Depression

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I'm tired. I feel complete hollow and alone. No sex drive, and not even music is helping me anymore. Sometimes I just want to end this...

My diagnostic: OCD, Depression, Anxiety and Schizoid personality.

Meds I'm on: Saphris 5mg (2x), Luvox 50mg, Imovane 7,5mg and Clonazepam 0,2mg (2x).
 

ArynCrinn

Banned
Adding low dose Wellbutrin is a common approach. If you're responding well to Zoloft, that's probably a better initial approach than switching meds. Viagra and related meds are often added as well. That's not actually a treatment for anorgasmia, but it's pretty commonly used, with good results.

I've found that Welbutrin (at any dosage) interferes with my ability to get satisfaction from smoking cigarettes or getting stoned in any way. So I stopped taking it when it was prescribed to me a long time ago. I can handle my highs and lows from a mood standpoint, but when a med starts interfering with my nicotine rush or ability to feel any pleasure from drugs, it's a no go.

Also, as a aside I'm cutting my dose of Saphris down to 5mg, can't stand the constant eyeball pressure and annoyed mood. Again, I'd rather have my highs and lows. Obviously I won't be telling the doctor this info but it needs to be done. My plan is to ween off the Saphis slowly.

Meds I'm on: Saphris 5mg (2x), Luvox 50mg, Imovane 7,5mg and Clonazepam 0,2mg (2x).

Ahh, somebody else who knows the numb tongue thing. Took me a while to get used to taking Saphris.
 

Gui_PT

Member
A father should never say that to his child. Fuck him. Who cares what people think it doesn't mean jack shit. You seem cool to me Vox-Pop.


I like to go for a long walk, exercise, cook, read comics or books, play some games, write, watch a good movie or TV show, spend some time with my niece and nephew.

Going outside for a walk seems t o help a lot. Listening to music also usually helps but sometimes those things don't help at all
 

BlazinAm

Junior Member
As someone with depression I try really hard not to assign intent to other people's words and actions.

Yep. Although people can say some really stupid things.

I feel like I am in a flux, just not going anywhere. This anxiety and stress situation sucks, I feel like I am always burned out.
 

Dawg

Member
I should really make an appointment with a doctor/therapist.

I've never been funny diagnosed yet I am completely certain I suffer from a case of anxiety or OCD, most likely a combination. I'm not talking 'bout I SAW THESE SYMPTOMS ON THE INTERNET, because the first case happened back in january 2011. Told myself it would go over soon (+ they usually tell depressed people to see if they're still depressed after a month or so).

After about six months back then, I figured there was something wrong. Went to the doctor and he took a blood sample and told me I should just "go out more". "Do some exercise". I remember telling him I was really down etc, but I couldn't explain the full story since he was convinced it was nothing :/

Ever since, I just don't have the strength to explain it again to a doctor. Afraid to get the "you don't have depression/ocd/anxiety, go out some more". So yeah, you could say I've been living with this OCD/anxciety for about two years without help now. There have been days I wish I'd been dead, but luckily they're not all like that...

I'm still baffled how I've been "ok" for about 18 years, and then this depression/anxiety/OCD just happened some time after my 18th birthday. :/
 

falconzss

Member
Haven't posted in here for some time. The day after I finally found the courage to call a therapist I emailed a student adviser (she's also a psychological counselor) at my university because I needed someone to talk to about my problems. Had an appointment the same day and well things moved fast that day. After telling her about my issues she immediately called a friendly doctor of hers and again two hours later I sat at the doctors office, diagnosed with depression and prescribed Citalopram. Felt so relieved to be taken seriously. Can't thank my counselor enough for her help.

That said, they also ran a blood test last week. My results were good.


I should really make an appointment with a doctor/therapist.

I've never been funny diagnosed yet I am completely certain I suffer from a case of anxiety or OCD, most likely a combination. I'm not talking 'bout I SAW THESE SYMPTOMS ON THE INTERNET, because the first case happened back in january 2011. Told myself it would go over soon (+ they usually tell depressed people to see if they're still depressed after a month or so).

After about six months back then, I figured there was something wrong. Went to the doctor and he took a blood sample and told me I should just "go out more". "Do some exercise". I remember telling him I was really down etc, but I couldn't explain the full story since he was convinced it was nothing :/

Ever since, I just don't have the strength to explain it again to a doctor. Afraid to get the "you don't have depression/ocd/anxiety, go out some more". So yeah, you could say I've been living with this OCD/anxciety for about two years without help now. There have been days I wish I'd been dead, but luckily they're not all like that...

I'm still baffled how I've been "ok" for about 18 years, and then this depression/anxiety/OCD just happened some time after my 18th birthday. :/



I understand that you're cautious and anxious because of your former experience seeing a doctor but do it. I wish I had done it earlier before things got so bad that I couldn't even leave the house anymore. It's not easy, I know how much courage it took me to do it.
 

Bagels

You got Moxie, kid!
I've found that Welbutrin (at any dosage) interferes with my ability to get satisfaction from smoking cigarettes or getting stoned in any way. So I stopped taking it when it was prescribed to me a long time ago. I can handle my highs and lows from a mood standpoint, but when a med starts interfering with my nicotine rush or ability to feel any pleasure from drugs, it's a no go.

Also, as a aside I'm cutting my dose of Saphris down to 5mg, can't stand the constant eyeball pressure and annoyed mood. Again, I'd rather have my highs and lows. Obviously I won't be telling the doctor this info but it needs to be done. My plan is to ween off the Saphis slowly.



Ahh, somebody else who knows the numb tongue thing. Took me a while to get used to taking Saphris.

What ClassyPenguin said - it sounds like it was doing its job as a smoking cessation aid (Wellbutrin is sold as Zyban for smoking cessation. Exact same drug). Embrace it!

I just read some studies on smoking and mental illness. There's some pretty shocking stuff - the mentally ill make up almost half the remaining market for cigarettes in the US; smoking is one of three key predictors of future suicide attempts (prior attempts, a subjective assessment that one's depression is very severe, and smoking) in the depressed; smoking speeds the metabolism of antipsychotics; and, in a real fuck you from big tobacco, internal tobacco industry documents reveal efforts to expand sales among the mentally ill. The tobacco industry's research arm, the Council for Tobacco Research, as one might expect, has a big interest in supporting research with a definite pro-tobacco agenda, or from people who "can be counted on" to deliver favorable results. The idea of "self-medicating" with tobacco (particularly among schizophrenics) gets a lot of support from the tobacco industry (as did the notion that schizophrenics are somehow resistant to lung cancer. They're not. They just tend to die earlier, from other things, before they can develop cancer). Big tobacco also partnered with the National Alliance for the Mentally Ill to get an exemption from federal rules banning smoking in hospitals for mental health facilities. My gut feeling is that allowing smoking could potentially increase participation in outpatient therapy groups and the like, but in the hospital? As it turns out, facilities that have smoking rooms on the floor and those that ban smoking (you can go outside to smoke here, but it gets really fucking cold in the Winter, so you have to ask how much frostbite each cigarette is worth) are equally effective in treating people. The problem being that most inpatient units do not routinely offer smoking cessation treatments - it's cold turkey for everybody.

The idea of an industry actively preying on the mentally ill is the kind of thing that makes me hate the world.
 

falconzss

Member
Have a question for you guys. Right now, only two people know about my depression. Besides these people (one of them is also diagnosed with depression) I haven't told anyone about it, neither friends nor family. How did you guys handle that? I can't fathom myself telling my family about it, mostly because I'd have also tell them about how I fucked up my last few semesters. My parents have enough to worry about, I don't want to make it worse and I also feel like if I wouldn't be such a failure, this wouldn't have happened...
Also, I know I shouldn't drink alcohol but today I just feel like I need it...
 

Cubsfan23

Banned
This book has been getting rave reviews on Depression/Anxiety

http://www.amazon.com/dp/159285849X/?tag=neogaf0e-20


In The Gifts of Imperfection, Brené Brown, a leading expert on shame, authenticity, and belonging, shares ten guideposts on the power of Wholehearted living—a way of engaging with the world from a place of worthiness.

Each day we face a barrage of images and messages from society and the media telling us who, what, and how we should be. We are led to believe that if we could only look perfect and lead perfect lives, we'd no longer feel inadequate. So most of us perform, please, and perfect, all the while thinking, "What if I can't keep all of these balls in the air? Why isn't everyone else working harder and living up to my expectations? What will people think if I fail or give up? When can I stop proving myself?"


http://www.ted.com/talks/brene_brown_on_vulnerability.html
 

BadTaste

Member
Yeah wonderful... the past 4 days I've been in a great mood, trying to get myself on my feet, getting a job, looking at college courses, working out, eating more regularly.

Then my dad comes through 30 minutes ago absolutely drunk threatening me to fight me, he kicked the washing bin at me, he was wishing that I was dead.

Now I feel hopeless and shit again.. I need to move out of here.

I'm not really upset that much, being on AD's has that effect I guess.
 
Fuck I'm weighting 100 kilos. I was on 94 kilos a few weeks ago and this fucking med, saphris, made me gain so much weight. Fuck my life. All that I needed now is to get diabetes...
 
Hi guys, might as well drop by.

Right now I feel like I've stopped caring about my life. I'm not happy, but I'm far from really being down in the dumps either.

If I want to put it in another way is that I feel like I'm underwater. Things happen all around me but I feel emotionally distant about it. It's like my head is taking the quote 'That's life' to extreme measures.

Is this depression, or is it normal.
 
Hi guys, might as well drop by.

Right now I feel like I've stopped caring about my life. I'm not happy, but I'm far from really being down in the dumps either.

If I want to put it in another way is that I feel like I'm underwater. Things happen all around me but I feel emotionally distant about it. It's like my head is taking the quote 'That's life' to extreme measures.

Is this depression, or is it normal.
I can't certainly diagose, but I would say you are feeling depressed.

I'm struggling similarly. I've basically ruined a lot of my "potential" in the last year and come to the ugly realisation that even if I'm earning money, a good bit for my age, I'm far away from the person I've wanted to be all my life, a good game developer and it'll likely never happen now.

God... even writing that is horribly depressing.
 

falconzss

Member
Hi guys, might as well drop by.

Right now I feel like I've stopped caring about my life. I'm not happy, but I'm far from really being down in the dumps either.

If I want to put it in another way is that I feel like I'm underwater. Things happen all around me but I feel emotionally distant about it. It's like my head is taking the quote 'That's life' to extreme measures.

Is this depression, or is it normal.

Since I'm no doctor I can't tell you what to do. Depending how long you've felt that way, you'd be better of seeing a doctor. Man...I feel dumb typing this...
 

Bagels

You got Moxie, kid!
Hi guys, might as well drop by.

Right now I feel like I've stopped caring about my life. I'm not happy, but I'm far from really being down in the dumps either.

If I want to put it in another way is that I feel like I'm underwater. Things happen all around me but I feel emotionally distant about it. It's like my head is taking the quote 'That's life' to extreme measures.

Is this depression, or is it normal.

It's important to remember that depression is a clinical diagnosis - you do not make it based on laboratory values or pathology specimens. As everyone else has said, you really need to see a doctor to confirm a diagnosis.

Having said that, you can get a sense of whether or not you might be depressed by looking at the nine cardinal symptoms of depression. For each symptom, award points as follows: Over the last two weeks, how often have you experienced this symptom? [a simpler form of the test requires you to just say yes or no]

Never - 0 points.
Fewer than half of the days - 1 point.
More than half of the days- 2 days.
All the time or nearly all the time - 3 points.


1.) Depressed mood - feeling down, depressed, or hopeless
2.) Interest - a lack of interest in your normal activities and hobbies


[A diagnosis of depression requires the presence of 1 or 2]

3.) Guilt - feeling that you've let people down
4.) Sleep - either sleeping too much or having trouble getting enough sleep
5.) Energy - feeling fatigued, tired, not having your normal amount of energy
6.) Concentration - difficulty...concentrating
7.) Appetite - eating more or less than usual
8.) Psychomotor - feeling, or having others feel like, you're moving/speaking/thinking either slower than usual or faster than usual
9.) Suicide - feelings that you would be better off dead, frequent thoughts of suicide, or an active intent to end your own life

The med school acronym is "SIG E CAPS" (which is old-school shorthand for a prescription for energy pills), but that's fucking dumb. That's 8 symptoms, and you've left of depressed mood (!). So, recently, I developed "Bagel's Depression Mnemonic":

DIGS E CAPS


It has all of the symptoms and, if you look back 2 weeks and award 0-3 points as described above, that's a PHQ-9, a commonly used and well validated screening tool for depression. You can use just the first 2 questions and that's a PHQ-2, which is actually a decent way to screen patients if you're too dumb to remember my incredible mnemonic or just REALLY pressed for time.

Also, "digs" is wonderfully dated beatnik slang which I really want to bring back.

The clinical diagnosis of depression requires the presence of symptom 1 or 2, and a total of 5 or more of the symptoms, total. So, just saying yes or no, you need 5 symptoms for at least 2 weeks.

If you award the points, you can get a better idea of how depressed someone is. Having someone do the test at frequent intervals can give you a good sense of how effective a particular intervention is. A score of 5 points or less is generally taken as a sign that someone is in remission. An effective treatment should give you a 50% or greater reduction in the PHQ-9 score (feel free to call it a "Bagels' score").

The last piece of the PHQ-9 is to ask: "how difficult have these things made it to live your life? If you have a score of 10, but it has not impacted your ability to live your life at all, I'd hesitate to call that depression. But if you're score is 6, but you've been completely unable to live your life as usual, that's a huge problem (imagine getting a 3 for depressed mood and suicidality). The key point being that diagnoses in psychiatry need to be correlated with some level of impairment. This is the difference between being a little shy, say, and being unable to leave your house because seeing other people is so traumatizing. One is just a normal aspect of a person's personality, and the other is potentially a medical problem.

The last word of caution is that these symptoms should NOT be due to something like the loss of a loved one. You need to account for culturally appropriate normal human reactions to life events. Bereavement is not a medical condition. If it lasts a really long time (in blah US culture, 6 months is usually given as the average amount of time it takes someone to deal with the initial stages of bereavement, but that can obviously vary), or the symptoms are way out of proportion (again, this needs to be calibrated for cultural and personal norms), or the symptoms are causing significant impairment to one's ability to live life as normal, you might pass from normal human behavior into the realm of medical illness.

So, you can use my INCREDIBLE rule to screen yourself for possible depression, but the diagnosis does require a detailed history from a healthcare provider. And, if suicidality is a concern, aggressive management is indicated. If you want to die, please get help. That is not normal, or a healthy sign that you've somehow come to terms with whatever is going on. It is a very real, very serious problem, with unbelievable consequences - the personal consequences are obviously at a maximum, but there are ramifications for friends, family, teachers, healthcare providers, coworkers, etc.

The other thing to note is that depression, particularly depression that has progressed to suicidal ideations, is very treatable. The actively suicidal may be candidates for ECT, inpatient treatment, medications, therapy - anything you can think of. And the cure rate for something like ECT is very high.
 

Rajack

Member
Another lonely, depressing Saturday night for me...I'm forever single, jobless, suffering from a variety of problems including PTSD due to half of my family dying unexpectedly over the holidays within the span of a week (and my discovery of both of them), and I have a horrible habit of saying really bad things that I don't even mean. I hate everything that I am and I can't help but wish for the simpler days of my early life where I had nothing to worry about.
 

Corky

Nine out of ten orphans can't tell the difference.
Remember you are welcome in here anytime.

If I had money I would just straight up leave my boring good for nothing situation right now. Anywhere, I swear to god it wouldn't matter - spin the globe and I'll go there.

Corky sounds like you need to see a doctor. Please do. If you need someone to talk to you can talk to me anytime. I know you don't know me but the offer stands..

I appreciate it, though I can't talk to doctors as from my past experiences with 'regular' doctors for my 'regular' physical pains has lead me to realize that if people can't do fuuuuuck-all for a busted shoulder or a shot back then I can't even take them seriously if they have the nerve to claim they know how to treat mental pain.

But let me save myself the trouble and see into the future and extrapolate a bit.

bodily trauma / chronic pain -> sent home with meds ad naseam, that's how they treat it.
mental pain -> sent home with meds, I'm sure. What are they gonna do? Listen to my bullshit feigning interest for 15 min once a week? If I need someone to talk to I'd rather talk to a wall of avatars and text that is GAF.



edit : alright, let's have some fun...


Never - 0 points.
Fewer than half of the days - 1 point.
More than half of the days- 2 days.
All the time or nearly all the time - 3 points.


1.) Depressed mood - feeling down, depressed, or hopeless - 3
2.) Interest - a lack of interest in your normal activities and hobbies - 3
3.) Guilt - feeling that you've let people down - 2
4.) Sleep - either sleeping too much or having trouble getting enough sleep - 3
5.) Energy - feeling fatigued, tired, not having your normal amount of energy - 3
6.) Concentration - difficulty...concentrating - 3
7.) Appetite - eating more or less than usual -3
8.) Psychomotor - feeling, or having others feel like, you're moving/speaking/thinking either slower than usual or faster than usual - 2
9.) Suicide - feelings that you would be better off dead, frequent thoughts of suicide, or an active intent to end your own life - 1
 

Detox

Member
I'm in a similar situation corky and I only recently asked for therapy and will soon be attending sessions. For five years I thought I could fix my problems but now I've realised that all my troubles lie in the way I think. The way I think makes me depressed and I'm so used to it that I don't know anything else. I hope the therapy changes the way my mind works and interprets events and the environment around me. You should try and seek help for the same reasons, I doubt you have been depressed your whole life though it may seem like it. There was a time when I was happy and I just need to 'remember' how to think like that again, you should try to do the same thing.
 

Bagels

You got Moxie, kid!
If I had money I would just straight up leave my boring good for nothing situation right now. Anywhere, I swear to god it wouldn't matter - spin the globe and I'll go there.



I appreciate it, though I can't talk to doctors as from my past experiences with 'regular' doctors for my 'regular' physical pains has lead me to realize that if people can't do fuuuuuck-all for a busted shoulder or a shot back then I can't even take them seriously if they have the nerve to claim they know how to treat mental pain.

But let me save myself the trouble and see into the future and extrapolate a bit.

bodily trauma / chronic pain -> sent home with meds ad naseam, that's how they treat it.
mental pain -> sent home with meds, I'm sure. What are they gonna do? Listen to my bullshit feigning interest for 15 min once a week? If I need someone to talk to I'd rather talk to a wall of avatars and text that is GAF.



edit : alright, let's have some fun...


Never - 0 points.
Fewer than half of the days - 1 point.
More than half of the days- 2 days.
All the time or nearly all the time - 3 points.


1.) Depressed mood - feeling down, depressed, or hopeless - 3
2.) Interest - a lack of interest in your normal activities and hobbies - 3
3.) Guilt - feeling that you've let people down - 2
4.) Sleep - either sleeping too much or having trouble getting enough sleep - 3
5.) Energy - feeling fatigued, tired, not having your normal amount of energy - 3
6.) Concentration - difficulty...concentrating - 3
7.) Appetite - eating more or less than usual -3
8.) Psychomotor - feeling, or having others feel like, you're moving/speaking/thinking either slower than usual or faster than usual - 2
9.) Suicide - feelings that you would be better off dead, frequent thoughts of suicide, or an active intent to end your own life - 1



So...26 total? And how much has it affected your ability to go about your life?

A BAGELS' SCORE OF 20+ points (with significant distress), suggests severe depression.


Let me just say that pain can be incredibly hard to treat, and many doctors do not know what to do (or are uncomfortable prescribing potentially HIGHLY addictive meds). Managing depression can be much more straight-forward. Don't let one bad experience with a doc sour you on getting mental health.
 

jufonuk

not tag worthy
I have for some time, had depression, had it after a long break-up and not being able to see my son for a bit, I am also prone to panic attacks

I am currently undergoing therapy to help me out, I am doing CBT as well (at a later date)

the thing is I go from really happy Hyper to Low, when I get calm and Normal I kinda feel everything is stale and listless..

I just hate feeling this way, I also feel like I dissapoint people, (including my GF)

I really hate feeling this way but cannot seem to get out of this funk.

I dont get sometimes why people like or care for me or even put up with me?

I dunno sometimes I wake up and the world is all bright and shit is great like today, then suddenly I just feel low and just start to worry.
 
1.) Depressed mood - feeling down, depressed, or hopeless - 2
2.) Interest - a lack of interest in your normal activities and hobbies - 3
3.) Guilt - feeling that you've let people down - 0
4.) Sleep - either sleeping too much or having trouble getting enough sleep - 3
5.) Energy - feeling fatigued, tired, not having your normal amount of energy - 3
6.) Concentration - difficulty...concentrating - 0
7.) Appetite - eating more or less than usual - 3
8.) Psychomotor - feeling, or having others feel like, you're moving/speaking/thinking either slower than usual or faster than usual - 1
9.) Suicide - feelings that you would be better off dead, frequent thoughts of suicide, or an active intent to end your own life - 3

That's mine.
 

Collete

Member
1.) Depressed mood - feeling down, depressed, or hopeless-3
2.) Interest - a lack of interest in your normal activities and hobbies-2
3.) Guilt - feeling that you've let people down-3
4.) Sleep - either sleeping too much or having trouble getting enough sleep-2
5.) Energy - feeling fatigued, tired, not having your normal amount of energy-3
6.) Concentration - difficulty...concentrating-3
7.) Appetite - eating more or less than usual-3
8.) Psychomotor - feeling, or having others feel like, you're moving/speaking/thinking either slower than usual or faster than usual-3
9.) Suicide - feelings that you would be better off dead, frequent thoughts of suicide, or an active intent to end your own life-3

25 points....hm.
 

Detox

Member
1.) Depressed mood - feeling down, depressed, or hopeless - 3
2.) Interest - a lack of interest in your normal activities and hobbies - 2
3.) Guilt - feeling that you've let people down - 2
4.) Sleep - either sleeping too much or having trouble getting enough sleep - 3
5.) Energy - feeling fatigued, tired, not having your normal amount of energy - 3
6.) Concentration - difficulty...concentrating - 3
7.) Appetite - eating more or less than usual -3
8.) Psychomotor - feeling, or having others feel like, you're moving/speaking/thinking either slower than usual or faster than usual - 1
9.) Suicide - feelings that you would be better off dead, frequent thoughts of suicide, or an active intent to end your own life - 1


The sleep and appetite has been getting to me a lot lately. I don't want to sleep and when I do I don't want to wake up and face another day. My appetite doesn't exist, I barely eat because I'm enjoying food but instead I'm forcing myself to eat. Most days recently I can get by with one meal and no snacks. I have no interest in my studies in my final and probably most important year ever in terms of education. It feels like my whole life I worked to get to university and now I don't even want to finish it. In terms of sleep, appetite and concentration I realise all these things are interconnected but I can't even find the passion to fix them.
 

Bagels

You got Moxie, kid!
You guys with Bagel Indexes in the 20s need to seek a doctor's help. You can expect good results with drugs or therapy (meds ARE recommended for the severely depressed), and even better results with meds AND therapy.

I implore you to see a physician.
 
You guys with Bagel Indexes in the 20s need to seek a doctor's help. You can expect good results with drugs or therapy (meds ARE recommended for the severely depressed), and even better results with meds AND therapy.

I implore you to see a physician.
I already have a doctor and take meds. Not like is doing anything.
 
1.) Depressed mood - feeling down, depressed, or hopeless - 2
2.) Interest - a lack of interest in your normal activities and hobbies - 1


[A diagnosis of depression requires the presence of 1 or 2]

3.) Guilt - feeling that you've let people down - 0
4.) Sleep - either sleeping too much or having trouble getting enough sleep - 3
5.) Energy - feeling fatigued, tired, not having your normal amount of energy - 2
6.) Concentration - difficulty...concentrating - 3
7.) Appetite - eating more or less than usual - 2
8.) Psychomotor - feeling, or having others feel like, you're moving/speaking/thinking either slower than usual or faster than usual - 1
9.) Suicide - feelings that you would be better off dead, frequent thoughts of suicide, or an active intent to end your own life - 3
17, huh? Seems like that isn't too bad? Or at least not as bad as I think I feel.


If you want to die, please get help. That is not normal, or a healthy sign that you've somehow come to terms with whatever is going on. It is a very real, very serious problem, with unbelievable consequences - the personal consequences are obviously at a maximum, but there are ramifications for friends, family, teachers, healthcare providers, coworkers, etc
Well, I wouldn't say it's healthy, but it's definitely a normal reaction to having a shitty life.
I'm unable to interact with strangers and people I know semi-well without huge bouts of anxiety. Imagine walking around on campus and your biggest fear is running into someone you know - but not too well, actual friends are excluded from the anxiety. I feel like I'm going to die if I see someone up ahead, start losing control of my limbs, start sweating profusely and dozens of thoughts begin flooding my head (When am I supposed to say hi? Should I say hi if he's busy talking to someone else? Where should I look? Do I look stupid?). Walking around and interacting with people feels like I'm in a lion's den. It's absolutely terrifying. And my terror obviously shows, as I'm regarded as a weird/pathetic guy by many, especially girls.
Add depression and ADHD, and you've got a grade A recipe for a guy who's never going to achieve anything, not in regards to a job and especially not in regards to women.

I can't even give a proper talk in front of people, how am I supposed to enroll in a phD program which requires lots of presentations and talks, and possibly tutoring? Although, seeing how my grades are going to shit thanks to my ADHD, I don't think any phD program would take me anyway. Seems like I'll be getting my master's degree and jumping off a building afterwards.

Yeah, I'd say not wanting to continue living this kind of shitty life for another 50-60 years (or more, if biomedical technology continues getting better) is a perfectly normal and sensible reaction.
As for the ramifications: fuck my parents, teachers, co-workers and all the other people who share some kind of superficial relationship with me
There's a handful of people whom I consider my friends, who would probably actually be sad if I offed myself, and I genuinely don't wish them that kind of grief, but in the end, it's my decision. Not saying I'm going to do it (yet), but I definitely think considering suicide can be sensible.
 

Detox

Member
I have to wait 6 weeks for my local authority to reply to me on what they are going to do with my depression. Meanwhile I've been thinking of taking Niacinamide to reduce my anxiety issues. I'm not sure how much to take but I'll start with 3 doses of 500mg a day to see if it does anything.
 
Kinda glad I found this, things have really ramped up for me in the depression department the past few months. Its been around a year now in which I can safely say I haven't really been happy. I recently told my parents as well that I think I am depressed to be honest its kind of made things worse. They are trying to help but it just makes me feel even worse because they have deal with it now as well. One thing is that my college course isn't going well for me the place is a shambles and the work not stimulating enough. I don't want to go back there because I feel its a waste of time and I should do something else instead. So they have been looking constantly for the past few days about A-levels and IT certifications and it makes me feel guilty that they doing so much when I care so little.

Yesterday though was pretty crushing, I play footy a lot pretty much every weekend (in the summer in the winter its more like every 2 to 3 weeks). So we started to play and I never found that drive I normally did to play and I was all over the place, I mean im not the best footballer I am pretty competent though but everything I did was wrong and I lacked the motivation to try. I was so angry with myself, I thought football was my last bastion and stronghold but the 'depression' seems to have just eaten away at that as well.


1.) Depressed mood - feeling down, depressed, or hopeless - 3
2.) Interest - a lack of interest in your normal activities and hobbies - 3
3.) Guilt - feeling that you've let people down - 3
4.) Sleep - either sleeping too much or having trouble getting enough sleep - 3
5.) Energy - feeling fatigued, tired, not having your normal amount of energy - 3
6.) Concentration - difficulty...concentrating - 1
7.) Appetite - eating more or less than usual - 2
8.) Psychomotor - feeling, or having others feel like, you're moving/speaking/thinking either slower than usual or faster than usual - 2
9.) Suicide - feelings that you would be better off dead, frequent thoughts of suicide, or an active intent to end your own life - 3

So 23 points for me.
 

Bagels

You got Moxie, kid!
I already have a doctor and take meds. Not like is doing anything.

So you're on the wrong meds. You want a 50% reduction in score by 6 weeks or so. If you're not there, or trending in that direction, you need to reevaluate dosing or switching meds.
 
So you're on the wrong meds. You want a 50% reduction in score by 6 weeks or so. If you're not there, or trending in that direction, you need to reevaluate dosing or switching meds.

That's great in theory, but meds do nothing for me apart from the side-effects (sexual dysfunction, insomnia) - I tried around 5 or 6 different ones.
I don't think anyone I know ever reported a 50% reduction in terms of how shitty they feel (which should be the same as a 50% reduction of score), many people seem to claim that the medication does very little or nothing.

Personally, I think a lot of medication is basically a sham, barely better than placebos, but with worse side-effects.
Normal antibiotics or whatever work the same for the overwhelming majority of people, but psychotropic drugs have a widely varying spectrum of effects, even on people of the similar/same age, gender and size who are suffering from the same disorder.
Considering the long-term side effects of the drugs on people like our own uchip, I find the ease with which ataractics are prescribed somewhat disturbing. Unless you are about to kill yourself, you may very well be better off without drugs.
 

Bagels

You got Moxie, kid!
That's great in theory, but meds do nothing for me apart from the side-effects (sexual dysfunction, insomnia) - I tried around 5 or 6 different ones.
I don't think anyone I know ever reported a 50% reduction in terms of how shitty they feel (which should be the same as a 50% reduction of score), most people claim that the medication does very little or nothing.

It's a small sample size in both cases. The literature is clear - it can take several meds, but people do get help.

In your case, being on antipsychotics poses unique problems. The drugs can either work amazingly well, or they make you feel worse.

It took me several trials (over 10) to zero in on the drugs that work for me. That's not typical, but ti happens. Mental illnesses are not created equal, you know?

The rush to give up is discouraging. It sucks that it takes time, but most people DO get better.
 
It's a small sample size in both cases. The literature is clear - it can take several meds, but people do get help.

In your case, being on antipsychotics poses unique problems. The drugs can either work amazingly well, or they make you feel worse.

It took me several trials (over 10) to zero in on the drugs that work for me. That's not typical, but ti happens. Mental illnesses are not created equal, you know?

The rush to give up is discouraging. It sucks that it takes time, but most people DO get better.

Well, I know quite a few people from self-help groups and the like, and in the long term, I've heard only bad things from those who take antipsychotics. What good is it having 30% less anxiety if I have 100% less sex drive and need 50% more sleep? When I took medications, I only got more depressed from not being able to sleep or even fap. For my anxiety, they did nothing, apart from giving me some fantastic nightmares. Yes, some of the other people did get help from the medication, but as I said, the persistence of overpowering side effects concerning sex drive and sleep can very well override any short-term help you get from the medication.

It's obviously not a peer-reviewed study, but the sample size is large enough that I would recommend people to be cautious with eagerly gobbling up anything the doctor prescribes.
And that's not even getting into the social problems not being able to drink alcohol poses. Fuck that.


Edit: There may very well be a drug out there for me, but seeing as how my previous trial runs resulted in several months of hell each, and my life (work, university, friends) doesn't stop for my trial, I don't see how another five trial runs (or how many it may take) would be feasible. And that's not even taking into account the possibility of permanent or long-term damage which persists even after quitting the medication.
 

Bagels

You got Moxie, kid!
Well, I know quite a few people from self-help groups and the like, and in the long term, I've heard only bad things from those who take antipsychotics. What good is it having 30% less anxiety if I have 100% less sex drive and need 50% more sleep? When I took medications, I only got more depressed from not being able to sleep or even fap. For my anxiety, they did nothing, apart from giving me some fantastic nightmares. Yes, some of the other people did get help from the medication, but as I said, the persistence of overpowering side effects concerning sex drive and sleep can very well override any short-term help you get from the medication.

It's obviously not a peer-reviewed study, but the sample size is large enough that I would recommend people to be cautious with eagerly gobbling up anything the doctor prescribes.
And that's not even getting into the social problems not being able to drink alcohol poses. Fuck that.


Edit: There may very well be a drug out there for me, but seeing as how my previous trial runs resulted in several months of hell each, and my life (work, university, friends) doesn't stop for my trial, I don't see how another five trial runs (or how many it may take) would be feasible. And that's not even taking into account the possibility of permanent or long-term damage which persists even after quitting the medication.

I hear you. Antipsychotics are a touch more hardcore than antidepressants, what with that potential for permanent damage. I'm sorry you haven't found success. It's especially hard in that these drugs manipulate your dopaminergic pathways, and you NEED dopamine for what we in the medical community like to call, "getting your freak on."

I'm much more familiar with antidepressants, so that's where my point really lies - most people get better with either drugs or therapy, and that number is much higher if you do both. It's easy to get discouraged, but the treatments do work in the long run. And for the sickest people, you might have access too ECT, which has a ridiculously high cure rate, and can work in a week or less. I just hate to see people say, "well, suicide is the only thing that makes sense!" The depressed brain is just not good at making rational decisions. It's like trying to come up with a plan for your heroin addiction while you're actually high.

I will say I did one trial with a mood-stabilizer and it was awful. Obviously, getting the right diagnosis and then receiving the right drugs is paramount.
 

Bagels

You got Moxie, kid!
lol

NOT. That's why it's a last resort.

Try again.

It's a last resort because of societal issues (people don't understand it), it's expensive (you need general anesthetic), there's a historical potential for severe memory loss, and anything requiring general anesthetic is inherently more dangerous. It is universally agreed to be the fastest, most effective treatment for depression.

Let me pull some articles when I'm in the hospital tonight, but the response rate to ECT is 80-90%. Basically ANY area of medicine would kill fro that kind of response to treatment.
 

Smiley90

Stop shitting on my team. Start shitting on my finger.
Try again.

It's a last resort because of societal issues (people don't understand it), it's expensive (you need general anesthetic), there's a historical potential for severe memory loss, and anything requiring general anesthetic is inherently more dangerous. It is universally agreed to be the fastest, most effective treatment for depression.

Let me pull some articles when I'm in the hospital tonight, but the response rate to ECT is 80-90%. Basically ANY area of medicine would kill fro that kind of response to treatment.

I just looked it up, because I was interested too:

Results:  In this meta-analysis, the overall remission rate was 50.9% (n = 402/790) for patients with unipolar depression and 53.2% (n = 168/316) for patients with bipolar major depression. A pooled odds ratio (OR) and confidence interval (CI) were calculated using random-effects meta-analysis with the Mantel–Haenzel method. This analysis shows similar efficacy of ECT in patients with unipolar and bipolar depression (OR = 1.08, 95% CI: 0.75–1.57).

Conclusion:  ECT appears to be equally effective for both bipolar and unipolar depression and the remission rates are encouraging, especially for bipolar depression.

Source: Efficacy of electroconvulsive therapy in bipolar versus unipolar major depression: a meta-analysis
Bram Dierckx, Willemijn T Heijnen, Walter W van den Broek, Tom K Birkenhäger


I figured a Meta-paper was good enough. They pooled data from 5 studies on the topic.
 

Bagels

You got Moxie, kid!
I just looked it up, because I was interested too:



Source: Efficacy of electroconvulsive therapy in bipolar versus unipolar major depression: a meta-analysis
Bram Dierckx, Willemijn T Heijnen, Walter W van den Broek, Tom K Birkenhäger


I figured a Meta-paper was good enough. They pooled data from 5 studies on the topic.

The numbers bounce around based on the outcome. Positive initial response, or treatment with routine maintenance treatments gets you that 80%+. Without followup or the initiation of medication therapy, you get that 50-60% figure, it seems. Even a 50% response rate is amazing, considering you're talking about response after 3 treatments or so.

The key is that the efficacy of ECT is well established. The reasons it's not a first-like therapy are not related to efficacy.

Thanks for looking into the data more!
 
I hear you. Antipsychotics are a touch more hardcore than antidepressants, what with that potential for permanent damage. I'm sorry you haven't found success. It's especially hard in that these drugs manipulate your dopaminergic pathways, and you NEED dopamine for what we in the medical community like to call, "getting your freak on."

I'm much more familiar with antidepressants, so that's where my point really lies - most people get better with either drugs or therapy, and that number is much higher if you do both. It's easy to get discouraged, but the treatments do work in the long run. And for the sickest people, you might have access too ECT, which has a ridiculously high cure rate, and can work in a week or less. I just hate to see people say, "well, suicide is the only thing that makes sense!" The depressed brain is just not good at making rational decisions. It's like trying to come up with a plan for your heroin addiction while you're actually high.

I will say I did one trial with a mood-stabilizer and it was awful. Obviously, getting the right diagnosis and then receiving the right drugs is paramount.
I'm not sure I got the difference between antipsychotics and antidepressants right, since English isn't my main language. Stuff that contains Benzodiazepine is an antipsychotic, right? And SSRs are antidepressants?

I tried various Benzodiazepines - supposedly extremely potent and addictive. I literally feel nothing out of the ordinary when taking 10 or even 20mg. People of similar weight tell me that 5-10mg is already enough to make them feel very relaxed, but for me they bring no relief.
Got a headache once, but this may have been unrelated since this could not be repeated in further trials. I always carry a pack with me, but it's more of a placebo thing and I use them less than once a month on average.

Tried a few SSRs as well, at best there was a 10% decrease in anxiety but I'm not sure about that any more. What I'm certain about are the side effects: sexual dysfunction, insomnia, horrible nightmares when I managed to sleep, feeling like a robot.
I wasted over a year of my life on SSRs, looking back I can't believe how quickly this period of time passed. I had literally zero actual life, no friends, barely did anything at university, nothing. I have no idea what I actually did all the time during that year.
Well, I had the same part-time job I have now, but that doesn't account for all my time.
Pretty scary. Luckily that ended when I went cold turkey.

As for the effectiveness, since my depression is a result of the shitty life I lead thanks to anxiety and, to a lesser extent, ADHD, it sorta makes sense that antidepressants won't work like they would for people whose "main illness" is depression.
Why the Benzodiazepines don't work, I have no idea. I guess I'm just a non-responder. At this point, I've all but accepted the fact that nothing and no-one can bring me relief.
Almost every single supposed authority has turned out to be a moron, I've heard so many contradicting points of view from different psychiatrists and neurologists that I've lost count. No treatment, be it therapy or medication, has turned up any kind of major success. I'm still going to therapy, but it's more of a ritual and I honestly don't expect much from it anymore.
 

Smiley90

Stop shitting on my team. Start shitting on my finger.
The numbers bounce around based on the outcome. Positive initial response, or treatment with routine maintenance treatments gets you that 80%+. Without followup or the initiation of medication therapy, you get that 50-60% figure, it seems. Even a 50% response rate is amazing, considering you're talking about response after 3 treatments or so.

The key is that the efficacy of ECT is well established. The reasons it's not a first-like therapy are not related to efficacy.

Thanks for looking into the data more!

I think the thing that was mentioned in the study was that you get around 50% with 6/7 treatment sessions, while there was a study that achieved 65%-ish, with 10 treatment sessions. So I can definitely see how you can get to 80% with follow-up and longer treatment, etc. You're right, the numbers are really high, even if it's "just" 55%.

And no worries, I was curious, I already went looking even before you edited your post to include the 'I'll look it up at the hospital" part ;)
 

Bagels

You got Moxie, kid!
I'm not sure I got the difference between antipsychotics and antidepressants right, since English isn't my main language. Stuff that contains Benzodiazepine is an antipsychotic, right? And SSRs are antidepressants?

I tried various Benzodiazepines - supposedly extremely potent and addictive. I literally feel nothing out of the ordinary when taking 10 or even 20mg. People of similar weight tell me that 5-10mg is already enough to make them feel very relaxed, but for me they bring no relief.
Got a headache once, but this may have been unrelated since this could not be repeated in further trials. I always carry a pack with me, but it's more of a placebo thing and I use them less than once a month on average.

Tried a few SSRs as well, at best there was a 10% decrease in anxiety but I'm not sure about that any more. What I'm certain about are the side effects: sexual dysfunction, insomnia, horrible nightmares when I managed to sleep, feeling like a robot.
I wasted over a year of my life on SSRs, looking back I can't believe how quickly this period of time passed. I had literally zero actual life, no friends, barely did anything at university, nothing. I have no idea what I actually did all the time during that year.
Well, I had the same part-time job I have now, but that doesn't account for all my time.
Pretty scary. Luckily that ended when I went cold turkey.

As for the effectiveness, since my depression is a result of the shitty life I lead thanks to anxiety and, to a lesser extent, ADHD, it sorta makes sense that antidepressants won't work like they would for people whose "main illness" is depression.
Why the Benzodiazepines don't work, I have no idea. I guess I'm just a non-responder.

TCAs, MAOIs, SSRIs,SNRIS are the most common ADs. There are also oddballs like bupropion which affect dopamine more strongly.

Benzos are anxiolytics/hypnotics. They reduce anxiety and promote calm and sleep. Their action is at GABA receptors.

Actual antipsychotics (neuroleptics) are dopaminergic, serotonegic or both - the idea is to deal with both positive and negative sympons of disorders like schizophrenia.
 

EdmondD

Member
Glad to hear you're feeling better SF. I was feeling really shitty myself yesterday but I feel better today. What's akathisia?

I like how SIG E CAPS is now called the Bagels test. Arrogant son of a.... ;)
 
T

Transhuman

Unconfirmed Member
1.) Depressed mood - feeling down, depressed, or hopeless - 3
2.) Interest - a lack of interest in your normal activities and hobbies - 3
3.) Guilt - feeling that you've let people down - 0
4.) Sleep - either sleeping too much or having trouble getting enough sleep - 3
5.) Energy - feeling fatigued, tired, not having your normal amount of energy - 2
6.) Concentration - difficulty...concentrating - 3
7.) Appetite - eating more or less than usual - 3
8.) Psychomotor - feeling, or having others feel like, you're moving/speaking/thinking either slower than usual or faster than usual - 1
9.) Suicide - feelings that you would be better off dead, frequent thoughts of suicide, or an active intent to end your own life -3

I haven't been eating or sleeping well for a few years. I honestly wouldn't know whether I ever feel tired, because I don't know what it's like to feel awake. Test to the contrary, I don't feel depressed. A few years ago I was definitely depressed, now I just feel constant apathy.
 
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