DeepEnigma
Gold Member
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Death Stranding Review Thread
- Thread starter Mista
- Start date
SS501
Neo Member
I don't know why people are complaining that it's getting review bombed and implying that it's getting a lot of undeserved 0 scores when the actual truth is that it's getting raided by both sides. Blind fanboys have been scoring it a 10/10 since the moment the user reviews became available and blind haters have been scoring it 0 since the same exact moment.
If there were no haters in there the game would have a 11/10 userscore right now due to how many people are rating it a blind 10/10 without even having played it and nobody would complain about this (some of them even admit it with crap like "installing it right now what a masterpiece 10/10" or "played 30 minutes and it's really the game of the generation", others even admit to scoring it a 10/10 just to fight back the 0/10 reviews).
All in all i think the end result will be closer to the truth and i am predicting a 6.5 ~ 7.0 when everything settles down.
That's also close to my personal score so far. Played almost 14 hours in total, i really wanted to love it but i just can't. It's very tedious, there are some moments of brilliance here and there but it's all getting buried under unfun controls and boring fetch quests. The story is intriguing but the writing itself is abysmal.
I can't say with confidence that i am having a fun time and i can't see myself finishing it if it ends up being more of the same for another 60 hours unless the story hooks me in hard. I am hoping that more gameplay mechanics will be unlocked soon to make my experience at least a bit more bearable cause i really want to finish it.
If there were no haters in there the game would have a 11/10 userscore right now due to how many people are rating it a blind 10/10 without even having played it and nobody would complain about this (some of them even admit it with crap like "installing it right now what a masterpiece 10/10" or "played 30 minutes and it's really the game of the generation", others even admit to scoring it a 10/10 just to fight back the 0/10 reviews).
All in all i think the end result will be closer to the truth and i am predicting a 6.5 ~ 7.0 when everything settles down.
That's also close to my personal score so far. Played almost 14 hours in total, i really wanted to love it but i just can't. It's very tedious, there are some moments of brilliance here and there but it's all getting buried under unfun controls and boring fetch quests. The story is intriguing but the writing itself is abysmal.
I can't say with confidence that i am having a fun time and i can't see myself finishing it if it ends up being more of the same for another 60 hours unless the story hooks me in hard. I am hoping that more gameplay mechanics will be unlocked soon to make my experience at least a bit more bearable cause i really want to finish it.
FranXico
Member
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Eiknarf
Banned
So he’s saying the mediocre User Score at Meteoritic is probably accurate once you get rid of the purposeful yet unwarranted 0s and the purposeful yet unwarranted 10s... At the end of the day, all the other scores will still probably average at around 6.5
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Javthusiast
Banned
He makes good points, and after playing the game myself I agree with them.
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Leave the 1's and the 9's though. Or wait, maybe we need to remove those too... oh where to we draw the line?
Come on people, user meta is not our first rodeo, so please stop trying to litmus this as a verifiable phenomenon that you know your asses will damn well flippy floppy when it comes to your games/system of choice.
Lionel Richie
Member
This makes no fucking sense, the amount of mental gymnastics you had to do to arrive at this conclusion is staggering. It got a lot of 10/10? Yeah, it also got a lot of shit scores. A game that features two 10/10's, a 6/10 and a 4/10 will have the same average as a game that receive four 7.5/10, you can make the same point both ways. Every time you can make an argument both ways, you have a moronic argument. You could say those two perfect scores are overhyping it and don't reflect the real game and that the other scores are actually more important for exposing some pretty considerable flaws. The game that receives more middle grounds scores isn't necessarily "safe", and besides this is an exercise in imbecility, it's extreme cherry picking. Luigi's Mansion 3 got 86 positive reviews and 3 mixed ones, Death Stranding got 67 positive reviews and 14 mixed ones. Like I said, you could make the argument that being overall more generally liked is more important, while you could also say that the peaks and valleys scores of Death Stranding holds more weight. What matters is that reaching conclusions from those differences (Luigi's Mansion is SAFE, Death Stranding is VANGUARD) feels like you're shoehorning actual facts to support your narrative. And all of that to shield yourself from the possibility that maybe a rock tripping simulator isn't very good.
Explosive Zombie
Banned
But we already know the Luigi's Mansion 3 is safe and that death stranding is not and we can even see that in the text of the reviews and how it's basically a best of the franchise not really doing anything especially new. So my view doesn't just bear out in theory it's actually true and few people would dispute it. 14 mixed reviews when nearly 70 are positive isn't that amazing to me. Maybe if death stranding had 14 negative reviews your point might hold more water to me but the negative reviews are the definite outliers. In fact 48 critics have given death stranding an 9 or above so the fact is the scores your citing are a statistical anomaly that are dragging down an average below a game that isn't getting such rave reviews and if you go beyond just numbers there's also the text no one is calling Luigi's Mansion 3 game of the gen but plenty of people are suggesting that for death stranding. You're both ways argument by the way is just total nonsense my argument wasn't only in favor of things that are better than their score says my argument was a general disdain for cumulative scores and how they aren't very useful except to people who don't have time to look beyond that.
Edit: the idea that mental gymnastics are required to notice a game is receiving more perfect scores than usual and that that fact is more interesting than it having slightly more mixed reviews than some other games is kind of laughable. what I'm saying has been common sense when it comes to movies forever but because video games rarely endure an actual spectrum of review scores I can see why someone secluded only to the video game side of media would consider this mental gymnastics.
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imsosleepy
Member
I already had my money worth in the first 2 hours of the game. The gameplay is great. Maybe u find it horrible but that does not make it bad. And geez. Sure its walking from a to be but its so much more then a walkijg sim. But hey just dont buy it..nobody forces u
Jigsaah
Member
I watched for an hour if that helps...
Also, I said I wasn't impressed so far. Not saying the game is bad...but you damage controlling it like this isn't helping your cause either.
Explosive Zombie
Banned
actually wasn't referring to you there's a post directly above mine with a guy is actually judging the gameplay based on a stream. Also it's not damage control I'm literally in here to argue because I believe my point is right I haven't bought the game I don't even own a PS4 anymore I'm strictly a PC gamer. I'm also not even a big kojima fan his only game I really like the lot was metal gear solid 5. This will be a good guide for you in the future when it comes to me arguing I argue things if I think what people are doing is wrong not because I have a personal investment in what's being discussed though it's possible I will at some point in the future have an actual personal investment in the product being discussed it is not the reason I usually argue about these things. in fact if I truly enjoyed something I often don't really care what other people think.
Jigsaah
Member
....look man I'm on the 3rd time reading this. It's Friday...my mind is fried from work and I can only guess English must not be your first language cuz your syntax is throwing me off. The gist i get is that you came in here to argue and you were responding to someone else.
Ok well that's your first mistake. We debate here, arguing sounds so angry. Are you angry? You don't look angry. Understand that a lot of people make their decision over whether they will buy a game or not based on much less than 30 minutes of a stream.
Personally, I've read like 5 or 6 reviews, watching now over an hour of stream not necessarily to decide IF I'm going to buy the game. It's whether to get it on PS4 or PC.
FranXico
Member
This is the OC summary of Death Stranding:
Looking at its actual distribution, even a conservative estimate gives it over 70 as an average score (hint: it still is close to 80).
Even if you consider that the peaks and valleys scores hold more weight (17 scores of 95% or higher versus 4 "shit" scores of 40% or lower), there are way more peaks than valleys in the case of Death Stranding. According to you, 4 is "a lot" and comparable to 17. Ok.
Can we compare Death Stranding to other games that failed to impress certain critics?
Let's see.
Maybe you consider a score of at least 60 as good, considering how displeased you were with people talking (trolling) about negative reviews of Crackdown 3.
For comparison, here is the OC summary of Crackdown 3:
There are also peaks and valleys here, but it was just a few peaks in this case, and a lot of valleys. (0 scores of 95% or higher, versus 6 scores of 40% or lower)
Sounds like you are the one shielding yourself from the fact that the hiking simulator might be better than you want to give it credit for, even resorting to fallacies, rather than facts, to support your narrative that DS is shit.
In fact, your whole argument does seem to go both ways, which in your own words, is moronic.
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Explosive Zombie
Banned
I'm not really interested in one individuals deciding process for buying a game. I also don't think of this a place where we language police people to the point that arguing is more offensive to them than just using the term debate. yes there's some syntax problems it's not because English isn't my first language it's because I'm using neogaf on my phone right now. the point is you are not the problem so you really don't need to keep responding this is about people actually judging a game is worth based on what they've seen in a stream it's not about you making informed decisions about what you should and shouldn't buy I already said I haven't bought it myself.
Ichabod
Banned
Looks about as I expected.
This is more than likely what I'll end up doing once I can find a good supercut. I wouldn't mind reading through a cliff notes version of the plot and lore, too. The world building and imagery does look pretty legit. Shame it's hindered by tedious game mechanics.
PropellerEar
Member
Finnish tech enthusiast site gave 5/5
"Hideo Kojima's peculiar masterpiece rises higher than the entire Metal Gear Solid series ever did." (My bad translation)
muropaketti.com
"Hideo Kojima's peculiar masterpiece rises higher than the entire Metal Gear Solid series ever did." (My bad translation)
Arvostelu: Death Stranding on mestariteos – Hideo Kojiman uusi videopeli ylittää kaikki odotukset - Muropaketti.com
”Hideo Kojiman omaperäinen mestariteos nousee korkeammalle kuin koko Metal Gear Solid -pelisarja on koskaan päässyt.”
muropaketti.com
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Lionel Richie
Member
This is the OC summary of Death Stranding:
Looking at its actual distribution, even a conservative estimate gives it over 70 as an average score (hint: it still is close to 80).
Even if you consider that the peaks and valleys scores hold more weight (17 scores of 95% or higher versus 4 "shit" scores of 40% or lower), there are way more peaks than valleys in the case of Death Stranding. According to you, 4 is "a lot" and comparable to 17. Ok.
Can we compare Death Stranding to other games that failed to impress certain critics?
Let's see.
Maybe you consider a score of at least 60 as good, considering how displeased you were with people talking (trolling) about negative reviews of Crackdown 3.
For comparison, here is the OC summary of Crackdown 3:
There are also peaks and valleys here, but it was just a few peaks in this case, and a lot of valleys. (0 scores of 95% or higher, versus 6 scores of 40% or lower)
Sounds like you are the one shielding yourself from the fact that the hiking simulator might be better than you want to give it credit for, even resorting to fallacies, rather than facts, to support your narrative that DS is shit.
In fact, your whole argument does seem to go both ways, which in your own words, is moronic.
My argument goes both ways? What are you talking about? I don't care about Crackdown 3, I didn't mean to defend Crackdown 3, I haven't played Crackdown 3. I thought the constant threads about Crackdown 3 were annoying because every single one of them were negative. I'm replying to something specific in this thread, the notion that we shouldn't consider Death Stranding's overall score, but rather that it got some very high ones. You bringing that up and implying I was a stout advocate for Crackdown 3 doesn't support anything, I'm not going both ways on shit. Seriously, what fallacy did I resort to?
There's plenty of people also suggesting Death Stranding is an absolute mess. That's how averages work, you consider the good reviews, consider the average reviews, consider the bad reviews and you make an average out of them. I also think that aggregate scores don't fully do a game justice. It isn't about how good it is, but rather how many people like it which should inform the player whether or not that game is a worthy buy. That's why I think you're looking for an angle here where there isn't one. The 10's it got don't mean more than the 6's. I think DS is clearly the game we all thought it was. If you were hyped, like you probably were, it's exactly what you wanted. If you weren't hyped, which is me, then every concern I had was confirmed. That's the one thing I always look forward to in reviews, any surprises. Like the game is MUCH better than we thought it was, or MUCH worse. I was surprised with God of War, as an example. I wasn't interested initially, read the reviews and it sounded really good, I bought it and really enjoyed it. DS honestly sounds like what we all knew from day one.
Listen man, I started this on the wrong foot, I was needlessly aggressive with you because perhaps I misjudged your first post in this current interaction. I'm a Nintendo fanboy (not a MS one, sorry
FranXico
), I'm going to get pissed off at people mocking Ninty lol. This is on me and I'm sorry. I still completely disagree with your argument but seeing it expanded it isn't unreasonable.
ethomaz
Banned
In OT I said something similar... the gameplay mechanics are the best I ever saw in a Kojima game.Finnish tech enthusiast site gave 5/5
"Hideo Kojima's peculiar masterpiece rises higher than the entire Metal Gear Solid series ever did." (My bad translation)
Arvostelu: Death Stranding on mestariteos – Hideo Kojiman uusi videopeli ylittää kaikki odotukset - Muropaketti.com
”Hideo Kojiman omaperäinen mestariteos nousee korkeammalle kuin koko Metal Gear Solid -pelisarja on koskaan päässyt.”
Genius.
You just don't want to stop to play... when you do that you keep thinking in the game.
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Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
This sort of comment reminds me of the chatter about Nier/Nier Automata's final endings. Yes you can watch them, and see the "trick" that Yoko is pulling, but its literally impossible to really understand why its so powerful UNLESS you've played through to that point.
To me it shows a fundamental lack of understanding about the experiential value of playing a videogame, which is ironic because the people who typically use this argument tend to be self professed "gameplay first" types.
demigod
Member
Ignore him, he's a Sony hater.
Explosive Zombie
Banned
My argument goes both ways? What are you talking about? I don't care about Crackdown 3, I didn't mean to defend Crackdown 3, I haven't played Crackdown 3. I thought the constant threads about Crackdown 3 were annoying because every single one of them were negative. I'm replying to something specific in this thread, the notion that we shouldn't consider Death Stranding's overall score, but rather that it got some very high ones. You bringing that up and implying I was a stout advocate for Crackdown 3 doesn't support anything, I'm not going both ways on shit. Seriously, what fallacy did I resort to?
There's plenty of people also suggesting Death Stranding is an absolute mess. That's how averages work, you consider the good reviews, consider the average reviews, consider the bad reviews and you make an average out of them. I also think that aggregate scores don't fully do a game justice. It isn't about how good it is, but rather how many people like it which should inform the player whether or not that game is a worthy buy. That's why I think you're looking for an angle here where there isn't one. The 10's it got don't mean more than the 6's. I think DS is clearly the game we all thought it was. If you were hyped, like you probably were, it's exactly what you wanted. If you weren't hyped, which is me, then every concern I had was confirmed. That's the one thing I always look forward to in reviews, any surprises. Like the game is MUCH better than we thought it was, or MUCH worse. I was surprised with God of War, as an example. I wasn't interested initially, read the reviews and it sounded really good, I bought it and really enjoyed it. DS honestly sounds like what we all knew from day one.
Listen man, I started this on the wrong foot, I was needlessly aggressive with you because perhaps I misjudged your first post in this current interaction. I'm a Nintendo fanboy (not a MS one, sorry
I was more disparaging to Nintendo than they deserve because I didn't like the idea that everyone should learn from Nintendo and Rockstar on how to make games. Were discussing confirmation bias here and to a certain extent if that's what you need you'll always get it, you'll see threads where a game gets totally panned but a person will say something like I follow this critic and they liked it or my good friend who I trust liked it. I don't have personal investment in this I don't own the game I don't plan to get it until it's on steam and even then maybe on a sale so I'm only arguing my argument because I think it does matter. I think it's far more interesting that it's getting such wildly rave reviews but also some really low ones, it's more interesting to me than everyone just generally agreeing Luigi's Mansion is really good. On top of that to me they're being judged on different scales death stranding is being judged on the basis of it trying to transcend the art form of video games where is Luigi's Mansion is being judged on it being fun little game for the whole family. There's no denying there's different criteria. so when people bring up that as an example of a game that gets better scores it just feels so weird to me like you might as well tell me the latest real time strategy game has better reviews than the new call of duty what would it even mean.
Explosive Zombie
Banned
I'm a big fan but it was a step backwards in a lot of ways.
AeonGaidenRaiden
Member
I loved F3. F4 I dropped after 7 hours in, it was just a drab in comparison.
SoraNoKuni
Member
I think there is some kind of peer pressure to dislike this game, people review bomb it and trashtalk just for the sake of it.
I played 3-4h and so far the gameplay is actually addicting, it really clicked with me.
Kojima's cinematic direction in this one is superb, the cutscenes are really really captivating and show off the possibilities of gaming as a medium for storytelling, I really believe that 6.8 IGN score created this whole trashtalk cult, you can of course dislike the game but the scale of everything else except the gameplay which someone may or may not like is so big and of quality that the 6.8 score is unjustifiable.
On another note... It's so Ironic how Kojima wanted to make a game about reconnecting while splitting the gaming community in half, like a... bang.
P.S Excuse my english, it's not my native language.
I played 3-4h and so far the gameplay is actually addicting, it really clicked with me.
Kojima's cinematic direction in this one is superb, the cutscenes are really really captivating and show off the possibilities of gaming as a medium for storytelling, I really believe that 6.8 IGN score created this whole trashtalk cult, you can of course dislike the game but the scale of everything else except the gameplay which someone may or may not like is so big and of quality that the 6.8 score is unjustifiable.
On another note... It's so Ironic how Kojima wanted to make a game about reconnecting while splitting the gaming community in half, like a... bang.
P.S Excuse my english, it's not my native language.
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MiguelItUp
Member
Just wanted to pop in to say I'm almost done with Episode 2, and I'm loving it. 
Also, yeah, while it may not be for everyone, but I don't understand why people need to review bomb. So ridiculous.
Also, yeah, while it may not be for everyone, but I don't understand why people need to review bomb. So ridiculous.
DynamiteCop!
Banned
For the same reason people positivity bomb, checks and balances.Just wanted to pop in to say I'm almost done with Episode 2, and I'm loving it.
Also, yeah, while it may not be for everyone, but I don't understand why people need to review bomb. So ridiculous.
MiguelItUp
Member
There's a wide difference. I'm not surprised you're blind to it considering your behavior, lmao.
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Heimdall_Xtreme
Hermen Hulst Fanclub's #1 Member
Wow Kojima can do the impossible.
He was able to create one of the best graphic engines of the gaming indutry, which was the Fox Engine, but now he has destroy it with the help of the Decima Engine.
I cannot believe it.
Take that Konami
He was able to create one of the best graphic engines of the gaming indutry, which was the Fox Engine, but now he has destroy it with the help of the Decima Engine.
I cannot believe it.
Take that Konami
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Chairman Tickles
Banned
Hey if you like walking sims, I can see why this might appeal to you. To each his own.
Lionel Richie
Member
I think the confirmation bias comes from the very nature of the hobby, games are such a ridiculous investment of time and money. Nowadays pretty much every game will take you at least 20 hours to get through, usually it's much more than that, and you have to pay a lot of money on consoles or building a PC. So you buy a PS4 and you don't like Nintendo or other PC centric games like sims and RTS enough to warrant another purchase, and you spend years waiting for Death Stranding. When it comes out it pretty much has to be good, you're going to spend 40 hours on it. If you watch a movie and it's terrible, you only wasted a couple of hours and maybe some change on it. I disagree with the notion that Luigi's Mansion 3 wasn't a risky project, just doing Dark Moon 2 could be seen as underwhelming considering that the Switch is somewhat a home console. I honestly wasn't sure how it was going to be received. The core gameplay is really strong, but the whole thing could be menial. I think it's about it being a different kind of risk than DS, one could be seen as unnecessary, the other could be seen as unsuccessful.
I think scores are only useful if we also read the actual reviews. Sure not all of them, but some of them and not randomly just because they share our view on the game. I like Destructoid, I always read their reviews and try not to check the score until I reach the end. A different metric like ACG does is also nice, give us your personal verdict on whether the game is worth first our money and then our time. We complain a lot about the bad things in the industry, but a lot of it is on us to just be different.
Heimdall_Xtreme
Hermen Hulst Fanclub's #1 Member
I think this game will be take it as a Cult videogame... actually is not for everyone, is more like "Art Film", actually i gonna get it, because the story and gameplay.
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Hinedorf
Banned
Without a doubt my favorite Kojima game/story to date
-Delivering packages is more fun than anything in MGS
-Cut scenes are mesmerizing
-Describing the game play in one word: Prudence
-My only gripe thus far is mission endings and the obnoxious and overly complicated grading system which is too on the nose with MGS. This game is not MGS but that is just MGS in this game and every time I see it I really want to ask Kojima the decision to do that rather than be unique.
-Delivering packages is more fun than anything in MGS
-Cut scenes are mesmerizing
-Describing the game play in one word: Prudence
-My only gripe thus far is mission endings and the obnoxious and overly complicated grading system which is too on the nose with MGS. This game is not MGS but that is just MGS in this game and every time I see it I really want to ask Kojima the decision to do that rather than be unique.
Bryank75
Banned
Loving it and I was braced for possible disappointment but honestly everything feels great and I've done a variety of things and just met Geoff a while ago. The intro was spine-tingling and the stealth has been very satisfying. Can't wait to get the Bola gun. Just got grenades... Social part really adds dimension to the game, just wish the bike was a bit faster and went lower when going fast.
ethomaz
Banned
Yeap it is the best Kojima work... the gameplay and story are both fabulous.
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Shifty
Member
Game's good, suck it nerds.
This is why we wait for release instead of escalating straight to foaming at the mouth.
This is why we wait for release instead of escalating straight to foaming at the mouth.
Are you using the boost with the bike? It took me a while to figure out that you can L3 it to get extra speed, or even a burnout-style launch from stationary.
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Bryank75
Banned
I just saw a hint for it but now I have no bike... I feel kinda stupid. But I've made huge progress since i started a few hours ago. Starting ch 3 now.
I really don't understand the bad reviews, somebody seems to have this idea that Kojima is pretentious and arrogant and has spread this idea around and it is like they are taking it out on the game instead of just judging the game fairly. I have not been bored for a second...
JareBear: Remastered
Banned
I’m too tired to write in-depth thoughts, will dive in more thoroughly tomorrow.
After 10+ hours my rating is around an 8.5
10 for everything technical (looks, sounds, and performs so tremendous)
Gameplay I give a 7, so far
So average that out to an 8.5 or so
After 10+ hours my rating is around an 8.5
10 for everything technical (looks, sounds, and performs so tremendous)
Gameplay I give a 7, so far
So average that out to an 8.5 or so
captainraincoat
Banned
Very good opening couple of hours but I can already see the game trying to stretch things out...hoping it throws a few cool things in as I can see myself not finishing this
Aceofspades
Banned
What drops? DF states that the struggle to find drops in the framerates throughout the game. Game is ultra stable
Geki-D
Banned
Same for me, the avatar just wasn't in the DLC, same for the golden sunglasses.
rofif
Can’t Git Gud
It's not a hiking or walking simulator... I am starting to hate those reviews. The game is not boring and if it is go play call of duty or something.
Even rdr2 was more boring with it's limited mission design and slow controls.
Anyway - what I am trying to say... Are we going to let giantbomb get away with 2/5 ?
Even rdr2 was more boring with it's limited mission design and slow controls.
Anyway - what I am trying to say... Are we going to let giantbomb get away with 2/5 ?