Destiny House of Wolves Reveal Thread

Not thrilled that the DLC maps I payed for are being released for free months later. I guess that sets precedent for when the PS exclusive stuff gets set free that XB1 players will get it for free, right?

I find it odd that rather than be glad others get to play on the maps, and the player base unified, you are angry that they get to play on them. It is better for the entire playerbase if people are unified. Meanwhile, you got to play the new maps for six months.

The exclusive content was advertised as being exclusive through the end of 2015.
 
I have the DLC but i dont mind. Still think in every MP game. That putting MP maps behind a DLC is just bad. It splits the playerbase up.
 
Not thrilled that the DLC maps I payed for are being released for free months later. I guess that sets precedent for when the PS exclusive stuff gets set free that XB1 players will get it for free, right?

lol bruh



You paid for months of exclusive access to them. How many times have you seen the maps outside of the DLC playlist? This shit happens EVERY FPS that has map packs.

People buy the DLC. And then they rarely see it in game outside of DLC playlists.

Halo 3 was the only game I can think of with the map pack model to be able to find DLC maps in game.


And that was because 1. They made the first map pack free after a while.
2. There were a bunch of playlists that REQUIRED the DLC. Not just DLC specific ones. Bungie got a lot of flak for this too but you can't deny it helped out people who bought the maps.
3. Halo ODST came with every single Halo 3 map so after ODST came out you could find DLC in playlists really easily.


All DLC map packs do, that don't become free, is segment the playerbase and deny the people who paid money access to them outside of specific playlists.
 
Yeah, DLC maps becoming free after a period of time should be standard practice. It does cheapen their value, though, and I get complaints. DLC should have new ways of adding value to compensate.
 
Yeah, and I still don't buy it. When I play a mode in any game that requires a lot of team work, I realize that a group of randoms aren't going to give me the best experience. If I have a consistently bad experience with randoms, I wouldn't drop the mode all together. If the game and the mode interest me enough, I would search for better teammates. If I never get a chance to try said mode unless I can put a group together, then I am less likely to even attempt it. Matchmaking (or SOMETHING like it) gives me the opportunity to at least give it a chance without a significant barrier to entry.

I guess I think it would give you a chance to try something that is almost guaranteed to be terrible.

I'd say pure random matchmaking would be terrible for 99 out of a 100 raids, due to AFK'ers, mike noise, drop outs etc. The whole aim of raids is that they're difficult or impossible to complete without good communication and teamwork (whether they achieve that or not is a separate issue)....almost by design a "good" raid should produce a "bad" MM experience (unless you are very lucky)

So you'd try it, hate it, then go off to try and find a group of some sort to complete it with. All you've gained via MM is a bad experience before you start looking for a group.

FWIW I totally agree that Destiny should have an LFG system of some sort, and I think that was their original plan. The idea of patrols, and public events was to encourage chance encounters which could lead to fireteams being made, and then over time morphing into raid teams.
 
I guess I think it would give you a chance to try something that is almost guaranteed to be terrible.

I'd say pure random matchmaking would be terrible for 99 out of a 100 raids, due to AFK'ers, mike noise, drop outs etc. The whole aim of raids is that they're difficult or impossible to complete without good communication and teamwork (whether they achieve that or not is a separate issue)....almost by design a "good" raid should produce a "bad" MM experience (unless you are very lucky)

So you'd try it, hate it, then go off to try and find a group of some sort to complete it with. All you've gained via MM is a bad experience before you start looking for a group.

FWIW I totally agree that Destiny should have an LFG system of some sort, and I think that was their original plan. The idea of patrols, and public events was to encourage chance encounters which could lead to fireteams being made, and then over time morphing into raid teams.

Just to be clear: I'm not advocating for Strike style matchmaking in Raids. I'm advocating an LFG tool for that. I do think MM should be in Nightfalls/Dailies/ToO though. Too early to tell for Prison of Elders.
 
Just to be clear: I'm not advocating for Strike style matchmaking in Raids. I'm advocating an LFG tool for that. I do think MM should be in Nightfalls/Dailies/ToO though. Too early to tell for Prison of Elders.

This would be the right way to do it. There absolutely should be an in game lfg system. I think that's what Bungie was trying to do with the tower but the 16 player limit kind of makes that difficult. Matchmaking for raids in this game would be just bad. Nightfall should have matching though.
 
Curious, is it all of TDB becoming available for free? Or just the crucible maps? If it isn't the whole thing, and someone buys HoW, how will the progression work for that player?

Good thing on the crucible maps though, opens up more maps for the standard rotation. More maps is good.
 
Yeah, DLC maps becoming free after a period of time should be standard practice. It does cheapen their value, though, and I get complaints. DLC should have new ways of adding value to compensate.

I liked all of the maps, and was fine with their value relative to everything else I paid for, but there is seriously nothing better than playing these maps with a larger pool of players and not the constantly shrinking pool of active DLC owners.

In my eyes you are paying to learn and master the new maps before everyone else. It's not like I'm going back to the Dark Below playlist once the House of Wolves maps release, so it's for the best.

Curious, is it all of TDB becoming available for free? Or just the crucible maps? If it isn't the whole thing, and someone buys HoW, how will the progression work for that player?

Good thing on the crucible maps though, opens up more maps for the standard rotation. More maps is good.

I think it's just for PvP, and it makes sense since you wouldn't want to trivialize the 20 dollars people paid for DLC. Crota and the story missions + strikes stay locked. Crota will always be relevant since it doesn't depend on a healthy stream of players.

It can't be understated that adding the old maps into rotation is in the best interest of the health of a PvP community.
 
I reccomended this to people looking to pick Destiny up. Get the base game after House of Wolves. Plenty of awesome fixes to the economy and light level stuff.

Then if you feel like extending your playtime you can get TDB and HoW if you want.
 
I reccomended this to people looking to pick Destiny up. Get the base game after House of Wolves. Plenty of awesome fixes to the economy and light level stuff.

Then if you feel like extending your playtime you can get TDB and HoW if you want.

I think waiting for Comet is a better advice. But yeah the changes are really great.
 
Comet is still a while away and we don't know what it will contain but I would say to wait for it, while these fixes help with grinding you are still stuck with running through the same few strikes and limited missions once you finish the base, if comet adds more to that it helps.
 
lol bruh



You paid for months of exclusive access to them. How many times have you seen the maps outside of the DLC playlist? This shit happens EVERY FPS that has map packs.

People buy the DLC. And then they rarely see it in game outside of DLC playlists.

Halo 3 was the only game I can think of with the map pack model to be able to find DLC maps in game.


And that was because 1. They made the first map pack free after a while.
2. There were a bunch of playlists that REQUIRED the DLC. Not just DLC specific ones. Bungie got a lot of flak for this too but you can't deny it helped out people who bought the maps.
3. Halo ODST came with every single Halo 3 map so after ODST came out you could find DLC in playlists really easily.


All DLC map packs do, that don't become free, is segment the playerbase and deny the people who paid money access to them outside of specific playlists.

Making several playlist DLC required was excellent. Much prefer that to a DLC only list with 3 or so maps
 
Just to be clear: I'm not advocating for Strike style matchmaking in Raids. I'm advocating an LFG tool for that. I do think MM should be in Nightfalls/Dailies/ToO though. Too early to tell for Prison of Elders.

Lol! We are really close then :) I'd say the same as you except ToO...I think NF is a stretch but random MM might be OK as a desperate fall back.

Anyway - have fun in Destiny :)
 
The PvP maps going free is nothing but good.

I am of the opinion that a good model is to pay to get the maps early and support the developer, but then after a limited time, being able to -actually play the damn maps- with the rest of the population. Paying for maps isn't very useful when you don't get to play them because people don't want to pay for DLC.

Bungie did this with Halo 2, and managed to do it with Halo 3 for the Heroic map pack, and then Don Mattrick happened and he ended that program. If Bungie had their way, all of Halo 3's MPDLC would have eventually gone free. Same with Reach. It didn't happen because Microsoft, as their publisher, prevented them from doing it anymore.


And I'll be fine with the DLC strikes and raids and whatever being included in the base game down the line, if Bungie is planning that. Not only will it get more people into the content, other MMOs already do this. World of Warcraft gives you all expansions but the newest one just for buying the game.
 
Yeah that voice was...not good, at all.

Everything else was, though. Good variety in the environments, and it confirms we'll fight the different factions, not just Fallen as some had thought. Only one we didn't see was Vex, unless I missed them.
 
That voice sounded like it was pulled straight from a 80's horror flick advertisement, so bad.

I'm sceptical but I do hope its fun.
 
So the prison of elders is not only for fallen it seems...

I really hope we don't just do one faction at a time, but have areas where multiple ones are fighting each other. Would be interesting to have combinations we don't get in the story, such as Cabal whomping on Hive while we're in the middle of it.

The bones on the ground make this look like a Hive themed area. Loving the environments.

tuE6aoe.png
 
Speaking of enemy types, I wonder if we will get new races to fight in the sequels starting with Destiny 2. I still think that whatever Comet is there will be no new enemies and no new planets. Comet will more or less fill in the the rest of areas we currently have.
 
I really hope we don't just do one faction at a time, but have areas where multiple ones are fighting each other. Would be interesting to have combinations we don't get in the story, such as Cabal whomping on Hive while we're in the middle of it.

The bones on the ground make this look like a Hive themed area. Loving the environments.

Not only that but that isn't that a Cabal styled building behind the Guardians?

It'd be pretty neat to see lotsa enemies.
 
You may already be familiar with the general progression guides found in our community OTs, but I've put together a small FAQ for the facets of these guides that are currently or about to become outdated by significant changes that are accompanying the House of Wolves release (whether you buy it or not). If anyone has any other questions I can answer I will try to add them or clarify existing answers. Most of this is common knowledge to regular players and this is mainly for new or returning players.

FAQ
Q: How do I reach max level?
A: The current max level is 32, requiring 144 Light, or four armor pieces all with 36 Light each. With HoW, the max level will be 34, requiring 168 light (armor pieces with 42 Light each).

So, to get to 32 you need four Legendaries, or three legendaries and one Exotic, with 36 Light. Currently, just as Vault of Glass and Iron Banner gear were the only way to reach level 30, Crota's End gear (and Iron Banner again) are the only way to reach level 32.

However, when House of Wolves arrives this will change significantly. Instead of requiring certain gear with the max amount of Light, any Legendary or Exotic gear can be Ascended to max Light. To do this, Legendaries require a new item called Etheric Light and Exotics require Exotic Shards (obtained from Xur, or by dismantling any Exotic).

Q: How do I get Etheric Light?
A: Etheric Light can Ascend any Legendary item (armor or weapon), and can be obtained from:
  • Nightfalls
  • Prison of Elders
  • Iron Banner (seems as though it will be purchaseable once per event at certain ranks)
  • Trials of Osiris
When an item is Ascended, it will be at the Attack/Defense/Light tier of the current top tier gear. However, this gear must still be upgraded (whether before or after Ascension) with materials and XP to be completely maxed.

Q: How do I reach level 28/30/31/32 before that?
A: So many different pieces of gear at so many different Light values are now potentially viable that it can be very confusing in terms of how to reach the significant level thresholds before that. These would be:

-28 to optimally complete VoG Normal
-30 to optimally complete VoG Hard/Nightfalls/Weekly and Daily Heroics at 30
-31/32 to optimally complete CE Normal (Swordbearer should be 32+) and Hard

We can expect the non-raid activities that are currently set at level 30 (Nightfall/Weekly/Daily) to be bumped up to level 32 when the expansion hits, while the raid thresholds are likely to stay the same. Hitting level 30 as soon as possible is a good idea for all players, and there are many ways to do this. Even if you don't surpass level 30 by the time HoW arrives, you'll be in great position to do so while experiencing at least some of the new content.

I suggest taking a look at this planner app and seeing how all the different pieces you can acquire (or may already have) will add up when maxed.

While many would have advised against leveling up "old school" gear like VoG raid gear because it would become obsolete, this is no longer the case because all of it can be ascended from here on. So if you obtain (or have vaulted) a piece that you like the look of or has good perks, go for it!

Q: What is the easiest route to 30 for a player who owns The Dark Below?
A: As prescribed in the original guides, new players should still focus on leveling up their Vanguard Rank to 2 and earning marks for their first legendary piece. Additionally, buying a new piece of armor from Xur is a simple way to acquire a piece 36 Light armor- preferably a helm, because these are more expensive to buy from vendors. However, owners of The Dark Below can also obtain a free pair of 33 Light gauntlets as a quest reward for the Urn of Sacrifice quest chain from Eris. Thus it's a good idea to knock that quest out ASAP.

An example of a quick and dirty path to level 30 is as follows:

Helm: Exotic from Xûr
Gauntlets: Eris quest reward
Chest: Whatever blue they find
Boots: Any Legendary vendor boots

Note that you can hit level 30 without even having full Legendary/Exotic gear. Because the Helm, Gauntlets and Boots can be ascended when you acquire your first Etheric Light, you'll be in good position to progress toward max level without even having set foot in a raid. This setup only costs 13 Strange Coins and 75 Vanguard Marks, and no Commendations are required.

Q: Speaking of Commendations, what are they for?
A: For the moment, after Rank 3 in any faction, you are awarded a Vanguard or Crucible Commendation with each further rank.

Currently, one of these is required to purchase any weapon, and certain armor pieces (helm and chest). However, they are being eliminated completely in House of Wolves. After the release, existing Commendations can be consumed for a reputation boost.

Q: I don't want to waste time/energy/glimmer/XP/mats/sanity on upgrading things that will be reset or obsoleted when the patch hits. How do I avoid this?
A: While having investment reset and potentially wasting resources was a substantial concern prior to The Dark Below, most of the systemic changes that are taking hold after the release will respect prior investment and allow you to choose the gear you want to remain relevant with you as you progress. Exotic perks and XP funneled into weapons and armor will not be reset when an item is Ascended. Some materials costs on items appear to be reduced for upgrades on newer (HoW-drop) gear, so you may wish to wait before spending these currencies as you may get more "bang for your buck" putting them into newer items rather than continuing to upgrade old ones to Ascend. However, on the whole my opinion is that this difference will be mostly negligible. If you are in the middle of upgrading an item that you like, don't feel that you have to stop for fear of getting screwed by the new system.

Q: Is there anything I should make sure to do in advance of the House of Wolves release?
A: The biggest thing to keep an eye out for here would be the vendor inventories.

While old existing gear will be upgradeable, and a large supply of new gear will be up for purchase and obtainable as drops... the entire current inventory of each vendor in the tower will be replaced. Expect armor pieces to have different visual appearances, stats and perks. Weapons will have different looks, base properties, and perks and the new inventories may not even mirror the exact weapon types in every slot of the old inventory.

Some of the current vendor inventories have very potent weapons with excellent perks for PvP, PvE or both. If there are any that you particularly want, spend the marks and commendations to pick them up as they may never be available again.

Note that while new vendor purchases after the HoW release can be reforged (rerolled for new perks), older gear cannot- so only make one of these purchases if you do want the vendor configuration of that item.

One other thing: if Xûr has an item you want in particular over the next couple of weeks, buy it immediately! Do not hold off just because he won't have the "latest version" until after the patch. Xûr can be very fickle with his inventories and you never know how long it'll be til That Thing You Want is available again.

Q: What other aspects of the Post-20 Leveling Guides are outdated?
A: Most of the general principles do still apply. However, these points do need some updating:
  • Raiding is emphasized heavily as a critical path toward progressing once you hit a certain level wall, but this won't really be the case anymore with the new patch. Between higher-Light vendor gear and the ability to Ascend any gear, it will be possible and even practical to, for the first time, hit max level without raiding at all. Because there will be an even wider range of entry thresholds in the post-HoW game, don't concentrate on hitting max level so much as on getting to the level you need to be to be effective in the content you want to play.
  • Iron Banner isn't really addressed at all, but is and will remain a concrete source of endgame progression, with two high-Light armor pieces available each event as well as the potential to obtain Etheric Light.
  • The specific vendor inventories in the build-making section are already out of date, and will be even moreso. However, the general idea of seeking out a varied arsenal of elemental weapons of the types you desire is still good advice. With reforging available on new vendor items this will be more possible than ever even without lucky drops.
  • Shards and Energy (both Ascendant and Radiant) are no longer going to be static piles in your inventory; they will be exchangeable for one another, for glimmer, and for Motes of Light. Always consider what your next goal is and how any new mats acquired can best contribute to your progression.
  • There are also several changes to the Crucible in general that will affect progression, so I'll list them here:
    • Legendary items will be added to post-game reward tables for all Crucible activities
    • Your first match in the daily featured Crucible activity will earn you a new reward package each day
    • Reputation and Mark gains will double for each completed Crucible match
As with the guides before, this FAQ will be outdated before too long but hopefully it helps some to bridge the gap. If you have any other questions which are completely unanswered here- please quote and ask and (assuming I have an answer :P) I'll edit this post to add it in.
 
So the prison of elders is not only for fallen it seems...

If it was, that would have been a total fail...

Different environments, different factions, etc... Not the same thing over and over.

It's clear it won't have matchmaking... since ToO doesn't... so it's still a lost cause.
 
If it was, that would have been a total fail...

Different environments, different factions, etc... Not the same thing over and over.

It's clear it won't have matchmaking... since ToO doesn't... so it's still a lost cause.

Not for me.
Really hope they dont gave in. Ever, The weekly matchmaking was already enough.
 
You don't have to use matchmaking. Just bring your own fireteam.

No because imo things are made easy enough already. It a high level content so you need imo to do some work to get a good fireteam to get that special event or Raid. That high tier of Destiny content. Adding matchmaking to everything totally kills that.
 
I understand why people are frustrated finding a group of six people for a raid that probably takes a 1-2 hour commitment.

But really, having to gather 2 other people for a much shorter event is a "lost cause"?
 
No because imo things are made easy enough already. It a high level content so you need imo to do some work to get a good fireteam to get that special event or Raid. That high tier of Destiny content. Adding matchmaking to everything totally kills that.

Or you could just not use it. It literally does not affect you one way or the other as long as it's an option. You're not even competing against people in PoE.
 
No because imo things are made easy enough already. It a high level content so you need imo to do some work to get a good fireteam to get that special event or Raid. That high tier of Destiny content. Adding matchmaking to everything totally kills that.

I think it's a good idea to have a mix of content for the endgame, that spans difficulty and complexity levels. Not everything needs to be a raid-like activity that precludes matchmaking. Iron banner vs. Trials of Osiris is a good comparison, where party matchmaking works for one, but not the other. If PoE is more combat focused than the raids, then matchmaking might work for it.
Or you could just not use it. It literally does not affect you one way or the other as long as it's an option. You're not even competing against people in PoE.

His point is that by making an activity that features matchmaking, you have to nerf the difficulty or type of things you do in that activity to make it suitable for matchmaking. He's asking for the endgame stuff to be exclusively more hardcore, ala raids.
 
Or you could just not use it. It literally does not affect you one way or the other as long as it's an option. You're not even competing against people in PoE.

It does. If matchmaking is added. The next thing is that Bungie doesnt want make it to difficult for that matchmaking group. Meaning the game gets even more casual. And that would really suck.

Edit: What GhaleonEB says.
 
Looking foward to this! Sent an email to my friends yesterday explaining Trials of Osiris and how having a three-person team will let us experience end-game content this time around. Last night three of us were all on the same time, first time in a long while. We are just going to do Dailies, Weeklies, and Nightfalls when we can to get into the groove of playing on a schedule. Eventually I'll lure them into the Crucible to practice Elimination before the Trials comes out.
 
His point is that by making an activity that features matchmaking, you have to nerf the difficulty or type of things you do in that activity to make it suitable for matchmaking. He's asking for the endgame stuff to be exclusively more hardcore, ala raids.

And I buy that for the Raids, but if PoE is basically a horde mode, I don't think that philosophy applies to it. I've said before though, I'll wait for the details before I argue that definitively.
 
Is this the new horde/firefight/whatever PvE mode?

Now that's something I want to see in action.

No because imo things are made easy enough already. It a high level content so you need imo to do some work to get a good fireteam to get that special event or Raid. That high tier of Destiny content. Adding matchmaking to everything totally kills that.
As somebody who does enough work day in and day out I don't look to my games to make things more difficult when it comes to the simple act of playing them, and wasted time is the cardinal sin.
 
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