hours with the game that while "hate" is probably unjustified, the game is definitely palpably worse than DS.

For me it's the usual argument: world cohesion. It's honestly a bit jarring seeing the two games back-to-back. Lordran made sense. I could feel its geography, verticality, connections. After first hours in DS2 I'm not feeling the world. I go left there's a castle, I go right there's a huge tower (which cannot be seen from the hub just a few meters away). Areas do not feel lived-in, and the connections are all long corridors or caves without much thought. Straight from the onset DS2 feels "gamey" where I think of the areas as game-levels rather than locations.

The positives are there too: my dual-wield build is challenging but feasible, I like the improved graphics and (don't kill me) lighter tone and more exposition from NPCs. But I think Dark Souls is more about discovery rather than boss fights or RPG elements, and I don't feel that I'm discovering Boletaria like I felt with Lordran, but rather playing a game. It's a good game though.

 

[Easy_D]

Wat? And why is this not "fixed" in vanilla DS2 then? Which was released in march last year?

<e> and of course the DX9 version of SotFS

Both PC versions have the same durability. The behavior is only seen in the PS360 versions.

 

[Resident_UA]

I only played bloodborne and gave up on both demon souls and dark souls 1 because they perform and look terrible on consoles. Keeping that in mind, could anyone explain to me why dark souls 2 is not as good and the first 2 games?

 

[Kapow]

Is it just me or is the camera a bit wonky? It seems like theres not a gradual progression with the speed the camera moves and it jumps from really slow to really fast. Might just be because I'm coming from the PC version...

 

[Mogwai]

Is it just me or is the camera a bit wonky? It seems like theres not a gradual progression with the speed the camera moves and it jumps from really slow to really fast. Might just be because I'm coming from the PC version...

I've been wondering the same. It's crap compared to Bloodborne. But I think it was the same in both the PS3 and PC version.

 

[phoenixyz]

Both PC versions have the same durability. The behavior is only seen in the PS360 versions.

Oh, I didn't know the DX9 version had 60fps.

 

[idonteven]

giant lord is destroying me...hardest boss so far

edit:nvm fought him the wrong way

 

[Ayt]

I only played bloodborne and gave up on both demon souls and dark souls 1 because they perform and look terrible on consoles. Keeping that in mind, could anyone explain to me why dark souls 2 is not as good and the first 2 games?

If you enjoyed the game play at all in Demon's or Dark Souls then you should definitely buy the game.

 

[duck_sauce]

I only played bloodborne and gave up on both demon souls and dark souls 1 because they perform and look terrible on consoles. Keeping that in mind, could anyone explain to me why dark souls 2 is not as good and the first 2 games?

Not as good does not mean it is a bad game. Comparision between DemS, DS and DS2 are nitpicking of the highest degree. Still very good games. I think the main reason for saying that DS2 is not as good is the fact, das the boss encounter are not as creative as in previous games and the world design is kind of uninspired in DS2.


Still...keep in mind...DS2 still a pretty great games and miles ahead of anything that is released all year long.

 

[sirap]

So...are the graphical upgrades worth a purchase on PC? I've looked at a few youtube vids but all I could see is some color grading that sucks donkey balls. They've completely blown out the highlights in Majula, and some of the tweaks to indoor colors looks weird.